Liam gone

[blackbart]

Maybe Coen doesn’t like LA. It’s not for everyone, he might want to go back to a rural setting.

I’m sure there are a lot of factors that came in to the decision that have nothing to do with his job responsibilities with the Rams.

 

[jrry32]

Quick do Carberry next

Unless Carberry used some sort of voodoo magic to injure all of our OLs, I don't think it's fair to blame him for his unit not performing when we lost like 7 of our top 9 OLs to injury and are relying on street FAs at multiple starting spots.

Not true at all. He's an extremely sought after coach in SEC and they fired their OC weeks ago. If anything it was a weird move he left there in the 1st place

It made sense to me to leave if he wanted a shot at being a NFL HC. But after the way this year went, he wasn't going to get considered for a promotion in the short term, so heading back to Kentucky is understandable.

 

[jrry32]

Maybe Coen doesn’t like LA. It’s not for everyone, he might want to go back to a rural setting.

I’m sure there are a lot of factors that came in to the decision that have nothing to do with his job responsibilities with the Rams.

Lexington isn't LA, but it's definitely not a rural setting, my friend.

 

[blackbart]

Lexington isn't LA, but it's definitely not a rural setting, my friend.

True but just outside of Lexington is, there’s not much of that left between Semi Valley and San Diego. And, no one wants to live around Bakersfield

 

[Zodi]

Unless Carberry used some sort of voodoo magic to injure all of our OLs, I don't think it's fair to blame him for his unit not performing when we lost like 7 of our top 9 OLs to injury and are relying on street FAs at multiple starting spots.

Not what I was referring to at all. Our lineman get zero push in the run game since Carberry came on board. DFarr and maybe even Baldy did a breakdown of Carberry's run blocking scheme last season and it is not good.

 

[TSFH Fan]

I think Baldy was pro-Carberry last year.


View: https://twitter.com/BaldyNFL/status/1475925194522910722

 

[OldSchool]

I think Baldy was pro-Carberry last year.


View: https://twitter.com/BaldyNFL/status/1475925194522910722

He was, he's also a huge fan of Yarber and the WR room with their blocking skills.

 

[jrry32]

Not what I was referring to at all. Our lineman get zero push in the run game since Carberry came on board. DFarr and maybe even Baldy did a breakdown of Carberry's run blocking scheme last season and it is not good.

Our OLs have gotten zero push for years, before Carberry got there. That's a result of McVay and Snead's preference for OLs who are lighter and more intelligent, skilled, and agile.

 

[PhillyRam]

Our OLs have gotten zero push for years, before Carberry got there. That's a result of McVay and Snead's preference for OLs who are lighter and more intelligent, skilled, and agile.

Havenstein is not light. Whitworth was not light. Edwards was an OT playing G. They are/were big enough. Denver always had light linemen and they could run the hell out of the ball.

It's obvious the run scheme here lacks imagination and any type of positive consistency.

Even Havenstein's pass blocking was horrendous and it looked like technique/scheme issues to some extent. Sure Crosby is a beast, but show him different looks. Don't retreat back to the QBs lap immediately off the snap everytime. Hit him first occasionally at the line. The coach can chip him occasionally. Instead it was a race back to Mayfield on every snap.

 

[jrry32]

Havenstein is not light. Whitworth was not light. Edwards was an OT playing G. They are/were big enough. Denver always had light linemen and they could run the hell out of the ball.

David Edwards is 6'6" 308. He's not a large OG. Reality is reality. McVay and Snead have a preference. That preference is not for 340 pound OGs.

Denver didn't burn teams by pushing them around. They used movement and scheming. Kyle Shanahan does the same. We also run a ZBS, but McVay doesn't scheme up his rushing attack as well as the Shanahans do/did.

It's obvious the run scheme here lacks imagination and any type of positive consistency.

You should have a talk with the HC, then.

Even Havenstein's pass blocking was horrendous and it looked like technique/scheme issues to some extent. Sure Crosby is a beast, but show him different looks. Don't retreat back to the QBs lap immediately off the snap everytime. Hit him first occasionally at the line. The coach can chip him occasionally. Instead it was a race back to Mayfield on every snap.

Crosby is one of the best EDGEs in the NFL this year. Havenstein's job is made harder by the fact that the interior OL isn't effective, which limits the QB's ability to step up in the pocket, and our LT is a street free agent, which limits the help Havenstein can get with Crosby. Havenstein, while a very good RT, has always had his limitations against top EDGE rushers when he's not getting help.

 

[FarNorth]

Our OLs have gotten zero push for years, before Carberry got there. That's a result of McVay and Snead's preference for OLs who are lighter and more intelligent, skilled, and agile.

And who also happen to be available with lower picks. Maybe if the Rams had, or had used, higher picks they might have gotten skill and power.

 

[PhillyRam]

David Edwards is 6'6" 308. He's not a large OG. Reality is reality. McVay and Snead have a preference. That preference is not for 340 pound OGs.

Denver didn't burn teams by pushing them around. They used movement and scheming. Kyle Shanahan does the same. We also run a ZBS, but McVay doesn't scheme up his rushing attack as well as the Shanahans do/did.

You should have a talk with the HC, then.

Crosby is one of the best EDGEs in the NFL this year. Havenstein's job is made harder by the fact that the interior OL isn't effective, which limits the QB's ability to step up in the pocket, and our LT is a street free agent, which limits the help Havenstein can get with Crosby. Havenstein, while a very good RT, has always had his limitations against top EDGE rushers when he's not getting help.

Regardless of all that...they are big enough and as you said the scheme is a problem. So not sure what the disagreement is here regarding the run game.

BTW, watch film on Jackie Slater one on one with Reggie White in the 89' Wild Card game. He mixed things up on every play...kept him off guard. Havenstein just retreated back on every play.

 

[BonifayRam]

RT Rob Havenstein is at his best when the offense runs the ball. The problem is McVay has had no running game for years now. Waste of one of the best run-blocking RT's in the NFL. Don't blame Havenstien. It's a shame to waste him with this pass first run last offense.

I would hope that McVay would look for a new OC who has a great mind for building a run game to go with what McVay has created thus far in the passing game.

Rams won the SB with Carberry as the OL coach. I have been critical of Carberry this season.

 

[blackbart]

RT Rob Havenstein is at his best when the offense runs the ball. The problem is McVay has had no running game for years now. Waste of one of the best run-blocking RT's in the NFL. Don't blame Havenstien. It's a shame to waste him with this pass first run last offense.

I would hope that McVay would look for a new OC who has a great mind for building a run game to go with what McVay has created thus far in the passing game.

Rams won the SB with Carberry as the OL coach. I have been critical of Carberry this season.

Agree but have no idea who that would be. Maybe someone from Cleveland? Callahan perhaps????

 

[jrry32]

Regardless of all that...they are big enough and as you said the scheme is a problem. So not sure what the disagreement is here regarding the run game.

BTW, watch film on Jackie Slater one on one with Reggie White in the 89' Wild Card game. He mixed things up on every play...kept him off guard. Havenstein just retreated back on every play.

The disagreement here is that we don't have an OL designed to push guys around. We have an OL designed to create horizontal movement, not vertical movement. And McVay is the guy who schemes the offense. When the offense struggles, people have a tendency to blame the assistants. McVay is the guy pulling the strings. He's a great coach, but he has some weaknesses.

Havenstein isn't Jackie Slater.

 

[Loyal]

Losing Liam is a big nothing burger to me....

 

[oldnotdead]

I've been saying for years Havenstein sucks against speed but no one believed me. All you had to do was go back and watched how old man Carlos Dunlap owned Rob every time the Rams played Seattle. Everyone thought it was an anomaly. Go back and look at his college film. Havenstein has heavy feet, i.e. slow feet which is death in the NFL. Why do you think he gets so damn many false starts? He's looking for an edge because he's beat at the snap. Why do you think I've been advocating to release Havenstein? But he's locked in for one more year due to cap numbers, especially if Stafford retires. But they have an out in 2024 in Havenstein's contract. Releasing him will actually clear cap.

I've said it ever since they signed Skura that he sucked. I've seen him play before he got here and he plays like another Blythe. Nsekhe is worth signing to a one or two year contract to play swing OT.

The Ram OL outlook next year is actually pretty good. I think they have the makings of a decent OL. If Noteboom can return to form they means they can play Jackson at LG which will plug that hole. Shelton can stay at RG and they can give Bruss a year to develop. Then they would move Jackson to RT and Bruss to OG (right or left). IMO that would mean 2024 OL would be better than the 2021 version.

 

[jrry32]

I've been saying for years Havenstein sucks against speed but no one believed me. All you had to do was go back and watched how old man Carlos Dunlap owned Rob every time the Rams played Seattle. Everyone thought it was an anomaly. Go back and look at his college film. Havenstein has heavy feet, i.e. slow feet which is death in the NFL. Why do you think he gets so damn many false starts? He's looking for an edge because he's beat at the snap. Why do you think I've been advocating to release Havenstein? But he's locked in for one more year due to cap numbers, especially if Stafford retires. But they have an out in 2024 in Havenstein's contract. Releasing him will actually clear cap.

I've said it ever since they signed Skura that he sucked. I've seen him play before he got here and he plays like another Blythe. Nsekhe is worth signing to a one or two year contract to play swing OT.

The Ram OL outlook next year is actually pretty good. I think they have the makings of a decent OL. If Noteboom can return to form they means they can play Jackson at LG which will plug that hole. Shelton can stay at RG and they can give Bruss a year to develop. Then they would move Jackson to RT and Bruss to OG (right or left). IMO that would mean 2024 OL would be better than the 2021 version.

Let's be clear, Havenstein having some limitations against speed is not a good reason to release him. There are ways to cover for that weakness, particularly for an OL like Havenstein who is great in many other respects. He's a top 10 player at this position. But it's harder to mask that weakness when you're having to mask the weaknesses of the rest of the OL.

 

[oldnotdead]

You can mask the weakness only by weakening something else. McVay hates to go max protect because that is the only way. Havenstein's play wasn't helped by Higbee whose play has really deteriorated this year. He has missed blocks, and his routes have been erratic at times. The breakdown of Mayfield's passes actually illustrates how badly Higbee's play has become. It was on the pass to Akers on the one yard line. Higbee missed his block and then ran a poor route that made the throw harder.

Having to support Havenstein for an entire game will hamstring the offense. He's the highest paid OL player but he's got a fatal flaw that being his heavy feet. As far as being the highest rated RT is that by PFF? If it is we all know how flawed their metric is.

 

[oldnotdead]

BTW Greg Olson is in line to replace Coen as OC. It will be interesting what wrinkles he will incorporate in the offense. Will he tailor more of it to fit Mayfield? It's clear that the Rams tailored the plays they gave Mayfield to run Thursday night to concepts he liked. It shows how perhaps McVay has grown as a HC. He refused to do that with Goff and basically hamstrung him retarding his development. Yet he began to tailor the offense when Stafford arrived.

I believe that Mayfield would be foolish not to spend at least a year with the Rams as a backup. He could grow in so many ways with some mentorship from Stafford. A year in this offense learning behind Stafford would make him the heir apparent to the starting position. I firmly believe Stafford retires either in January or in 2024. One more serious concussion during the 2023 season would be all it takes. If Baker is their backup this team won't miss a beat next year. That's why I truly believe Baker will stay at least through 2023.

I think we need to get used to the idea of Mayfield being the next QB for the Rams. After watching the breakdown of his play, I'm feeling a whole lot better because unlike Murray, Baker has grown professionally as an NFL QB. That breakdown showed me that Mayfield is a tier one QB in the NFL.