Leonard Fournette a great solve at RB

[jrry32]

Huh? They went to the afc championship 2 years ago. A big reason was Calais Campbell who signed with the jags because of coughlin.

You're shooting your own argument in the foot. Now, Coughlin had a veteran leader like Calais Campbell, and the young players on the team still ended up hating TC (and the franchise because of him). Yes, they went to the AFCCG two years ago because they had talent. And now, their entire team is being blown up because none of the young players wanted to stick around. Of course, the veterans are also being shipped out too. It's quite simple to me. If one of their young talents acted out because he wanted to be "freed," that player was likely just an asshole. When all their young talents were acting out because they wanted to be "freed," Coughlin was the asshole.

 

[rams1fan]

You're shooting your own argument in the foot. Now, Coughlin had a veteran leader like Calais Campbell, and the young players on the team still ended up hating TC (and the franchise because of him). Yes, they went to the AFCCG two years ago because they had talent. And now, their entire team is being blown up because none of the young players wanted to stick around. Of course, the veterans are also being shipped out too. It's quite simple to me. If one of their young talents acted out because he wanted to be "freed," that player was likely just an asshole. When all their young talents were acting out because they wanted to be "freed," Coughlin was the asshole.

I am not shooting myself. The owner khan should have backed him like Mara did in ny.
the players complained because coughlin had a policy that if you are not at a meeting five minutes early than you are late. Hardly draconian. And fines around this is what p,Ayers won because technicality it was against the rules.

and LF needing to be freed. Do some research. Multiple on and off field incidents. Being overweight.

 

[Loyal]

Well, Leonard Fournette end up on the Rams, we better have an Oline to open holes for him. HE better not be a team cancer which is even more important.

 

[jrry32]

I am not shooting myself. The owner khan should have backed him like Mara did in ny.
the players complained because coughlin had a policy that if you are not at a meeting five minutes early than you are late. Hardly draconian. And fines around this is what p,Ayers won because technicality it was against the rules.

and LF needing to be freed. Do some research. Multiple on and off field incidents. Being overweight.

Mara didn't back Coughlin. In fact, Coughlin was on his way to being fired until he listened to his players/Mara and mellowed. It's quite easy to understand why Khan didn't back him.

Coughlin out as Jags' executive VP of football ops

Jaguars owner Shad Khan said his decision to fire Tom Coughlin immediately instead of after the season came "in recent days."

www.espn.com

I've done my research. I know that organization well. Coughlin tried to run the team like a tyrant, and the players had enough of it. Coughlin's actions blew up that team, and they're why the Jaguars, try as they might, cannot get their top young pass rusher, Yannick Ngakoue, to even negotiate with them. I don't care to hear excuses about technicalities and all these players being bad eggs. One of the most important jobs the coaching staff and front office have is managing egos. The Jaguars fired Coughlin because he couldn't manage the players' egos or his own.

As for you citing LF's issues, Dante was allegedly a problem there too. Magically, those problems disappeared and his play improved mightily when he ended up on a better-run team.

 

[rams1fan]

Mara didn't back Coughlin. In fact, Coughlin was on his way to being fired until he listened to his players/Mara and mellowed. It's quite easy to understand why Khan didn't back him.

Coughlin out as Jags' executive VP of football ops

Jaguars owner Shad Khan said his decision to fire Tom Coughlin immediately instead of after the season came "in recent days."

www.espn.com

I've done my research. I know that organization well. Coughlin tried to run the team like a tyrant, and the players had enough of it. Coughlin's actions blew up that team, and they're why the Jaguars, try as they might, cannot get their top young pass rusher, Yannick Ngakoue, to even negotiate with them. I don't care to hear excuses about technicalities and all these players being bad eggs. One of the most important jobs the coaching staff and front office have is managing egos. The Jaguars fired Coughlin because he couldn't manage the players' egos or his own.

As for you citing LF's issues, Dante was allegedly a problem there too. Magically, those problems disappeared and his play improved mightily when he ended up on a better-run team.

Dante was outplayed . how was that coughlins fault?

 

[jrry32]

Dante was outplayed . how was that coughlins fault?

Former Jags DE Dante Fowler Jr. shares thoughts on winning grievance vs. organization

The Jacksonville Jaguars were slammed yesterday by the NFLPA after it was reported that an arbitrator ruled in their favor against the organization after the team fined a player over $700,000 for r…

jaguarswire.usatoday.com

 

[Loyal]

I'd be full in on Fournette if he becomes Ram. If he's good team mate, I could give a shyte about what happened in Jacksonville. I'm not getting excited or worked up about it one way or the other until I see him in (split) horns.....See what I did there?

 

[Malibu]

Jville is a very sad situation. They had some strong key talent but they hated TC and look at the result. Most players that are not resigned by the Rams most you can tell loved it here and wanted to continue with the Rams. One player you can label a malcontent but multiple players I highly doubt it.

They put up with it in NE for one reason - results!

 

[rams1fan]

Former Jags DE Dante Fowler Jr. shares thoughts on winning grievance vs. organization

The Jacksonville Jaguars were slammed yesterday by the NFLPA after it was reported that an arbitrator ruled in their favor against the organization after the team fined a player over $700,000 for r…

jaguarswire.usatoday.com

What does this have to do with being outplayed by Yannick? Nothing. Fowler complained about not starting over Yannick. And I am not saying Fowler was a bad player. And obviously both the Jaguars and Rams new it as we trader a third and a fifth for him. But the Jags traded him because of worth and the Rams let him go because of worth (i.e. not worth 16 mil). Yet you only criticize the Jags.

 

[8to12]

He fits exactly what the Rams need - a power back that goes between the tackles which compliments Henderson. Plus a huge threat in the passing game only Helaire fits that bill currently in the draft. LF is a great blocker. Zero learning curve that a draftee will take.

Sure I get it the oline was not good last year especially as it pertains to our run game. I have been probably the biggest proponent of that being our #1 issue along with our Run D. The Run D has been somewhat addressed still need a beefy ILB. If we spend draft capital on the oline and add LF the offense will be better.

You keep mentioning "run between the tackles". That is not the Rams scheme. They primarily an "outside' Zone" ; all the blockers block to one side or another, the RB follows that side -to side motion until a crease is created then they sharply cut upfield. I could be wrong, but not sure the Jaguars had him do that or if he had skill at it.
With that said, you are pretty adamant about it and I am not here to change your opinion. However, your position also seems to be telling others that it's the only way. We both want the Rams to get back to scoring 30+ points a game and go deep into the playoffs. Their forte is offense. They score a lot of points from the Play Action Pass, which is set up by the running game, and the RB's share in the scoring in the Red Zone. However, the 49ers just got to the Superbowl using the same ZBS scheme with a RB by committee. Two of the three RB's were undrafted FA's. So, there are cheaper ways to get there.

 

[jrry32]

What does this have to do with being outplayed by Yannick? Nothing. Fowler complained about not starting over Yannick. And I am not saying Fowler was a bad player. And obviously both the Jaguars and Rams new it as we trader a third and a fifth for him. But the Jags traded him because of worth and the Rams let him go because of worth (i.e. not worth 16 mil). Yet you only criticize the Jags.

Straw man argument. I said that Dante was supposedly a bad egg in Jacksonville, and that problem completely disappeared when he went to a better-run team. Yes, I blame the Jaguars for that. Well, I blame Tom Coughlin for that. I blame Tom Coughlin for driving away Jalen Ramsey. I blame Tom Coughlin for making Yannick and Fournette so angry that neither wants to stick around in Jax. He poisoned the team's relationship with its young building blocks. You can continue making excuses for him, but I've said my piece and am moving on. Have a nice night.

 

[jrry32]

You keep mentioning "run between the tackles". That is not the Rams scheme. They primarily an "outside' Zone" ; all the blockers block to one side or another, the RB follows that side -to side motion until a crease is created then they sharply cut upfield. I could be wrong, but not sure the Jaguars had him do that or if he had skill at it.
With that said, you are pretty adamant about it and I am not here to change your opinion. However, your position also seems to be telling others that it's the only way. We both want the Rams to get back to scoring 30+ points a game and go deep into the playoffs. Their forte is offense. They score a lot of points from the Play Action Pass, which is set up by the running game, and the RB's share in the scoring in the Red Zone. However, the 49ers just got to the Superbowl using the same ZBS scheme with a RB by committee. Two of the three RB's were undrafted FA's. So, there are cheaper ways to get there.

The Rams use both inside- and outside-zone elements in our scheming. I think Fournette would fit well in both, but that's obviously debatable. As for the 49ers, they have a Shanahan. We don't. McVay is an elite schemer. IMO, he's a better passing-game schemer than Kyle. But the Shanahans are the GOAT running-game schemers. McVay isn't on Kyle's level. Nobody in the NFL is right now. Pointing to them as a model for how we should do things is like pointing to Belichick's ability to take cast-off LBs and turn them into studs and saying that we can do that. It's just not realistic.

But I don't want Fournette here to be a workhorse. I'd like to see what Henderson can do. But I would love to have him as one half of a two-headed monster rushing attack.

 

[Ram65]

But I don't want Fournette here to be a workhorse. I'd like to see what Henderson can do. But I would love to have him as one half of a two-headed monster rushing attack.

I really doubt he would be happy in that role heading into a contract year. I also doubt Rams would want to pay him $10Mil for his fifth-year option making him a one-year rental.

 

[jrry32]

I really doubt he would be happy in that role heading into a contract year. I also doubt Rams would want to pay him $10Mil for his fifth-year option making him a one-year rental.

Okay. If he plays well as a one-year rental, we get a compensation pick back. And if Henderson proves not to be a NFL starter, we have a fallback option in 2020 and potentially beyond.

 

[ramfan46]

Every situation should be looked at individually, but the Rams greatest running back was known as a bit of locker room problem before he was traded to the team. Nothing about Fournette should be cast in stone, each team has a different dynamic and some guys fit better than others depending on circumstances.

 

[rams1fan]

Straw man argument. I said that Dante was supposedly a bad egg in Jacksonville, and that problem completely disappeared when he went to a better-run team. Yes, I blame the Jaguars for that. Well, I blame Tom Coughlin for that. I blame Tom Coughlin for driving away Jalen Ramsey. I blame Tom Coughlin for making Yannick and Fournette so angry that neither wants to stick around in Jax. He poisoned the team's relationship with its young building blocks. You can continue making excuses for him, but I've said my piece and am moving on. Have a nice night.

I never said Dantes was a bad egg in Jacksonville. I said he was outplayed by Yannick and that is a fact. Blaming Coughlin makes zero sense. You want to blame everything on Coughlin. great. Whem we dont sign Ramsey will that be Coughlins fault.

 

[Neil039]

I'm not for trading for Fournette. I had to remind myself he played with Nick and Gardner last season and still had 1,700 all purpose yards. Not to shabby.

 

[Ram_Rally]

Any running back the Rams bring in from free agency, trade, or draft is only as good as their offense line.

Not entirely true. That would suggest that there's literally no difference between a Zeke level back and a Trent Richardson type back. Running backs still need vision and explosiveness despite their line play

 

[TexasRam]

Not entirely true. That would suggest that there's literally no difference between a Zeke level back and a Trent Richardson type back. Running backs still need vision and explosiveness despite their line play

It's a good discussion and there is Truth in both statements the two of you made, In my opinion.

"Any RB is only as good as their offensive line"
and
"RB's still Need vision and explosiveness despite their line play"

Gurley in 2016 averaged 3.2 YPC
Gurley in 2018 averaged 4.9 YPC

Gurley didn't change, but his Oline and surrounding cast certainly did.

A RB is going almost no where with a bad surrounding cast and especially Oline (though WR and TE blocking is also huge)

But the difference between a healthy Gurley and a RB that drops passes, cant pass block, lacks vision, lacks ability to breaks tackles/make people miss, lacks speed to break off explosive plays etc - Is night and day.

RB talent affects an offense, but so does O-line. A bad O-line can destroy an offense. A bad RB can limit an offense.

 

[8to12]

The Rams use both inside- and outside-zone elements in our scheming. I think Fournette would fit well in both, but that's obviously debatable. As for the 49ers, they have a Shanahan. We don't. McVay is an elite schemer. IMO, he's a better passing-game schemer than Kyle. But the Shanahans are the GOAT running-game schemers. McVay isn't on Kyle's level. Nobody in the NFL is right now. Pointing to them as a model for how we should do things is like pointing to Belichick's ability to take cast-off LBs and turn them into studs and saying that we can do that. It's just not realistic.

But I don't want Fournette here to be a workhorse. I'd like to see what Henderson can do. But I would love to have him as one half of a two-headed monster rushing attack.

Nice reply ..... the inside zone is less obvious to me....thank you for pointing that out.
If the Rams made a trade for him, his salary due is 8.5 Mil. And, I think he will want a pay increase in his next deal. So, how much is too much for a RB in the Rams offense? Did they or did they not learn a lesson by paying Gurley over 15-mil? At some point you have to say the Rams are capped out on Max contracts / Franchise type players.