Covid 19 thread

[Loyal]

Honest question here and I think the answer and the whole train of thought is quite sad. But how can you expect people in this country to have an honest and thoughtful debate anymore? Most people would rather assign hateful adjectives to somebody than open up their minds to have a discushion. Most people will look at a headline and grab one stat from it and run with that when a further dig into the numbers will show you a vastly different story than the big money headline, sensationalism sells and people refuse outside thought. We’re truly in a sad state in this country. Best of luck to you and apologies if I helped drag you back in here even if it was just for a minute. Everybody knows I rarely participate in this thread.

Covid thread homer

 

[Loyal]

Spot on. Healthy dialogue seems to have almost completely exited our country. In its place, we accuse each of other of lying, call each other names, we “whatabout”, we cherry-pick, and we straw-man.

Disinformation flies around at the speed of information and seems to get at least equal amplification.

A long long time ago, I was waiting tables and Bob Costas came in. I smothered him asking questions and trying to pick his brain.

What he told me has stuck with me.

He said that there are two ways to get attention in this country. One is to be consistent, level headed, and to be really lucky. The other is to have such an outlandish take on things that you call attention to yourself. That this second way is the shortcut that we see happen so much in the media. No one wants to be patient and hope they get lucky - they want the attention now so they say things they don’t really mean.

I think we see a lot of this. The loudest voices on both sides of most issues are the extreme voices. And they are so loud, that the measured responses get muted out.

I don’t know the fix, but I’d love to be able to mute out the extremes some how.

The same Bob Costas that derided the LA Dodgers as having the weakest starting line up in history before the 1988 World Series, vs. the Mighty A's. Loved seeing him eating his outlandish take! Even Lasorda said they used his comments as bulletin board material during the series....lol

 

[12intheBox]

The same Bob Costas that derided the LA Dodgers as having the weakest starting line up in history before the 1988 World Series, vs. the Mighty A's. Loved seeing him eating his outlandish take! Even Lasorda said they used his comments as bulletin board material during the series....lol

The Dodgers suck donkey dick. Always have - always will.

 

[Loyal]

The Dodgers suck donkey dick. Always have - always will.

You are displeasing the Great Dodger in the Sky. Say 10 Tommy Lasordas and 15 Walter Alstons as penance, and avoid the Cardinals at all costs.

 

[12intheBox]

You are displeasing the Great Dodger in the Sky. Say 10 Tommy Lasordas and 15 Walter Alstons as penance, and avoid the Cardinals at all costs.

The slim fast guy? What does he have to do with this?

 

[bluecoconuts]

And then there's me, a Kupp loving, Goff supporting guy who always right and should always be listened to.

 

[Mackeyser]

With all due respect, I have my detailed understanding as you have. I would never think I am teaching you anything. I trust you have done your footwork as passionate as you are. That I hope you know is a compliment.

FACT:

The mask PROTECTS oneself 30-65%. The best I have seen for mask protecting others is 70%. Respectable amount.

Together the best info I have found is two people wearing masks protect each other is 98.5%.

So I will ask you again, why is the narrative one way? It PROTECTS both of us enough to make it part of the narrative. But it is not.

I too consider myself as a Constitutionalist as you have alluded to for yourself. But you have to wonder why the overwhelming one way narrative.

I use common sense with the guidelines we have been given and the environment I am in. I am not wearing a mask and gloves driving alone in my car. I also don't walk like a grey back in the store without a mask. This is an easy one for me.

Then I’m confused what the argument is?

Ive never said peeps need to wear them by themselves or even alone outside as COVID-19 isn’t an airborne virus.

My sole purpose in repeating myself as I have is that many continue to either misapply data or not know and then make “common sense” judgments based off that.

The mistake: “I don’t have COVID-19. Why should I wear a mask when it doesn’t protect me?“

The correction: “Well you can’t truly know because by the time you get your test results presuming your just had a test, unless you fully quarantined, you may have contracted it, ESPECIALLY if you weren’t wearing a mask. Also, the mask isn’t to protect you, it’s to protect others from you.”

So, if you agree with that, then we agree. Not sure I understand the issue...

 

[Mackeyser]

Well Mack, that's why I have the signature that I do.

on my phone, I don’t see signatures... I don’t know what it is.

 

[Mackeyser]

well, you're wrong. I'm a historian that believes in context. My original post had more to do with the severity of the crisis. It doesn't approach the severity of the Spanish Flu, regardless of the era. Global communications are good, but it also spreads fear like a wildfire. As for your previous post and this one, fear is a weapon against liberty. It just is. Trading security for safety is a good way to flex authoritarian muscles of the state. And I could give a shyte if you cast a judgmental eye if I don't bow down to the mob in a year's time, and it won't be just me.

In the absolute, that’s a Sui Juris argument and it’s both beyond the scope of this forum and one I just disagree with. No right or liberty is absolute. We can argue where the lines are, but if the argument starts and ends at “my rights are absolute”, then that argument inherently obviates society.

Both power and liberty inherently must have limits in a society in order for a society to exist. Heck, the entire purpose of laws is to govern behavior which by definition confines liberty.

As for the 1918 flu, if you’d like to make points based on historical events and science that tell us that the outcome was inevitable and then use those same tools to make your point about COVID-19, I’d be glad to read them.

I mean, the Spanish flu was different and more virulent in part because of how it spread. That’s important.

My point is that you cannot just use data from periods 100 years apart without context. With money they account for inflation and appreciation of assets.

I know you know this and this was the exception I took.

 

[Mackeyser]

The Dodgers suck donkey dick. Always have - always will.

Dodgers rule!

[insert Kirk Gibson HR here]

 

[Mackeyser]

And so survival of the fittest (which is not me) is an outmoded idea? We better get word to all HS biology classes about that change,,

I didn’t say that.

I said that it obviated society.

The societal equivalent of Darwinism is Eugenics and I don’t think any of us wants to go there.

Actually, prolly none of us should so as to keep the thread open...

So... um... think it’ll be a mild hurricane season this year?

 

[-X-]

Yeah, this is getting out of hand now.

Zerohedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

Florida health officials left COVID-19 trackers slackjawed on Sunday when it reported more than 15k new infections in just 24 hours on Sunday (the data were gleaned from the prior day). But as hospitalizations surge, questions have grown about whether the state is still trying to 'juke' its data, something that a now infamous whistleblower alleged before she was fired (she has since started her own COVID-19 data portal relying on public info).

Journalists scouring the reams of daily data for discrepancies have apparently happened upon bombshell they had been hoping for: Orlando Health has just confirmed that some of the data it shared over the weekend were wrong, after journalists reported more than 50 labs showing 100% positivity rate, or roughly around there. One local Fox affiliate looked into the numbers and contacted a few of the labs to confirm that their internal data matched the public data released by the state.

As it turned out, some of these discrepancies were pretty extreme: Orlando Health, one of the organizations contacted by Fox, confirmed that it's positivity rate was actually 9.8%, not the 98% that had been reported to the state.

Coronavirus Cases Up The report showed that Orlando Health had a 98 percent positivity rate. However, when FOX 35 News contacted the hospital, they confirmed errors in the report. Orlando Health's positivity rate is only 9.4 percent, not 98 percent as in the report.

The Orlando VA confirmed a similar discrepancy.

The report also showed that the Orlando Veteran’s Medical Center had a positivity rate of 76%. A spokesperson for the VA told FOX 35 News on Tuesday that this does not reflect their numbers and that the positivity rate for the center is actually 6 percent.

FOX 35 is still waiting to hear back from the Florida Department of Health about an explanation for these errors. Readers can maybe find some comfort in the fact that these errors likely exaggerated the statewide positivity rate, but still: With the state's handling of the response coming under such intense scrutiny - and with Gov DeSantis admitting that reopening bars so quickly was a mistake - sees errors point to a culture of carelessness that Floridians might find extremely discouraging, especially now that their state is home to the new national epicenter (Miami).

 

[Loyal]

I didn’t say that.

I said that it obviated society.

The societal equivalent of Darwinism is Eugenics and I don’t think any of us wants to go there.

Actually, prolly none of us should so as to keep the thread open...

So... um... think it’ll be a mild hurricane season this year?

Historically, no. The movement along this line was actually called social darwinism and it was in vogue in the early 20th century.

Eugenics was certainly an odious, active, quasi 'scientific' endeavor. Margaret Sanger was a big proponent of eliminating blacks through targeted abortion, i.e. "Family planning." She was one of the Eugenics chicks and Hitler loved that crap.

No. Hell no I'm not talking about eugenics IN THE LEAST. It's an observation from on high and isn't quite social darwinism, it's the idea that without any outward prodding, those with advantages through ability, power, technological superiority or resistance to disease, will conquer. *shrugs. I'm not an advocate of it, I just know historically this is true. Acknowledging it doesn't indicate support of it.

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

Yeah, this is getting out of hand now.

Zerohedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

Florida health officials left COVID-19 trackers slackjawed on Sunday when it reported more than 15k new infections in just 24 hours on Sunday (the data were gleaned from the prior day). But as hospitalizations surge, questions have grown about whether the state is still trying to 'juke' its data, something that a now infamous whistleblower alleged before she was fired (she has since started her own COVID-19 data portal relying on public info).

Journalists scouring the reams of daily data for discrepancies have apparently happened upon bombshell they had been hoping for: Orlando Health has just confirmed that some of the data it shared over the weekend were wrong, after journalists reported more than 50 labs showing 100% positivity rate, or roughly around there. One local Fox affiliate looked into the numbers and contacted a few of the labs to confirm that their internal data matched the public data released by the state.

As it turned out, some of these discrepancies were pretty extreme: Orlando Health, one of the organizations contacted by Fox, confirmed that it's positivity rate was actually 9.8%, not the 98% that had been reported to the state.



The Orlando VA confirmed a similar discrepancy.



FOX 35 is still waiting to hear back from the Florida Department of Health about an explanation for these errors. Readers can maybe find some comfort in the fact that these errors likely exaggerated the statewide positivity rate, but still: With the state's handling of the response coming under such intense scrutiny - and with Gov DeSantis admitting that reopening bars so quickly was a mistake - sees errors point to a culture of carelessness that Floridians might find extremely discouraging, especially now that their state is home to the new national epicenter (Miami).


View attachment 37387

Yeah it’s been out of hand for some time senor Dude, who the hell knows what to believe anymore?

Just isn’t quite the talking point to many whom frankly just don’t want to hear it.

I recall a saying from my past, “those that know...know,

Those that don’t?

They don’t care”

I blame it on that damn Elephant














(in the room)

 

[-X-]

Yeah it’s been out of hand for some time senor Dude, who the hell knows what to believe anymore?

Just isn’t quite the talking point to many whom frankly just don’t want to hear it.

I recall a saying from my past, “those that know...know,

Those that don’t?

They don’t care”

I blame it on that damn Elephant














(in the room)

You just call me an elephant?

 

[Dieter the Brock]

The numbers are all fucked up
We have no clue was the facts are

Nobody will really know the true extent of what is occurring for about 3 to 5 years.

* Both extremes of this argument accuse the other side of not having the facts but the numbers are just wrong all the way around. So I find it funny how people complain about the orange guy not having the facts straight when the facts they’re rocking are total bullshit too

What we do know:

30 million (reported to a MD) get the flu in the USA every year on average (much more unreported). The cost of unproductive work hours is enormous, and most of these get the annual flu shot.

Influenza, depending A or B is around .01 to near 1% death rate - relevant to the culture socioeconomic level.
C-19 could come in at around 1 to 1.5% death rate, even though the figures show 3-6% in some countries. Usually turns into Pneumonia for the socioeconomically disenfranchised.

There is a middle ground of rationality that nobody wants to meet. Our country is suffering because of this all or nothing mentality - you can read it in these posts. It’s unfortunate.

But the truth is more people are getting killed or dying in massive numbers by other diseases, social issues, street violence, bad diet, than are dying from C19. Not that C19 isn’t an issue, but the numbers people are using are not accurate.

I find it funny how everyone has fired our immune systems. And instead opted for hysteria.

Exercise. Eat well. Drink less. Don’t smoke. Be kind to others. Have lots of sex. Lower your stress levels. Done

See you all in October 2021

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

Yeah, watcha gonna do about it

Its always good seeing you around

 

[Loyal]

The numbers are all fucked up
We have no clue was the facts are

Nobody will really know the true extent of what is occurring for about 3 to 5 years.

* Both extremes of this argument accuse the other side of not having the facts but the numbers are just wrong all the way around. So I find it funny how people complain about the orange guy not having the facts straight when the facts they’re rocking are total bullshit too

What we do know:

30 million (reported to a MD) get the flu in the USA every year on average (much more unreported). The cost of unproductive work hours is enormous, and most of these get the annual flu shot.

Influenza, depending A or B is around .01 to near 1% death rate - relevant to the culture socioeconomic level.
C-19 could come in at around 1 to 1.5% death rate, even though the figures show 3-6% in some countries. Usually turns into Pneumonia for the socioeconomically disenfranchised.

There is a middle ground of rationality that nobody wants to meet. Our country is suffering because of this all or nothing mentality - you can read it in these posts. It’s unfortunate.

But the truth is more people are getting killed or dying in massive numbers by other diseases, social issues, street violence, bad diet, than are dying from C19. Not that C19 isn’t an issue, but the numbers people are using are not accurate.

I find it funny how everyone has fired our immune systems. And instead opted for hysteria.

Exercise. Eat well. Drink less. Don’t smoke. Be kind to others. Have lots of sex. Lower your stress levels. Done

See you all in October 2021

No, you can't escape that easily! We are your Taos, Dennis Hopper style!

 

[-X-]

Everyone: Da fuq you doin' over there, Florida?

Florida: