OFFICIAL 2021 Coaching changes / Black Monday

[Poppinfresh]

I'm happy for the guy. I think it's crazy that there's only 3 black GMs too though I also don't like this rule I don't think AA type approach is the way to go but that's a conversation for another time and place.

Why is that? 13% of the population, just under 10% of the GM jobs. That puts AA at 1 off the pace if we go strictly by percentage of representation in America. By that logic, the bigger surprise is that there isn't 1 Asian GM.

Anyhow, just a thought experiment. Happy for Holmes, he definitely has earned it and has put in the work over a lot of years to work up to this moment. The situation in Detroit's more than a little bit of a dumpster fire, but hopefully he can turn some things around.

 

[Dodgersrf]

As I understand it, two candidates in the same cycle would only be 3 consecutive comp picks. I believe that's the max.

That's what i heard as well.
Shreager may have made a mistake.

 

[jrry32]

Why is that? 13% of the population, just under 10% of the GM jobs. That puts AA at 1 off the pace if we go strictly by percentage of representation in America. By that logic, the bigger surprise is that there isn't 1 Asian GM.

Anyhow, just a thought experiment. Happy for Holmes, he definitely has earned it and has put in the work over a lot of years to work up to this moment. The situation in Detroit's more than a little bit of a dumpster fire, but hopefully he can turn some things around.

The composition of the NFL and major college football does not match our general demographics. Considering the fact that scouts typically have played football at a high level (whether college or NFL) and GMs typically have worked in scouting, I expect you see my point.

 

[12intheBox]

View: https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1349918233231560709?s=20

 

[Psycho_X]

View: https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1349918233231560709?s=20

Good riddance. Now if we can just get Lions and Chargers to hire some coaches not named Staley I will feel good.

 

[So Ram]

Good riddance. Now if we can just get Lions and Chargers to hire some coaches not named Staley I will feel good.

Brad Holmes is gone to the lions. They like taking From The Rams. The Rams did get A”Robinson last season though.

 

[RocknRam29]

View: https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1349918233231560709?s=20

View: https://twitter.com/MySportsUpdate/status/1349919547315384327

 

[den-the-coach]

49ers lose Saleh & LaFleur well, good, it's about time...Excellent hire by the Jets & Saleh will make the Jets relevant again.

 

[ljramsfan]

49ers lose Saleh & LaFleur well, good, it's about time...Excellent hire by the Jets & Saleh will make the Jets relevant again.

I had a feeling that LaFleur would get promoted

 

[thirteen28]

View: https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/1349918233231560709?s=20

I really think the 49ers should hire someone like Larry Marmie to replace Saleh. But hey, that's just me ...

 

[Poppinfresh]

The composition of the NFL and major college football does not match our general demographics. Considering the fact that scouts typically have played football at a high level (whether college or NFL) and GMs typically have worked in scouting, I expect you see my point.

Actually, most former players go into coaching or broadcasting (if they pursue anything after retirement at all), and the most successful GM's and front office executives have overwhelmingly been people who haven't played football at more than a high school level, and were more into academics.

Eric DeCCosta of the Ravens played for Colby College, which isn't a high level program.

Mike Mayok made it to the Steelers but never played a snap of pro ball

Dave Caldwell played at John Carroll University, so not high level ball

Jason Licht played at Nebraska-Wesleyan. So not high level ball

Ryan Pace played for Eastern Illinois. So not high level

Steve Keim played for NC State and made it to Dolphins training camp, but never played a snap in the NFL

Tom Telesco was a backup receiver at powerhouse John Carroll University

Rick Spielman played at Southern Illinois and made it to a couple of training camps, but never played a down in the NFL

Snead played for Alabama-Birmingham, but as soon as he transferred to Auburn, he became a front office person.

Jon Robinson Southeast Missouri State.

John Lynch....the first name on this list to have a real football career.

Brett Veach was a backup at Delaware

Belichick played wat Wesleyan.

So out of 34 executives, only 13 of them played football and only 1 of them ever took a snap in the NFL. Only 3 of them played college ball at a school anybody has ever really heard of.

When I look at heads of scouting, the numbers get even grimmer for people who have worn pads.

Your argument is bad.

 

[Florida_Ram]

Sad to say Brad Holmes will probably hire Staley next week if the Rams defense keeps the Pack in check.

He might still hire him and if he doesn't I will be shocked if one of the last few vacant head coaching positions isn't offered to the young genius.

I've given up hope Staley will be a Ram next year.

 

[jrry32]

Actually, most former players go into coaching or broadcasting (if they pursue anything after retirement at all), and the most successful GM's and front office executives have overwhelmingly been people who haven't played football at more than a high school level, and were more into academics.

Eric DeCCosta of the Ravens played for Colby College, which isn't a high level program.

Mike Mayok made it to the Steelers but never played a snap of pro ball

Dave Caldwell played at John Carroll University, so not high level ball

Jason Licht played at Nebraska-Wesleyan. So not high level ball

Ryan Pace played for Eastern Illinois. So not high level

Steve Keim played for NC State and made it to Dolphins training camp, but never played a snap in the NFL

Tom Telesco was a backup receiver at powerhouse John Carroll University

Rick Spielman played at Southern Illinois and made it to a couple of training camps, but never played a down in the NFL

Snead played for Alabama-Birmingham, but as soon as he transferred to Auburn, he became a front office person.

Jon Robinson Southeast Missouri State.

John Lynch....the first name on this list to have a real football career.

Brett Veach was a backup at Delaware

Belichick played wat Wesleyan.

So out of 34 executives, only 13 of them played football and only 1 of them ever took a snap in the NFL. Only 3 of them played college ball at a school anybody has ever really heard of.

When I look at heads of scouting, the numbers get even grimmer for people who have worn pads.

Your argument is bad.

For 2020:
Jets: Joe Douglas - Played college football at Richmond
Dolphins: Chris Grier - Played college football at UMass-Amherst
Patriots: Nick Caserio (now with the Texans) - Played college football at John Carroll University
Bills: Brandon Beane - N/A

Steelers: Kevin Colbert - N/A
Ravens: Eric DeCosta - Played college football at Colby College
Browns: Andrew Berry - Played college football at Harvard
Bengals: Duke Tobin - Played college football at Illinois and Colorado and then played in the Arena League

Titans: Jon Robinson - Played college football for the Air Force Academy and Southeast Missouri State
Colts: Chris Ballard - Played college football at Wisconsin
Texans: Brian Gaine (last GM before Caserio was hired) - Played college football at Maine and made a NFL practice squad
Jaguars: Dave Caldwell - Played college football at John Carroll University

Chiefs: Brett Veach - Played college football at Delaware
Raiders: Mike Mayock - Played college football at Boston College and had a short NFL career
Chargers: Tom Telesco - Played college football at John Carroll University
Broncos: John Elway - Hall of Fame QB

Redskins: Kyle Smith (closest thing to a GM they have right now) - Played college football at Youngstown State and spent brief time on NFL rosters
Giants: Dave Gettleman - Played college football at Springfield College
Cowboys: Stephen Jones - Played college football at Arkansas
Eagles: Howie Roseman - N/A

Packers: Brian Gutekunst - Played college football at Wisconsin-La Crosse
Bears: Ryan Pace - Played college football at Eastern Illinois
Vikings: Rick Spielman - Played college football at Southern Illinois and spent brief time in the NFL
Lions: Bob Quinn - N/A

Saints: Mickey Loomis - N/A
Buccaneers: Jason Licht - Played college football at Nebraska and Nebraska Wesleyan
Panthers: Marty Hurney - Played college football at Catholic University
Falcons: Thomas Dimitroff - Played college football at the University of Guelph (in Canada)

Seahawks: John Schneider - Played college football at the University of St. Thomas
Rams: Les Snead - Played college football at Troy, UAB, and Auburn
Cardinals: Steve Keim - Played college football at N.C. State and spent brief time in the NFL
49ers: John Lynch - (Future) Hall of Fame Safety

My argument is quite sound. The vast majority of NFL GMs played college football. And the demographics of college football are unlike the demographics of the general American population. Back to your bitching.

 

[Poppinfresh]

For 2020:
Jets: Joe Douglas - Played college football at Richmond
Dolphins: Chris Grier - Played college football at UMass-Amherst
Patriots: Nick Caserio (now with the Texans) - Played college football at John Carroll University
Bills: Brandon Beane - N/A

Steelers: Kevin Colbert - N/A
Ravens: Eric DeCosta - Played college football at Colby College
Browns: Andrew Berry - Played college football at Harvard
Bengals: Duke Tobin - Played college football at Illinois and Colorado and then played in the Arena League

Titans: Jon Robinson - Played college football for the Air Force Academy and Southeast Missouri State
Colts: Chris Ballard - Played college football at Wisconsin
Texans: Brian Gaine (last GM before Caserio was hired) - Played college football at Maine and made a NFL practice squad
Jaguars: Dave Caldwell - Played college football at John Carroll University

Chiefs: Brett Veach - Played college football at Delaware
Raiders: Mike Mayock - Played college football at Boston College and had a short NFL career
Chargers: Tom Telesco - Played college football at John Carroll University
Broncos: John Elway - Hall of Fame QB

Redskins: Kyle Smith (closest thing to a GM they have right now) - Played college football at Youngstown State and spent brief time on NFL rosters
Giants: Dave Gettleman - Played college football at Springfield College
Cowboys: Stephen Jones - Played college football at Arkansas
Eagles: Howie Roseman - N/A

Packers: Brian Gutekunst - Played college football at Wisconsin-La Crosse
Bears: Ryan Pace - Played college football at Eastern Illinois
Vikings: Rick Spielman - Played college football at Southern Illinois and spent brief time in the NFL
Lions: Bob Quinn - N/A

Saints: Mickey Loomis - N/A
Buccaneers: Jason Licht - Played college football at Nebraska and Nebraska Wesleyan
Panthers: Marty Hurney - Played college football at Catholic University
Falcons: Thomas Dimitroff - Played college football at the University of Guelph (in Canada)

Seahawks: John Schneider - Played college football at the University of St. Thomas
Rams: Les Snead - Played college football at Troy, UAB, and Auburn
Cardinals: Steve Keim - Played college football at N.C. State and spent brief time in the NFL
49ers: John Lynch - (Future) Hall of Fame Safety

My argument is quite sound. The vast majority of NFL GMs played college football. And the demographics of college football are unlike the demographics of the general American population. Back to your bitching.

You've listed a lot of people who aren't GM (Duke Tobin, John Elway, Kyle Smith, Stephen Jones etc.). And, oddly, you lie/overinflate where some of these dudes played (let's take Snead as an example - he was essentially "Rudy")

Now not only is your argument bad, but you should feel bad for being intellectually dishonest. Not only that, but you're clinging to the absolutely absurd belief that being a 2nd string player at some Division III school as a couple of these dudes were made them "football people". No, it made them academics who were able to display just enough athleticism to get a free education. These dudes all have business degrees, something a footballer doesn't get.

 

[jrry32]

You've listed a lot of people who aren't GM (Duke Tobin, John Elway, Kyle Smith, Stephen Jones etc.). And, oddly, you lie/overinflate where some of these dudes played (let's take Snead as an example - he was essentially "Rudy")

Duke Tobin functions as the Bengals GM:

Bengals' Duke Tobin lands right in the middle of new GM power rankings

The Bengals’ Duke Tobin sits 16th in updated rankings.

bengalswire.usatoday.com

John Elway was the Broncos GM until about 10 days ago:

3 immediate impacts of John Elway's promotion for Broncos offseason - Mile High Sports

The Broncos will have a new person calling the shots in terms of free agency and the draft this year, we know that much for sure. What else we know from the move on Drew Lock and Vic Fangio's future and more.

milehighsports.com

Stephen Jones is running the show in Dallas (but his father, who has the title of GM, also played for Arkansas, so it's a moot point):

View: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2637834-nfl-execs-the-cowboys-under-stephen-jones-are-turning-into-a-scary-contender


Kyle Smith functioned as the top personnel man in the Redskins FO this year, which is the equivalent of a GM:

Washington Football Team: Kyle Smith needs a promotion to GM

It is clear a new culture is being set in the nations capital, and Kyle Smith is an unsung hero of that new culture for the Washington Football Team.

riggosrag.com

I didn't lie or overinflate on any of these guys. I listed exactly where they played. Go do the research. Don't get upset with me because you didn't have your facts straight. It doesn't matter that Snead was "Rudy." Playing college football matters a lot if you're trying to break into the scouting world. (And playing football at Auburn helped Snead land a grad assistant job there, which undoubtedly helped him land his first NFL scouting job.) Then again, what would I know? I only worked in a NFL front office in the past.

Now not only is your argument bad, but you should feel bad for being intellectually dishonest. Not only that, but you're clinging to the absolutely absurd belief that being a 2nd string player at some Division III school as a couple of these dudes were made them "football people". No, it made them academics who were able to display just enough athleticism to get a free education. These dudes all have business degrees, something a footballer doesn't get.

I'm clinging to the very rational belief that it is difficult to break into the NFL scouting profession without having played football at the college level, unless you're very connected. And no, all of these dudes don't have business degrees. (For example, Les Snead majored in psychology.) It's also flatly untrue that football players don't get business degrees. You're full of it. Frankly, it blows my mind that you're complaining about something that has no effect on you. And then you add to that awful behavior by repeatedly making factually incorrect statements and flailing arguments.

 

[Poppinfresh]

Duke is the Director of PLayer Personnel. He's not the GM. Stephen Jones has some responsibility from dear old dad, but he isn't GM, either. As you say, John Elway WAS the Broncos GM. And Vince Lombardi used to be the GM of the Packers, so there's that. Kyle Smith, also, by your own link? Not GM.

I listed every GM. You, apparently not liking the result of that, decided to expand it to "GM-Like". Unless you also go around claiming that fry cooks at McDonald's are like executive chefs at restaurants like NOBU....

The rest is you just trying to cling desperately to individual words while ignoring context because you know you're treed. Think we're done here. Better luck next time.

 

[Neil039]

Reading Lions fans they’re not excited about the pick but they don’t know him. Seems like they’d have preferred a retread instead of a bright young mind.

I felt the same with Sneed initially....my apologies. Crow doesn’t taste well raw or cooked.

 

[OldSchool]

I felt the same with Sneed initially....my apologies. Crow doesn’t taste well raw or cooked.

I know the taste

 

[jrry32]

Duke is the Director of PLayer Personnel. He's not the GM. Stephen Jones has some responsibility from dear old dad, but he isn't GM, either. As you say, John Elway WAS the Broncos GM. And Vince Lombardi used to be the GM of the Packers, so there's that. Kyle Smith, also, by your own link? Not GM.

I used the GMs from the 2020 season (except for the Texans because they were letting BOB sink the ship as HC/GM). John Elway was the Broncos GM during the 2020 season. Duke Tobin is the Bengals de facto GM. He is the guy who handles all the personnel decisions. The link I posted said this about Kyle Smith: "He essentially is the Co-GM with Head Coach Ron Rivera." But if you'd prefer Ron Rivera, he spent nearly a decade in the NFL after playing at Cal. As for Stephen Jones, I already told you that your quibbling is irrelevant. Jerry lists himself as the GM and won a national championship while playing football at Arkansas. So you're wasting your time arguing that one.

I listed every GM. You, apparently not liking the result of that, decided to expand it to "GM-Like". Unless you also go around claiming that fry cooks at McDonald's are like executive chefs at restaurants like NOBU....

You made a bogus claim. I went through and listed every single team's top personnel guy, which is either the GM or the equivalent of the GM. The fact that these guys all work in the NFL makes your little McDonalds analogy foolish. Keep digging the hole deeper. You're embarrassing yourself.

EDIT: To use an accurate analogy, David Shaw is Stanford's "Bradford M. Freeman Director of Football." If we are to use your logic, Stanford has no head coach, because they use a different title. They also use different titles for the OC and DC jobs ("Andrew Luck Director of Offense" and "Willie Shaw Director of Defense"). Yet, anybody who understands football recognizes that David Shaw is the HC, Lance Anderson is the DC, and Tavita Pritchard is the OC.

The rest is you just trying to cling desperately to individual words while ignoring context because you know you're treed. Think we're done here. Better luck next time.

Glad you finally are taking the L and moving on. I appreciate the self awareness.

 

[den-the-coach]

Sad to say Brad Holmes will probably hire Staley next week if the Rams defense keeps the Pack in check.

I concur I'm happy for Holmes although I will miss him too, but it appears one of the reasons that made Holmes even more attractive was his plan to hire Staley as Head Coach....Let's be honest here, it kind of sucks because McVay found him, nobody in the NFL heard of Brandon Staley, but that's the way it goes.