The Goff-season Thread

[kurtfaulk]

First, with Warner, he had a so-so season with the Giants, and was actually on his way to taking them to the playoffs. But the Giants had drafted Eli Manning, and Tom Coughlin wanted him to start, so Warner got benched for that reason alone (and much to the anger of his teammates, who wanted Warner to continue starting). If I remember correctly, the Giants didn't win a single game that Eli started that year (but emphasis on 'if'). In 2006, Warner went to the Cardinals, who had drafted Matt Leinart as their future. That's when Warner started wearing the glove too ... something the Rams could have figured out with him had they not threw him under the bus. Leinart started most or all of 2006 given that he was the Cardinals first round draft pick ... then in 2007, the Cardinals finally threw in the towel and gave the reins to Warner. With a supporting cast that was good, he returned to the same form he showed with the Rams when the supporting cast around him there was solid.

i have to disagree a little here. the giants were 5 and 2 then warner had two very bad games, as he did on occasion, which put them at 5 and 4. then coughlin succumbed to the pressure to start eli. the system didn't play to warner's strengths so he did well to even do as well as he did. he didn't put up flashy numbers but did enough for them to win. it was never a long term gig for warner after martz screwed him by cutting him so late into the free agency period and the giants were basically his only offer.

at the cardinals, once again the system denny green ran didn't sit well with warner. he never looked like himself, even with fitz and boldin. predictably he was benched for leinart. then whisenhunt came to town and with him he brought a scheme that maximised warner's talent. after being forced to start leinart at the beginning of the 2007 season whisenhunt would bring in warner to kick start the offense mid game almost every week. the rams did him a favour by rubbing out leinart so he could start warner fulltime. and warner went off for the rest of the season. the rest was history.

not directed at you but for the people that say warner's resurgence was due to fitz and boldin, well, that is absolute crap. he had them in 2005/6 and he couldn't get out of his own way. his resurgence was due to finally being back in a scheme that let him be him. what he did in 2008 with minimal running support was amazing.

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[jrry32]

Okay we're not going to agree on that, which is fine.

Well, look at Fitzpatrick's opposition in 2020. The guy is capable of being absolutely lethal like he was against the 49ers and Raiders. But he's also capable of being a dumpster fire like he was against the Patriots and Seahawks (and that was when the Seahawks defense was pure shit). People were driven nuts by Goff's turnover-prone play against Miami and SF (the second game), but that's literally what you can get any week of the year from Fitz. That's why he's never held onto his starting job for long. So yeah, whether we do better, the same, or worse really depends on how often Fitztragic and Fitzmagic show up and in which games.

As for Minshew, the Jaguars weren't trading that dude before the season, so he wasn't going to be an option this year. But after the first two games, he wasn't very impressive. I think he's redeemable. Things were bad in Jax. I like aspects of his game. He reminds me a lot of Fitzpatrick, actually. Sneaky good athlete, great at improvising, fun to watch, but streaky and turnover prone. I don't think he would have been an upgrade on Goff this year.

What I really wanted to know was that if you wanted to keep Goff because you thought he would get back to his prior form? Or if you would be okay with this version of Goff moving forward?

Based on what we're paying Goff, we need better than the 2020 version.

It seems like the only difference is that you have faith in Goff to rebound, while I don't because I don't see the OL being able to be improved enough to recreate the pockets we had in 2017/2018.

I do. I am one of those people who believes in patience with pocket passers. They take longer to mature. You deal with volatility in their early years. As long as they show you something, give them a chance to hit their primes before you throw in the towel. Goff more than showed us something in 2017 and 2018. It's less about rebounding and more about Goff maturing and continuing to gain experience. Progression with pocket passing QBs often isn't linear. You have ups and downs when they're young.

And if you do think he can get back to form, it follows that you think the OL/WR (or whatever the issue is) will be improved?

Although having said that, I'd be totally fine with Goff if he goes back to turning the ball over like he did in 2017/2018 as opposed to 2019/2020.

I do. I think the OL is close, as long as Whit returns. Replace Blythe with a guy who doesn't get pushed around. That'll fix the weak link. The OL is all about the sum of its parts. That means having one or two truly good/great players and no weak links. Blythe was the weak link. Upgrade on him, and we'll have a top 10 unit. I think highly of the other four guys (Whit, Edwards, Corbett, and Hav).

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

In the recent Late Night Happy Hour with the Kamenetzky Brothers there was a lot of good talk about QB. Couple things that stuck with me too...

First the question "is Goff holding McVay back." We all have our opinions there and my own is that this season where the Rams had a #1 scoring defense and developed a fantastic run game down the stretch the QB position did hold the Rams back, the argument is moreso how much of it was Goff and whether he can get his mojo back. But the opinion that matters is McVay. And if you imagine being McVay going into an NFC playoffs where you can't swing a dead cat without hitting a future Hall of Fame QB it makes sense that his irritation with his QB position (and some other parts of the team too btw like the OL, WR, and gameplanning) might boil over a bit and put that question in his mind.

Second is their discussion about McVay wanting to get "granular" with the offense. The question of to what extent he's been involved in the three different phases I find very interesting. He reportedly hired Staley because he wanted to be more involved in defensive gameplanning and he was also rumored to be more involved in defense than people realize (first time I heard that was during Wade's last season if memory serves). If that is true does he feel like he needs to be more involved in the offense? Sounds like that might be the case if the reporters are reading things correctly.

This is going to be a really interesting offseason man.

You pointed out is ” Goff holding McVay back” (and it can be debated yes)

However, I’d say its the other way around

At some point McVay needs to allow Goff to occaisonally make his own decisions

 

[ottoman89]

You pointed out is ” Goff holding McVay back” (and it can be debated yes)

However, I’d say its the other way around

At some point McVay needs to allow Goff to occaisonally make his own decisions

He sure does.. but it'd probably end up in another interception.

 

[thirteen28]

i have to disagree a little here. the giants were 5 and 2 then warner had two very bad games, as he did on occasion, which put them at 5 and 4. then coughlin succumbed to the pressure to start eli. the system didn't play to warner's strengths so he did well to even do as well as he did. he didn't put up flashy numbers but did enough for them to win. it was never a long term gig for warner after martz screwed him by cutting him so late into the free agency period and the giants were basically his only offer.

at the cardinals, once again the system denny green ran didn't sit well with warner. he never looked like himself, even with fitz and boldin. predictably he was benched for leinart. then whisenhunt came to town and with him he brought a scheme that maximised warner's talent. after being forced to start leinart at the beginning of the 2007 season whisenhunt would bring in warner to kick start the offense mid game almost every week. the rams did him a favour by rubbing out leinart so he could start warner fulltime. and warner went off for the rest of the season. the rest was history.

not directed at you but for the people that say warner's resurgence was due to fitz and boldin, well, that is absolute crap. he had them in 2005/6 and he couldn't get out of his own way. his resurgence was due to finally being back in a scheme that let him be him. what he did in 2008 with minimal running support was amazing.

.

Fair enough, but the point is that Warner needed the right conditions to succeed - and that's a HOF QB. If it applies to him, it pretty much applies to any QB.

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

He sure does.. but it'd probably end up in another interception.

Then so be it, 13 picks isn’t the end of the world, many a HOFr have doubled that amount in a season, many more others had multiple 13 plus pick seasons

Its almost as if our base didn’t learn a damn thing running KW outta down, how ironic what a different QB he was when his o line couldn’t afford even minimal time, almost...this almost sounds a little familiar...nah not with our experts

 

[ottoman89]

Then so be it, 13 picks isn’t the end of the world, many a HOFr have doubled that amount in a season, many more others had multiple 13 plus pick seasons

Its almost as if our base didn’t learn a damn thing running KW outta down, how ironic what a different QB he was when his o line couldn’t afford even minimal time, almost...this almost sounds a little familiar

It's not just the picks I look at, some QBs throw picks that are tipped passes or in right windows.. and Goff does that and I can live with those. The ones that bother me are the JV level decisions and it too often happens.

WITH that being said, and all the frustration I have for Goff right now, IF we so choose to hang on to him, I know he can make great throws and have big games. It'd just that the last season and half or so he's been trending the wrong way.

 

[dieterbrock]

Then so be it, 13 picks isn’t the end of the world, many a HOFr have doubled that amount in a season, many more others had multiple 13 plus pick seasons

Its almost as if our base didn’t learn a damn thing running KW outta down, how ironic what a different QB he was when his o line couldn’t afford even minimal time, almost...this almost sounds a little familiar...nah not with our experts

Only 3 turnovers in his last 6 games. Incidentally, Brees had 3 turnovers in his last game alone

 

[Ram_Rally]

GUYS LOOK

 

[ottoman89]

GUYS LOOK
View attachment 43116

Ramsey just having fun with it.

 

[jrry32]

Only 3 turnovers in his last 6 games. Incidentally, Brees had 3 turnovers in his last game alone

Posted a 100+ passer rating in the two playoff games with a busted thumb on his throwing hand. Didn't turn the ball over. Played smart, conservative football. Simply put, we begged Goff to be exactly the type of QB he was in the playoffs. The defense wasn't the dominant unit we needed against Green Bay to make a Super Bowl run. I am strongly in favor of running it back with Goff next year. I'm fine with bringing in somebody who can start if Goff implodes. But I think it would be a mistake to move on from Goff, unless we can get Watson.

 

[SteezyEndo]

GUYS LOOK
View attachment 43116

Lol wait what?...

 

[Ram_Rally]

Ramsey just having fun with it.

They're good friends. Wonder if they're talking

 

[ottoman89]

They're good friends. Wonder if they're talking

Oh I'm sure. NFL players love to stir the pot.

 

[Ram_Rally]

Lol wait what?...

See Ramsey's comment?

 

[SteezyEndo]

See Ramsey's comment?

LA=Louisiana=New Orleans?

Dude I am just f’n around. I know Ramsey meant LA Los Angeles, its just if that comment holds water there would be no more threads about Goff.

 

[payote75]

It's is kind of ironic this comment comes on the heels of that Twitter video that someone posted earlier today and Jordan (spelling???) Specifically said jalen subtly tips you off about something with out saying it or them realising it.....for some of us we can only hope that's the case lol.

 

[Merlin]

You pointed out is ” Goff holding McVay back” (and it can be debated yes)

However, I’d say its the other way around

At some point McVay needs to allow Goff to occaisonally make his own decisions

That happened this season up front, Goff was checking into and out of plays based on his reads and also had protections. Truth is that QBs earn that privilege through demonstrating proficiency and his struggles don't set up your argument all that well.

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

That happened this season up front, Goff was checking into and out of plays based on his reads and also had protections. Truth is that QBs earn that privilege through demonstrating proficiency and his struggles don't set up your argument all that well.

Pretty sure he was only given one option to check into, at least isnt this common knowledge the Rams call at least two plays in the huddle? (What if both plays were wrong, did he have the reign to x McVays call? probably not)

100% disagree with your second sentence, first how the heck can you make that statement with any authority, lol, I guess the great Aerosmith lyric “you gotta lose to know how to win” doesn’t resonate, to me that’s a very prophetic line.

 

[Ellard80]

Ramsey can comment.. but... yeah.....