Pick #57 - Rams select WR Tutu Atwell

View: https://twitter.com/ramsnfl/status/1388297996547223553?s=21

 

[NJRamsFan]

Yeah, everyone uses analytics, but some are MUCH farther along than others.

The Rams are at the vanguard in this respect.

I keep seeing this as generally accepted knowledge and I’ve seen mentions to the rams investing in their data analytics but never saying they are much further along than the rest of the NFL. Do you have any sources ?

 

[Faceplant]

Both are very, very fast. Eskridge is 5'8" 185 and a former defensive player. He plays the game the physicality and violence you expect of a defensive guy now playing offense. Tutu might have a small edge in terms of speed, but Eskridge is extremely fast himself. Both are very quick. Eskridge is the more polished route runner at this stage imo. Eskridge catches the ball and plays through contact better. Eskridge was also an elite returnman in college. Frankly, the biggest differences for me are the weight (both are 5'8", but Eskridge is 30+ pounds heavier) and Eskridge being much more physical.

Well, if Eskridge tries to play with physicality and violence at the NFL level, his 185lb ass is likely to be mince meat. Bring it sister.

Here's hoping that Atwell can use his speed to take away angles and big hits and that he has a long and healthy career as a Ram.

 

[MachS]

I am not saying you are wrong but that the Rams preferred Atwell.

We'll never know for sure how we had the "speedy" WRs ranked. But one thing we know for sure is McVay loved Atwell pre draft. Peter Shraeger, the NFL network insider is arguably the closest media member to McVay. They have a personal relationship that goes back to when McVay was an assistant coach back in Washington. Shraeger and McVay used to go get drunk at the combine & senior bowl and talk about players. Shraeger said McVay told him pre-draft to watch out for Tutu Atwell in LA. That he loved his game and the way he tracked the ball down the field reminded him of DeSean Jackson Jr.

So if they had in depth conversations about him pre draft, that means we were likely targeting him. I think if a player was taken before 57 we really wanted, it probably wasn't Moore or Eskridge but rather another position player, maybe on defense and ultimately it made us pull the trigger on Atwell.

 

[Psycho_X]

a) as much as Isaac Bruce and Torry Holt had miles of YAC, they also frustrated defenders by getting down or running out of bounds to avoid the big hit... and this was during that fucked up "Jacked UP" time. "Live for another down" was a mantra... even as Martz was leaving Warner to get hammered.

b) also, Tutu is 160 and should only be gaining weight prior to the season. All this stuff about 155 or lower is in the past. As of now he's up to 160 and I would be surprised if he's less than 165 at the start of pre-season.

Yeah, I always liked the GSOT receivers were told the live for another down way of life and they did it. I remember that was part of the whole "Rams offense is soft" talk that followed them around because no one had anything else bad they could say about them. And I was fine with that. Would much rather they stay healthy and deal with some playground insults than have them take hits and miss half the season. Something I hope Atwell embraces and if he does and avoids those Brandin Cooks helmet to helmet hits he should have a long and fruitful NFL life.

3) We KNOW that teams valued their 2022 draft picks SO HIGHLY that almost none were traded. The 2021 draft class had over 600 players in it, down nearly 2/3rds over normal years and with the super senior COVID compensation, in 2022 there will be over 2200 players in that draft... which essentially turns the draft into giant 1st, 2nd, and 3rd rounds with a partial 4th. That means that the Rams EASILY could have traded up using 2022 draft picks if they were so inclined. EVERYONE who had 2022 picks had ammo. Not saying a 2022 6th rounder would get you a 1st in 2021, but a 2nd next year would EASILY get you a 2nd this year.

We don't know who the trade up would have been for and it's moot now, but yeah... much like manipulating the cap, the current draft circumstances made moving up this year a much easier task than in normal years ESPECIALLY if a team were inclined to use 2022 picks (almost none were).

Agreed and is one reason I expected this draft to possibly look a little different than most. The crop of players was suspect at best so while I understand the reservations of drafting a very small WR that high I also won't get upset about it if he brings a dangerous wrinkle to our offense. I understand the metrics are abnormal and maybe if Tutu were in the 2020 or 2022 draft he wouldn't get drafted until the 4th round but in this screwed up year I'm ok with pushing the metrics a little farther to grab a talented player who might be deficient in one category. Especially when he practically blows every other metric out of the water.

 

[Neil039]

I may be wrong but I see a bunch of failed gadget plays with only a few successful ones regarding Atwell.

McVay may see Atwell as Tyreek Hill, I see him as Hill’s underdeveloped little brother.

 

[jrry32]

Well, if Eskridge tries to play with physicality and violence at the NFL level, his 185lb ass is likely to be mince meat. Bring it sister.

Here's hoping that Atwell can use his speed to take away angles and big hits and that he has a long and healthy career as a Ram.

Nope. He's a well-built player. He'll be fine.

 

[rams1fan]

absolutely not true.

1) indicates their intent.

2) indicates intel which guided their decision. They didn't just fear it, they had intel that a specific team wanted him. Whether that intel was ultimately true isn't the point. That intel was a factor in deciding to not trade down.

3) We KNOW that teams valued their 2022 draft picks SO HIGHLY that almost none were traded. The 2021 draft class had over 600 players in it, down nearly 2/3rds over normal years and with the super senior COVID compensation, in 2022 there will be over 2200 players in that draft... which essentially turns the draft into giant 1st, 2nd, and 3rd rounds with a partial 4th. That means that the Rams EASILY could have traded up using 2022 draft picks if they were so inclined. EVERYONE who had 2022 picks had ammo. Not saying a 2022 6th rounder would get you a 1st in 2021, but a 2nd next year would EASILY get you a 2nd this year.

We don't know who the trade up would have been for and it's moot now, but yeah... much like manipulating the cap, the current draft circumstances made moving up this year a much easier task than in normal years ESPECIALLY if a team were inclined to use 2022 picks (almost none were).

Moderator says not to continue with this

That's a terrible metric to base an opinion on.

There are umpteen reasons why a team might use the entire time.

Read the thread. The Moderator already stated not to continue with this matter.

 

[Mackeyser]

I keep seeing this as generally accepted knowledge and I’ve seen mentions to the rams investing in their data analytics but never saying they are much further along than the rest of the NFL. Do you have any sources ?

No sources beyond me seeing some language tidbits which are clues to a deeper engagement with the data than other clubs.

As in, rather than just aggregate and use the Next Gen Stats as factors, the Rams went further and utilized the NGS as well as combine and other factors to CREATE a metric based on what THEY specifically want to see.

So, the Rams went with Tutu because based on their deeper understanding of not just what but HOW they want to deploy speed in their offense, Tutu was the fastest guy in the draft.

Many teams utilize data aggregation from sources like NGS, SPARQ and others. Teams will then apply varying degrees of processing to come up with hopefully a greater insight into which players may be a better match for them.

However, the Rams have taken the raw data and specifically created new evaluation metrics based on their specifically tailored requirements. The process of quantifying their requirements based on scheme, and then applying the aggregated data is a substantially deeper and better application of the data than to just use deeper levels of abstraction as if that creates a deeper understanding of how Player A would help the team as opposed to Players B-Z.

That's just one example I can recall off the top of my head.

McVay is positively LEAKY when it comes to dropping hints about how the Rams utilize and customize the data for their specific needs. I don't think he nor most fans/media have the slightest clue how often he drops nuggets about how deeply the Rams engage statistical analysis for not just the draft, but to evaluate each player for each practice and each game. He's not seen as such because he a) couches his revelations in coach speak and b) most folks don't listen for it or even understand it.

I mean, just the fact that they quantify how much a player works (it's so much more than just "measuring steps" or "distance traveled") in practice and will pull a player so as to remove overwork as a factor to reduce soft tissue injuries is another way that they're engaging the data on a deeper level than others. I've never heard of another team pulling a player from practice because they're not only measuring the output of the player during practice, but also have developed a baseline AND correlated that to game output to understand on a personal level how best to optimize practice and training to obtain optimal results on game day.

The level of integration between data and our Training Dept is another. Reggie Scott has such a data driven department that it often confuses rookies and those new to the org because they've never seen anything like it. But the results from Reggie Scott and crew are the best in the league most years by a far cry and in measurable ways.

Anyway, yeah, based on info from the Rams both direct and indirect, it's clear that the Rams engage analytics more than other teams. That's changing as teams have noticed our success, but success isn't guaranteed by just throwing money or bodies at the equations... another reason why it will take teams years to catch up if ever... at least under McVay.

 

[RamFan503]

I keep seeing this as generally accepted knowledge and I’ve seen mentions to the rams investing in their data analytics but never saying they are much further along than the rest of the NFL. Do you have any sources ?

It was in a previous thread not related to this thread. The Rams were the first to use a certain analytics company and they used them extensively due to their multi-facited information. Other teams are now starting to use them but the Rams lean more heavily on modern information and play time data.

 

[RamFan503]

Moderator says not to continue with this

Read the thread. The Moderator already stated not to continue with this matter.

Knock off the passive aggressive bullshit. If you need clarity on this, feel free to PM a moderator.

 

[Merlin]

Read the thread. The Moderator already stated not to continue with this matter.

I blame the mods for everything too. Those bastids.
~ @Loyal

 

[So Ram]

I keep seeing this as generally accepted knowledge and I’ve seen mentions to the rams investing in their data analytics but never jsaying they are much further along than the rest of the NFL. Do you have any sources ?

I know in baseball it is known Houston is big on analytics.St. Louis got fined for stealing info from them & lost draft pick & fined.
Houston cheated to a different level and got busted. The Angels are just a mess of a FRANCHISE!!
If you look at how the NINERS just drafted,you can tell The Rams have different analytics & the way they value there system.The info is changing as well as we know it.
Like I’ve said I’m just glad Les Snead is allowed to be more apart of system than with Jeff Fisher.Look at Houston have that Penn St. Guy O’Brien.

Sources? Just seeing how NFL teams draft & build there franchise should be enough. To say Brad Holmes does things the same way as The Rams tells you there is a big difference.

First Rd. Draft picks or not ?? Mcvay values mentoring & the personal side of things as well.Weedle & Matthew were good examples as well as Talib for Peters.

 

[Merlin]

I may be wrong but I see a bunch of failed gadget plays with only a few successful ones regarding Atwell.

McVay may see Atwell as Tyreek Hill, I see him as Hill’s underdeveloped little brother.

The guy has a ton of size questions without a doubt. But beyond that to call him a gadget player baffles me. He is almost unstoppable when he gets a free release. In fact I wonder what he would have done with a really good QB throwing to him.

Good thing is we're about to find that out.

 

[Riverumbbq]

My only worry is that McVay early in the season will really light a few teams up and all the quick scores will put the D on the field a LOT.

One of the side effects of tightening up the O that I liked (maybe the only thing) was that it chewed up clock and didn't let other explosive teams get into a rhythm.

That said, there's a peace in knowing you can score from anywhere. The 2018 team was like that and the GSOT teams were def like that.

May depend on which McVay we get in 2021. Will he go pass crazy trying to take the top off teams because he now has so many offensive receiving weapons plus Stafford or will he try to balance the clock with what should also be a very effective rushing game. Time management, as you've made clear, will be essential in maintaining a steady defense which could collapse late in the game if exhausted, ... McVay is likely tempted by his abundance of offensive toys, staying the course is going to require some patience on his part.
These next couple of seasons could be magical so long as we avoid injuries, can't wait for the camp reports to start coming in ...

 

[SuperMan28]

The one who plays the biggest role on beating Tom Brady will be my favorite.

 

[NJRamsFan]

Knock off the passive aggressive bullshit. If you need clarity on this, feel free to PM a moderator.

No u

 

[NJRamsFan]

It was in a previous thread not related to this thread. The Rams were the first to use a certain analytics company and they used them extensively due to their multi-facited information. Other teams are now starting to use them but the Rams lean more heavily on modern information and play time data.

I didn’t get a chance to see that one. And I’m not doubting the rams heavily utilize these things just find it mind boggling that other multi billion dollar organizations aren’t doing the same

 

[Memento]

No u

 

[NJRamsFan]

Hit em with the

 

[Memento]

Hit em with the
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