The Goff-season Thread

[Merlin]

In before merge.

 

[XXXIVwin]

Just spitballin’ here, but...

Maybe Snead and McVay think that “the market for Goff” won’t be affected much by what they say about him?

And maybe other GM’s will have their own opinions of his value based on five years of tape?

And some fakey platitudes from McVay won’t enhance his trade value much?

I dunno, it does indeed seem like McSnead is putting up a giant lit-up neon sign that says “Goff available for trade.” But maybe they don’t think it will enhance his trade value to talk about how great they think he is, because other teams would just think the praise was transparent BS?

I dunno, just spitballin...

 

[XXXIVwin]

I'm frustrated with Goff but I'm not THIS frustrated. Sheesh.

I’ll admit it. I was. Still am.

Glad that Goff had gritty games against both Sea. and GB. But Goff’s regression this year led me to say “Fuck it” after 4 years of rooting for the guy.

 

[TSFH Fan]

Couple of rambling bits of nonsense:


(1) Hey, remember this guy?


View: https://twitter.com/camdasilva/status/1090620613260132353?s=20


That Goff got up on a podium and made a personal promise, dedicating everything in his heart and soul. I don't think we've seen that guy in a while.
If he would've got up on a podium and said something similar after the Packer game, I think a lot of people would have thought it out of character.

The perception may be that Goff grew content riding on McVay's coattails. The problem is, those aren't coattails, McVay hit the Rams and the league like a tsunami and Goff, I think, was swept up, to a degree, in the McVay phenomenon. Also, McVay, at least publicly, has seemingly given Goff training wheels for 3.5 years, always taking the blame for Goff's missteps.

The point? Yeah, Goff's got to make this about him and make it personnel.

More importantly, the coaching staff wanted Goff to make it more about him:

Rams planning for Jared Goff to 'truly have some ownership' of offense

Jared Goff’s command of the offense should grow this year.

theramswire.usatoday.com

The public support given to Wolford and the lack of public support given to Goff look like to coaches aren't satisfied with Goff's efforts to take control. We need that 2016 Goff back, the guy who pours his heart and soul into fixing his team.

--------

(2) Goff just finished up his 26 year old season, his fifth in the league. He ended the season injured, with question marks about his future in the league.

Drew Brees' 26 year old season was his fifth year in the league. He ended the season injured, with question marks about his future in the league. It was Brees' last season with the Chargers as they elected to move on to their shiny new QB. Brees' career sort of got better after that.

No one expects Goff to miraculously improve like Brees, that's just ridiculously stupid, or is it?

 

[Neil039]

 

[Da-Rock]

I am in the boat of -

Goff has shown us what he has.....and that is he is a solid QB capable of good and bad games, but with a higher talent ranking than your average Joe QB in the league.

What does that mean?

We can win with him, but we will lose almost as often and it requires a lot of maintenance by McVay.

If I were to spitball the issue between Goff and McVay......go back to how often we heard McVay had to hold Goff's hand to get him to realize his talent and win games......maybe McVay is done with doing that and after seeing his offense under a different type of QB. Maybe he has realized he wants something else.......maybe he thinks his offense can be better with someone other than Goff.

 

[SteezyEndo]

Are we shocked it came to this? Goff has the athletic talent of a good QB, but he is lacking the acumen of what makes a QB great, and I think that is something McVay expects most. Whatever happens hope its for the best. We can try to rebuild an OL around Goff and hope that will fix Goff. I am worried that it might be too late to do even that, and have to look for a more consistent option. Goff right now might be the most predictable QB in the league especially now that the word is out he cannot function without an elite OL. That might take up too much time and resources to redo everything allover again...

 

[TexasRam]

Are we shocked it came to this? Goff has the athletic talent of a good QB, but he is lacking the acumen of what makes a QB great, and I think that is something McVay expects most. Whatever happens hope its for the best. We can try to rebuild an OL around Goff and hope that will fix Goff. I am worried that it might be too late to do even that, and have to look for a more consistent option. Goff right now might be the most predictable QB in the league especially now that the word is out he cannot function without an elite OL. That might take up too much time and resources to redo everything allover again...

This "Goff requires an elite line" stuff isn't factual in my opinion.

2018 Line
Whitworth - Elite
Saffold - Very good. Not Elite. 2nd team pro bowl in 2017, no other Pro bowls.
Sullivan - Very good run blocker. Struggled in pass pro in 2018.
Blythe - Career backup.
Havenstein - Very good run blocker. Struggles in pass pro. Zero Pro Bowls.

Goff put up the highest scoring offense over 2 years with this Oline (Brown at RG in 2017(below average NFL player))

That is 3 of 5 Lineman in 2017-2018 that were not very good at pass pro (Sullivan, Blythe and Havenstein).

But 4 of 5 were very good run blockers (All but Blythe)

So our running game was tops in the league and setup heavy use of playaction which Goff executed at an elite level.

 

[Mackeyser]

It still results in dead cap money, no matter when the trade is official, both this year and next. And dead money is money that can't be spent on other players.

Because Watson is only due $10.5M next year, EVEN WITH trading Goff and with Watson's salary, they STILL save $2M on the cap this next year. Watson's big money doesn't start until 2022 and the cap should have more than recovered by then.

If we just keep Goff, his total cap hit including salary and past bonuses is $36M while his trade cap hit is $24M... When the change is added, even with Watson's $10.5M, the Rams net close to $2M in savings for 2021. The issue for the Rams at least has nothing to do with the cap when it comes to Watson... it's having the necessary resources to facilitate the trade. We'll see how that goes. Who knows if the Rams are even interested? Beyond a single source who texted Stephen A Smith, we don't know and it seems like the report of Watson wanting to go to NY was bogus. The iron shavings point to us making a big move like Watson, but could be a false reading, who knows?

We haven't, but we haven't seen a lot of what we saw in 2018 that is entirely outside of Goff's control. We have seen serious regression in the OL, and after an offseason to fix it the Rams pretty much decided to stand pat. Instead of fixing the line, McVay tried to adjust the offense around that to mask its weaknesses, but that's like stuffing dirty laundry into the hamper - you may not see it but sooner or later the smell is going to get out. And at critical times, it did. Because of the OL deficiencies, we've seen our play action game suffer, as well as our ability to throw downfield, as either the QB gets sacked or isn't confident in the guys in front of him, not to mention nowhere to step up to when the blocking doesn't hold. And we've seen at times some really, really bad playcalling.

The thing that is so maddening about this is that those of us who want to hold onto Goff for at least one more year will acknowledge his play as suffered and needs to improve. But getting people to realize McVay's neglect of the OL and its effects as well as the lack of scheme innovation and sometimes bad playcalling has had a major affect on Goff's play seems to be more difficult than pulling teeth from a pissed off grizzly bear. That's probably because acknowledging McVay's role in the offensive struggles severely weakens the case for moving on from Goff at the present time. And from McVay himself, I have seen very little in terms of action from him to back up his "I've got to do better" talk.

Beyond a fan's basic observation, what information do you have that McVay has done very little in terms of action? You state it as fact, but at best all we as fans have is broadcast tv and a few reports from reporters, none of which tells us the steps a HC in the NFL takes to prepare the team each week or how he addresses schematic, structural, player and opponent issues.

All of this is really projecting.

I say this as someone who unless we get Watson, I want Goff to return. I think he's head and shoulders better than any other choice including Wentz, Stafford, Jimmy G, Teddy Bridgewater, Gardiner Minshew or any other QBs that might be available as well as any other QBs on our roster.

But this projecting serves no one. At the very least we have to acknowledge our limitations as fans to even ascertain what's going on based on what we see on the field.

Example: McVay may see the issue with the OL and call a play where "if the C is pushed back, go to the #2 read immediately". When Goff takes a sack because he's looking at the first read, that's bad. All we see is Blythe getting walked back and Goff taking a sack when he may have had instructions to deal with exactly that scenario and failed to execute.

That's a hypothetical, but it illustrates the possibility that what we see on the field is limited to what we see and that's it. We can't draw any conclusions because we're missing too much information.

Well, we'll have to agree to disagree about being hellbent on burning bridges. It's one thing for McVay to say what he said after an emotional playoff loss, but more than a week later for Snead to say what he said makes it really look like they want to twist the knife.

And it's fine for him to have high expectations for the QB, but shouldn't he hold himself to those same expectations? Like I've said above, for all of his repeated sayings of "I've got to do better", I've seen little action from him in the last two seasons that really squares with those words.

Watson would be a splash. Stafford would be a belly flop.

Again, we don't know what internal structures, processes or efforts McVay has made to facilitate "I've got to do better". Not every attempt at anything is successful, so it could be that fixing one thing broke another. We don't know.

We all feel like we know this team very well, but do we? We know almost nothing about what happens inside the building and are only told what they want us to know. All we see are the games on Sunday and a few snippets of practices. We didn't even get to see any preseason or OTAs this year.

I just see a lot of filling in the blanks when we simply cannot know much of anything right now. Even connecting the obvious dots may not draw the right picture.

And I agree that Watson would be a splash and anyone else would be a belly flop. I don't count Rodgers because he's just angling for a new contract and there's no way they don't work that out. No way. Zero.

 

[kurtfaulk]

Couple of rambling bits of nonsense:


(1) Hey, remember this guy?


View: https://twitter.com/camdasilva/status/1090620613260132353?s=20


That Goff got up on a podium and made a personal promise, dedicating everything in his heart and soul. I don't think we've seen that guy in a while.
If he would've got up on a podium and said something similar after the Packer game, I think a lot of people would have thought it out of character.

The perception may be that Goff grew content riding on McVay's coattails. The problem is, those aren't coattails, McVay hit the Rams and the league like a tsunami and Goff, I think, was swept up, to a degree, in the McVay phenomenon. Also, McVay, at least publicly, has seemingly given Goff training wheels for 3.5 years, always taking the blame for Goff's missteps.

The point? Yeah, Goff's got to make this about him and make it personnel.

More importantly, the coaching staff wanted Goff to make it more about him:

Rams planning for Jared Goff to 'truly have some ownership' of offense

Jared Goff’s command of the offense should grow this year.

theramswire.usatoday.com

The public support given to Wolford and the lack of public support given to Goff look like to coaches aren't satisfied with Goff's efforts to take control. We need that 2016 Goff back, the guy who pours his heart and soul into fixing his team.

--------

(2) Goff just finished up his 26 year old season, his fifth in the league. He ended the season injured, with question marks about his future in the league.

Drew Brees' 26 year old season was his fifth year in the league. He ended the season injured, with question marks about his future in the league. It was Brees' last season with the Chargers as they elected to move on to their shiny new QB. Brees' career sort of got better after that.

No one expects Goff to miraculously improve like Brees, that's just ridiculously stupid, or is it?

Brees didn't need to be miraculously improved. He played lights out the 2 years previously. To the point where he kept rivers on the bench for 2 years. He made a miraculous recovery from injury.

On a side note how useless are the Chargers. After rivers rookie year they had 2 qbs on the roster worth valuable draft picks. Instead of trading one of them they kept the status quo and got nothing in return when they let Brees walk.

.

 

[Mackeyser]

Hmmmm.... You seem to be making statements you couldn't possibly know and stating them as fact. Not sure how you could know any of this.

Agreed. If they are ready to move on then that is their decision. I just don't buy into much of anything that is being discussed here.

So you think that is how negotiations go in the NFL? Downgrading your commodity in public so everyone knows you want to rid yourself of his contract? You don't think Snead would be hammering the phone lines so that every team that was even a consideration would know the situation? Seems like a pretty stupid way to go about getting value back.

Personally, I think there is at least as much of a chance that they have done this to send a warning shot to Goff that he needs to get his shit together - that he needs to put in some serious work starting immediately after the Packers game ended.

But what do I know. I'm just another Yahoo posting on a sports board.

I don't think this is how negotiations happen...typically.

Honestly, I was taken aback not by McVay, but by Snead. THAT'S the one I don't get.

Does it downgrade Goff to get cute like that? I dunno, I'm not one of the other 31 GMs in the league. I would assume his 5 years in the league and all the tape does that better than a couple of press conferences would.

If it was just McVay, I would think it's "shots fired". However with Snead ALSO saying and then reiterating the exact same point... seems like it's too far gone. It may not be... as I posted earlier, this may be a warning shot that's meant to narrowly miss and make clear that the next one hits, but it feels more like something's brewing.

That's just my gut talking, tho.

And we're all just yahoos posting on a sports board. It's what we do...

 

[XXXIVwin]

Most Turnovers By A Qb Since 2018 | StatMuse

Since 2018, Josh Allen has the most turnovers by a quarterback, with 102 turnovers.

www.statmuse.com

 

[Mackeyser]

I say this with respect, I think you're making unsound assumptions. I've kept trying to tell people this (for years now). Young pocket passers are volatile from season to season and even week to week. Many of the good ones didn't find consistency until they hit their prime. And that window generally starts between 27 years old and 30 years old. But people are so quick to give up on QBs these days.

People assume that progression is linear. You get more experience, so you should keep getting better. It doesn't work that way. Pocket passers have inconsistencies up until their primes. But when they hit their primes, they generally settle down and are fairly reliable from year to year. Next season starts that window for Goff.

To demonstrate my point, look at Goff's and Peyton Manning's career arcs:

Jared Goff Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Checkout the latest stats for Jared Goff. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.

www.pro-football-reference.com

Peyton Manning Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Checkout the latest stats for Peyton Manning. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.

www.pro-football-reference.com

Outside of their rookie years, they're nearly identical through their respective age-26 seasons. I don't think anybody would tell you that Peyton Manning wasn't preparing for games back then. I'm not a patient person, so I get the desire to have an answer on Goff now. But I think we're just going to have to wait and see how things play out.

I agree with your analysis.

My only quibble is this... if it turns out that the issue is Goff not putting in the extra work, then we have no basis upon which to derive this big jump.

We know SOMETHING has moved McVay off of Goff in a major way and knowing how McVay struggles with balance, I can imagine the biggest issue for him from the most important position would be a lack of preparation... which means doing ALL of the extra stuff needed to be great...which Goff is capable of being.

So, if he's putting in the extra work or at the very least gets the message, he should blow away any competition and rip shit up next season.

That presumes that he's still here, of course.

 

[Mackeyser]

I’ve watched this clip and see a lot of talking heads discuss this Goff story. This is where I have a big problem with how the Rams are handling this situation. Goff is getting *clowned* by a lot of these talking heads, and for as much as Goff’s inconsistent play opened this up, McVay and now Snead’s comments are really fanning the flames. People are having a field day with the “he’s a Ram right now. What day is it... January 26?” Line and mocking Goff throughout the media. It really shows that the FO doesn’t care how Goff feels.

Again, I have no problem if the Rams decided they need to move on. But don’t open up your QB to get clowned this way throughout the media, especially since it hurts your leverage for trade negotiations.

I dunno.

Maybe they are exercising really poor judgment.

Maybe they've already tried all of the other steps and nothing's worked over the last two years.

Maybe something happened...an event or catalyst which changed the dynamic and it's a moment where there's a before and an after and the before Goff and the after Goff are two different dudes and McVay and Snead are responding to the after Goff.

I agree that I'm not comfortable with how this is being played out, but I don't exactly know how we got here, either. This may be restrained. I dunno.

We know the Rams keep a tight lipped ship because no one blabbed about the starting QB. NO one. Not a single person. In today's world, that's INCREDIBLE!!! So if something happened, we might never know.

As for Goff being mocked in the media... they will say "Goff has the 2nd most wins of any QB since 2017" and then turn around and dog him out for the entire segment. That has been there even during 2018. All this hasn't help put the fire out, but I dunno that it's added much if anything to it. That fire has been there since his rookie year.

 

[Shuie3225]

Don't know how, just know they have to.

Its not going to happen. We will have one new OL starter next year, and none of the 5 will be pro bowl caliber. So expecting the OL to be a lot better is foolish. It will be very similar to this season. And if that's the case, why would anyone expect Goff to play better next year?

His 2 great years came behind a top 5 OL that had three pro bowl caliber players. No chance we have that next season.

 

[Mackeyser]

It wasn't a pff stat. It was a dvoa. See that's the the thing. All of these different analytics are saying they were good and yet y'all keep saying it wasn't. Based on what? What are you seeing that all these different organizations don't?

And as for the 2018 line. That might be the best in Rams history. Please don't tell me that Goff needs a once in a lifetime line to succeed.

Here's an example. Neither DVOA or the PFF stats take into account the Rams staying in max protect as often as they do. That means 2 fewer eligible receivers out in routes.

We're constantly leaving the RB and TE in to block.

So the data is helpful, but it's not singularly illustrative.

 

[Mackeyser]

Well I could go on and on about how, as a science major, I hate when people refute a stat with "idk but it won't change my mind. I just trust my eyeballs.".

I respect what you do. And your knowledge. Absolutely no doubt about that. But PFF is employed by every nfl team and college program. Their not some teenagers in a basement making things up. Simply dismissing their metrics because of your eyeballs is a fatal flaw. But I'm totally inclined to leave well enough alone. And again, I know you know your stuff. I'm just highly against the eyeball analysis.

Actually, while they are trying to recruit better stat takers, many still have ZERO background in football and make tallies without understanding what a player's assignment was.

It may look on the tape like one OL was beat, but when you go to the all 22 and look at the play design, it turns out that the 2nd OL completely whiffed on the handoff and left the 1st OL to look like he just abandoned his block for no reason.

Btw, that happened with Blythe a LOT this year.

PFF while they do generate data is not and never will be the be all and end all. It's barely a start to understand a player's play. Barely. And it leaves out so much context that to give those numbers anything more than minimal weight means being subject to wildly inaccurate conclusions.

Do we use PFFs grade for Jalen Ramsey? They gave him a 53 for maybe his best game of the season.

Here's the bottom line. With football analytics still in its nascent stage, basic data tallies like what PFF provide can be valuable. Rest assured as the analytics continues to mature, PFF will have to become MUCH, MUCH more sophisticated including maybe even having access to the team's playbooks or at the very least chart every play and then cross reference known plays to determine what the assignment is prior to assigning a grade.

As it is right now, PFF is a place to start and they by no means offer ANYTHING that could lead a team to determine anything about a player. It's a basic tool at best and at worst can be misused to inappropriately rate a player which could cost a team millions.

 

[MachS]

Because Watson is only due $10.5M next year, EVEN WITH trading Goff and with Watson's salary, they STILL save $2M on the cap this next year. Watson's big money doesn't start until 2022 and the cap should have more than recovered by then.

If we just keep Goff, his total cap hit including salary and past bonuses is $36M while his trade cap hit is $24M... When the change is added, even with Watson's $10.5M, the Rams net close to $2M in savings for 2021. The issue for the Rams at least has nothing to do with the cap when it comes to Watson... it's having the necessary resources to facilitate the trade. We'll see how that goes. Who knows if the Rams are even interested? Beyond a single source who texted Stephen A Smith, we don't know and it seems like the report of Watson wanting to go to NY was bogus. The iron shavings point to us making a big move like Watson, but could be a false reading, who knows?



Beyond a fan's basic observation, what information do you have that McVay has done very little in terms of action? You state it as fact, but at best all we as fans have is broadcast tv and a few reports from reporters, none of which tells us the steps a HC in the NFL takes to prepare the team each week or how he addresses schematic, structural, player and opponent issues.

All of this is really projecting.

I say this as someone who unless we get Watson, I want Goff to return. I think he's head and shoulders better than any other choice including Wentz, Stafford, Jimmy G, Teddy Bridgewater, Gardiner Minshew or any other QBs that might be available as well as any other QBs on our roster.

But this projecting serves no one. At the very least we have to acknowledge our limitations as fans to even ascertain what's going on based on what we see on the field.

Example: McVay may see the issue with the OL and call a play where "if the C is pushed back, go to the #2 read immediately". When Goff takes a sack because he's looking at the first read, that's bad. All we see is Blythe getting walked back and Goff taking a sack when he may have had instructions to deal with exactly that scenario and failed to execute.

That's a hypothetical, but it illustrates the possibility that what we see on the field is limited to what we see and that's it. We can't draw any conclusions because we're missing too much information.



Again, we don't know what internal structures, processes or efforts McVay has made to facilitate "I've got to do better". Not every attempt at anything is successful, so it could be that fixing one thing broke another. We don't know.

We all feel like we know this team very well, but do we? We know almost nothing about what happens inside the building and are only told what they want us to know. All we see are the games on Sunday and a few snippets of practices. We didn't even get to see any preseason or OTAs this year.

I just see a lot of filling in the blanks when we simply cannot know much of anything right now. Even connecting the obvious dots may not draw the right picture.

And I agree that Watson would be a splash and anyone else would be a belly flop. I don't count Rodgers because he's just angling for a new contract and there's no way they don't work that out. No way. Zero.

Nice post. I see a lot the same way. My view is if we can get Watson, Rodgers, or a a 1st round rookie we love, I'm all for moving on. Thats assuming we could trade Goff somewhere which might not be possible. But the average options like Minshew, Stafford, etc. I dont think is worth it.

But looking at the organization, I think McVay is now officially just done with Goff. Something happened this year. Yes he has played supar for two years, yes hes turned the ball over more than anyone during that time. But McVay has defended Goff for years now. Even for half of this season, and Goff had some bad games early...McVay took the blame like he typically does. Something happened later in the season and it was the straw that broke the camels back. I personally think it has to do with Goff's work ethic and focus, study time, film prep, etc. Some games he slices someone up and other games he looks completely unprepared. For whatever reason I think McVay told Snead that's it and its time move on. Whether we can trade him this off-season or not..the Goff/McVay marriage is over.

Because the fact is, McVay and Sneads job could be in jeopardy if they keep starting Goff for another 2-3 years and spinning their wheels. Obviously the contract is horrible in hindsight, but now there's logic in ripping off the band-aid if you've decided Goff is no longer the guy.

The media circus and not committing to Goff next year does a couple things. It lets everyone know we're open for business, and Goff is available via trade well before the draft and free agency. You know there are a few teams that like Goff over what they have.. whether or not they can take his contract is a different story. Next, its shots fired at Goff. Its let's him know where the franchise stands and that his play is unacceptable. IF we cannot trade him, maybe he bounces back with a better year and he has even more trade value next season.

But the blatant calling out of Goff and disrespect from the organization, tells me McVay is done with him. Even if we can't trade him and he has a nice bounce back year..I think hes still gone next off-season. The relationship is just too fractured at this point to repair.

 

[Mackeyser]

Try not to project on me, because as I've said, I don't think our line was great. I just used the numbers to come to the conclusion that they weren't bad like y'all are making them out to be. I stated so earlier.

What did Mcvay do to cover up the line issue? And why would pff not have accounted for that in their in depth analysis? Because rolling out over and over will obviously not increase time in the pocket rates

a) they don't do in depth analysis. They do tally aggregation. They cannot do in depth analysis because they don't know the play or the progressions within the play.

b) as has been said, not all of the PFF graders have a football background. After YEARS of criticism Collinsworth and company decided to upgrade their stat collecting crew, but they use a LOT of people and you have to pay for experience. When PFF first started, it was literally fans doing it. Literally. They volunteered and got some minor consideration. So even with PFF's basic training, they are making grades when they have no idea what constitutes a "win" or even if a play was a positive or not. Over the course of a season, it averages out, but even then, expressly because their numbers lack context and depth, it's barely a basic evaluation tool. Barely.

c) roll outs unless the DE/OLB on that side blows it up will take nearly 3s if not longer. They are a longer play by design. McVay pulled out all the tricks to bolster the OL including almost always going max protect (meaning the RB and TE/TEs stay in to block instead of going out of routes to stress the D and give the QB more targets.

 

[Mackeyser]

Nice post. I see a lot the same way. My view is if we can get Watson, Rodgers, or a a 1st round rookie we love, I'm all for moving on. Thats assuming we could trade Goff somewhere which might not be possible. But the average options like Minshew, Stafford, etc. I dont think is worth it.

But looking at the organization, I think McVay is now officially just done with Goff. Something happened this year. Yes he has played supar for two years, yes hes turned the ball over more than anyone during that time. But McVay has defended Goff for years now. Even for half of this season, and Goff had some bad games early...McVay took the blame like he typically does. Something happened later in the season and it was the straw that broke the camels back. I personally think it has to do with Goff's work ethic and focus, study time, film prep, etc. Some games he slices someone up and other games he looks completely unprepared. For whatever reason I think McVay told Snead that's it and its time move on. Whether we can trade him this off-season or not..the Goff/McVay marriage is over.

Because the fact is, McVay and Sneads job could be in jeopardy if they keep starting Goff for another 2-3 years and spinning their wheels. Obviously the contract is horrible in hindsight, but now there's logic in ripping off the band-aid if you've decided Goff is no longer the guy.

The media circus and not committing to Goff next year does a couple things. It lets everyone know we're open for business, and Goff is available via trade well before the draft and free agency. You know there are a few teams that like Goff over what they have.. whether or not they can take his contract is a different story. Next, its shots fired at Goff. Its let's him know where the franchise stands and that his play is unacceptable. IF we cannot trade him, maybe he bounces back with a better year and he has even more trade value next season.

But the blatant calling out of Goff and disrespect from the organization, tells me McVay is done with him. Even if we can't trade him and he has a nice bounce back year..I think hes still gone next off-season. The relationship is just too fractured at this point to repair.

I agree.

Also, I think people REALLY underestimate Goff's value around the NFL. Goff's resume would mean 2 1st rounders or a high 1 and high 2.

Rest assured there are teams out there that KNOW what @jrry32 was saying about the development time of a pocket QB and the time with McVay will be considered valuable.

Also, what other QB is available that's been to a Super Bowl, been to 2 Pro Bowls, led the #1 offense twice and has the second most wins... all in the last 4 years?

That's an amazing resume and while fans may think Goff's a ham sandwich, rest assured teams know that he's a great kid with a good head on his shoulders who may not have been a long term fit in this situation, but should have a long future in the NFL.

Goff would be gangbusters in Indy and I would only do that trade if we had an agreement in principle for Watson.