Center is the need

[dang]

Rzms have a lot of $$$ tied up with Goff. They need to give him the pieces to maximize his effectiveness. That means B+ OL and WR4 that can mature into WR3 or WR2 if Reynolds or Woods moves on.

 

[ramfan46]

Rzms have a lot of $$$ tied up with Goff. They need to give him the pieces to maximize his effectiveness. That means B+ OL and WR4 that can mature into WR3 or WR2 if Reynolds or Woods moves on.

I'm not giving up hope on Nsimba Webster. I really liked what I saw from him last year in preseason. When he took over the PR job, he made good decisions and caught the ball clean. He keeps displaying soft hands. If they draft a WR cool, but I like the top 4 right now.

 

[So Ram]

My thoughts exactly for this draft and who will likely be available and at what position with our needs but probably our needs will be BPA at that point as well. I'm excited as hell and know Snead can turn our picks into a few more quality players/starters.

Fortunately now we have ammo to play to his biggest strengths as a GM.



It seems Center is an undervalued part of the O-Line but I am not one that undervalues it's importance. A center that can make the proper calls for protection at the line, cause consistency for our young QB and cohesion between the left and right sides of the the line is not imperative but a must. At least 3 pretty damned good Center prospects will be there when our picks in the 2nd round come up.

Young QB ?? Jared Goff is a veteran that has been to the SuperBowl.

Center ?? Austin Blythe has experience as well & knows the calls better than any Lineman on The Rams. Sullivan was brought in late in 2017. Resigned late again 2018 on a 2yr deal. The Rams then cut him & gave the Center position to Brian Allen. Bad decision imo. That said I don’t see The Rams valuing it as much as you.

 

[Corbin]

Young QB ?? Jared Goff is a veteran that has been to the SuperBowl.

Center ?? Austin Blythe has experience as well & knows the calls better than any Lineman on The Rams. Sullivan was brought in late in 2017. Resigned late again 2018 on a 2yr deal. The Rams then cut him & gave the Center position to Brian Allen. Bad decision imo. That said I don’t see The Rams valuing it as much as you.

 

[shovelpass]

Reeder on passing downs

I disagree with this. Reeder was pulled on passing downs last season and for good reason. He struggles in space and is too stiff to be a good coverage LB. Maybe he improves in the offseason but there's better options for LBs, Howard is a coverage guy who was getting snaps later in the season.

Reeder's numbers in coverage
�

Year ▼	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	Int	Tgt	Cmp	Cmp%	Yds	Yds/Cmp	Yds/Tgt	TD	Rat	DADOT	Air	YAC	Bltz	Hrry	QBKD	Sk	Prss	Comb	MTkl	MTkl%
2019	25	LAR	LB	51	16	8	0	17	16	94.1%	246	15.4	14.5	2	158.0	6.6	111	135	3	0	0	0.0	0	58	9	13.4%

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/R/ReedTr01.htm

 

[mikedlo23]

i honestly don't see the need to draft any early offensive line picks in the draft next week....i believe going into this year the best 5 will start regardless of position.... my five would be

LT-WHIT
LG-CORBETT
C-BLYTH
RG-EVANS
RT-HAV

that still leaves us edwards,allen,noteboom with the odd men out....the only guy i would consider taking if he fell to us is austin jackson to replace whitworth next year if he retires

 

[BonifayRam]

Brian Allen's coronavirus diagnosis explains the signing of Blythe as a one year stop-gap. I still think there is no guarantee Blythe will the starter at C. Also I strongly believe that Snead still feels that Allen is their man long term and I agree. Allen outplayed both Sullivan and Blythe last year. Why he's disparaged on this board is puzzling. Simply breaking down his play last year is all it would take.

Most teams only carry 8 o-line on the active roster while stashing 2 or 3 on the PS. Only 7 are active (dressed) on game day. Right now their starting o-line looks like:

LT Whitworth
LG Corbett
C Allen
RG Evans as that is where his best fit is
RT Edwards because I think he was originally drafted to replace Havenstein

Gameday: OT Havenstein if he's still on the team or Brewer if he isn't. OG/C Blythe if Allen is good to go or if Blythe is starting then Shelton.

IMO those are the 8 guys on the active roster in September with Noteboom on PUP. When he's active I believe Havenstein (assuming he wasn't traded) or Blythe is released if Allen is healthy.

The Rams are committed to Whitworth through the 2021 season. That's why I believe that Noteboom will be placed carried on PUP all the way through TC and into the season. He will then become Whitworth's backup until 2022.

This is why I don't see them investing draft capital on the o-line this year. Of course, this changes somewhat if they are able to trade Havenstein before the season which then allows them to carry Noteboom on the active roster through the season.

Read this article by Bret Stuter this morning thought of you old...... His opinion on Ram OL'er David Edwards was very close to yours. His thoughts where Edwards was ordained to start @ the RT post. Of course that's not a bad spot for Edwards to start it's where most of all his colliege starts came at. Plus add the fact that Edwards did excel there @ RT post. I just think he will be an excellent OG too. Kromer might also look @ Brian Allen or Chandler Brewer as starting RG's in 2020 too.

As you might know I have been thinking that the Rams will attempt to trade Hav .....before the draft, during the draft or after the draft & maybe even before the trade dealine in October this season too.

3 reasons why LA Rams trade RT Rob Havenstein during NFL draft

The LA Rams re-signed virtually all 2019 offensive linemen. But early in the 2020 NFL Draft, will the team shock anyone by trading away RT Rob Havenstein?

ramblinfan.com

The LA Rams re-signed virtually all 2019 offensive linemen. But early in the 2020 NFL Draft, will the team shock anyone by trading away RT Rob Havenstein?

The LA Rams ended the 2019 NFL season with a 9-7 record, and just five picks in the 2020 NFL Draft. But that was before the team claimed a 2020 third-round compensatory pick (number 104), and before the team traded for a second-round pick from the Houston Texans by trading away wide receiver Brandin Cooks.

But the pattern of the LA Rams pre-draft meetings suggests that the team would like to address nice different positions in the 2020 NFL Draft: LB, ER, DL, CB, WR, TE, RB, OC& OT.

That suggests that the Rams will need more NFL draft picks than their current stockpile of seven. Of course, the team could trade back, and there are many teams openly discussing a variety of trade back and trade-up options on draft day. But the basic requirements of any trades still apply. The Rams must hold something of value for another team, the other team must hold something of value for the Rams, and both teams must see more value in what the other team offers. On draft-day with limits to technology, the Rams may not be able to negotiate a suitable trade within the time allowed.

Of course, the time consumed on draft day is the pick for pick assessment based upon the draft board that exists when the trade is executed. But there are other trade scenarios to consider. What about a player for pick(s) trade scenario? As we’ve analyzed the LA Rams position heading into the 2020 NFL Draft, one player’s name keeps surfacing as the logical choice for a draft-day trade, that of OT Rob Havenstein.

Starting offensive tackles seller’s market
Many teams need offensive linemen this year. That’s why the NFL Free Agency market for young offensive linemen was so aggressive this year. And it’s why may mock drafts suggest that six offensive tackles will come off the board in round one of the 2020 NFL Draft. All of these independent forces are creating a solid market for the LA Rams to pursue fielding calls for right tackle Rob Havenstein.

The Rams are committing to a youth movement along their offensive line. While many NFL teams are trying to find 2020 starters, the Rams have a luxury of drafting in 2020 for 2021 starters. That is the reason why the team re-signed Austin Blythe and Andrew Whitworth. But adding them, plus center Coleman Shelton, to the existing roster has the Rams loaded with players who may have starting potential in 2020, but who will need time both in practice and in the preseason to get there.

Move OT merchandise
Which means the Rams have too many offensive linemen at the same plateau right now. It makes sense as the Rams added two offensive linemen in the 2018 NFL Draft, two more in the 2019 NFL Draft, and then, due to injuries, were forced to add two more in 2019 midseason. That’s six offensive linemen over 18 months. And if the pre-draft meetings hold true, the Rams intend to add two more offensive linemen in the 2020 NFL Draft. Something has to give.

The Rams COULD attempt to trade one of their multiple young prospects. But the value of those prospects may be more in favor of the Rams retaining the player than to trade them. What is the market value of a Joseph Noteboom right now? A young player coming off injury who did not impress with his Rams’ debut in 2019. What about David Edwards, a young man who did step up for the team late in 2019?

Of course, those same questions could be asked of the LA Rams’ Rob Havenstein. The difference is that Havenstein has played at that NFL level and has been a starter on a super bowl team’s offensive line. Havenstein played poorly in 2019 and then was injured as well. But of the LA Rams plentiful offensive linemen, the easiest to trade and receive something of value in this draft is Havenstein. So what could he bring about for the Rams in return? Of course, that will truly depend upon the team and the urgency. He should be able to get a draft value of a second-round pick in the 2020 NFL Draft. For the right tea

Reason one- Young enough to fit rebuilding team profile
Rob Havenstein is just 27 years old. that means in terms of the NFL life cycle, he has a good five-six years of productive value before a team will be forced to reevaluate the position. While he is young enough to have plenty of productive years remaining in his NFL career, he has already proven to the NFL that he can play at a very good level.

And for teams in the hunt for their franchise quarterback, the incentive to ensure good offensive line play is a rather high priority. If a team invests a valuable first-round pick in a quarterback, the team is virtually obliged to invest in an offensive line to protect that quarterback.

The Miami Dolphins are a curious team in the 2020 NFL Draft. The team holds three first-round picks, and will most certainly choose a quarterback at pick number five. The team will likely want to add an elite skill player at pick number 18. But by the time the Dolphins return for their third selection in round one, many of the best offensive tackles will be off the board.

Faced with the likelihood of swinging and missing for a defensive player like Edge rusher Yetur Gross Matos out of Penn State or trading for a field-tested NFL veteran offensive tackle to protect their new quarterback, I could see plenty of justification to trade the 26th pick of the 2020 NFL Draft to the LA Rams for Havenstein. The Dolphins make this pick because no offensive tackle is better at 26. The LA Rams make this pick since the team has committed to David Edwards, and can afford to select an offensive tackle to develop in 2020.

Reason two – More certain than NFL rookie
The greatest struggle in drafting an NFL rookie offensive lineman is the sheer patience involved in waiting for that player to develop into a true NFL veteran. Regardless of the round or pick, offensive linemen take time to become good. Some of that reason lies in the fact that the offensive lineman depends so heavily upon his teammates in a game.

NFL rookies at the offensive line must not only adapt to a new city, a new team, but also to a new group of teammates. Offensive lines are judged just as much as a unit as judged as five individual players. All of those changes and relationships take time to build, all of which happen simultaneously to learning an NFL playbook and understanding blocking assignments.Life comes at you fast as an NFL rookie. That is why the 2020 NFL Free Agency market for offensive tackles signing their second contract was so active. NFL teams understand that the most valuable time for an offensive tackle happens during their second contract, or from years five through eight. The current market for offensive tackles is $10 million / year. Right now, Havenstein is playing on a contract that extends to 2022 and pays less than $8 million per year. His price tag will not be the least bit discouraging to a potential NFL trade partner.

Reason three – May no longer fit LA Rams youth movement
The LA Rams resigned center Austin Blythe to a one-year deal and offensive tackle Andrew Whitworth to three-year-but-works-like-a-one-year deal. The plan is for the Rams to develop a backup to take over at left tackle and center in 2021. But the Rams already have a young starter at right tackle in David Edwards.

Where does Rob Havenstein fit in that mix? If the team demotes David Edwards, do they swap players if Havenstein plays poorly in 2020? Havenstein may have created the current Rams offensive line strategy. When he went down to injury in 2019, the team was forced to reinforce the offensive line ranks. The team traded for backup lineman Austin Corbett and signed center Coleman Shelton off the Arizona Cardinals practice squad. Committing that 2020 fifth-round pick in 2019 essentially forced the Rams to go all-in with a younger offensive line. The team was able to reintroduce Blythe at the center and maintained Whitworth at the left tackle, but the final games did not see Havenstein at the right tackle.

The LA Rams have the potential to use the 2020 NFL Draft to squeeze an NFL team desperate for a 2020 starting offensive tackle out of a valuable draft pick. And the team has plenty of surplus at the offensive line to do so without impacting their own 2020 success. Do the Rams have momentum from 2019 they wish to build upon? It certainly seems that way, right down to bringing back Johnny Mundt, who was so instrumental in two tight-end sets to help with the blocking schemes.

 

[OntarioRam]

Wasn't Havenstein injured last season? Or did his poor play pre-date that? My memory is failing me.

Havenstein was awful last year but he has a pretty established history now of being an above-average NFL right tackle. He's only 27 years old, but brings experience to an otherwise young o-line. He knows our system and playbook well. I am not so sure I would be keen to move on from him, especially if he was playing hurt last year, which might well explain his poor play.

The offensive line is, far and away, the most important offensive position after QB. Everything depends on. Every player has his price. But the o-line is one place I am very hesitant to make knee-jerk reactions on young, proven players. Even if it would free up some cap space. It is the one place I would pay a premium. You always needs lots of depth on o-line too. It is the reason I was on the record as wanting to retain Saffold - even if it required a slight overpay - and wanted to retain Blythe due to his versatility making him invaluable depth.

I'd only trade Hav for a mid round 2nd round pick or higher. At that point, you have to consider the number of years of cheap labour your draft pick can deliver.

But I doubt many teams would offer that for a guy at Hav's salary coming off of a severe "down year".

 

[hotanez]

Kromer might also look @ Brian Allen or Chandler Brewer as starting RG's in 2020 too.

If Kromer thinks that Brian can start and be successful at OG in the NFL he should be fired in my opinion. Brian's lack of size/power hurt us at center but at guard he might get Goff and our RBs killed. My opinion is that Brian is a center only and so far not a very good one unfortunately.

 

[den-the-coach]

Brian's lack of size/power hurt us at center but at guard he might get Goff and our RBs killed. My opinion is that Brian is a center only and so far not a very good one unfortunately.

Didn't like when they Drafted Allen and still don't like him. At best, he's a backup Center and IMO, they will move on from him. I expect the Rams to draft either Cushenberry or Matt Hennessy and then Brian Allen will only be a footnote.

 

[Ram65]

Wasn't Havenstein injured last season? Or did his poor play pre-date that? My memory is failing me.

Reports were he was overweight and out of shape in camp. He looked slow in the regular season. I think and hope he gets back to 2018 playing. He did just enough to pass protect Goff. He was much better run blocking.

 

[Ram65]

i honestly don't see the need to draft any early offensive line picks in the draft next week....i believe going into this year the best 5 will start regardless of position.... my five would be

LT-WHIT
LG-CORBETT
C-BLYTH
RG-EVANS
RT-HAV

that still leaves us edwards,allen,noteboom with the odd men out....the only guy i would consider taking if he fell to us is austin jackson to replace whitworth next year if he retires

I think Edwards would be over Evans but, there would be competition.

The ROD prevailing thought has been the Rams need a better offensive center. It's possible they would draft one of the top ones if available. They could let him compete at OG as well. Seems like a healthy Blythe gets a shot at OC/OG a. I'm not expecting wholesale changes in the offensive line but, the Rams could draft a couple. I think they play the board.

 

[RamDino]

I haven't thought about this too much, but our starting O-line could be the same one we finished up with last year. However, I do expect the young guys on the line to be much better than last year! I guess that does make Big Rob expendable. I would explode if the Rams got a second rounder for him, but I would take a third as well. Unfortunately, drafting O-lineman this year will probably not make a difference THIS YEAR, so I would draft T and C in round 3 or later and go for RB and WR in the second round. I just think the RB and WR positions offer the most potential for success in this year's draft. I get excited reading about all of the running backs you guys are posting that might be had in the second round, and some of them look like studs! And I have also heard that there are 25 receivers in this draft that are all very good! Can you imagine what the Rams would be like with another great running back AND wide receiver??? Of course they also need some defensive help, so I am glad Les and McVay have to make these decisions and not me -lol. Cheers!

 

[FarNorth]

Didn't like when they Drafted Allen and still don't like him. At best, he's a backup Center and IMO, they will move on from him. I expect the Rams to draft either Cushenberry or Matt Hennessy and then Brian Allen will only be a footnote.

If the report about his performance at the Senior Bowl is accurate I'll take Hennessy and be very happy about it. We could maybe actually get him too. Cushenberry probably goes higher.

 

[So Ram]

Didn't like when they Drafted Allen and still don't like him. At best, he's a backup Center and IMO, they will move on from him. I expect the Rams to draft either Cushenberry or Matt Hennessy and then Brian Allen will only be a footnote.

Interesting take Allen gets cut ?

 

[So Ram]

I haven't thought about this too much, but our starting O-line could be the same one we finished up with last year. However, I do expect the young guys on the line to be much better than last year! I guess that does make Big Rob expendable. I would explode if the Rams got a second rounder for him, but I would take a third as well. Unfortunately, drafting O-lineman this year will probably not make a difference THIS YEAR, so I would draft T and C in round 3 or later and go for RB and WR in the second round. I just think the RB and WR positions offer the most potential for success in this year's draft. I get excited reading about all of the running backs you guys are posting that might be had in the second round, and some of them look like studs! And I have also heard that there are 25 receivers in this draft that are all very good! Can you imagine what the Rams would be like with another great running back AND wide receiver??? Of course they also need some defensive help, so I am glad Les and McVay have to make these decisions and not me -lol. Cheers!

My whole thing is why creat a hole & loss assets?? Evans has
More value as a swing player.

 

[BonifayRam]

Wasn't Havenstein injured last season? Or did his poor play pre-date that? My memory is failing me.

Havenstein was awful last year but he has a pretty established history now of being an above-average NFL right tackle. He's only 27 years old, but brings experience to an otherwise young o-line. He knows our system and playbook well. I am not so sure I would be keen to move on from him, especially if he was playing hurt last year, which might well explain his poor play.

The offensive line is, far and away, the most important offensive position after QB. Everything depends on. Every player has his price. But the o-line is one place I am very hesitant to make knee-jerk reactions on young, proven players. Even if it would free up some cap space. It is the one place I would pay a premium. You always needs lots of depth on o-line too. It is the reason I was on the record as wanting to retain Saffold - even if it required a slight overpay - and wanted to retain Blythe due to his versatility making him invaluable depth.

I'd only trade Hav for a mid round 2nd round pick or higher. At that point, you have to consider the number of years of cheap labour your draft pick can deliver.

But I doubt many teams would offer that for a guy at Hav's salary coming off of a severe "down year".

No other member here has had so much to say on Havenstein as I. Its well documented & found in the search button in this forum. There has been many beliefs posted here in ROD on just what happened to the 2015-2018 Rob Havenstein. Still open & debated. I will try to offer up the facts as I know them & my own seen sentiments on Hav's 2019 season.

The facts are Hav did not play in the preseason, thus none of us who were unable to attended Ram open TP's could see for ourselves Hav's practicing performances nor get a good view of Hav's physical condition. I never saw any articles or tweets being posted from TC & preseason on any pro or con issues with Hav....nothing. I did read in ROD by good rep'd members here who attended open practices & remarked on the appearance of Hav's physical condition. Most all stated Hav appearance was he was overweight & very soft all over.

I have the ability to watch & record all Ram games. Viewed from my position in the mancave in front of my HD TV Game .....Hav was having big problems in his pass protection. There was not much of a drop off in his run blocking at first. Now this is just me here & this is what I saw from him in 2019.

First Hav did look heavier & stiffer from previous seasons. The Best way to paint a picture for you particularly on passing downs, Hav @ the moment of the snap looked as if he had no knees.....just joints @ his hips & ankles. Meaning he was never under his pads when going @ his defenders. Causing him to play tall all the time. His defender was always either to his right or left never centered. Need to keep in mind Hav was never athletic so this is a real bad routine to fall into. Hav's foot quickness slowed down where he was late to the edge seemed like every snap.

Go watch Hav in 2019 & see where his hand placement was in comparison to Edwards, Whitworth or Corbett. Hav's hands started way too low to set up a snap punch on his defender. Now the worse alm: Hav seemed to have lost all of his initial lateral quickness he was beat silly on inside pass rushing moves all day long!

Now to your injury question.....Hav had no injury connection until wk 10 Steeler game when he suffered a knee injury. Many here have speculated that Hav had suffered a knee injury earlier in the season but it was not reported as by the NFL rules. Wk #11 game Kromer only dressed 2 reserve back up. OL'ers Shelton OC & Austin Corbett OG suited up that was it. Kromer went into that game without a reserve OT. Back main up OT Evans was in street clothes. If Hav was suffering any kind of knee problem would Kromer have done that?

During the Steelers game starting center Brian Allen was carted off the field with knee ligament tear forcing Coleman Shelton to play center. When Hav wen down reserve OG Corbett went in to play either the RT or RG post not sure which not sure if Edwards shifted out or what. Now Corbett had been activated for the first time in a Ram game & took snaps in place for Hav. Corbett's performance was bad. Hav eventually was forced to return to play RT with the injury. Hav show'd up for the first time on the official injury list wk#11 following the Steelers game. Bobby Evans started the rest of the season.

Now here is an interesting fact on Hav.....was listed on the injury list for four weeks (wk#11 thru wk#14) as DNP or LP. On wk#15 Hav was still listed on the injury list but was participating in the full practice for the entire week. Hav never show'd up on the injury list again in 2019.

During wk #16 Whitworth suffered a quad injury & he also was having pain issues with his left ankle that required surgery @ the end of the 2019 season. Hav who was not listed on the injury list any longer was not activated for the game. Instead, OT Chandler Brewer took his position as reserve OT. Next week #17 both starting OT's were on the injury list. Once again Hav's place was taken up by Chandler Brewer. What does that say to you @OntarioRam ?

 

[BonifayRam]

Didn't like when they Drafted Allen and still don't like him. At best, he's a backup Center and IMO, they will move on from him. I expect the Rams to draft either Cushenberry or Matt Hennessy and then Brian Allen will only be a footnote.

We discussed this before about our lightweight & short centers (Blythe/ Allen).... I understand that the smaller more mobile faster ones have a better fit with the Kromer scheme, but I am ready to see some new girth & power come from that center position.

Cushenberry 6-3/313, Hennessy 6-4/308 & Biadasz 6-4/314 would all be a welcome site in Ramhorns

 

[den-the-coach]

Interesting take Allen gets cut ?

IDK, it's possible, IMHO.

 

[den-the-coach]

Cushenberry 6-3/313, Hennessy 6-4/308 & Biadasz 6-4/314 would all be a welcome site in Ramhorns

You're preaching to the choir!