Titans GM: Trade interest is increasing for NFL Draft's No. 1 pick

[OldSchool]

All of these guys aren't franchise QB's. Two in a draft is rare, possibly 4 is going to go down as the best QB draft ever. And until the draft hype started I was reading posters who were saying this was a relatively weak QB class.

We may have different ideas of what a franchise QB is. IMO it's a guy who gives you a decade plus of excellent play and gets to at least a few pro bowls.

Not a good QB, and excellent QB, top 10 type year after year.

I had a long retort typed up but looking back over your comments in this and other QB discussions I realize it's not worth it. You seem to think that the only QB's that are worthy of the ambiguous title "Franchise QB" are people destined to the hall of fame. You apparently have scouted all these QB's and know none of them will help the Rams or make us a better team and take us to the playoffs. I must be the only one also that has noticed a trend btw, "they" say every year that it's a weak QB class, don't hold much hope for next year though you seem to want to kick the QB can down the road.

You make completely unsubstantiated claims like:

Nobody anywhere thinks any of the QB's coming out are real "franchise" types

It's just not worth the time to dig up the many scouting reports that say all three of Wentz, Goff and Lynch have it in them to be good NFL QB's. Most of us are tired of trotting out backup QB's and there are three good QB's in this draft that could solve our problem for us. But some people don't seem to want to spend a draft pick or two to move up, and almost all of us agree the premise of this article moving to number one isn't realistic for the Rams, but moving up to 4 or 6 is a very real possibility.

I don't want a trade up to #1 but if Fisher and Snead decide they can't live without Wentz or Goff or Lynch there. Then I'll be happy they at least acknowledge that in the modern QB driven NFL they keep trotting out shit at that position and they're trying finally to fix the problem and make us competitive.

 

[12intheBox]

I want to trade up to #1. I want Wentz. And I'm willing to go as high as 1,2,2 this year plus 1 next year.

 

[CanRamFan]

You present a nice catch 22, if we put too much in the QB we might not have enough elsewhere. Yet we don't have enough now at QB to have balance. And that's where most that want to trade up for a QB stand. Right now we have no chance to compete with our current QBs and won't until we address the position. And to not address it because of a pick or two seems silly.

I hear what you're saying, I respect your opinion but I just can't get on board with the idea of giving up premium picks. I have a feeling Snead has something up his sleeve that none of us have discussed or imagined. Few more weeks...should be fun.

 

[CGI_Ram]

NOPE!

If I were certain about the QB I was selecting; I'd do it in a heartbeat.

 

[OldSchool]

I hear what you're saying, I respect your opinion but I just can't get on board with the idea of giving up premium picks. I have a feeling Snead has something up his sleeve that none of us have discussed or imagined. Few more weeks...should be fun.

So what will we accomplish if we spend a premium pick on a nice WR or CB or whatever and we keep trotting out Keenum and Foles at QB and stay at 6 or 7 wins? I pointed out in my mock the last time Snead traded up in the 1st round with his next pick he traded down and ended with the same amount of picks. And honestly aside from Havenstein he's been better off not picking in the 2nd round!

The other thing that I laugh at, and you're not the only one to make this assumption, is who's to say that premium pick would hit if we kept it instead of trading it? So instead of trading up and getting a potential quality starting QB we stay put, miss out on the good QB's and take other players. Next year that 1st round pick we would have traded away we take a guy who flops and never amounts to anything. Now we've missed out on a QB and we wasted a 1st round pick on a bust. A hypothetical situation for sure I admit that. But really all our discussions are hypothetical situations where we assume what other people think/know. I agree it can't come soon enough, I'll just never be content to keep trotting out bad QB's especially after listening to people, including those who don't want to trade up, complain about how bad our QB play was last year.

 

[CGI_Ram]

It's a QB driven league.

The rules make it so.

Got

To

Get

One

(Maybe Keenum is it? I dunno. But the decision makers need to be sure / find one)

 

[Amitar]

Damn that's steep....no thanks
Cook is a better player than Mannion....better athlete...had better success...

Them why did they spend a third round pick on Mannion?
First they believed in Bradford, then Foles, then Davis, then Keenum, then let Keenum go, then traded for Keenum, then drafted Mannion who sits on the bench. They get an F- grade right now in evaluating QBs. So if they trade up for one of these QB's when a majority of people are saying this is a weak QB class it will probably ruin the Rams for years.

 

[CanRamFan]

So what will we accomplish if we spend a premium pick on a nice WR or CB or whatever and we keep trotting out Keenum and Foles at QB and stay at 6 or 7 wins? I pointed out in my mock the last time Snead traded up in the 1st round with his next pick he traded down and ended with the same amount of picks. And honestly aside from Havenstein he's been better off not picking in the 2nd round!

The other thing that I laugh at, and you're not the only one to make this assumption, is who's to say that premium pick would hit if we kept it instead of trading it? So instead of trading up and getting a potential quality starting QB we stay put, miss out on the good QB's and take other players. Next year that 1st round pick we would have traded away we take a guy who flops and never amounts to anything. Now we've missed out on a QB and we wasted a 1st round pick on a bust. A hypothetical situation for sure I admit that. But really all our discussions are hypothetical situations where we assume what other people think/know. I agree it can't come soon enough, I'll just never be content to keep trotting out bad QB's especially after listening to people, including those who don't want to trade up, complain about how bad our QB play was last year.

As I was reading the first half of your post I was thinking, "That's a whole lot of hypotheticals" and sure enough...We could also trade up for Goff or Wentz and they could end up sucking major donkey butt and be totally screwed because we have no premium picks to improve our team. Just using the same logic..
I've actually been pretty happy with most of the Snead 1st round picks to date. With the exception of TA I think he's done pretty stellar in the first round.
I guess I don't dislike Keenum as much as you and that's probably the root of our disagreement. I personally feel he's good enough if we surround him with better talent on O and keep our D top shelf. I'm even optimistic that Keenum will improve from what we saw last year if he actually does end up the starter.

I like :

1. Doctson
2A. QB (Lynch ? Cook ? Jones ?) or Hunter Henry
2B. Whichever we didn't get with 2A
3. LB or DT

I predict none of this will happen.

 

[OldSchool]

As I was reading the first half of your post I was thinking, "That's a whole lot of hypotheticals" and sure enough...We could also trade up for Goff or Wentz and they could end up sucking major donkey butt and be totally screwed because we have no premium picks to improve our team. Just using the same logic..
I've actually been pretty happy with most of the Snead 1st round picks to date. With the exception of TA I think he's done pretty stellar in the first round.
I guess I don't dislike Keenum as much as you and that's probably the root of our disagreement. I personally feel he's good enough if we surround him with better talent on O and keep our D top shelf. I'm even optimistic that Keenum will improve from what we saw last year if he actually does end up the starter.

I like :

1. Doctson
2A. QB (Lynch ? Cook ? Jones ?) or Hunter Henry
2B. Whichever we didn't get with 2A
3. LB or DT

I predict none of this will happen.

You're visiting Alice too often if you think Lynch isn't picked by #15 in the first round I'm sorry to break it to you. I know how many self appointed experts say it will be otherwise. The first defense position I'd like to see taken is CB. The one I think we need the least is a LB. We have Tree in the middle with Hager backing him up. We have Barron starting at the WILL and Ayers on the other side. We have Hodges and Lynch backing them up. Couple that with the article CGI posted and what we saw last year and that's the 3rd LB for us is out on the field around 45% of the time. I see no need for another LB when we're only going to have 2 on the field the majority of the time. Whereas at CB we lost JJ and we don't know if Gaines will be back healthy. Leaving us with Tru, Joyner, Stensabough, Roberson and Christian Bryant. I could also see FS since we're really looking at Cody Davis starting with only Bryant and Joyner with experience playing there too. DT I'm in the camp that refuses to believe we let Brockers leave and we have Trinca-Pasat backing him up and we have Donald with Ethan Westbrook backing him up. Add to that our other DT in passing downs is usually a DE like Hayes or Simms.

If we stay at 15 we're rolling the dice but I'd go

1) Lynch
2a) Boyd
2b) Kendall Fuller
3) Austin Hooper
4) Will Redmond

That's 2 CB allowing Joyner to move to FS along with Davis.Our QBotf a WR and TE for him.

 

[rdlkgliders]

If I were certain about the QB I was selecting; I'd do it in a heartbeat.

I hear you @CGI_Ram , I am just not sure that certainty exists at that position. Specifically in an era where the gap between the collegiate athlete and Pro athlete is so distinct in regards to the systems and demands that todays NFL requires and the one played in college. I have listened to several coaches and players elaborate on this topic. The game is very different when played from the gun vs under center. I wish it were not such a high risk ventue because a game changing QB would be a huge step in a long run of playoff appearances. If wrong you have just used a tremendous amount of assets both in present and future drafts.[/QUOTE]

 

[Ramatik]

That scenario we have a top Qb and top WR from this draft (rd2) and also our 4th round and later picks. And 2017 we have all our picks except Rd 1.

It's not mortgaging any draft.

It's basically saying I'll give you my extra 2nd and my 3rd and next years one to swap 1st round picks.

Would an Aaron Rodgers be worth a first and 3rd round? Of course.

I like Goff a lot and would definitely give up a 1st and 3rd to get him since My Qb is a journeyman.

I would be okay with a 1st and 3rd I suppose. But it won't be that cheap.

And we really don't know that he is a "Franchise Quarterback". I think you are throwing away other potential Pro Bowlers because people are so caught up in the quarterback idea that they are willing to be goofy over it.

 

[Ramatik]

I don't want a trade up to #1 but if Fisher and Snead decide they can't live without Wentz or Goff or Lynch there. Then I'll be happy they at least acknowledge that in the modern QB driven NFL they keep trotting out crap at that position and they're trying finally to fix the problem and make us competitive.

I'm not in love with any of these guys. The NFL draft is littered with potential every year. And a lot of garbage gets picked as guys can't handle playing with the big boys.

But here's how I feel, if the Rams move up and get one, then I'm on board. Because like OldSchool says, Fisher and Snead have picked him. IF they don't, and the boys decide it's not worth it. I'm on board.

Don't over pay. But I think these guys have shown they have the guts to do what needs to be done to get a player they have pegged.

Rookie of the year twice in a row? Who does that?

 

[Force16X]

That scenario we have a top Qb and top WR from this draft (rd2) and also our 4th round and later picks. And 2017 we have all our picks except Rd 1.

It's not mortgaging any draft.

It's basically saying I'll give you my extra 2nd and my 3rd and next years one to swap 1st round picks.

Would an Aaron Rodgers be worth a first and 3rd round? Of course.

I like Goff a lot and would definitely give up a 1st and 3rd to get him since My Qb is a journeyman.

conversely, would Ryan Leaf be worth it ? hopefully the correct decision will be made.

 

[LesBaker]

I had a long retort typed up but looking back over your comments in this and other QB discussions I realize it's not worth it. You seem to think that the only QB's that are worthy of the ambiguous title "Franchise QB" are people destined to the hall of fame. You apparently have scouted all these QB's and know none of them will help the Rams or make us a better team and take us to the playoffs. I must be the only one also that has noticed a trend btw, "they" say every year that it's a weak QB class, don't hold much hope for next year though you seem to want to kick the QB can down the road.

You make completely unsubstantiated claims like:



It's just not worth the time to dig up the many scouting reports that say all three of Wentz, Goff and Lynch have it in them to be good NFL QB's. Most of us are tired of trotting out backup QB's and there are three good QB's in this draft that could solve our problem for us. But some people don't seem to want to spend a draft pick or two to move up, and almost all of us agree the premise of this article moving to number one isn't realistic for the Rams, but moving up to 4 or 6 is a very real possibility.

I don't want a trade up to #1 but if Fisher and Snead decide they can't live without Wentz or Goff or Lynch there. Then I'll be happy they at least acknowledge that in the modern QB driven NFL they keep trotting out crap at that position and they're trying finally to fix the problem and make us competitive.

When did I say a franchise QB is one destined for the HOF? C'mon, we can have discussion about this and you can see from this thread I'm not the only one wary of handing over a lot of high picks for a question mark, and that's what ANY QB coming out of college is........

I'm not sure if you read @Ramsey 's excellent post where he breaks down the hit/miss at QB's in the draft. Based on factual history at least one of the two guys you like is going to be bust/backup eventually. If you include a third there is a good chance only one will be really good.

There are no blue chip types like there have been in the past. No Luck, no Griffin (see how that turned out), nothing like that. Giving up too much can set a team back and I'd rather not see that.

FYI I want a great QB, and have watched our Rams get average to lousy QB play for close to a decade now. I want it fixed as much as you and all the rest of us do. I'm not convinced that it's worth the risk of giving up picks in a draft where we only have 5 and giving up a first rounder next year too. If there was a group of draft guru's and talent evaluators pointing at one or two guys and saying "he's got it all" it would be different. And even then it's not a sure thing. Remember all the hype around Bradford from the so called experts? I do.........

 

[LesBaker]

I'm not in love with any of these guys. The NFL draft is littered with potential every year. And a lot of garbage gets picked as guys can't handle playing with the big boys.

But here's how I feel, if the Rams move up and get one, then I'm on board. Because like OldSchool says, Fisher and Snead have picked him. IF they don't, and the boys decide it's not worth it. I'm on board.

Don't over pay. But I think these guys have shown they have the guts to do what needs to be done to get a player they have pegged.

Rookie of the year twice in a row? Who does that?

I have also come to trust Snead and Fisher's ability to judge talent. Of course they aren't 100% but they have a history that can't be ignored. Plus Snead is fearless about making a move and so far when he has done that and been aggressive about targeting a player by moving up or down he's almost always hitting. So if he decided to move into a spot to get a player my confidence in the pick goes up. If he decided to move way up to grab a QB then my mindset will be he thinks that QB is going to be good or better than good and as usual I will pull for that guy.

 

[OldSchool]

When did I say a franchise QB is one destined for the HOF? C'mon, we can have discussion about this and you can see from this thread I'm not the only one wary of handing over a lot of high picks for a question mark, and that's what ANY QB coming out of college is........

You said he was somebody who played for 10+ years at excellent play and gave you pro bowl level play. Well guess what you just described a 10 year pro who's excellent and in the pro bowl regularly.

I'm not sure if you read @Ramsey 's excellent post where he breaks down the hit/miss at QB's in the draft. Based on factual history at least one of the two guys you like is going to be bust/backup eventually. If you include a third there is a good chance only one will be really good.

I read it and I also know that it applies to all positions and you know what? It does not matter because if you're a team that doesn't try to draft a decent QB you won't be anything in the NFL.

There are no blue chip types like there have been in the past. No Luck, no Griffin (see how that turned out), nothing like that. Giving up too much can set a team back and I'd rather not see that.

Again you come back to your opinion and state it routinely as if it was fact and is right where draft pundits, former scouts etc etc have said otherwise. Good lord you keep citing that QB's don't work out well guess what THAT'S THE SAME FOR EVERY POSITION! You seem to have us take a WR because you're afraid a QB isn't going to live up to your standards and keep trotting out Keenum and his under .500 records. And then you follow up a post where you're arguing taking a QB and say if Fisher and Snead take the guy you'd have more confidence in him and would be fine with it. It's clear to me you're arguing just to argue when you put those last two posts back to back. Have a great day I'm done discussing QB's and drafts with you for now.

 

[lockdnram21]

I want to trade up to #1. I want Wentz. And I'm willing to go as high as 1,2,2 this year plus 1 next year.

That means no decent wide out or cb. Rather draft doctson in first and try and trade up for Cook with both seconds or roll with keenum and Mannion.

 

[OldSchool]

That means no decent wide out or cb. Rather draft doctson in first and try and trade up for Cook with both seconds or roll with keenum and Mannion.

Doctson is nice but Cook, Keenum and Mannion is trotting out more garbage at QB and we're back to drafting the position in a year or two.

 

[wmc540]

IF Snead & Fisher were to do a "Trade Up" like this for one of these top two QB's (Wentz/Goff) they would flushed all my faith in them down the toilet & terminally damaged my relationship with both of them at that point..

Lol. How will Snead and Fisher sleep at night?