The Goff-season Thread

[Mackeyser]

Posted a 100+ passer rating in the two playoff games with a busted thumb on his throwing hand. Didn't turn the ball over. Played smart, conservative football. Simply put, we begged Goff to be exactly the type of QB he was in the playoffs. The defense wasn't the dominant unit we needed against Green Bay to make a Super Bowl run. I am strongly in favor of running it back with Goff next year. I'm fine with bringing in somebody who can start if Goff implodes. But I think it would be a mistake to move on from Goff, unless we can get Watson.

totally agree.

I think Goff can be the top of the 2nd tier of QBs and isn't someone you just throw away for a ham sandwich and some tokens to the local arcade.

But Watson's a next level elite QB and the chance to upgrade to a QB like that when a team already has as much as this team has? Yeah, that's like a "twelfth of never" situation.

So, I'm almost all in on Goff... the one exception would be Watson. Short of Watson, we have our QB and he's plenty good enough.

 

[Mackeyser]

I'm 60 years old. What the hell does any of this gibberish mean?

Deshaun Watson made a post on... I dunno, probably instagram and Jalen Ramsey basically said that he'd look good in Horns.

Part of it is just game recognizing game and Ramsey having fun on social media, but also... he's probably not kidding.

The idea that a team leader is putting this out there can't help but put the idea in Watson's head that LA could be his next home. That, honestly, was the one thing I was wondering... was Watson even CONSIDERING LA as an option?

Well, when one of the two untouchable players on the Rams comes out and tells you that you'd be welcome... it changes things.

Is it a big deal? Is Ramsey calling for Goff to be dumped, etc? No, not at all. But part of always improving is always improving. Ramsey goes against Goff every practice and has to know him pretty well as a player.

Could be nothing... or could be the first of many dominoes.

Looks to be a fun off-season.

Even if you don't like the Goff/Watson talk, beats the shit out of all those off-seasons where we'd lose our good players and no one even wanted to play for us or coach for us...

Those days SUCKED.

 

[HitStick]

Don't just drafted Ram OL'ers sit for 3 to 4 seasons till they learn where to line up & how to understand what they are supposed to do? Then they depart & leave for free agency elsewhere with no wear or tear & the sidewalls still have the rubber tits on them.

That is a downside. Unfortunately, the Rams seem to want to cross train every single O-Lineman outside of Whitworth when in reality, they should be focused on the position they were drafted to play. Build depth for everything else

 

[TexasRam]

Sigh. Are we really back on the time to throw per snap nonsense? Russell Wilson had more time to throw per snap than Goff. But we both know that Wilson's OL was not a good pass blocking unit. That stat isn't helpful. It doesn't account for differences in schemes or differences in playing styles. Last I saw, we were the heaviest play-action passing team in the NFL. If somebody overtook us for #1, we were easily in the top 3. Play-action passes are slower developing plays, as are bootlegs (something else we used a lot). I watched this team play 18 games. Our traditional dropback passing game was all about quick throws this year. The time to throw stat isn't going to be an apples to apples comparison for those reasons.

As for the rest of it, I'm not going to speculate over which QBs would be better or worse in our system. Outside of the obvious ones, it's a completely pointless debate.

Yea I really do not get the logic at all. Rams time to throw is at the very bottom of the league when you take out the rollouts.

But it really just take watching the games and see MCvay was forced to the rollouts due to the Oline.

Goff was 4-1 against Brady Wilson and Murray clearly outplaying all three of them. The same teams that Boast your 2020 pro bowl WR roster.

The inability to parse context is a problem.

I could conclude Ramsey was only an average based on lack of interceptions. Unless I watched the games and considered the context of what he was doing.

 

[UKram]

No bro we were 9-6 mostly for the defense had we had a middle of the road defense we would be giving the jaguars a pick in the 1-8 section of the draft. Got to just dig a bit deeper on the stats.

So by that you’re insinuating that football is a team game and players need help from the surrounding cast ... say like an oline that can block a pass rush or a player that can get deep

 

[dieterbrock]

So out of all the other QBs - maybe Ryan and Stafford with a heads on straight Darnold as a possible runner up

Good list although I'd have to disagree on either of these guys. First, Dome QB's statistically have an advantage of playing indoors a majority of the season, so straight up numbers arent exactly fair. But playoff wise? Ryan choked big time in the SB and has 11 turnovers in 10 post season games. Goff has only 2 turnovers in 6 playoff games, (and 1 INT was completely on Gurley) while Stafford has 5 turnovers in just 3 games.
And Darnold? Yeah, just no....

 

[Ellard80]

Yea I really do not get the logic at all. Rams time to throw is at the very bottom of the league when you take out the rollouts.

But it really just take watching the games and see MCvay was forced to the rollouts due to the Oline.

Goff was 4-1 against Brady Wilson and Murray clearly outplaying all three of them. The same teams that Boast your 2020 pro bowl WR roster.

The inability to parse context is a problem.

I could conclude Ramsey was only an average based on lack of interceptions. Unless I watched the games and considered the context of what he was doing.

PFF had out OL as the 3rd best in the league.. I'm not saying I think its #3.... but the narrative hat our Oline is shitty is the biggest overblown conclusion on this board.

They definately take roll outs into play - they break down every single play of the season. Also... many of the rollouts he has to get rid of teh ball almost instantly because the opponents know we like to bootleg - so many of the rollouts are not resulting in more time to pass.

Yeah of course the oline was bad at times- see the 4th quarter in the GB game. Goff didn't have any time to look down the field.

But most teams olines get beat sometimes - see the #2 GB line get their ass beat against tampa bay earlier this year.

 

[payote75]

So by that you’re insinuating that football is a team game and players need help from the surrounding cast ... say like an oline that can block a pass rush or a player that can get deep

Course it's a team game but sometimes superstar players need to make superstar plays and if they unable to do so then you cannot make dumb ones aka turnovers. Especially if your being paid on that level. Goff makes close to or more than all or some of the qbs left as well as others in the league. Superstar plays negate at least some turnovers but if not then team is in trouble. Because it is a team game if you turn the ball over constantly how can you tell the defense be great every time I give it away ok??? Or if the defense knows it would be better than it shows but the quarterback keeps on handing them a short field. That's exactly why of Goff can't at leastanage the game going forward the rams have issues and we will blow it with a good to very good defense. How long before the team loses hope if Goff doesn't show more? The game right. So I get the offensive deficiencies but if your a superstar you need to over come them once in a while so the team can believe in you. Sure the online can use some help but it was still ranked third in the league so even with that he should of been at least a little better.
And this isn't a me Vs Goff thing I want him to be great but let's understand nobody is above criticism and some deserve some more than others for the money they make.

 

[Merlin]

Keep in mind other teams ran boots too. The division round in fact had 4 of the top 6 QBs in boot usage this year. Mahomes was first in redzone in fact.

Goff ran the most at 92 but Rogers who was 6th in boot usage ran 57.

 

[UKram]

Course it's a team game but sometimes superstar players need to make superstar plays and if they unable to do so then you cannot make dumb ones aka turnovers. Especially if your being paid on that level. Goff makes close to or more than all or some of the qbs left as well as others in the league. Superstar plays negate at least some turnovers but if not then team is in trouble. Because it is a team game if you turn the ball over constantly how can you tell the defense be great every time I give it away ok??? Or if the defense knows it would be better than it shows but the quarterback keeps on handing them a short field. That's exactly why of Goff can't at leastanage the game going forward the rams have issues and we will blow it with a good to very good defense. How long before the team loses hope if Goff doesn't show more? The game right. So I get the offensive deficiencies but if your a superstar you need to over come them once in a while so the team can believe in you. Sure the online can use some help but it was still ranked third in the league so even with that he should of been at least a little better.
And this isn't a me Vs Goff thing I want him to be great but let's understand nobody is above criticism and some deserve some more than others for the money they make.

I agree no one is above criticism.. I was probably one of gurleys harshest critics last year ... the difference being I realised it was due to injury ...

Goff has made some completely boneheaded mistakes and turnovers this year ... and I criticised him for it ... but some of his critics are acting like it’s ALL on goff ...

how many of the ints came about because he had a dude in his face .?
How many of the balls did he force because he was about to get sacked and was trying to make a play ?
How many were because a WR ran the wrong route ?
How many were flat out dumb decisions?
How many were ripped out of Bobby trees hand after he caught it ?

I’m well aware Next year is goffs prove it year (which is kinda ridiculous) when if asked after his rookie year would we take goff having 3 playoff seasons in the next four .. two pro bowl seasons ..a Super Bowl appearance .. being in the top 5 winningest QBs in a four year span .and in the four year period being undefeated in those four years when leading at the half . everyone would have bit the questioners hand off for it ..

I’m also aware that if we do get rid of goff withou giving him any offensive help (o line and a deep threat burner ) and we let him go .. there will be teams fighting like fuck to sign him imagine him winning Super Bowls for the pats for the next few years

 

[payote75]

I agree no one is above criticism.. I was probably one of gurleys harshest critics last year ... the difference being I realised it was due to injury ...

Goff has made some completely boneheaded mistakes and turnovers this year ... and I criticised him for it ... but some of his critics are acting like it’s ALL on goff ...

how many of the ints came about because he had a dude in his face .?
How many of the balls did he force because he was about to get sacked and was trying to make a play ?
How many were because a WR ran the wrong route ?
How many were flat out dumb decisions?
How many were ripped out of Bobby trees hand after he caught it ?

I’m well aware Next year is goffs prove it year (which is kinda ridiculous) when if asked after his rookie year would we take goff having 3 playoff seasons in the next four .. two pro bowl seasons ..a Super Bowl appearance .. being in the top 5 winningest QBs in a four year span .and in the four year period being undefeated in those four years when leading at the half . everyone would have bit the questioners hand off for it ..

I’m also aware that if we do get rid of goff withou giving him any offensive help (o line and a deep threat burner ) and we let him go .. there will be teams fighting like fuck to sign him imagine him winning Super Bowls for the pats for the next few years

I think we kind of have a similar view just that I'm picking at the negative and you the positive which I completely understand. However Goff is not the only one to face such adversity or maybe some lack of weapons. Realistically though kupp and woods are two of the best route runners in football so I can't really by that one everyone make mistakes but that's the point say kupp and woods did do that ...how often ....not often enough with Goff it's too often. We could dissect all qbs ints and fumbles and remove some of the fault from slot of those plays like dropped balls or tipped tipped balls etc. I'm sure even Arod with his 7 ints could have one or two in there with the wrong route or tipped. I don't count those things against Goff.
My concerns are reading the defenses....going through progressions quick enough....turnovers....and his panic under pressure.
My other concern is he may need the perfect environment to succeed. This wasn't always my thinking I have gone back and forth. I see the tools and the skills but I've beens saying for a while now it might be upstairs I don't know.

Even if the rams get an all Pro line and a deep threat can he read a defense can he go through progressions fast enough can he pass when flustered.

I'm self admittedly in no man's land. I just want the kid to succeed but I want the team to succeed more. It's in the regimes hands. All I can say.
I do see exactly what your saying but there are always going to be points and then counterpoints. We need to hope for the best.

I don't lay all the blame on Goff not by a long shot. Being the quarterback no matter who you are always puts a target on your back unfortunately.

I said a month ago if we stick with Goff let's at least get someone to push or that can over take him should he struggle and not a Fitzpatrick type I mean someone with actual upside. And I was pretty quickly met with a lot of negative feedback and like I had attacked Goff lol.

In the end we just want to win hopefully with Goff but if he ain't it then yea we need to do what's best. I stated yesterday I'd root for him no matter where he went except against us. He is that good of a kid too me.

 

[UKram]

I think we kind of have a similar view just that I'm picking at the negative and you the positive which I completely understand. However Goff is not the only one to face such adversity or maybe some lack of weapons. Realistically though kupp and woods are two of the best route runners in football so I can't really by that one everyone make mistakes but that's the point say kupp and woods did do that ...how often ....not often enough with Goff it's too often. We could dissect all qbs ints and fumbles and remove some of the fault from slot of those plays like dropped balls or tipped tipped balls etc. I'm sure even Arod with his 7 ints could have one or two in there with the wrong route or tipped. I don't count those things against Goff.
My concerns are reading the defenses....going through progressions quick enough....turnovers....and his panic under pressure.
My other concern is he may need the perfect environment to succeed. This wasn't always my thinking I have gone back and forth. I see the tools and the skills but I've beens saying for a while now it might be upstairs I don't know.

Even if the rams get an all Pro line and a deep threat can he read a defense can he go through progressions fast enough can he pass when flustered.

I'm self admittedly in no man's land. I just want the kid to succeed but I want the team to succeed more. It's in the regimes hands. All I can say.
I do see exactly what your saying but there are always going to be points and then counterpoints. We need to hope for the best.

I don't lay all the blame on Goff not by a long shot. Being the quarterback no matter who you are always puts a target on your back unfortunately.

I said a month ago if we stick with Goff let's at least get someone to push or that can over take him should he struggle and not a Fitzpatrick type I mean someone with actual upside. And I was pretty quickly met with a lot of negative feedback and like I had attacked Goff lol.

In the end we just want to win hopefully with Goff but if he ain't it then yea we need to do what's best. I stated yesterday I'd root for him no matter where he went except against us. He is that good of a kid too me.

But kupp and woods weren’t the only players running routes .. they might not have but GE JRey and others may have

He can read progressions and defended his 2018 season proved he could .. my question is not can he but does he have time to read all his progressions

Woods and kupp are some of the cleanest route runners in the nfl .. but they aren’t classic burners defences don’t have to worry about playing safeties deep so they can sit on those 8-15 yard routes that’s woods and kupp thrive on

I agree get a backup in that can push him ... but those of us “in goffs corner” know that this board will be hell the second he loses a game or throws a pick or takes a sack or goes three and out .. certain members will be calling for the back up to start (look at wolford they all thought he was the second coming of Warner )

 

[payote75]

But kupp and woods weren’t the only players running routes .. they might not have but GE JRey and others may have

He can read progressions and defended his 2018 season proved he could .. my question is not can he but does he have time to read all his progressions

Woods and kupp are some of the cleanest route runners in the nfl .. but they aren’t classic burners defences don’t have to worry about playing safeties deep so they can sit on those 8-15 yard routes that’s woods and kupp thrive on

I agree get a backup in that can push him ... but those of us “in goffs corner” know that this board will be hell the second he loses a game or throws a pick or takes a sack or goes three and out .. certain members will be calling for the back up to start (look at wolford they all thought he was the second coming of Warner )

Yea it's just my own personal out look right now. I know he can make the throws he has the tools my concern is taking it up to that special level. It's hard with the cap to give a perfect environment to a qb in today's game but I'm with you and listen bro at the end of the day I so want to be wrong I want to eat dirt lol and a lot of it. I've defended Goff and I've voiced my concerns. Right now my concerns are stronger. So I hear you I agree with most of it but at this moment we are on opposite sides of the island and I'm hoping to get back to your side sooner rather than later. Lol

 

[badnews]

PFF had out OL as the 3rd best in the league.. I'm not saying I think its #3.... but the narrative hat our Oline is shitty is the biggest overblown conclusion on this board.

They definately take roll outs into play - they break down every single play of the season. Also... many of the rollouts he has to get rid of teh ball almost instantly because the opponents know we like to bootleg - so many of the rollouts are not resulting in more time to pass.

Yeah of course the oline was bad at times- see the 4th quarter in the GB game. Goff didn't have any time to look down the field.

But most teams olines get beat sometimes - see the #2 GB line get their ass beat against tampa bay earlier this year.

That's a testament to how much McVay went out of his way to hide his lines deficiencies... and a testament to how weird PFFs rating systems are

 

[Bearrister]

Lions are actively looking for a trade partner for Stafford. I wonder if the Rams will explore that option.

Sources: Lions actively seek to trade Stafford

With a new GM and a new head coach, the Lions will soon begin fielding trade offers for veteran quarterback Matthew Stafford, sources told ESPN.

www.espn.com

 

[Bearrister]

Lions are actively looking for a trade partner for Stafford. I wonder if the Rams will explore that option.

Sources: Lions actively seek to trade Stafford

With a new GM and a new head coach, the Lions will soon begin fielding trade offers for veteran quarterback Matthew Stafford, sources told ESPN.

www.espn.com

I just remembered that their GM was our head of college scouting. He’ll have as much intimate knowledge about Goff as any opposing GM out there. Then again, that’s also assuming they would even want Goff in a trade for Stafford.

 

[Giles]

Lions are actively looking for a trade partner for Stafford. I wonder if the Rams will explore that option.

Sources: Lions actively seek to trade Stafford

With a new GM and a new head coach, the Lions will soon begin fielding trade offers for veteran quarterback Matthew Stafford, sources told ESPN.

www.espn.com

Eh much rather go for Watson.

 

[Bearrister]

Eh much rather go for Watson.

Oh I would too, but as has been discussed over and over here Watson probably isn’t realistic (if the Rams can get Watson they should absolutely go for it). Stafford is in that next tier of QBs who may be attainable, but the question is whether he’d be an upgrade.

This is more of a question for the people who think we should move on from Goff - is Stafford someone you move on from Goff for? Stafford wouldn’t come here to get into a QB competition or to “push” Goff. He’ll have too many other suitors for that.

The funny thing is that earlier in this thread, I said that Stafford was one of the QB’s in the “non-elite” tier who I would consider as a Goff replacement. Now that he’s on the market, I’m not so sure.

 

[Giles]

Imo no I much rather keep goff. Stafford is intriguing but he hasn't accomplished anything in his long career. Goff has simply accomplished more so far and his career has barely started.

 

[Allen2McVay]

Would think teams like the Colts and Niners will look into Stafford.