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The Ripper

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I've never heard anywhere (not even in this thread) that Stan has the votes to block Spanos, but I have read and heard numerous times that Spanos has the votes to block Stan. Whether that's true or not, who knows?

It's true because no one has the votes so everyone has the votes to block. The question is how many owners that don't support relocation will abstain which lowers the the required number of yes votes.
 

bluecoconuts

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I've never heard anywhere (not even in this thread) that Stan has the votes to block Spanos, but I have read and heard numerous times that Spanos has the votes to block Stan. Whether that's true or not, who knows?

I have heard that nobody has the votes to move at this point, but I'm sure that if it came up most of the owners will get behind what Goodell/the LA committee says to go.

If that translates to Kroenke having the votes to block Spanos or just that Spanos doesn't have the support at this point, who knows? Honestly I've only heard that Spanos believes he has the votes, if he does or not is another thing. Honestly I think he probably doesn't, if the committee says "Lets let the Rams move" and Goodell does, then Kroenke will probably move. Same thing if they want to have the Carson project, it's unlikely Kroenke will be able to stop them from saying yes (without up and moving and going to court or something crazy).

I remember reading that most owners will switch loyalties pretty easily. Jerry Jones for example appears pretty firmly in the "Kroenke to LA camp", talking about how he wanted to pair up with the Rams because they "Are a very popular team in Southern California" but if everyone else wanted Carson, I wouldn't be shocked to see him vote that way. Maybe a few will vote with their buddy, but nobody will be the swing vote.
 

bluecoconuts

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Political infighting could cast Carson in poor light in NFL stadium race
By NATHAN FENNO AND RICHARD WINTON

The day after a chaotic Carson City Council meeting that included allegations of corruption and threats of litigation, one of the most vocal proponents of the city's proposed $1.7-billion professional football stadium said toxic politics could undermine the project.

"This could jeopardize an NFL stadium being built here," said Jim Dear, mayor of Carson for more than a decade before stepping down in March after being elected city clerk.

Though Carson's City Council unanimously approved a ballot initiative in April to move forward with the proposal, the discord casts the city in an unwelcome light in the midst of the competition to return the NFL to Los Angeles.

Dear's comments came less than 24 hours after his outburst at Tuesday's City Council meeting in a dispute stemming from uncounted ballots cast in the June 2 election to fill one of two vacant council seats.

During the meeting, Mayor Albert Robles led an unexpected effort that appointed Jawane Hilton, a local pastor, to the council for the seat Robles vacated in April to become mayor.

One of the three councilmembers, Elito Santarina, walked out in protest and accusations flew between Robles and Dear.

Over the weekend, Dear, accompanied by two sheriff's deputies, changed the combination to the safe in City Hall where the ballots reside. Robles expressed suspicion while Dear said the combination hadn't been changed since the 1990s.

As the confrontation at the meeting continued, Dear shouted and strutted around the council chambers.

"I'm going to answer the false accusations and lies that this corrupt little Al Robles has brought," Dear said.

Dear promised a lawsuit. He called former Carson Mayor Vera DeWitt, a longtime adversary, "Vera the evil DeWitch." He threatened to embarrass Robles.

"There's a lot more I know about your background that will be revealed in due time," Dear said. "The people of Carson will not put up with this tomfoolery."

Onlookers booed. Dear later stormed out of the meeting and didn't return.

"I've seen a lot of stuff, but I've never seen anything like that," Robles said Wednesday. "I was embarrassed for our city and just disappointed."

In an interview, Dear said Robles' actions endangered the stadium for "political gain."

"It is horrible for our image," said Dear, who more than quintupled his $22,000 salary as mayor by moving to clerk.

"They are behaving as though the NFL deal is dead for Carson. I think we have a chance but they are damaging our chances by their behavior. They are showing the NFL and the world that Carson is rampant with corruption. Which football team ownership builds a stadium in a city with corrupt council members?"

While the histrionics convey a sense of Carson's fractious political landscape, they're unlikely to have any practical effect on the stadium project that's racing ahead. Dear joined four other members of a city authority overseeing the stadium site in approving a $180,000 contract with a consultant Tuesday to oversee its environmental remediation. It's one more step toward building the 70,000-seat stadium.

The San Diego Chargers and Oakland Raiders, which would share the privately financed stadium, have agreed to reimburse Carson for all expenses connected to the effort.


Dear had previously been effusive in his public support of the deal. Robles said the political turmoil is of "no consequence" to the deal.

"He's trying to create the perception that if the NFL decides not to come to Carson, that it's because of this political turmoil and therefore, as the mayor, I would be responsible for it," said Robles.

"We're looking into ways to circumvent the city clerk because he will not hold the city of Carson, its residents or the project hostage for his own political gains. This project is going to proceed."

Mark Fabiani, point man on stadium issues for the Chargers, said the matter is an "internal issue" in Carson.

"We don't anticipate that the dispute will impact our progress there," he said.

But a solution doesn't appear to be at hand. Dear said Tuesday's move is designed to allow Robles to fill the final vacant seat in the five-member council, avoid an election and control the panel.

Faced with what the Robles-led council saw as repeated delays in certifying Hilton as the winner of the June election, two of the three members voted last week to hire a former Compton city clerk to complete the count.

Dear, who had been attending a conference in Riverside last week, responded to the move with a plan to seek an injunction to block the count. That led to Robles' end-around during Tuesday's meeting by appointing Hilton to the second vacant seat rather than waiting for the certification of his election.

Hilton, who leads the June 2 election by 18 votes pending a hand recount next week, blamed the verbal sparring on Dear trying to run the city from the clerk's office.

"This is Jim Dear losing his power," Hilton said. "It's a new day in Carson and he's not excited about it. … We're going to look better because he is not leading our city."

Dear, however, doesn't think the council had a quorum to appoint Hilton — only two members remained after Santarina departed — and plans to sue.

Robles is upset by the entire situation.

"Why [Dear] insists on postponing, on delaying the inevitable is beyond my comprehension," he said. "It makes absolutely no sense."

On Tuesday, the politicking didn't end when Dear left the council chambers.

Long after the departure, Councilmember Lula Davis-Holmes proposed removing Dear's name from the boulevard that runs through the 157-acre former landfill where the stadium would sit. Dear spearheaded an effort to rename the street after himself in 2011. Davis-Holmes wants the name erased.

Applause filled the room.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/nfl/la-sp-nfl-stadium-carson-20150618-story.html




Honestly this probably wont really mean much if the NFL wants Carson, but it's interesting how there's such stark differences in Carson and Inglewood. Carson seems to be very fishy with all the different issues and controversies.
 

mr.stlouis

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Even if the they were able to add the provision to the budget it still wouldn't have changed the the original legislation that set up the STLRSA so it would have been Nixon who sued. It's probably too risky to extend the bonds without some kind of guarantee from the NFL that St Louis would have a team. He can't run again but there could be fallout to others if they extended the bonds and the NFL rejected St Louis.

I just like how you think I'm always wrong. Makes me smile. Now tell me you didn't tell me that, please. It's what I wanna hear. :)
 

brokeu91

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I am not going through hours of radio interviews. It has been said no one has the votes for relocation.
It's also the first I've heard that too. I've definitely heard it the other way around though through multiple people/sources
 

mr.stlouis

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Dude, did you even read my post? I'm not even going to respond until you actually read it, and then figure out why that entire post was completely unnecessary and completely off the mark.

The question is do I really need to read it to know where you are going with it? Is it worth the time? Why no, not at all. If I disagree with the conclusion to this degree then the odds of that wavering, on a topic I follow closely, is rather moot.
 

The Ripper

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I just like how you think I'm always wrong. Makes me smile. Now tell me you didn't tell me that, please. It's what I wanna hear. :)

I don't think your wrong I was adding to what you said. I think Silvey and has group completely went about the issue the wrong way. I have also trying to figure out why Nixon wouldn't just issue the bonds because if he did the funding issue would be resolved and then the next battle would be the shared revenues which in the end might be a bigger battle. Once the bonds are extended and the funds come through they can't return it.
 

bluecoconuts

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The question is do I really need to read it to know where you are going with it? Is it worth the time? Why no, not at all. If I disagree with the conclusion to this degree then the odds of that wavering, on a topic I follow closely, is rather moot.

Uh, yeah you probably do, since its obvious you don't know where I was going or what the post even said.

If you're gonna attack someone, at least know what they're saying, instead of attacking them for something they're not even saying.
 

OldSchool

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and yet you make that claim. prove it.

No need to prove it. We've all seen it said and read that it's been said. He could provide you a video with 80 people saying that exact thing and it would be spun to mean anything but what was said.
 

blue4

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Dude, did you even read my post? I'm not even going to respond until you actually read it, and then figure out why that entire post was completely unnecessary and completely off the mark.

In Iced's defense, it took me a few read throughs to get what you were saying. First time I read it I had the "What!?" thing going on too.
 

blue4

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Political infighting could cast Carson in poor light in NFL stadium race
By NATHAN FENNO AND RICHARD WINTON

The day after a chaotic Carson City Council meeting that included allegations of corruption and threats of litigation, one of the most vocal proponents of the city's proposed $1.7-billion professional football stadium said toxic politics could undermine the project.

"This could jeopardize an NFL stadium being built here," said Jim Dear, mayor of Carson for more than a decade before stepping down in March after being elected city clerk.

Though Carson's City Council unanimously approved a ballot initiative in April to move forward with the proposal, the discord casts the city in an unwelcome light in the midst of the competition to return the NFL to Los Angeles.

Dear's comments came less than 24 hours after his outburst at Tuesday's City Council meeting in a dispute stemming from uncounted ballots cast in the June 2 election to fill one of two vacant council seats.

During the meeting, Mayor Albert Robles led an unexpected effort that appointed Jawane Hilton, a local pastor, to the council for the seat Robles vacated in April to become mayor.

One of the three councilmembers, Elito Santarina, walked out in protest and accusations flew between Robles and Dear.

Over the weekend, Dear, accompanied by two sheriff's deputies, changed the combination to the safe in City Hall where the ballots reside. Robles expressed suspicion while Dear said the combination hadn't been changed since the 1990s.

As the confrontation at the meeting continued, Dear shouted and strutted around the council chambers.

"I'm going to answer the false accusations and lies that this corrupt little Al Robles has brought," Dear said.

Dear promised a lawsuit. He called former Carson Mayor Vera DeWitt, a longtime adversary, "Vera the evil DeWitch." He threatened to embarrass Robles.

"There's a lot more I know about your background that will be revealed in due time," Dear said. "The people of Carson will not put up with this tomfoolery."

Onlookers booed. Dear later stormed out of the meeting and didn't return.

"I've seen a lot of stuff, but I've never seen anything like that," Robles said Wednesday. "I was embarrassed for our city and just disappointed."

In an interview, Dear said Robles' actions endangered the stadium for "political gain."

"It is horrible for our image," said Dear, who more than quintupled his $22,000 salary as mayor by moving to clerk.

"They are behaving as though the NFL deal is dead for Carson. I think we have a chance but they are damaging our chances by their behavior. They are showing the NFL and the world that Carson is rampant with corruption. Which football team ownership builds a stadium in a city with corrupt council members?"

While the histrionics convey a sense of Carson's fractious political landscape, they're unlikely to have any practical effect on the stadium project that's racing ahead. Dear joined four other members of a city authority overseeing the stadium site in approving a $180,000 contract with a consultant Tuesday to oversee its environmental remediation. It's one more step toward building the 70,000-seat stadium.

The San Diego Chargers and Oakland Raiders, which would share the privately financed stadium, have agreed to reimburse Carson for all expenses connected to the effort.


Dear had previously been effusive in his public support of the deal. Robles said the political turmoil is of "no consequence" to the deal.

"He's trying to create the perception that if the NFL decides not to come to Carson, that it's because of this political turmoil and therefore, as the mayor, I would be responsible for it," said Robles.

"We're looking into ways to circumvent the city clerk because he will not hold the city of Carson, its residents or the project hostage for his own political gains. This project is going to proceed."

Mark Fabiani, point man on stadium issues for the Chargers, said the matter is an "internal issue" in Carson.

"We don't anticipate that the dispute will impact our progress there," he said.

But a solution doesn't appear to be at hand. Dear said Tuesday's move is designed to allow Robles to fill the final vacant seat in the five-member council, avoid an election and control the panel.

Faced with what the Robles-led council saw as repeated delays in certifying Hilton as the winner of the June election, two of the three members voted last week to hire a former Compton city clerk to complete the count.

Dear, who had been attending a conference in Riverside last week, responded to the move with a plan to seek an injunction to block the count. That led to Robles' end-around during Tuesday's meeting by appointing Hilton to the second vacant seat rather than waiting for the certification of his election.

Hilton, who leads the June 2 election by 18 votes pending a hand recount next week, blamed the verbal sparring on Dear trying to run the city from the clerk's office.

"This is Jim Dear losing his power," Hilton said. "It's a new day in Carson and he's not excited about it. … We're going to look better because he is not leading our city."

Dear, however, doesn't think the council had a quorum to appoint Hilton — only two members remained after Santarina departed — and plans to sue.

Robles is upset by the entire situation.

"Why [Dear] insists on postponing, on delaying the inevitable is beyond my comprehension," he said. "It makes absolutely no sense."

On Tuesday, the politicking didn't end when Dear left the council chambers.

Long after the departure, Councilmember Lula Davis-Holmes proposed removing Dear's name from the boulevard that runs through the 157-acre former landfill where the stadium would sit. Dear spearheaded an effort to rename the street after himself in 2011. Davis-Holmes wants the name erased.

Applause filled the room.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/nfl/la-sp-nfl-stadium-carson-20150618-story.html




Honestly this probably wont really mean much if the NFL wants Carson, but it's interesting how there's such stark differences in Carson and Inglewood. Carson seems to be very fishy with all the different issues and controversies.


I can't give this much credit. What city council in America doesn't have differences and arguments? Kind of the whole point of America's style of govt at that level.
 

rams2050

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I have to admit, the Carson City Council sounds more dysfunctional -- by far -- than most others. Actually, reading it is sort of entertaining. I could see a Saturday Night Live skit emerge from this foolishness. . .
 

iced

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No need to prove it. We've all seen it said and read that it's been said. He could provide you a video with 80 people saying that exact thing and it would be spun to mean anything but what was said.

it has never been said That Kroenke has the votes to block spanos - and that's the only part i was mentioning

NOT that no one has the votes
NOT that Spanos has the votes (despite he claiming it, it being rumored, and/or Fabiani saying it)
 

bluecoconuts

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I can't give this much credit. What city council in America doesn't have differences and arguments? Kind of the whole point of America's style of govt at that level.

I don't know much about local levels, but it seems to be more than normal, and mostly over the stadium. The support from the population is there, I think there's a few politicians calling foul because they're doing some iffy things to speed it up in their eyes. Its just weird how them and Inglewood are so different in that regard. I'm sure the fact that Kroenke helped with reelection campaigns doesn't hurt either.
 

OldSchool

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it has never been said That Kroenke has the votes to block spanos - and that's the only part i was mentioning

NOT that no one has the votes
NOT that Spanos has the votes (despite he claiming it, it being rumored, and/or Fabiani saying it)

It has been in fact by multiple sources. It's been said that all 3 of the owners can block the others from a move. And it will stay that way until Goodell comes down with a plan to endorse and the 8 man committee votes.
 

The Ripper

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I can't give this much credit. What city council in America doesn't have differences and arguments? Kind of the whole point of America's style of govt at that level.

I have to admit, the Carson City Council sounds more dysfunctional -- by far -- than most others. Actually, reading it is sort of entertaining. I could see a Saturday Night Live skit emerge from this foolishness. . .

If you want a good read do a search on Carson, CA for corruption. I am not saying it's going to hinder a stadium but the city has had it's share of scandals.
 

iced

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It has been in fact by multiple sources. It's been said that all 3 of the owners can block the others from a move. And it will stay that way until Goodell comes down with a plan to endorse and the 8 man committee votes.

I never doubted that - what I have doubted are statements that indicate "Kroenke has the votes to block Spanos"

has never been said, and again that is my only point.

The only thing worse than baseless speculation is the spread of misinformation
 
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