Les Snead Better Be Right

[Loyal]

Could be worse this guy could be a Rams fan instead. BTW if you've never watched one of his video's get ready for lots of language definitely NSFW.

you got the memo, right? After Kiper hated our draft, I am officially loving everything....

 

[OldSchool]

you got the memo, right? After Kiper hated our draft, I am officially loving everything....

Watch that if no kids or wife is around Headphones are best haha

 

[Adi]

O line was horrible last year but there were a lot of injuries. I think if healthy this line is alot deeper than you think . I will trust that mcvay picked the right offensive weapons until they prove me wrong . It was his call, no way snead would go after Everett that early .

 

[Psycho_X]

Kind of a dig at Fisher? But yes, Snead owns this draft now more than any other. I'm sure he is well aware of that as well.

 

[OldSchool]

Kind of a dig at Fisher? But yes, Snead owns this draft now more than any other. I'm sure he is well aware of that as well.

Little backhand slap to the Jeff Fisher error

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

or this is his last year with the Rams. I'm just a fan that believes both the Offense and Defense schemes start out front. I have heard some say that Rams coaches must like what they have on the Oline, since they didn't address it whatsoever in the Draft. Whitworth and Sullivan FA pickups must have been all they intended to do with the Oline. I think it was an absolute fail not picking Forrest Lamp at #37, but hey, what do i know? I don't get paid to make these decisions and Les Snead does. If Gurley and Goff are getting no help again this year from the defensive push, Snead should be canned. yeah, he gets a lot of direction from coaches, but he is the lone holdover (besides Coach Bones) from the Fisher regime.

I want to be that guy that loves the taste of crow, but if I am right, I want Snead's head on a stick.

There are Olinemen on the Rams that played at a high level at the end of 2015. It was something like 6-7 games without a sack. Then Boudreau was supposedly ill all year and we immediately saw a drop off. But really other than Barnes blocking in reverse and GRob's mistakes were they really that bad? Havenstein regressed once he was injured but the two glaring holes have been addressed in free agency. I am guessing Kromer thinks he can get good play out of the guys on the roster, or at least wants to see if he can. The need for weapons that can reliably catch and reliably be where they are supposed to be when the ball comes out, was a more glaring need.

 

[Loyal]

There are Olinemen on the Rams that played at a high level at the end of 2015. It was something like 6-7 games without a sack. Then Boudreau was supposedly ill all year and we immediately saw a drop off. But really other than Barnes blocking in reverse and GRob's mistakes were they really that bad? Havenstein regressed once he was injured but the two glaring holes have been addressed in free agency. I am guessing Kromer thinks he can get good play out of the guys on the roster, or at least wants to see if he can. The need for weapons that can reliably catch and reliably be where they are supposed to be when the ball comes out, was a more glaring need.

The undeniable truth was that Gurley regressed. He was getting hit in the backfield almost every time he touched the ball, Goff was sacked/hit like a punching bag...This is more than just GRob's fault

 

[Prime Time]

Ya'll can make fun of me now.

 

[tempests]

Kind of a dig at Fisher? But yes, Snead owns this draft now more than any other. I'm sure he is well aware of that as well.

He's expressed similar sentiment over all his drafts.

I imagine any GMs favorite draft is the one they just completed. This is when they're the most confident in what they've done.

 

[RamFan503]

or this is his last year with the Rams. I'm just a fan that believes both the Offense and Defense schemes start out front. I have heard some say that Rams coaches must like what they have on the Oline, since they didn't address it whatsoever in the Draft. Whitworth and Sullivan FA pickups must have been all they intended to do with the Oline. I think it was an absolute fail not picking Forrest Lamp at #37, but hey, what do i know? I don't get paid to make these decisions and Les Snead does. If Gurley and Goff are getting no help again this year from the defensive push, Snead should be canned. yeah, he gets a lot of direction from coaches, but he is the lone holdover (besides Coach Bones) from the Fisher regime.

I want to be that guy that loves the taste of crow, but if I am right, I want Snead's head on a stick.

Maybe he is the lone hold over because he gets the coaches into positions they want to be in rather than for who they pick. We don't really know who decides what players Snead and his staff scout or who ultimately controls the draft board. My suspicion is, however, that it is not Les.

It's all just speculation on my part but if he is doing HIS job, then there is no reason to can him. I mean literally zero.

 

[ramsplaya16]

maybe one every year, if that? We see LT's go early all of the time

well since 2010-2016, 17 interior lineman were selected in the first round, not even including players that were playing guard in their rookie seasons, expecting them to kick out to tackle but never have (Ex. juwann james) so thats almost 3 interior lineman a year being taken in the 1st on average... so when the talent is there they definitely get drafted early, even in the top 10 on a couple occasions... so if Lamp was THAT good, he would have gotten drafted as early as guys in recent past...

 

[Ramrasta]

Welp the 49ers just took Toth as a UDFA.
Fuller went in round 7.

Orlosky is still unsigned afaik, but he is the worst of those 3.

That's unfortunate. Thought we might steal him outside the draft.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

The undeniable truth was that Gurley regressed. He was getting hit in the backfield almost every time he touched the ball, Goff was sacked/hit like a punching bag...This is more than just GRob's fault

I think a lot of it was scheme, inexperience and bad coaching. I have seen what the improvements from a switch to a good OLine coach can do. I have brought it up here a few times. I believe that if the staff really felt there was such a dearth of talent among the lineman they would have drafted at least one.

 

[RamFan503]

The reason is probably disrespect for interior linemen, no matter how good.

Come on man. Interior OL is drafted in the first more than ever. Maybe, just maybe, most teams thought the linemen available were no better than what they had and therefore taking one would be a wasted pick.

Maybe they expect Jon Toth to slip to us as an UDFA? I do think not taking any OL was short-sighted though as Whitworth and Sullivan probably won't be here past two more years and we have questionable depth behind them.

Still, our depth may be better than the rookies available. I'll agree that sounds like a sad commentary. But we spent a lot of capital on the OL and it is quite possible it wasn't wasted.

I think that with Fisher's firing, who also helped hire Les Snead (Fisher), Snead emerged as more powerful than he was. No one was fooled that a pick in prior Fisher drafts, was anything but a Fisher favorite that Snead helped him to get. Snead was involved with hiring the HC this time around, and so I would consider him with more responsibility for picks...JMO

Not sure how much of this is accurate. Snead was a KD pick as far as I can tell. Fisher wouldn't really have much knowledge of the guy before he came here. He may have signed off on Snead but.... As far as Snead being involved in hiring McV... do you have anything that really proves that out? Not saying it's not the case but I haven't seen it.

GMs miss a lot too. It's a crapshoot. Greg Robinson was the number 2 overall pick and would have been picked high if the Rams passed on him. Fans have every right to get upset or ecstatic over their teams draft. Don't know how many times I've loved a pick (Tavon Austin) and ended up being wrong. The same with hating a pick (James Laurinaitis) and being wrong.

In my opinion I think it was a huge mistake to pass on Lamp. The Rams offense sucked last year primarily due to the horrible line. I understand they signed some players, but they need to build a line that can dominate if they want to win. The reason the Cowboys were so good with rookies on offense was due to their line. If the Rams want a good offense they need better line play.

I agree... well... mostly. I stopped pontificating long ago as to my prowess in second guessing the pros. First off, it does no good. Second, the fans consistently prove the blind squirrel adage. So maybe the Rams should have taken an Olineman. But there is at least as good a chance that it would have been a wasted pick. I think it is a given though that Dallas' Oline was not available in this draft.

I don't buy this theory at all and it's a theory that is very popular on this board. The theory is that we have good talent on offense, but Fisher was such a bad coach that they all played like crap. Fisher is a .500 coach in the league. He isn't great, he isn't good, but he's not totally abysmal. The guys on the offensive line weren't playing bad just because the coaching was bad (and it was) it was because they aren't that good of players. You win on offense and defense along the line of scrimmage. Having Donald, Brockwrs, and Quinn help the defense play well. The offense has a bunch of borderline starters and a very good LT, but he's 35 and his play and durability can easily jump off a cliff. Why this team doesn't consistently invest in the line with their draft picks baffles me. My main complaint with the Fisher and Snead regimes is that they didn't invest in the line until 2015. I think it was a mistake passing on Lamp.

All that being said, Everette is a great fit with McVay.

Here is where I really take a departure. There are stud olinemen that come up - no doubt. But I personally think coaching has a greater effect on the line than anywhere else. I was all over building the line when we did. We even saw some pretty good play early on. But then the improvement I think we all were seeing simply stopped. Is that the players or the coaching and schemes. I'm going with coaching and schemes. Guess we'll see.

Clearly the Rams line was way worse than all of the other teams listed.

Clearly the Rams OFFENSE was worse.... much like a very good offense can make a defense look better and a good defense can make an offense look better, there are always cause and effect issues in football. Coaching and schemes can be as big of an effect IMO.

Remember we have replaced 40% of our starting O.L. By doing so we have upgraded our depth and hopefully shifted players into a position to be more successful. It is not like we have ignored the O.L. Maybe there just wasn't any projected starters when we drafted worth the loss of another projected player with immediate value to our team.

This

Okay but our center has been injured a lot and he's old. I fail to see the logic in not supplying a young backup. I would take anyone up on a bet that he doesn't start 16 games and he isn't on our team next year.

And would a subpar rookie start over a player we already have?

The LT is 35. Always draft linemen. Always. Kromer may be a great coach, but this line was horrible last year. Why not draft top notch talent when it falls to you? When was the last time the Rams had a pro bowl offensive lineman?

Yeah... I remember Devaney saying you ALWAYS draft a QB. I think that kind of absolute statement makes for taking bad players just because you have a mantra.

The Rams took some players that many thought were very good Olinemen in recent years. So what then adds up to a probowler? Forcing a pick so that you use one of your 8 picks on an Olineman? Or possibly taking what you have and working with them as they might have better talent and no rookie jitters?

 

[GabesHorn]

Please don't make me list 45 seperate sites and the talking head scouts and so called draft experts. I truly like the old guy on NFL network who times Rich Eison's 40 yard dash each combine. Mike had Lamp as his favorite OL period. Inside his top 20 players. I thought it was a pure miracle that he actually fell to us. I was freaking out. I watched enough film an old OL like me can stand on this guy after hearing the Rams had a hard on for him . Grabbing a first round Elite talent without a 1ST round pick? HELL YEAH!!! Plus player meet need also and Mikes comparison player was the stud cowboy they stole from us in the AD draft. We were gonna trade back in for him. I'm old I forget names sometimes. Quite a comparison for a quality judge of college players in my personal opinion. I now know McVay wanted HIS guy to recreate his past success IF he can. Even down to his hope for a fullback like he also had. Its all gonna ride on Goff's success anyway. I'd worry about middle pass rush first and get Higbee and Hemingway up to speed first as a TE whisperer.

I know all about smoke screens but I also just lived through the Groygate that gave many Rams fans heart failures . Then a LONG pause even before we gave Sullivan the longest physical and waited on all results and consults before we ever signed him. As a 55+ yr fan of the Rams I've seen our LA DR.s mess up more times then not with DR.s opinions. This is the last day I can even fuss over not getting Lamp. I remember the draft year Rams fans were split over the Clemson WR who the Bills drafted and GRob. Now both players are looking at no 5th year extentions as possible busts. As an old OL of course I thought GRob was the way to go. So if only we took the OL we wanted to trade back for and skipped GRob? Only time will tell. I know how hard it is to get a move TE route ready and built up enough to block properly in the NFL. Everett has some very weak blocking efforts that may alarm you. He has his handsome highlights and tackle breaking . Yet even at his lower level of competition he really lacks in his blocking efforts. Gonna NEED 10-15 LBS for sure. Don't want to slow him down. As an ex basketball player he is like 3 other NFL greats that came that same route to NFL success. I just think McVay saw himself turning this guy into a Probowler like another we saw break all TE records and I think retired a falcon. Don't think Kromer could break it to McVay after he fell in love with his pre-draft pick he knew he could even trade down for. Was a done deal with no threat of losing his player. Kinda obvious now.

Snead just made sure it happened the way our new young General wanted it in his very first draft attempt. Snead actually loved being able to make the trade down. Too easy. Lamp never had a chance. Kromer told McVay he could make it work with what he has. (My words) Hope it works out for us and Goff more importantly. With as many OL injuries the Rams have on average yearly are we stacked enough to keep Goff safe? We were not last year with the addition of two very old players. One with a bad back. We will see . The Chargers drafted Feeney also as they need to protect that aged QB Rivers in his last expensive years. Just trying to vent it all out and start over fresh tomorrow. Its all been done. Maybe my disgust is a good sign for our success. I am normally very happy with our drafts. If not always. Can Snead find us a diamond in the UDFA ? Show us some true skill Lester. :giveup: :icare:

 

[BeefJurky]

Come on man. Interior OL is drafted in the first more than ever. Maybe, just maybe, most teams thought the linemen available were no better than what they had and therefore taking one would be a wasted pick.


Still, our depth may be better than the rookies available. I'll agree that sounds like a sad commentary. But we spent a lot of capital on the OL and it is quite possible it wasn't wasted.

Not sure how much of this is accurate. Snead was a KD pick as far as I can tell. Fisher wouldn't really have much knowledge of the guy before he came here. He may have signed off on Snead but.... As far as Snead being involved in hiring McV... do you have anything that really proves that out? Not saying it's not the case but I haven't seen it.


I agree... well... mostly. I stopped pontificating long ago as to my prowess in second guessing the pros. First off, it does no good. Second, the fans consistently prove the blind squirrel adage. So maybe the Rams should have taken an Olineman. But there is at least as good a chance that it would have been a wasted pick. I think it is a given though that Dallas' Oline was not available in this draft.

Here is where I really take a departure. There are stud olinemen that come up - no doubt. But I personally think coaching has a greater effect on the line than anywhere else. I was all over building the line when we did. We even saw some pretty good play early on. But then the improvement I think we all were seeing simply stopped. Is that the players or the coaching and schemes. I'm going with coaching and schemes. Guess we'll see.


Clearly the Rams OFFENSE was worse.... much like a very good offense can make a defense look better and a good defense can make an offense look better, there are always cause and effect issues in football. Coaching and schemes can be as big of an effect IMO.


This


And would a subpar rookie start over a player we already have?

Yeah... I remember Devaney saying you ALWAYS draft a QB. I think that kind of absolute statement makes for taking bad players just because you have a mantra.

The Rams took some players that many thought were very good Olinemen in recent years. So what then adds up to a probowler? Forcing a pick so that you use one of your 8 picks on an Olineman? Or possibly taking what you have and working with them as they might have better talent and no rookie jitters?

You mean Rhaney? Our current backup C who was a 7th rounder himself?
Yea, maybe they would.

 

[jrry32]

well since 2010-2016, 17 interior lineman were selected in the first round, not even including players that were playing guard in their rookie seasons, expecting them to kick out to tackle but never have (Ex. juwann james) so thats almost 3 interior lineman a year being taken in the 1st on average... so when the talent is there they definitely get drafted early, even in the top 10 on a couple occasions... so if Lamp was THAT good, he would have gotten drafted as early as guys in recent past...

I hate these arguments. Lamp is that good. People have made this same argument about so many players over the years. It's as if they think that great players don't fall out of the first round every year.

If you think he's not that good, turn on the games, break him down for us, and tell us what his flaws are.

 

[Zodi]

Little backhand slap to the Jeff Fisher error

He also said you can't bond with someone "at a company picnic" lmao.

Tons of respect for Fisher and where he brought us, but it's no secret that he had a country-club style to him.

 

[Zodi]

I hate these arguments. Lamp is that good. People have made this same argument about so many players over the years. It's as if they think that great players don't fall out of the first round every year.

If you think he's not that good, turn on the games, break him down for us, and tell us what his flaws are.

Scouting isn't an exact science, so trying to figure it out with absolutes doesn't work. Like I said, a lot of "experts" had a first round grade on Lamp, but 32 teams thought otherwise. I doubt it was due to the fact that teams disrespect the position.

He could go on to be the best guard in NFL history or a total bust, and it wouldn't mean anyone would be wrong. Draft value is based on a limited body of work, potential, and speculation. It's no different than picking between different scratch-off lottery tickets, and choosing the one that usually pays out more.

 

[jrry32]

Scouting isn't an exact science, so trying to figure it out with absolutes doesn't work. Like I said, a lot of "experts" had a first round grade on Lamp, but 32 teams thought otherwise. I doubt it was due to the fact that teams disrespect the position.

He could go on to be the best guard in NFL history or a total bust, and it wouldn't mean anyone would be wrong. Draft value is based on a limited body of work, potential, and speculation. It's no different than picking between different scratch-off lottery tickets, and choosing the one that usually pays out more.

Yes, it would. It's very different than picking between lottery tickets. It's not an exact science, but you're not operating in the dark either.

If someone wants to say, "He didn't go in the first, so he can't be that good." Fine. Go ahead and explain why. If you can't, you're not in a position to be making that claim.

And yes, NFL teams do disrespect interior OLs. That's not the sole reason why Lamp fell, but it is one of the biggest. If he were considered a legitimate LT prospect, he'd have gone top 20.