Covid 19 thread

[Allen2McVay]

Much of the information on this thread is accurate but it’s being presented in a misleading way.

Another thing that makes any U.S. COVID discussion difficult is that the U.S. response to COVID has not been a National response but a state-by-state response.

It’s important to consider Then vs. Now. Two months ago vs. one month ago vs. now, things were different.

For example, there was a time when NYS represented more than 50% of the U.S. deaths. Now, the NYS deaths are 25% of the U.S. deaths.

Another important stat is the positive test percentage. States that opened up too early (i.e., did not follow the guidelines for 2 week reductions in positives, hospitalizations, incubations and deaths) and are now dealing with significant spikes, currently have positive test percentages of 15-25%.

By comparison NYS, which mostly did follow the guidelines before beginning a phased-in reopening, has seen positive test percentages at or near 1% for a month now.

Of course things can change on a dime.

 

[Ramhusker]

I think you're being unreasonably angry because you are dead set on the belief that the masks are the culprit. And the patriot in me defends our country, and looks a bit deeper than what the media spin is creating. There is no comparison to our beloved country, however if one chooses to engage in that I recommend looking at the death rate %, where we are much lower than many for which are represented as being more compliant. As always, I thank you for your service to our country, and mean no disrespect of it.
The tragedy in the USA boils down to 2 major issues,
1. The inability to control the wildfire that was the New York City proper
2. The utter disgrace of how elders were returned to long term care facilities/nursing homes/assisted living centers
That wasnt Utah's fault, or Alaska, Idaho etc...

I have to agree. What went on in NY with the nursing homes could be considered manslaughter. It disgusts me still.

 

[norcalramfan]

Note the date.

Chloroquine is a potent inhibitor of SARS coronavirus infection and spread - Virology Journal

Background Severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) is caused by a newly discovered coronavirus (SARS-CoV). No effective prophylactic or post-exposure therapy is currently available. Results We report, however, that chloroquine has strong antiviral effects on SARS-CoV infection of primate cells...

virologyj.biomedcentral.com

 

[XXXIVwin]

in that region there have been a reported 184 million deaths, as opposed to the 124 mill here in the USA

Think you might be overstating it a bit here

(Just kidding man)

 

[dieterbrock]

Is this a thread about COVID-19, or is this a hidden politics thread where people are just backing into their corners and trying to act like it’s not all politics when it is?

Ah, so that's your angle? Got it.
And your lack of addressing your mistake in grossly mis-quoting, and passing insults as you did, says a lot about your character
My POV is crystal clear, supported by fact after fact. If you read what I have written, over and over, its not difficult to understand.
I find it ignorant and offensive for people to broadbrush the USA as one entity, and as a failing one at that.
Like being an accused homer for a team, as we defend our team and players, I offer the same reasoning for the country I love. And love more than any sports team.
I also have seen more sacrifices made by people than ever before. The world literally stopped, and without resistance complied with stay at home orders. Businesses destroyed, education levels dropped, unemployment sky rocketed and many who kept their jobs have seen their pay decreased while workload increased. We shut our doors and followed orders.
So F-U to those who want to criticize America. We are United States, and many, if not most states have reported very low numbers. This is a horrible epidemic that is affecting the globe like no other. The desire to make our country a Villain in this makes me sick.
The USA has not done a poor job, we are doing the best we can.

 

[Merlin]

IMO the biggest problem is the reporting. It is standing in the way of a real look at what we have and where we're at.

The news wants me to believe that China has far fewer infected than the US. But I find that extremely unlikely. Also the US numbers represent what I believe to be a money grab by the medical business at large, where they have shamelessly gamed all of this in their favor.

As a result we still don't know enough about the potency of this virus IMO. And that's a fucking problem because we're going to reach that point maybe soon where our cure is worse than the actual disease.

 

[oldnotdead]

Yes less than 2 weeks prior she was tested and was negative then. But AZ has a lot of people who simply don't take the situation seriously. Only constant testing and heightened awareness are required these days.

 

[bluecoconuts]

Ah, so that's your angle? Got it.
And your lack of addressing your mistake in grossly mis-quoting, and passing insults as you did, says a lot about your character
My POV is crystal clear, supported by fact after fact. If you read what I have written, over and over, its not difficult to understand.
I find it ignorant and offensive for people to broadbrush the USA as one entity, and as a failing one at that.
Like being an accused homer for a team, as we defend our team and players, I offer the same reasoning for the country I love. And love more than any sports team.
I also have seen more sacrifices made by people than ever before. The world literally stopped, and without resistance complied with stay at home orders. Businesses destroyed, education levels dropped, unemployment sky rocketed and many who kept their jobs have seen their pay decreased while workload increased. We shut our doors and followed orders.
So F-U to those who want to criticize America. We are United States, and many, if not most states have reported very low numbers. This is a horrible epidemic that is affecting the globe like no other. The desire to make our country a Villain in this makes me sick.
The USA has not done a poor job, we are doing the best we can.

Yes, I accidentally mistook you for another poster who's making similar arguments with a similar name. We can pretend like that's a big deal, and then I can point out that only days ago I provided sources for information that someone requested, and then you claimed that I didn't ever post sources. So even if that's the wrong poster, you've still made a mistake. I guess that totally invalidates everything? Or is it not actually relevant to the discussion? You let me know, I'm happy to hammer on every little typo and mistake if that's how you feel you need to debate.

My angle isn't politics, my angle is simple, I want to go back to normal, I want people to take things seriously so I can stop having to wear PPE all the time, and deal with all this other bullshit, and actually go out to bars and restaurants and games and other events. I'm not an idiot though, and I can see a spade for a spade.

Your POV not crystal clear either, nor are you debating in an honest way. Yes, you can pull out data and graphs and post it, and that's good, it's a good way to support an argument. However, as pointed out, it's how you're presenting it is the issue. I know what the attempt is, and it works on most people because they see data and assume that is that, they don't know how to read it, nor do they have any actual interest in doing so. However, it fails when you're talking to someone who understands how to analyse raw data and pick relevant data points from unnecessary ones, which so happens to be a major part of my job.

So yes, it is true that NYC was hit harder than anyone else in the United States. However that is not relevant data to the conversation of how to control the virus right now because they are not the problem area.

And yes, everyone made sacrifices for the country in terms of staying home and everything. So how about instead of "Fuck you" to those who want to point out that the pandemic is not done and we need to keep doing the right thing so we can get past this, maybe a big "fuck you" to those who want to just throw out everything that we've done because they just don't give a shit anymore.

This isn't a joke, people are dying. A 17 year old cancer survivor with a compromised immune system just died in Florida because her anti-mask wearing mother thought it would be good to go to a "coming out party" at a local church, and then for her first week tried to treat her with Hydroxychloroquine instead of taking her to a hospital until it was too late. So yeah, I'm going to paint people who refuse to do the right thing and the fact that our country is still having cases in the numbers that we are still as bad.

Because it sure as shit aint good.

 

[Mojo Ram]

The 1987 movie “Broadcast News” holds up really well and tackles this subject.

As does the more recent "Nightcrawler" film...minus the psycho protagonist.

 

[XXXIVwin]

Ah, so that's your angle? Got it.
And your lack of addressing your mistake in grossly mis-quoting, and passing insults as you did, says a lot about your character
My POV is crystal clear, supported by fact after fact. If you read what I have written, over and over, its not difficult to understand.
I find it ignorant and offensive for people to broadbrush the USA as one entity, and as a failing one at that.
Like being an accused homer for a team, as we defend our team and players, I offer the same reasoning for the country I love. And love more than any sports team.
I also have seen more sacrifices made by people than ever before. The world literally stopped, and without resistance complied with stay at home orders. Businesses destroyed, education levels dropped, unemployment sky rocketed and many who kept their jobs have seen their pay decreased while workload increased. We shut our doors and followed orders.
So F-U to those who want to criticize America. We are United States, and many, if not most states have reported very low numbers. This is a horrible epidemic that is affecting the globe like no other. The desire to make our country a Villain in this makes me sick.
The USA has not done a poor job, we are doing the best we can.

It’s a painful topic for all of us.

Painful, confusing, and frustrating.

Cheers man.

 

[dieterbrock]

Yes, I accidentally mistook you for another poster who's making similar arguments with a similar name. We can pretend like that's a big deal, and then I can point out that only days ago I provided sources for information that someone requested, and then you claimed that I didn't ever post sources. So even if that's the wrong poster, you've still made a mistake. I guess that totally invalidates everything? Or is it not actually relevant to the discussion? You let me know, I'm happy to hammer on every little typo and mistake if that's how you feel you need to debate.

Coward.
You can’t even own up to a mistake like a man.
Whatever.
It’s a tough world out there buttercup. I’ll stick to discussing with folks who are competent enough to actually read what others write.

 

[Mackeyser]

Coward.
You can’t even own up to a mistake like a man.
Whatever.
It’s a tough world out there buttercup. I’ll stick to discussing with folks who are competent enough to actually read what others write.

You both been dancing on this line, but this posts jumps way over. It’s a direct attack on another poster and it’s not remotely ok.

We don’t have to agree but we do have to get along.

 

[Mojo Ram]

@bluecoconuts @dieterbrock

I would suggest a break from each other and maybe this thread for a day or two. At the very least, cool off before posting. This is a thread that i and many others don't want locked.

 

[SteezyEndo]

Did anyone read about a withdraw from the WHO?.

 

[Mojo Ram]

The coronavirus is ushering in a new era of surveillance at work

https://www.axios.com/companies-sur...rus-b2394e03-63c3-4dee-a8fe-f5594019d170.html

As companies continue to prepare for the return of their employees to the workplace, they're weighing new types of surveillance in the name of safety.

Why it matters: Just as the coronavirus pandemic has acted as an accelerant for the adoption of remote work, it has also normalized increased surveillance and data collection. In the post-pandemic workplace, our bosses will know a lot more about us than they used to.

What's happening: "We're in this new era of biodata collection," says Amy Webb of the Future Today Institute.

A majority of employers, 51%, have begun or are planning to begin collecting temperature data on employees, according to survey data from Gartner provided to Axios.

• 60% are collecting self-reported data from employees on symptoms, and another 25% are asking employees to report who they've been in contact with. And 5% of firms say they're going as far as collecting workers' medical histories.
• "It is all a form of surveillance," says Brian Kropp, head of Gartner's human resources practice.
• "I think most of it doesn’t have nefarious intent," Webb says. "But, that being said, we don’t have clarity on how these data might be accessed by an insurer, for example. There isn't enough regulation or transparency around where data are being stored."

Another form of pandemic-era surveillance that's gaining popularity is the use of temperature-reading infrared cameras to watch over workers and customers.

• "When the pandemic took hold, I started seeing more and more companies like Amazon using this technology to help identify sick people in their warehouses. Thermal imaging cameras are beginning to appear in Subway restaurants. Carnival Cruise Lines, whose ships became hot spots for the virus’s spread, said all passengers and crew would be screened when it began sailing again," the New York Times' Jonah Kessel writes.
• These cameras are not always accurate and raise a whole host of privacy concerns.

And even those who work from home may have to deal with a rise in surveillance.

• Since the start of the pandemic, a slew of companies have asked their newly remote employees to install software that tracks their mouse movements or keystrokes — or which webpages they visit as a way — to ensure they're being productive, NPR reports.

What to watch: Past studies have shown us that many workers aren't willing to put up with employer data collection. In a 2019 Gartner survey, 23% of workers said it was unacceptable for employers to ask for medical data.

• But now, the desire to stay safe at work could quickly change those opinions and clear the lane for robust workplace surveillance.

 

[bluecoconuts]

Coward.
You can’t even own up to a mistake like a man.
Whatever.
It’s a tough world out there buttercup. I’ll stick to discussing with folks who are competent enough to actually read what others write.

Uh, yeah, I said I mistook you for another poster, that is admitting a mistake.

You wanna chat gloves off, bring it to PMs.


Sorry, @Mojo Ram, but if y'all are going to allow that type of trash comment to stick, I'm going to respond to it, has absolutely no place and had absolutely nothing to do with the topic or discussion at hand.

 

[Mojo Ram]

Sorry, @Mojo Ram, but if y'all are going to allow that type of trash comment to stick, I'm going to respond to it, has absolutely no place and had absolutely nothing to do with the topic or discussion at hand.

That's fine, deleting posts is not my favorite thing to do and generally opens a pandora's box of having to delete even more posts. I had hoped that a public warning would do the job.

Fact remains that you both need to cool off or take a break. The next "last word in" will draw some official time off.

 

[Dieter the Brock]

As does the more recent "Nightcrawler" film...minus the psycho protagonist.

Nightcrawler is fucking good

It’s like Network part 2

 

[XXXIVwin]

Here’s an update to a graph I posted about a week ago, comparing new cases in the USA vs. new cases in the European Union. Granted, “fatalities“ is a more important statistic than “new cases”. But with a huge surge in new cases, deaths tend to follow.

The discrepancy is only going to get WORSE in the weeks ahead. The EU is flatlining and the USA is skyrocketing with no end in sight.

To those with whom I respectfully disagree in this thread:
I’m a “fan” of the USA just like I’m a fan of the Rams. I don’t take pleasure in these awful numbers— just the opposite, it’s frightening and disturbing. [During the Fisher era, I loved the Rams but questioned the decisions made by leadership. By the same token, during this crisis, I want only the best for the USA, but seriously question the decisions made by leadership.]

One has to twist oneself into a pretzel trying to explain away this graph. As we move into the coming months, is there really any question as to which region— the EU or the USA— is going to fare better?

We’re all football fans here. We all appreciate the simplicity of the scoreboard. It’s a freaking blowout.

The Graphic Truth: The US pandemic is totally different (and much worse) than the EU's

The United States and the European Union have comparable population sizes, but the trajectories of their COVID-19 outbreaks have been vastly different. Data recently released by the European Center for Disease Control and Prevention shows that while new COVID cases in the EU are 82 percent lower...

www.gzeromedia.com

 

[kurtfaulk]

The coronavirus is ushering in a new era of surveillance at work

https://www.axios.com/companies-sur...rus-b2394e03-63c3-4dee-a8fe-f5594019d170.html

As companies continue to prepare for the return of their employees to the workplace, they're weighing new types of surveillance in the name of safety.

Why it matters: Just as the coronavirus pandemic has acted as an accelerant for the adoption of remote work, it has also normalized increased surveillance and data collection. In the post-pandemic workplace, our bosses will know a lot more about us than they used to.

What's happening: "We're in this new era of biodata collection," says Amy Webb of the Future Today Institute.

A majority of employers, 51%, have begun or are planning to begin collecting temperature data on employees, according to survey data from Gartner provided to Axios.

• 60% are collecting self-reported data from employees on symptoms, and another 25% are asking employees to report who they've been in contact with. And 5% of firms say they're going as far as collecting workers' medical histories.
• "It is all a form of surveillance," says Brian Kropp, head of Gartner's human resources practice.
• "I think most of it doesn’t have nefarious intent," Webb says. "But, that being said, we don’t have clarity on how these data might be accessed by an insurer, for example. There isn't enough regulation or transparency around where data are being stored."

Another form of pandemic-era surveillance that's gaining popularity is the use of temperature-reading infrared cameras to watch over workers and customers.

• "When the pandemic took hold, I started seeing more and more companies like Amazon using this technology to help identify sick people in their warehouses. Thermal imaging cameras are beginning to appear in Subway restaurants. Carnival Cruise Lines, whose ships became hot spots for the virus’s spread, said all passengers and crew would be screened when it began sailing again," the New York Times' Jonah Kessel writes.
• These cameras are not always accurate and raise a whole host of privacy concerns.

And even those who work from home may have to deal with a rise in surveillance.

• Since the start of the pandemic, a slew of companies have asked their newly remote employees to install software that tracks their mouse movements or keystrokes — or which webpages they visit as a way — to ensure they're being productive, NPR reports.

What to watch: Past studies have shown us that many workers aren't willing to put up with employer data collection. In a 2019 Gartner survey, 23% of workers said it was unacceptable for employers to ask for medical data.

• But now, the desire to stay safe at work could quickly change those opinions and clear the lane for robust workplace surveillance.

Every new crisis, whether real or manufactured, brings the world closer to the "1984" type nightmare.

Our civil rights get picked away at bit by bit. Just so we can get used to the new normal, which is always worse than the previous normal.

We know what's coming. The new vaccine will have a microchip so we all can be easily tracked. 5G will be the tracker, every pole around the world will have an antenna sooner or later.

The new world order is coming and we aren't gonna like it.

.