Coach Mcvay show (warning, Goff thread incoming)

[dieterbrock]

Are you comparing their games against the Bears? One was in Chicago on Thursday night, the other in LA on Monday - I'd imagine if the Rams had to play in Chicago on a short week the results would have been different.

I have no problem giving Goff credit where it's due - overall he's been awesome this year. But at the same time, he's the main reason for two of our losses - I'm wondering why people are so adverse to giving him blame.

You said if Brady played against the Dolphins, they would have won. That's fair
Conversely, if Goff played against the Bears, Tampa would have won
Its not complicated

 

[payote75]

Yeah had past tense, but even now he has me nervous. Just hope he really is the real deal. I guess we will see upcoming games how his play goes. I bet all eyes will be on him no doubt.

I'm not saying he isn't .. I'm just saying I'd like to have a back up plan incase he reached his ceiling. A young Sam Darnold who needs to sit on the bench for a year anyway to get his game back is a good thing. It may light a fire it may push Goff to that next level. I have not given up on him by any means just feel we have a lot invested and want a back up plan. I really don't want to waste AD's career.

 

[Ellard80]

They didn't stop running the ball against the Bills when they were losing by even more. It was bad coaching.

Besides that in the buffalo game they and 13 rushing attempts in the 2nd half and in the dolphins game they had 11...

Sooooo

 

[Ellard80]

Do you know what fronts the dolphins were in when we ran? Just wondering. If you can unequivocally say "yes we were successful running against cover zero" then I'll concede. However I suspect that we were more successful running when the dolphins were NOT in cover zero. So I'm guessing that what you saw was the Rams running when they didn't see cover zero and committing to passing when they did.

He abandoned running way to early though. I'll give you that. And probably still got too pass happy to an extent, But when you're down 28-7 running the ball into a stacked box when time isn't on your side is just bad football. And even worse, it puts jared in unfavorable long down and distance. And guess what happens when a shaky qb has unfavorable down and distance? Even more blitzing.

yeah soooooo i agree with some of your points.

play calls are dictated by scheme and personal - not what worked on the last play or an early play or whatever.

Running into a cover zero blitz isn't a high percentage... throwing a quick pass of some kind is your best action against a cover zero blitz... and that's what it seemed like they were trying.

How many times they ran or whatever or the rankings of the defense or any other stuff... it's not that simple.

if someone is going to blitz me with everyone - im going to make them fucking pay PERIOD

not go fetal with some kind of HB dive or whatever,,,, their perhaps where scheme problems or exeuction problems, the philosophy is EXACTLY what you should do at this level of football.. If you can't make them pay for a all out blitz at an NFL level then that is a big issue. This isn't high school wishbone football in 1971.


Also here is something to think about -- the fact that they were mugging the line of scrimmage was also about smothering the run as well.

 

[madrid311]

Shanahan and mcvay belive a good pocket qb can be developed into their system and compete At a high level. That's why Shanny wanted cousins instead of rg3. That's why he took garrapalo. Now that garrapalo is injury prone he will look elsewear for his qb. Mat Ryan or cousins on his wish list. Goff is the same to mcvay. It's why he is so mad that goff (who is an average qb that shows signs of being a really good qb to flashing he can be elite) still hasn't figured it out consistently. He's pissed about it. He's not mcvays qb remember.
It will be interesting to see how this plays out in the next year or so.

 

[FrantikRam]

You said if Brady played against the Dolphins, they would have won. That's fair
Conversely, if Goff played against the Bears, Tampa would have won
Its not complicated

Okay that's fine - Goff has had better games than Brady.

But overall, we would be much better with Brady at QB than Goff. He's a better player. Making that point because Goff absolutely deserves the lions share of the blame for these last two losses.

You seem to come to Goff's defense a lot - do you have no issue with an NFL QB turning the ball over four times? Are you not concerned?

 

[dieterbrock]

Okay that's fine - Goff has had better games than Brady.

But overall, we would be much better with Brady at QB than Goff. He's a better player. Making that point because Goff absolutely deserves the lions share of the blame for these last two losses.

You seem to come to Goff's defense a lot - do you have no issue with an NFL QB turning the ball over four times? Are you not concerned?

Why are you making an argument that isnt there? Goff played like shit and they lost. Get over it already.
He also played great against a Chicago team that has been destroying QB's this season. (Like Brady)
As for the defending him stuff? Well, of course I'll defend him, he's our QB and the best we've had since Warner, and the best team we've had since the GSOT. Unlike the GSOT, this team is going on 4th straight winning season and should continue for years to come

 

[dieterbrock]

He's not mcvays qb remember.

He sure is McVay's QB. If he wasnt, Goff wouldnt have gotten that massive extension.

 

[Reddog99]

He sure is McVay's QB. If he wasnt, Goff wouldnt have gotten that massive extension.

I could be wrong but back when the Rams first hired Mcvay its seems like i remember him saying himself that Jarred Goff was one of the main things that attracted him to the Rams. If correct id say he's definitely his QB.

 

[nighttrain]

I could be wrong but back when the Rams first hired Mcvay its seems like i remember him saying himself that Jarred Goff was one of the main things that attracted him to the Rams.

i believe that is correct
train

 

[Merlin]

You guys can keep going back and forth on this all you want but cover 0 is about the QB. When you see cover 0 the answer is going to be beating them over the top. Period. If you want a head coach who is going to mash his RB into cover 0 looks you want another head coach, someone like Jeff Fisher. McVay is going to have his offense and his QB answer by checking out of any run play even if it's dialed up and trying to beat it over the top.

Sorry but that's just the truth here. You see some positive runs early and think "oh well that will keep happening." But it probably wouldn't keep happening. Because you have a very low percentage chance to beat those extra defenders. This is why basic offensive football with a capable QB includes a check to pass when he sees zero, with a mental note that he'd better be on his hot route which will allow him to get the ball out. And sometimes he can take a shot too if he likes the matchup here or there btw, but getting the ball out fast is an absolute requirement you can't fuck around.

The Dolphins went balls out to force the game into Goff's hands. McVay could have run the ball every play, sure. But no offensive mind is going to shit his pants and go into a full shell during a game and change the way he does business because "OMG WHAT IF MY QB PLAYS LIKE A ROOKIE?" That is some bitch ass gameday approach IMO. It looks great after the game for the playcalling crowd, and after his QB had a fucking meltdown. But it's not something anyone is going to do. Coaches who allow a defense to dictate to them by running cover 0 won't last long in this league.

 

[Liberator]

Besides that in the buffalo game they and 13 rushing attempts in the 2nd half and in the dolphins game they had 11...

Sooooo

Fair enough but I think the Rams should have never let goff throw 61 times. It's that simple. That's way too much for a mistake prone QB who is clearly having a horrible day.

 

[Ram_Rally]

You guys can keep going back and forth on this all you want but cover 0 is about the QB. When you see cover 0 the answer is going to be beating them over the top. Period. If you want a head coach who is going to mash his RB into cover 0 looks you want another head coach, someone like Jeff Fisher. McVay is going to have his offense and his QB answer by checking out of any run play even if it's dialed up and trying to beat it over the top.

Sorry but that's just the truth here. You see some positive runs early and think "oh well that will keep happening." But it probably wouldn't keep happening. Because you have a very low percentage chance to beat those extra defenders. This is why basic offensive football with a capable QB includes a check to pass when he sees zero, with a mental note that he'd better be on his hot route which will allow him to get the ball out. And sometimes he can take a shot too if he likes the matchup here or there btw, but getting the ball out fast is an absolute requirement you can't fuck around.

The Dolphins went balls out to force the game into Goff's hands. McVay could have run the ball every play, sure. But no offensive mind is going to shit his pants and go into a full shell during a game and change the way he does business because "OMG WHAT IF MY QB PLAYS LIKE A ROOKIE?" That is some bitch ass gameday approach IMO. It looks great after the game for the playcalling crowd, and after his QB had a fucking meltdown. But it's not something anyone is going to do. Coaches who allow a defense to dictate to them by running cover 0 won't last long in this league.

THANK YOU

 

[kurtfaulk]

This is why basic offensive football with a capable QB includes a check to pass when he sees zero, with a mental note that he'd better be on his hot route which will allow him to get the ball out. And sometimes he can take a shot too if he likes the matchup here or there btw, but getting the ball out fast is an absolute requirement you can't fuck around.

this 100%.

if another team tries to use that shit again and goff doesn't make them pay i'm gonna be very upset. well he doesn't have to make them pay but he certainly can't turn the ball over.

surely they have to use these looks at practice every week, especially after what happened to them in the superbowl and all of last season. i'm astounded that goff didn't know what to do when the phins d brought it to him.

.

 

[gogoat1]

THANK YOU

Running the ball every down is not what fans like me are talking about. Its simply not running the ball a lot more in the first half. I have said it before, if the Rams ran the ball on the plays that accounted for the Rams first 2 turnovers they do not happen and the Rams end up with points. It snowballed. Rams run when they should, Goff simply has a "off" game in a ugly win rather than a all time terrible game.
If this were a game against a team with a potent offense I can see passing on all those cover 0s. But Miami with a first time starter never had a shot at running up the score unless we did something stupid, and we did.
I am a pass first guy, always have been. But I am even more about simply doing whatever gives you the best, most secure chance to win the game. And most of the time, a heave dose of the run is just that.
WAY MORE THINGS have to go right on a passing play than running play. Its simple math. Running play all that has to happen is the O linemen blast the guy in front of them and the simple hand off is made.
On a passing play the QB has to drop back, O linemen have to hold onto their block for a long time, receiver has to get off the line and into his route on time, QB has to read the defense, has to make a accurate throw, receiver has to see the pass, catch the pass and run up field.
Simple math.
And since the Rams have not deep threat to stretch the field, put some fear in the back of their minds it multi ply's the simple math theory in the wrong direction.

 

[Tano]

You guys can keep going back and forth on this all you want but cover 0 is about the QB. When you see cover 0 the answer is going to be beating them over the top. Period. If you want a head coach who is going to mash his RB into cover 0 looks you want another head coach, someone like Jeff Fisher. McVay is going to have his offense and his QB answer by checking out of any run play even if it's dialed up and trying to beat it over the top.

Sorry but that's just the truth here. You see some positive runs early and think "oh well that will keep happening." But it probably wouldn't keep happening. Because you have a very low percentage chance to beat those extra defenders. This is why basic offensive football with a capable QB includes a check to pass when he sees zero, with a mental note that he'd better be on his hot route which will allow him to get the ball out. And sometimes he can take a shot too if he likes the matchup here or there btw, but getting the ball out fast is an absolute requirement you can't fuck around.

The Dolphins went balls out to force the game into Goff's hands. McVay could have run the ball every play, sure. But no offensive mind is going to shit his pants and go into a full shell during a game and change the way he does business because "OMG WHAT IF MY QB PLAYS LIKE A ROOKIE?" That is some bitch ass gameday approach IMO. It looks great after the game for the playcalling crowd, and after his QB had a fucking meltdown. But it's not something anyone is going to do. Coaches who allow a defense to dictate to them by running cover 0 won't last long in this league.

What? You never saw Waterboy where the QB kneeled on every play on one series early in the second half.

 

[Ram_Rally]

Running the ball every down is not what fans like me are talking about. Its simply not running the ball a lot more in the first half. I have said it before, if the Rams ran the ball on the plays that accounted for the Rams first 2 turnovers they do not happen and the Rams end up with points. It snowballed. Rams run when they should, Goff simply has a "off" game in a ugly win rather than a all time terrible game.
If this were a game against a team with a potent offense I can see passing on all those cover 0s. But Miami with a first time starter never had a shot at running up the score unless we did something stupid, and we did.
I am a pass first guy, always have been. But I am even more about simply doing whatever gives you the best, most secure chance to win the game. And most of the time, a heave dose of the run is just that.
WAY MORE THINGS have to go right on a passing play than running play. Its simple math. Running play all that has to happen is the O linemen blast the guy in front of them and the simple hand off is made.
On a passing play the QB has to drop back, O linemen have to hold onto their block for a long time, receiver has to get off the line and into his route on time, QB has to read the defense, has to make a accurate throw, receiver has to see the pass, catch the pass and run up field.
Simple math.
And since the Rams have not deep threat to stretch the field, put some fear in the back of their minds it multi ply's the simple math theory in the wrong direction.

I agree with you. We got way too pass happy. But we have to remember that the dolphins sold out to stop the run because they knew we'd try and pound the rock and they knew our offense struggled against pressure. Running into that is playing right into their hands.

Brockers was asked how an offense can beat a cover zero and he basically responded "hit them with one or two big plays and they'll back out of it".

 

[Bootleg]

I could be wrong but back when the Rams first hired Mcvay its seems like i remember him saying himself that Jarred Goff was one of the main things that attracted him to the Rams. If correct id say he's definitely his QB.

Yes he did say that.

And beyond that, Goff got the mega-dollar, multi-year contract precisely because he was McVay's guy. If he wasn't, McVay would have looked elsewhere once Goff's rookie deal was up.

 

[ramsince62]

When McVay was asked what Goff needs to do better he said “urgency and preparation”

He didn’t play with urgency. And he didn’t prepare himself well enough to deal with what was coming at him. He sees 6 guys rushing him and he knows he only has 5 guys blocking. Hello! Get your head out of your rear end Jared.

McVay said he needs to do a better job of not putting the team in a position where they will make mistakes. In other words, if he puts Goff in a position to make mistakes, Goff will surely make them.

After 5 years, McVay can’t trust Goff to not make mistakes in difficult situations.

Not really sure what the Rams can here, but they need to stop trading first round picks moving forward.

I've always described Goff as a "tweener", he's servicable with adequate OL support but will likely never carry the team on his shoulders. He is what he is, the numbers and results speak for them selves, he's got the numbers to support this conclusion. He's somewhere around 13 or 14th in the league. I don't see any reason to assume he'll ever rise much above that, certainly not a top 10n this league.