Matt Stafford Traded to Rams

[kurtfaulk]

Aw c'mon.

That team was 9-7 and six of those wins was against the NFC West which was gawd awful then.

They had a high powered passing attack and a weak running game and got hot in the playoffs.

Of their last regular season games, they went 5-5... all five of those wins were against the NFC West.

They were the epitome of a mediocre team that just got hot at exactly the right time.

So let's not do this like Warner (who's one of my top 3 favorite players, ever) led the Cardinals to dominate with no running game and no defense.

They went 3-7 outside the NFC West and only got into the playoffs b/c the division was complete shit.

Still, what they did was impressive.

But faulting Stafford because that 11-5 Lions team didn't pull out their game...

I mean is it a team game or isn't it?

With Goff it's a team game. With Stafford it's all his fault?

Good Lord Almighty, this cannot turn into the next version of the Warner/Bulger debates.

No one has time for that... so can we just all decide together to NOT do that?

I replied to a post about qb performance and Kurt was phenomenal that season.

The cards locked up the division with 3 weeks to go in the season and being the cards they sleepwalked the rest of the regular season. Don't downplay what Kurt did for that organisation.

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[Mackeyser]

I don't want to insult McVay. I can respect that he made the call he felt was best at QB. I still can't wrap my head around it or agree with it. And I absolutely hate the way they went about it. But I don't harbor ill will towards him. The simple truth for me is that I hate the way this organization has conducted itself for well over a decade under certain circumstances. The way it dumped Kurt nearly caused me to quit being a Rams fan. And then I watched the shameful way it jettisoned Ike and disrespected St. Louis on the way out. Doing this to Jared the way they did it feels like Kurt all over again. And let's be honest, they didn't handle the Gurley situation well either. I just don't know, man. I just don't know.

Don't disagree with any of it... except maybe Gurley. All that pouting was driving me freaking insane. And we saw based on his play this year that he just isn't the same guy.

But yeah.

This was new for McVay/Snead tho. We've never seen them publicly do this... and did they really think if things didn't pan out on the FA front that they'd be able to work effectively with Goff after that?

So, I'm with you on this point.

Still, my friend, I was wrong. This Stafford deal will be a steal for us.

Part of why Stafford was a "gunslinger" is because he had to be. Other than when he had Caldwell, he didn't have an OC worth a damn until Jim Bob Cooter and even then, he never put together a solid plan for the O.

I feel VERY confident that in McVay's offense, it will be back to the dynamism of 2018, but with all the lessons learned. McVay will not ask Stafford to be the Stafford from Detroit.

Also, the props Rodgers gave to Stafford mean a lot to me and that he gave those props as a total aside on the Pat McAfee Show... unprompted... shows how the league feels that Stafford has been criminally under-supported.

Also, dude's tough as nails, is a super good guy (for real, how he supported his wife through a brain surgery and her still ongoing recovery is just nails, man. NAILS) and he's a grinder.

Take the time you need. Once we start playing, you'll see why I said after a day that I was totally wrong about Stafford.

 

[Mackeyser]

I replied to a post about qb performance and Kurt was phenomenal that season.

The cards locked up the division with 3 weeks to go in the season and being the cards they sleepwalked the rest of the regular season. Don't downplay what Kurt did for that organisation.

.

I would never do that. That said, they locked up the division knowing they could go 7-9 and still win it.

Kurt was very good that season. Again, one of my favorite players of all time. I watched all of their games that season, I think.

Point was that in a tough division, that team even with Kurt being Kurt don't go 8-8 so he never gets the chance to go further.

It was serendipity and I'm glad he's a HoFer because of it.

My point is that the TEAM got hot at the end, not just Kurt.

 

[-X-]

Good Lord Almighty, this cannot turn into the next version of the Warner/Bulger debates.

 

[kurtfaulk]

I would never do that. That said, they locked up the division knowing they could go 7-9 and still win it.

They were a team of players that were used to losing. Kurt had to show them how to win. And prod them along the way to stay focused. It wasn't an easy task.

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[Mackeyser]

I just don't see where communicating with Jared hurts the team. They don't have to tell him everything, but they could at least tell him that they're planning to trade him and currently working on finding a deal. I get that they implied that to the media, but you would think they'd at least communicate that to their QB.

I don't think they knew, even per the Silver piece with is pretty one-sided.

The Rams reached out to GB. They said absolutely not for Rodgers.

The Rams reached out to the Texans. The price was TOO HIGH FOR SNEAD!!! Just that phrase doesn't compute for me. Like... I think I'll need exponential notation to convey how many exclamation points I'd need to accurately convey my surprise...

Rams obviously have Brad Holmes number and in light of the two biggest names not being options (TOO HIGH FOR SNEAD??? WTF are they asking for???) they inquired about Stafford. Clearly, McVay has been grinding tape on the options... and specifically Stafford (I don't think there'd be too many questions about Watson and zero for Rodgers) and then left for a bit of vacay in Cabo where every NFL player and lots of coaches seem to go...

They weren't close to the highest bid, but... as we BOTH said... Goff had value and they wanted a QB coming back which no one else was offering.

McVay called Kroenke and said for Stafford, the juice was worth the squeeze.

The various FOs got on the phone and worked out a deal.

They told McVay.

McVay called Goff and told him.

There was nothing to tell Goff before because all of this was exploratory.

Even in the Silver piece, iirc, they said the Rams were prepared to go into 2021 with Goff and Wolford.

And short of making this deal with Stafford, that would have been exactly what happened.

So why would the Rams tell Goff that they were trying to trade him when they didn't even know they were until they did?

We all know this happens all the time... teams call and teams answer calls all the time.

BET, the Broncos are taking calls for Von Miller. Even if they discuss scenarios are they supposed to tell him that they're trying to trade him just due to discussing scenarios? Not remotely.

 

[ottoman89]

I don't think they knew, even per the Silver piece with is pretty one-sided.

The Rams reached out to GB. They said absolutely not for Rodgers.

The Rams reached out to the Texans. The price was TOO HIGH FOR SNEAD!!! Just that phrase doesn't compute for me. Like... I think I'll need exponential notation to convey how many exclamation points I'd need to accurately convey my surprise...

Rams obviously have Brad Holmes number and in light of the two biggest names not being options (TOO HIGH FOR SNEAD??? WTF are they asking for???) they inquired about Stafford. Clearly, McVay has been grinding tape on the options... and specifically Stafford (I don't think there'd be too many questions about Watson and zero for Rodgers) and then left for a bit of vacay in Cabo where every NFL player and lots of coaches seem to go...

They weren't close to the highest bid, but... as we BOTH said... Goff had value and they wanted a QB coming back which no one else was offering.

McVay called Kroenke and said for Stafford, the juice was worth the squeeze.

The various FOs got on the phone and worked out a deal.

They told McVay.

McVay called Goff and told him.

There was nothing to tell Goff before because all of this was exploratory.

Even in the Silver piece, iirc, they said the Rams were prepared to go into 2021 with Goff and Wolford.

And short of making this deal with Stafford, that would have been exactly what happened.

So why would the Rams tell Goff that they were trying to trade him when they didn't even know they were until they did?

We all know this happens all the time... teams call and teams answer calls all the time.

BET, the Broncos are taking calls for Von Miller. Even if they discuss scenarios are they supposed to tell him that they're trying to trade him just due to discussing scenarios? Not remotely.

The Rams offer was or wasn't the highest?

 

[Mackeyser]

The Rams offer was or wasn't the highest?

Initially was not.

They were given the chance to up it. Washington's offer was better, initially their 1st and 3rd this year, iirc.

 

[ottoman89]

Initially was not.

They were given the chance to up it. Washington's offer was better, initially their 1st and 3rd this year, iirc.

Thanks! I think Lions taking all of Goff's guarantees, and getting Goff off our hands plus getting a bonafide star in Stafford was a friend helping a friend with Holmes/Snead, granted the draft picks obviously helped.

 

[Mackeyser]

A stat just saw on Greeny this morning.

in the 3 Detroit playoff losses in the past 12 years... Detroit defense gave up 31.7ppg.

that's crazy

 

[den-the-coach]

Thanks! I think Lions taking all of Goff's guarantees, and getting Goff off our hands plus getting a bonafide star in Stafford was a friend helping a friend with Holmes/Snead, granted the draft picks obviously helped.

I agree and what some are forgetting is to factor in Goff's contract and the fact when the Rams contacted Goff's agent to restructure, his agent said no....If the Rams can extend Stafford & restructure Woods, Kupp, Donald & Ramsey they will have 38 million available cap space, that in itself makes sense.

 

[Tano]

Thanks! I think Lions taking all of Goff's guarantees, and getting Goff off our hands plus getting a bonafide star in Stafford was a friend helping a friend with Holmes/Snead, granted the draft picks obviously helped.

That's the thing - I can't say this enough.

Detroit did NOT take all of Goff's guarantees. From everything I have read, the Rams are responsible for all of the guarantees and that's what makes this a crap trade imho.

Stafford imo is only slightly better than Goff. He is not a winner and makes mistakes when he has a lead. Goff doesn't.

People say Stafford never had an OL - that is not true. He had a couple ALL Pro OL in prior years. He had possibly the best WR in the history of the game (well maybe the Minnesota one was better), and he had 3 really good receivers last year and his line wasn't worst than ours from what I could see from the Chicago game.

Goff was pressured much more than Stafford when he played Chicago.

The Rams probably would have gotten a first and a second for Goff if they had played their cards right but they went guns blazing and paid for it.

I would have been okay with this trade if the Rams traded Goff and a third this year and maybe a second next year.

That would have been enough in my book.

And all you Anti Goff fans can disagree with me all you want but I am sticking to my guns on this one.

However, he is a Ram now and I will root for him but I will still hate the trade because of the firsts given up.

 

[Mackeyser]

I agree and what some are forgetting is to factor in Goff's contract and the fact when the Rams contacting Goff's agent to restructure, the agent said no....If the Rams can extend Stafford & restructure Woods, Kupp, Donald & Ramsey they will have 38 million available cap space, that in itself makes sense.

Did that happen?

I keep seeing folks make reference to the org going to Goff and asking for a contract break.

Is there a source?

Because the only reference I can find was when I was watching Colin Cowherd and he just said, "this is what I think happened"... that's it.

But if there's an independent source, that'd be new info...

 

[TexasRam]

I don't think they knew, even per the Silver piece with is pretty one-sided.

The Rams reached out to GB. They said absolutely not for Rodgers.

The Rams reached out to the Texans. The price was TOO HIGH FOR SNEAD!!! Just that phrase doesn't compute for me. Like... I think I'll need exponential notation to convey how many exclamation points I'd need to accurately convey my surprise...

Rams obviously have Brad Holmes number and in light of the two biggest names not being options (TOO HIGH FOR SNEAD??? WTF are they asking for???) they inquired about Stafford. Clearly, McVay has been grinding tape on the options... and specifically Stafford (I don't think there'd be too many questions about Watson and zero for Rodgers) and then left for a bit of vacay in Cabo where every NFL player and lots of coaches seem to go...

They weren't close to the highest bid, but... as we BOTH said... Goff had value and they wanted a QB coming back which no one else was offering.

McVay called Kroenke and said for Stafford, the juice was worth the squeeze.

The various FOs got on the phone and worked out a deal.

They told McVay.

McVay called Goff and told him.

There was nothing to tell Goff before because all of this was exploratory.

Even in the Silver piece, iirc, they said the Rams were prepared to go into 2021 with Goff and Wolford.

And short of making this deal with Stafford, that would have been exactly what happened.

So why would the Rams tell Goff that they were trying to trade him when they didn't even know they were until they did?

We all know this happens all the time... teams call and teams answer calls all the time.

BET, the Broncos are taking calls for Von Miller. Even if they discuss scenarios are they supposed to tell him that they're trying to trade him just due to discussing scenarios? Not remotely.

You make some good points and admittedly it’s not always clear when the right time to tell a player you are trading him is. Imagine telling him you are looking to trade him and then it doesn’t work out. Goff would say too bad I want out now with your no confidence bullshit.

So I am not holding that against Mcvay. And honestly telling the media “right now”, was really the honest approach. We would be harping on him either way. It’s just a shitty situation where many of us think Mcvay made some bad decisions leading to the offensive demise. So Goff is the fall guy. So we will see if Mcvay was right. I doubt it. But in a twisted sense I hope he was because otherwise we are in for a long period of just above average football without addressing the real issues and selling the farm needlessly.

Also your arguments from silence are not proof. Saying “ we never heard” Goff doing extra work with WR’s or “We never heard” him doing extra film work. That’s some bad logic. It also degrades the player in a rumor like fashion, which is pretty shitty.

Did you hear Donald staying overtime in the film room this year? Me neither.

 

[den-the-coach]

Did that happen?

I keep seeing folks make reference to the org going to Goff and asking for a contract break.

Is there a source?

Because the only reference I can find was when I was watching Colin Cowherd and he just said, "this is what I think happened"... that's it.

But if there's an independent source, that'd be new info...

Been reported by multiple media outlets, in fact Colin Cowherd referred to the agent saying "Pound Salt." Yes it appears that did happen and besides McVay feeling Goff was not seeing the whole field, the agent not willing to restructure factored in as well IMHO.

 

[ottoman89]

Been reported by multiple media outlets, in fact Colin Cowherd referred to the agent saying "Pound Salt." Yes it appears that did happen and besides McVay feeling Goff was not seeing the whole field, the agent not willing to restructure factored in as well IMHO.

I know Cowherd said he wouldn't be surprised if the agent said that, but he was speculating and didn't know if it had.

 

[ozarkram]

I kept waiting for the phone call from Snead/McVay asking my opinion. Still waiting. Go figure.

 

[den-the-coach]

I know Cowherd said he wouldn't be surprised if the agent said that, but he was speculating and didn't know if it had.

Okay I misheard it then, I thought he said they reached out and the agent said no, then he adlibbed and said "Pound Salt."

 

[Mackeyser]

That's the thing - I can't say this enough.

Detroit did NOT take all of Goff's guarantees. From everything I have read, the Rams are responsible for all of the guarantees and that's what makes this a crap trade imho.

Stafford imo is only slightly better than Goff. He is not a winner and makes mistakes when he has a lead. Goff doesn't.

People say Stafford never had an OL - that is not true. He had a couple ALL Pro OL in prior years. He had possibly the best WR in the history of the game (well maybe the Minnesota one was better), and he had 3 really good receivers last year and his line wasn't worst than ours from what I could see from the Chicago game.

Goff was pressured much more than Stafford when he played Chicago.

The Rams probably would have gotten a first and a second for Goff if they had played their cards right but they went guns blazing and paid for it.

I would have been okay with this trade if the Rams traded Goff and a third this year and maybe a second next year.

That would have been enough in my book.

And all you Anti Goff fans can disagree with me all you want but I am sticking to my guns on this one.

However, he is a Ram now and I will root for him but I will still hate the trade because of the firsts given up.

The Lions took all guarantees which is why the Rams have zero dead cap in 2022 which is huge. I was mistaken that they were able to take our 2021 dead cap, but they def took the 2022 cap hit because Goff's salary guarantees on the 2nd day of the league year, 3/18, iirc

When Stafford had an offense, he didn't have a defense and vice versa.

In the 3 playoff games with Stafford, the Detroit D gave up 31.7ppg, so even if the D did well during the season, they crapped the bed in the playoffs...

There is no evidence that Goff could have garnered a 1st and 2nd. Rest assured, Snead had fielded inquiries about Goff.

Do you REALLY think if Snead thought he could get that, that he wouldn't have pulled the trigger?

I'm def not anti-Goff. If anything, *I* was the ONLY one on this forum who went to the mattresses saying that Goff could be ELITE. I think I know why that's not the case now, but maybe it still can be.

Goff is not without skill or good traits. The Rams were public about going forward with him insofar as there'd be a competition which I said several times I thought he'd win. The Rams and many orgs in the NFL see Stafford as an upgrade.

As for the picks? I dunno. I see all sorts of pros and cons.

I HATED this trade at first and I don't expect anyone to come around like I did or as fast...

I certainly don't begrudge anyone still processing this.

 

[dieterbrock]

I don't want to insult McVay. I can respect that he made the call he felt was best at QB. I still can't wrap my head around it or agree with it. And I absolutely hate the way they went about it. But I don't harbor ill will towards him. The simple truth for me is that I hate the way this organization has conducted itself for well over a decade under certain circumstances. The way it dumped Kurt nearly caused me to quit being a Rams fan. And then I watched the shameful way it jettisoned Ike and disrespected St. Louis on the way out. Doing this to Jared the way they did it feels like Kurt all over again. And let's be honest, they didn't handle the Gurley situation well either. I just don't know, man. I just don't know.

I hear you, I feel what you're saying. Funny thing is, what makes me angry is how seemingly haphazardly they gave away the farm, and handed out these contract extensions to Cooks, Gurley and Goff, yet played such hardball with Aaron Donald. I mean really? Maybe the best football player to wear a Rams uni and he had to show up with his tail between his legs? And "earn" that raise?
Alas, coaches/front office guys are just like politicians. We can support them wholeheartedly and feel that they really care and live by the code they preach. But they really only care about winning. I mean if they can win while abiding to their mantra, great. But they have to win or else. Lastly, I think for good or bad, we see a reality of McVay. When he likes a player/coach, he gives them his all. But he can lose that love in a minute, and cut ties immediately. We saw it with Gurley after CJ Anderson came in, and I'm sorry but that moment came when Wolford came in and played with spunk. He was happy with Jared, until that day, then it was over. To an extent he wrote off Wade and Bones too....
For me its the Horns, they're just woven in to my fabric. I'm all in on Stafford now, he's our guy. I think its pretty lousy how folks are dumping on Goff, attacking his character, making up stuff to force blame. But it is what it is. I can surely support Stafford without tearing down #16