Jrry32 Post-Free Agency Mock Draft

[jrry32]

I am not advocating for forcing need picks TJ Watt is not so much better(if he is at all) than Chris Godwin, Zay Jones, or Evan Engram that a 3rd OLB is a better value for this particular team than a starting WR or TE .

He is that much better than those guys. And you're ignoring the point of the draft. You readily admit that those guys may not be ready to contribute in a major way as rookies. So this 3rd OLB vs. starting WR/TE point is meaningless. Barwin is on a one year deal. It's very possible that Watt will become a highly productive starting OLB at the same time that those three guys become highly productive starting WRs.

But again, you're missing my point. I am going into the draft saying, "Here's the list of guys that I think can become major contributors to us. How can I get as many of them as possible?" I can't get a player like Watt in the 4th/5th round. Due to the depth of this WR class, I likely can get a WR like those guys in the 4th/5th round.

I don't have a problem with Kittle or Reynolds, they are good players. Why give McVay good when you can give him potentially great.

The 6'4" 250 pound TE who blocks like an OT and runs a 4.52 40 can't be great? The 6'3" WR with the speed to get vertical, the quickness to separate as a route runner, and the hands/body control to consistently win 50-50 balls can't be great?

That's my problem here. Why pass on a guy like Watt when there aren't a ton of OLBs I like outside of the second round if I can get a TE and WR in the 4th/5th who are both NFL ready in many respects and have high ceilings?

Of course, there's the possibility that Reynolds goes much higher. It would make sense. He should. If that were to happen, my strategy would change. My strategy is going to depend on how the draft goes on draft day. Watt might be gone before #37. That would completely change everything. I'm not going to force another OLB pick in there. I'm going to go after the next player that I rate highly.

 

[pmil66]

Would be very interesting for the rams to hire an O minded coach, and use the first 3 draft picks on D. Would think coach McVay voice will be the loudest in the draft room when the rams pick 37 comes up and a TE or WR he likes is still on the board. I do like the trade down, even in round 2 to pick up an exra 3rd rounder. Need another playmaker or 2 on O.

 

[OldSchool]

Would be very interesting for the rams to hire an O minded coach, and use the first 3 draft picks on D. Would think coach McVay voice will be the loudest in the draft room when the rams pick 37 comes up and a TE or WR he likes is still on the board. I do like the trade down, even in round 2 to pick up an exra 3rd rounder. Need another playmaker or 2 on O.

What does a smart OC turned HC want? A defense that can make it so that every time they score 20 points have a great shot at winning sounds like an OC's best friend. A defense that can go out there and take the ball away from the opposition allowing his offense more chances at scoring the ball. Or would a smart OC/HC want a defense with holes in it forcing his offense to score 35 a game? Frankly from what we've seen in history is most OC's think they can work their magic with anybody on offense. It boosts the ego to do more with less.

 

[pmil66]

What does a smart OC turned HC want? A defense that can make it so that every time they score 20 points have a great shot at winning sounds like an OC's best friend. A defense that can go out there and take the ball away from the opposition allowing his offense more chances at scoring the ball. Or would a smart OC/HC want a defense with holes in it forcing his offense to score 35 a game? Frankly from what we've seen in history is most OC's think they can work their magic with anybody on offense. It boosts the ego to do more with less.

What does a smart OC turned HC want? A defense that can make it so that every time they score 20 points have a great shot at winning sounds like an OC's best friend. A defense that can go out there and take the ball away from the opposition allowing his offense more chances at scoring the ball. Or would a smart OC/HC want a defense with holes in it forcing his offense to score 35 a game? Frankly from what we've seen in history is most OC's think they can work their magic with anybody on offense. It boosts the ego to do more with less.

A smart OC turned HC wants a top D coordinator to call the shots on D, and he has that with Wade. Stay out of the way and let Wade do his thing. And im sure Wade wants the O to keep his D off the field, as that was the biggest problem last season, tired D. Too many 3 and outs. Just think in roster building the rams have work to do on the O side, more than the D side. And using 2 of the top 3 picks next month is the way the rams need to go.

 

[OldSchool]

A smart OC turned HC wants a top D coordinator to call the shots on D, and he has that with Wade. Stay out of the way and let Wade do his thing. And im sure Wade wants the O to keep his D off the field, as that was the biggest problem last season, tired D. Too many 3 and outs. Just think in roster building the rams have work to do on the O side, more than the D side. And using 2 of the top 3 picks next month is the way the rams need to go.

I disagree that they need more on the O than the D I'd say they need to build up both by taking the best player each time they're up to draft especially if that player is at a position that could use an upgrade. Our biggest upgrade on offense is continually getting ignored. That's McVay, Kromer, Olsen and LaFleur. Those four alone are a huge upgrade on offense and worth every penny. While Wade is an upgrade on Williams it's not as big of one compared to the offense.

Again this is all speculation, we don't know what players will even be available when we're OTC and we don't know what direction Snead and McVay will go. That's what these mocks are for to feel things out. Hell I'm working on a full mock, all the teams every pick. And you'd be surprised at how hard that is every time you see somebody who'd be a great pick for somebody you pass over 3 or 4 other guys that would also. And all of a sudden you have a guy you're certain would be a great pick at the top of round 2 is now available in the middle of round 3. For the record I didn't go the same route as Jrry. But I can see the value in those picks and how each one of them makes the Rams as a whole a much better team.


View: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hM28G5fBFQLnCtu8TUHl1sexKbgXWZG0GvugeA1rzwU/edit?usp=sharing


First google doc and not sure if I'm sharing it right. I'm thinking with my next two picks Watkins at DT and Roullier at Center. If the board is friendly to the Rams.

 

[jrry32]

A smart OC turned HC wants a top D coordinator to call the shots on D, and he has that with Wade. Stay out of the way and let Wade do his thing. And im sure Wade wants the O to keep his D off the field, as that was the biggest problem last season, tired D. Too many 3 and outs. Just think in roster building the rams have work to do on the O side, more than the D side. And using 2 of the top 3 picks next month is the way the rams need to go.

The Rams need to add talent, not positions.

 

[BonifayRam]

I would just add this....of the 6 draft selections in the Rams 2016 draft 5 of the 6 picks were offense. That offensive draft followed the 2015 Rams draft when the Rams had 9 selections Snead used the first 7 selection on offensive players with the last two 7th rd'ers going to defense.Thus over the last 2 Ram drafts 12 out of 15 picks were offense.

Rams should see dividends coming their way offensively from those past two drafts from those 2nd & 3rd season players.

 

[StealYoGurley]

It speaks volumes that McVay came in and hasn't cleaned out getting rid of all these bad WR's and TE that you think we have. He clearly gives the impression that he likes these guys.

I want to leave this alone, but I have to straighten some mischaracterizations of my statements. I never once called anyone bad. I did say Tavon is the least efficient WR since targets became a stat. I said Robert Woods can potentially eclipse his mediocre career numbers, but thats not enough. I like cooper, but his or a 5th rounder does not elevate this group out of the bottom 5 in the NFL.

Even if McVay wanted to get rid of Tavon he couldn't because of the cap ramifications. It also makes no sense to cut second year players on cheap rookie deals even if he wanted to (to be clear I am not advocating he do so) especially before making any other additions. The fact that McVay hasn't cut guys on cheap rookie contracts or taken a huge cap hit to cut Tavon doesn't indicate anything one way or another. We will have a better idea of what he thinks about that group in about a month.

You're implying that later round picks can't be contributors yet you cite another teams great weapons and all but one of them are 3rd round or later picks.

Also a mischaracterization. I clearly said I like Higbee and I think he can be a contributor even if he is the 2nd TE. My argument was the presence of Higbee or Cooper shouldn't stop the Rams from adding talent at those positions early. That doesn't mean Cooper and or Higbee can't or won't contribute offensively.

Secondly, why would I discount another team's 3rd rounder like Reed being a contributor when I have been saying this whole time the rams should add an offensive piece in the third round at the least.

Additionally, I said when Desean Jackson (2nd round pick) Pierre Garcon (6th round Pick) went to Washington as their top 2 receivers they were bonafide NFL talents. I didn't say late round talents cant develop and contribute. I said when Kirk Cousins took off he wasn't surrounded by guys who were late round developmental talents at that stage of their career. When Garcon and DJax got to the Skins and when Kirk Cousins took off they weren't late round picks being asked to be immediate contributors. Even if you are looking at them from the standpoint of when the main guys in that unit were drafted ( DeSean 2nd, Reed 3rd, Garcon 6) as opposed to their formation as players when they joined the redskins; the 2nd and 3rd round picks are still 2 of the 3 offensive focal points. Wouldn't you be ecstatic getting a DeSean level talent in the 2nd a Reed talent in the third to go with what we already have in Woods who could potentially match Garcon's production and Cooper as a Crowder like 4th round talent? A team can maximize the talents of a 4th round pick like Crowder when he is only asked to be the 4th option because there are two bonafide NFL WRs and Jordan Reed at TE ahead in the pecking order. I love cooper in that sort of situation as well, but we aren't there yet. RBs were never part of my argument. You brought that up, most myself included agree that late or UDFA RBs can be major contributors.

 

[pmil66]

I disagree that they need more on the O than the D I'd say they need to build up both by taking the best player each time they're up to draft especially if that player is at a position that could use an upgrade. Our biggest upgrade on offense is continually getting ignored. That's McVay, Kromer, Olsen and LaFleur. Those four alone are a huge upgrade on offense and worth every penny. While Wade is an upgrade on Williams it's not as big of one compared to the offense.

Again this is all speculation, we don't know what players will even be available when we're OTC and we don't know what direction Snead and McVay will go. That's what these mocks are for to feel things out. Hell I'm working on a full mock, all the teams every pick. And you'd be surprised at how hard that is every time you see somebody who'd be a great pick for somebody you pass over 3 or 4 other guys that would also. And all of a sudden you have a guy you're certain would be a great pick at the top of round 2 is now available in the middle of round 3. For the record I didn't go the same route as Jrry. But I can see the value in those picks and how each one of them makes the Rams as a whole a much better team.


View: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hM28G5fBFQLnCtu8TUHl1sexKbgXWZG0GvugeA1rzwU/edit?usp=sharing


First google doc and not sure if I'm sharing it right. I'm thinking with my next two picks Watkins at DT and Roullier at Center. If the board is friendly to the Rams.

Very interesting mock. Like the Zay Jones pick at 37, but would take Sidney Jones at 69 over WItherspoon, provided everything checks out with the medicals. Just think Jones is a better football player, and willing to wait a year, since the rams have Tru and Webster to start at CB this season.

 

[pmil66]

The Rams need to add talent, not positions.

Agree, just disagree where the talent is most needed. But do respect the time and research you do in posting your choices. Much appreciated.

 

[jrry32]

Agree, just disagree where the talent is most needed. But do respect the time and research you do in posting your choices. Much appreciated.

I'm not making a judgement of where talent is most needed. I don't believe in drafting positions; I believe in drafting players.

 

[jrry32]

Very interesting mock. Like the Zay Jones pick at 37, but would take Sidney Jones at 69 over WItherspoon, provided everything checks out with the medicals. Just think Jones is a better football player, and willing to wait a year, since the rams have Tru and Webster to start at CB this season.

Give me Witherspoon in a second over Jones at #69. Jones is likely out for all of 2017 and may never be the same player (although, I think he'll recover okay). Witherspoon has the talent and cover skills to be a better cover CB than Jones even if Jones does recover, and he can play in 2017. I'd take Jones if he were healthy because of Witherspoon's softness in the run game, but with the injury, it's not a question for me.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Sorry Jrry but that draft would be disappointing for me.

Watt is slow off the line and doesn't move his feet fast enough. If the Rams trade back to late second round, maybe. I hate to think he is the Rams edge rusher of the future. One thing he has in his favor is his brother was a late bloomer and continued to improve in the NFL. Some are predicting he does the same. That is a risky prediction.

Lewis and Roullier are nice picks. After that there are too many injury risks.

 

[jrry32]

Sorry Jrry but that draft would be disappointing for me.

Watt is slow off the line and doesn't move his feet fast enough. If the Rams trade back to late second round, maybe. I hate to think he is the Rams edge rusher of the future. One thing he has in his favor is his brother was a late bloomer and continued to improve in the NFL. Some are predicting he does the same. That is a risky prediction.

Lewis and Roullier are nice picks. After that there are too many injury risks.

You're entitled to your opinion, but I don't see that at all. Watt's burst and agility are a big part of what made him such a disruptive pass rusher this year. He gets to the corner quickly and wins with his flexibility and hand usage.

His measurables only back that up. The analytics love him because of his otherworldly twitch/agility scores.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

You're entitled to your opinion, but I don't see that at all. Watt's burst and agility are a big part of what made him such a disruptive pass rusher this year. He gets to the corner quickly and wins with his flexibility and hand usage.

His measurables only back that up. The analytics love him because of his otherworldly twitch/agility scores.

I am probably wrong on JT. I read a rumor that Green Bay is looking at him to replace Clay Matthews Jr. I don't think he is that caliber, but if the rumor is true they do.

 

[JKBOGEN]

So height and weight tell you who will succeed and who won't? Interesting analytics. Mardy Gilyard was 6'0" 187lbs we better not ever draft a WR with those same specs! OH NO! Robert Woods is 6'0" 190lbs we're screwed now

Size is not a talent. Once you realize that when scouting these players you find gems in all shapes and sizes.

 

[LACHAMP46]

Size is not a talent.

Size, speed, and especially weight are special talents...Guys that are big, that can move are typically more talented.

If all things are equal, re: measurables....take the bigger player in a contact sport. JMO

 

[Merlin]

Watt is a scary and exciting pick all in one. Boom or bust. His injuries really worry me, however his game tape on defense is ridiculous. If he can stay healthy I think Pro Bowls are in his future. He's that kind of talent. So even though it terrifies me, I can get behind him there in round 2 and since I am very concerned with Robert Quinn and how long he has left getting a guy of Watt's caliber makes a lot of sense.

Lewis I absolutely love. Took him in the ROD mock draft, dude is going to be a shutdown corner in this league. Getting him round 3 would be a thing of beauty; don't see him being there but in this particular draft yeah it's possible.

Rest of your picks are real solid. Not sure what round some of them will go, this draft is going to be very hard to predict past the third or so round due to the depth of it, but can't really knock any of them and a couple I do like very much like your boy Kittle. He and Butt are my type of TE, very well rounded with good coaching in college and prepared for the NFL.

Only concern I'd have is wideout, but the fact is the Rams aren't gonna get everything they want in this one. They need to play to the strengths of the draft and I think this mock does that, real nice job.

 

[Merlin]

I want to leave this alone, but I have to straighten some mischaracterizations of my statements. I never once called anyone bad. I did say Tavon is the least efficient WR since targets became a stat. I said Robert Woods can potentially eclipse his mediocre career numbers, but thats not enough. I like cooper, but his or a 5th rounder does not elevate this group out of the bottom 5 in the NFL.

I understand where you're coming from wrt the WR position SYG. It's hard to say right now that the Rams have enough to be even mediocre on offense, lot of unknowns there. But one thing I've been saying over and over for some time now is that the draft tends to dictate how you approach it and this one in particular is absolutely loaded on defense at the top.

My top 50 is defense dominated. Not saying I'm some pro evaluator, but it's insane how good the CB, DE, LB positions are in this draft. Now the Rams are going to have specific types in mind, and I think weakside OLB and top cover corner are going to be the priority for them, but even weeding out the bigger 4-3 DEs there's still a high likelihood that WR is going to have lesser value than the defensive positions on the Rams' board when they're on the clock at 37.

What they need at wideout is specific too. They need an X receiver. Badly. This is why the only guy I'd be comfortable with them taking at 37 is Godwin (who again will probably not have as much value as CB and DE but we'll have to see how it plays out). Round 3 I'd take Ford, or go with one of the TEs. Round 3 is my offensive skill spot, but if they go with a rush guy at 37 and have Lewis sitting there at their round 3 spot I am not gonna complain.

This is a very important draft for Les Snead. He's out of Fisher's shadow and has to absolutely kill this draft. That means avoiding the reaches and try to get the best combo he can by playing to the draft's strengths. When all is said and done there will be a position or two he doesn't address no matter how it plays out. But if he adds difference makers we're gonna be ok.

 

[StealYoGurley]

I understand where you're coming from wrt the WR position SYG. It's hard to say right now that the Rams have enough to be even mediocre on offense, lot of unknowns there. But one thing I've been saying over and over for some time now is that the draft tends to dictate how you approach it and this one in particular is absolutely loaded on defense at the top.

My top 50 is defense dominated. Not saying I'm some pro evaluator, but it's insane how good the CB, DE, LB positions are in this draft. Now the Rams are going to have specific types in mind, and I think weakside OLB and top cover corner are going to be the priority for them, but even weeding out the bigger 4-3 DEs there's still a high likelihood that WR is going to have lesser value than the defensive positions on the Rams' board when they're on the clock at 37.

What they need at wideout is specific too. They need an X receiver. Badly. This is why the only guy I'd be comfortable with them taking at 37 is Godwin (who again will probably not have as much value as CB and DE but we'll have to see how it plays out). Round 3 I'd take Ford, or go with one of the TEs. Round 3 is my offensive skill spot, but if they go with a rush guy at 37 and have Lewis sitting there at their round 3 spot I am not gonna complain.

This is a very important draft for Les Snead. He's out of Fisher's shadow and has to absolutely kill this draft. That means avoiding the reaches and try to get the best combo he can by playing to the draft's strengths. When all is said and done there will be a position or two he doesn't address no matter how it plays out. But if he adds difference makers we're gonna be ok.

I try to avoid commenting on others people's mocks to avoid things like this haha. The only reason I commented here is I just don't think there is any chance the Rams wait that long to address the offense all things considered. Just a matter of perspective and apparently mine is very different from others, but I am fine with because that is what forums are for. IMO from what I know about all the decision makers involved and based on what the Rams have done this offseason; offensive additions, specifically weapons for Goff will be a priority. I see them going for players they have closer to the top of their board on the offensive side of the ball as opposed to offensive players lower down their board.