The Goff-season Thread

[OldSchool]

Because the guys making the decisions might be lol

So the same guy that said Hared deserved this contract is now saying he isn’t worth the contract? Sorry can’t have both things be correct. This is becoming more and more clear it’s to motivate Jared to improve what he did wrong this year. I just hope Snead and McVay are looking in the mirror to get better too.

 

[Ram_Rally]

I hope so, but playing devil’s advocate, Goff’s contract is also a lot bigger than Osweiler’s. If I’m a potential trade partner, I’m hammering that fact to leverage as many picks as possible. At the very least the Osweiler trade is the floor of any potential deal.

I think it was similarly sized relative to cap space. But that will be the counter

 

[OldSchool]

If they do that, I cut ties with this franchise for good. There aren't many lines for me, but that level of stupid isn't something I will abide. If they want to deal Goff to facilitate a Watson trade, I'm game. But dumping a starting QB like that is beyond the threshold for stupidity that I'll take. We got a fucking starting QB and a 2nd for Sam fucking Bradford. Goff is more durable and better than Bradford ever was.

If they bail on him I’ll lose all faith in this teams leadership. Its already shaken as it is.

 

[Ram_Rally]

If they do that, I cut ties with this franchise for good. There aren't many lines for me, but that level of stupid isn't something I will abide. If they want to deal Goff to facilitate a Watson trade, I'm game. But dumping a starting QB like that is beyond the threshold for stupidity that I'll take. We got a fucking starting QB and a 2nd for Sam fucking Bradford. Goff is more durable and better than Bradford ever was.

What if it's necessary to facilitate the trade? Like a third team

 

[jrry32]

Yeah that's the real issue. We give out some awful contracts.

However, on Goff's performance. I think we have to differentiate between playing well and playing gutsy. The Seahawks win was gutsy but his numbers were bad. I get it, the thumb, but it still wasn't great. Just gutsy. The Packers game. I mean 21 completions for 174 yards is not effiicient enough. If you're Mcvay, those 2 games don't sway you that much.

Our QB playing with a busted thumb on his throwing hand currently has the third highest playoff passer rating this season behind Mahomes and Rodgers.

 

[Ram Ts]

It’s weird. Only thing that makes sense to me is McVay & Snead want to put pressure on Goff to focus and work harder — ala Phil Jackson type motivation via the media.

If they truly want him gone, they are only damaging themselves in efforts to trade him for some value. It’s also a huge admission of their own fault in giving him the keys and the huge extension. So I gotta believe they understand that and it’s simply a plan to light a fire under Goffs ars motivation.

 

[Ram_Rally]

So the same guy that said Hared deserved this contract is now saying he isn’t worth the contract? Sorry can’t have both things be correct. This is becoming more and more clear it’s to motivate Jared to improve what he did wrong this year. I just hope Snead and McVay are looking in the mirror to get better too.

Yeah I agree with you here. I'm saying that they're handling of it is what's awful here.

 

[jrry32]

What if it's necessary to facilitate the trade? Like a third team

There isn't a universe where trading our limited number of draft picks facilitates a trade for a top QB without absolutely gutting this team. If we get Rodgers or Watson, I'll wait and see what the deal is. But I can't imagine a scenario where we are benefited by paying a team to take Goff. It's such a bad decision.

 

[thirteen28]

Yeah I totally agree with you. I’m starting with the premise that the Rams FO isn’t stupid, so
I’m hoping/assuming they have something lined up. But the more I think out potential scenarios (like the Goff-dumping trade outlined above) I’m seeing a lot that suggests I could be wrong about the FO. I hope I’m not.

I mean sure, I'd love to get Watson, but we're probably not going to be able to. The compensation will be very high (probably more than we can afford) and there will be all kinds of cap ramifications. Both the compensation and cap ramifications will make it harder to surround Watson with the talent he needs to make this team a winner. Even though he played well last year, his team was 4-12, which pretty much says all you need to know about the talent around him. And I do have a slight concern about his knee since his ACL has been torn once.

Short of a simple 1-1 swap with no cap ramifications of Goff for Watson (available only in Fantasyland), I just don't see a way this works our for the Rams in the long run. Fixing the OL and evaluating Goff for another year under better circumstances (with McVay retooling his scheme and playcalling) seems like a much better long term plan because we could move on from Goff without blowing up the team if he still doesn't improve, and we will have more cap room and draft capital to work with.

This just smacks of the kind of short term thinking that ends up derailing franchises from long term success.

 

[Ram_Rally]

Our QB playing with a busted thumb on his throwing hand currently has the third highest playoff passer rating this season behind Mahomes and Rodgers.

That's two games though. How many of those QBs are you taking Goff over.

 

[Ram_Rally]

There isn't a universe where trading our limited number of draft picks facilitates a trade for a top QB without absolutely gutting this team. If we get Rodgers or Watson, I'll wait and see what the deal is. But I can't imagine a scenario where we are benefited by paying a team to take Goff. It's such a bad decision.

Well that'll just be my stipididty lol I'm sure the front office knows better

 

[jrry32]

Well that'll just be my stipididty lol I'm sure the front office knows better

I'm sorry, dude. That's my bad. I'm not trying to insult you.

I figured you were floating the idea, not that you supported it. The Osweiler trade was a unicorn when it comes to QBs. The Texans handed out a terrible contract to a QB who didn't deserve it. And when he played, he stunk to such a level that they were desperate to clear him off the books of a team that could contend with somebody serviceable. Goff has been disappointing, but even disappointing Goff is a middle of the pack starting QB.

 

[thirteen28]

Who knows for certain?
Look what people were willing to give up for Bradford. I cant remember the details, but we got a pretty good deal for him from Philly.
I think Philly got something decent in return when Bradford went to Minnesota.

I'm sure Goff has value to a few teams out there.
How much? Idk.

This is from the Bradford-to-Philly trade:

The Eagles announced Tuesday that they have agreed to trade quarterback Nick Foles, a fourth-round draft pick in 2015 and a second-round pick in 2016 to the St. Louis Rams in exchange for quarterback Sam Bradford and the Rams' fifth-round pick in 2015.

Not exactly a king's ransom.

Vikings gave up a 1st and a conditional 4th that could have been higher (don't know if conditions were met), but they end up doing so for what turned out to be one season's worth of work.

 

[jrry32]

That's two games though. How many of those QBs are you taking Goff over.

Well, the most any QB has played is three. Some have only played one. My point was that Goff played efficient, safe football this postseason despite his busted thumb. That's exactly the sort of football we begged him to play with our defense being as good as they are.

 

[Ram_Rally]

I'm sorry, dude. That's my bad. I'm not trying to insult you.

I figured you were floating the idea, not that you supported it. The Osweiler trade was a unicorn when it comes to QBs. The Texans handed out a terrible contract to a QB who didn't deserve it. And when he played, he stunk to such a level that they were desperate to clear him off the books of a team that could contend with somebody serviceable. Goff has been disappointing, but even disappointing Goff is a middle of the pack starting QB.

Lol no you're all good man. We've both been around a while here. I know there was no insult. But yeah I was just speculating because it makes no sense to openly distance yourself from your qb like this.

 

[dieterbrock]

They've been transparent about contracts though. In fact. Here's Mcvay when asked about jared getting an extension last off-season:

"Whether it ends up happening this year or next year, there is a zero pct. chance this guy's not gonna get an extension he's worthy of."


That's a far cry from what we're hearing now

This isnt about contracts, its about player. They yanked everyone's chain about Gurley for months, heck all of 2019 season.
Wouldnt make sense to say they werent happy with him if they were looking to trade him

 

[Dodgersrf]

This is from the Bradford-to-Philly trade:

The Eagles announced Tuesday that they have agreed to trade quarterback Nick Foles, a fourth-round draft pick in 2015 and a second-round pick in 2016 to the St. Louis Rams in exchange for quarterback Sam Bradford and the Rams' fifth-round pick in 2015.

Not exactly a king's ransom.

Vikings gave up a 1st and a conditional 4th that could have been higher (don't know if conditions were met), but they end up doing so for what turned out to be one season's worth of work.

Bradford also had bad knees and was already holding the "injury prone" label for many people.

Goff is a superior trade candidate imo.
At least health and talent wise.

 

[jrry32]

This is from the Bradford-to-Philly trade:

The Eagles announced Tuesday that they have agreed to trade quarterback Nick Foles, a fourth-round draft pick in 2015 and a second-round pick in 2016 to the St. Louis Rams in exchange for quarterback Sam Bradford and the Rams' fifth-round pick in 2015.

Not exactly a king's ransom.

Vikings gave up a 1st and a conditional 4th that could have been higher (don't know if conditions were met), but they end up doing so for what turned out to be one season's worth of work.

Yeah, we got a second and a starting QB for a lesser QB than Goff. And the Eagles got a first for him. The 49ers traded a 2nd for Jimmy G. The Broncos got two firsts for Jay Cutler. The Patriots got the #34 pick for Cassel and Vrabel. The Eagles got a second and DRC for Kevin Kolb. The Bengals got a first and second for a retired Carson Palmer. The Patriots got a first for Drew Bledsoe. We have a two-time Pro Bowl QB who is about to enter his prime. If we can't get at least a second for him, we're nuts to trade him. Frankly, we have no business getting less than a first.

 

[thirteen28]

Bradford also had bad knees and was already holding the "injury prone" label for many people.

Goff is a superior trade candidate imo.
At least health and talent wise.

Doesn't mean someone is going to be eager to take his contract, especially with the salary cap likely declining this offseason. Bradford was in his sixth season when he got traded and we never extended him, so he had at most one year left on his deal which meant pretty much zero long term cap issues for either of the trade partners in that one.

 

[Bearrister]

Lol no you're all good man. We've both been around a while here. I know there was no insult. But yeah I was just speculating because it makes no sense to openly distance yourself from your qb like this.

Yeah I should clarify also - I don’t think the Rams should do a salary dumping trade of Goff’s. I’m firmly in the “trade for Watson if you can, otherwise stick with Goff and improve the team” camp. Im
just speculating on scenarios and trying to make sense of McVay’s and Snead’s comments about Goff’s future with the team. It doesn’t make sense for them to question his place on the roster unless they’re ready to move on. I don’t buy the “light a fire under Goff’s ass” line of thinking- it’d be one thing to make it clear that his starting job may be in question, but it’s a whole different level to say he may not even be on the roster next year. That’s the kind of thing that potentially erodes trust and willingness to work with someone, especially since Goff has such a big guaranteed contract.