Jrry32 Post-Free Agency Mock Draft

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So height and weight tell you who will succeed and who won't? Interesting analytics. Mardy Gilyard was 6'0" 187lbs we better not ever draft a WR with those same specs! OH NO! Robert Woods is 6'0" 190lbs we're screwed now :D
ha!:rockon:...I am always leery of short corners after Tye Hill.
 

den-the-coach

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Love the Vanderdoes pick and he'll be great in Wade's scheme and Chase Roullier from Wyoming to being the starting center of the Los Angeles Rams...Gutsy call there and is he ready? And how can you not like a linebacker with the surname of Biegel? The dogs will be barking as @jrry32 embraces the badger state in this draft...Nicely done counselor, nicely done!
 

jrry32

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Jourdan Lewis the next Tye Hill?
Tye Hill 5-10, 185---NFL Bust
Jourdan Lewis 5-10, 188 ----NFL ?

They're not comparable. Hill was a speedster with mediocre cover skills and a fear of contact. Lewis is a sticky cover CB who plays bigger and faster than his numbers indicate. Lewis is much more similar to Brent Grimes (5'10" 185), Chris Harrs Jr. (5'9" 194), Jason Verrett (5'10" 188), and Janoris Jenkins (5'10" 193) than Tye Hill. In fact, he has a skill-set that's quite similar to Janoris's except Lewis doesn't gamble.

Another couple of players I've seen him compared to are Pac Man Jones (5'10" 187) and Brandon Flowers (5'10" 189), but Lewis isn't a headcase off the field like Pac Man.

Point being that despite their listed heights and weights, Tye Hill and Jourdan Lewis have next to nothing in common. Lewis is pretty much the anti-Hill.(tough, tenacious, physical, and a better football player than athlete)
 

jrry32

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Love the Vanderdoes pick and he'll be great in Wade's scheme and Chase Roullier from Wyoming to being the starting center of the Los Angeles Rams...Gutsy call there and is he ready? And how can you not like a linebacker with the surname of Biegel? The dogs will be barking as @jrry32 embraces the badger state in this draft...Nicely done counselor, nicely done!

I hope so. He's a well-coached kid with good technique. If not, Wichmann or another one of the OLs will win the position. I have a lot of faith in Kromer. He's very good at what he does.
 

den-the-coach

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For the record after watching the Chase Roullier highlights that @jrry32 posted love that RB Brian Hill, sure wish the Rams had not signed Dunbar and looked at this kid...Maybe it's the dreads & donning #8, but I like that kid quite a bit!
 

StealYoGurley

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Lewis isn't a nickel back. He's a starting CB. My expectation is that he'd start with Trumaine Johnson and slide into the slot when we go to the nickel with Webster or Gaines playing outside.

Lewis is a first round talent available in the third round because of this stacked CB class. You're not going to find better value in this draft in the late 2nd to mid/late 3rd round than you'll find at CB. The fact that Wade blitzes on a high percentage of passing plays only makes a sticky press CB like Lewis more valuable to our team.

As for NT, I can't find the stat, but I remember reading that the Broncos spent more time in their base defense than any other team in the NFL last year. As it stands now, I'm not comfortable with our DL depth or with our current starters. Vanderdoes gives us a run-stuffing presence that we sorely need in our base defense, and he has pass rush potential down the line. He's a nice value pick in the 4th round because he physically has the talent of an early round pick. However, due to injuries, he'll fall to the mid-rounds. He fits a big need and offers nice value.



I don't want to ask Wade to do more with less. You don't need to score 30 PPG if you have a top 5 defense. Wade has shown he's capable of making a defense with good talent great and making a defense with great talent elite. It puts less pressure on Goff and McVay if our defense is consistently holding the opposition under 20 points per game.



In the most important respects, yes. For one, you don't have to worry about Woods, Tavon, and Reynolds/Cooper dogging it on their routes. Second, I think the route running will be significantly improved. Third, I trust McVay WAY MORE than I trust Boras or Cignetti to maximize the skill-sets of our players, scheme them open, and put them in positions to succeed.

Is Woods, Tavon, and Evan Engram or Zay Jones or Chris Godwin that much better than Britt, Tavon, and Quick or Cooper?(in 2017)

From my vantage point, whether we address WR in the second round or the fifth round, we're not going to have an elite unit unless a couple of our guys step up this year. Is it realistic to count on a rookie to be a superstar for us?

Too much to argue here we could go on forever. So I will just say this. The last 4 years the Rams have at best finished 28th in offense while finishing dead last offensively the past 2 years. During that time Tavon Austin has been one of the least efficient WRs in NFL history. Woods is a nice piece with upside to produce more than he has in the past, but hasn't eclipsed 700 yards to this point in his career. You can expect improvements from 4th round picks Higbee and Cooper, but not to the point where they are offensive focal points this team is sorely lacking. They hired a young Offensive Head Coach and Offensive Coordinator coming from two teams with some of the best weapons in the league to develop the number one overall pick at QB they spent significant draft capital on to trade up for. With all that said do you really think they will not address the offensive side of the ball and get those guys help until the 4th round?
 

StealYoGurley

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What's the best friend a young QB can have? A running game and a defense that isn't going to put him so far behind he has to throw the ball 50 times a game. So far we're working towards that while also giving him better pass protection and giving him a reliable route runner with good hands that's a hard working pro. We also really don't know what we have in last years draft picks. To sell them short without seeing what we have in them is a disservice.

We don't know what we have one way or another, that certainly shouldn't stop us from adding more talent on the offensive side of the ball in addition to them. Just because we add more offensive talent doesn't mean those guys wont play. You are just adding weapons to a team that doesn't have many.
 

jrry32

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Too much to argue here we could go on forever. So I will just say this. The last 4 years the Rams have at best finished 28th in offense while finishing dead last offensively the past 2 years. During that time Tavon Austin has been one of the least efficient WRs in NFL history. Woods is a nice piece with upside to produce more than he has in the past, but hasn't eclipsed 700 yards to this point in his career. You can expect improvements from 4th round picks Higbee and Cooper, but not to the point where they are offensive focal points this team is sorely lacking. They hired a young Offensive Head Coach and Offensive Coordinator coming from two teams with some of the best weapons in the league to develop the number one overall pick at QB they spent significant draft capital on to trade up for. With all that said do you really think they will not address the offensive side of the ball and get those guys help until the 4th round?

I answered your question already.

You chose not to respond to any of the questions I asked you. I'll just repost my earlier response to this same question:
I don't want to ask Wade to do more with less. You don't need to score 30 PPG if you have a top 5 defense. Wade has shown he's capable of making a defense with good talent great and making a defense with great talent elite. It puts less pressure on Goff and McVay if our defense is consistently holding the opposition under 20 points per game.

In the most important respects, yes. For one, you don't have to worry about Woods, Tavon, and Reynolds/Cooper dogging it on their routes. Second, I think the route running will be significantly improved. Third, I trust McVay WAY MORE than I trust Boras or Cignetti to maximize the skill-sets of our players, scheme them open, and put them in positions to succeed.

Is Woods, Tavon, and Evan Engram or Zay Jones or Chris Godwin that much better than Britt, Tavon, and Quick or Cooper?(in 2017)

From my vantage point, whether we address WR in the second round or the fifth round, we're not going to have an elite unit unless a couple of our guys step up this year. Is it realistic to count on a rookie to be a superstar for us?

I'll also add:
If McVay felt we had nothing at WR or TE, why didn't he add another veteran WR or TE?
 

StealYoGurley

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Lol, fine Jerry I will post the long response I was trying to avoid.

As for going WR or TE early, it doesn't guarantee you anything for 2017. Tyler Higbee was a very talented pass catching TE coming out of college, and look what he did as a rookie. TEs have one of the toughest transitions to the NFL. At the end of the day, taking a WR or TE in the second or third round doesn't guarantee us that they'll be ready to make an impact in 2017.

You are right rookies provide no guarantees in 2017, but that goes for either side of the ball. This isn't a quick fix. Get talented guys around Goff early and start develop them and their moldable traits into legitimate weapons. Start building a long term rapport with the Rams most important asset now

TE is a tough transition. If you put a former WR like Higbee consistently inline against powerful NFL DEs you are setting that guy up for failure. On the flip side, as a TE coach McVay coached one of the better rookie TE seasons out of a big time talent in Jordan Reed who had 500 yards in 3 TDs playing in only 9 games. Reed had alot of talent as a rookie and McVay put that talent in a position to succeed by using him as mismatch weapon in the slot and out wide against LBs and Safeties. I believe McVay can do that again by taking advantage of the best talents available in this extremely talented TE class.

IMO, our defense is closer to greatness than the offense. McVay was smart to address the elephant in the room (the OL) in FA in a huge way. With Kromer joining as OL Coach, I'm very confident we can put a quality starting five out there. I think that we can have one of the league's better run blocking OLs. That will allow McVay to use Gurley and the running game to open things up for the passing attack. I also believe we'll see much better pass blocking.

Part of the problem last year running the ball is no one respected our WRs. Tavon, Woods, and a 5th round rookie is a bottom 5 WR group in the league and is scaring anyone, so we will be running into alot of the same issues. I agree Kroemer will improve this group significantly, but it won't suddenly become a game changing group like Cowboys

If McVay felt we had nothing at WR or TE, why didn't he add another veteran WR or TE?

I didn't say we had nothing, but both the TE and WR position need upgrades and Free agency isn't the only place you add talent. The Rams don't need multiple new TEs with Harkey, Higbee, Hemmingway and other developmental guys on the roster. They could however use an upgrade at TE and they can certainly do that when this 2017 draft has the best group of TEs in a while. Why pay a couple million short term for vet when you can have the cheaper higher upside guy potentially giving you more.

As for not adding another veteran WR the Rams are spending the 5th most money in the league at WR next year. With so many other needs, limited cap space, and a ton of money already committed to the position it makes more sense to supplement that position through the draft where you get more upside and more value.

From my vantage point, whether we address WR in the second round or the fifth round, we're not going to have an elite unit unless a couple of our guys step up this year. Is it realistic to count on a rookie to be a superstar for us?

Yes we will not have an elite unit next year, but it doesn't mean we shouldn't start developing top notch talent around Goff. If a rookie with potential can come in year one a put up rookie year Allen Robinson numbers or something like that as he builds towards the future with Goff I will take it. Michael Thomas and Sterling Shepard were big contributors after getting drafted in the second round in a weaker WR draft. Obviously Thomas is the higher end of the spectrum, and we are less likely to find a guy like that. However, the chances of finding a guy like that are significantly higher in the 2nd compared to the 5th. Even if you don't get a guy that good I would be happy with sterling shepherd like rookie production with that guy showing potential for more. IMO I would rather start developing a higher round guy with more talent instead of just adding yet another middle round guy.

As for NT, I can't find the stat, but I remember reading that the Broncos spent more time in their base defense than any other team in the NFL last year. As it stands now, I'm not comfortable with our DL depth or with our current starters. Vanderdoes gives us a run-stuffing presence that we sorely need in our base defense, and he has pass rush potential down the line. He's a nice value pick in the 4th round because he physically has the talent of an early round pick. However, due to injuries, he'll fall to the mid-rounds. He fits a big need and offers nice value.

Wade does play alot of base, but he also does not rotate his lineman nearly as much as guys like Greg Williams. The three main backup Bronco d linemen Gotsis, Kilgo, and Winn combined for 645 snaps, while each starting D lineman played at leas that combined amount. RE Crick played 939 snaps, NT Williams played 644 snaps, and LE Wolfe played 663 snaps while missing 2 games. In contrast Donald played 830 and with Brockers banged up Easley was second with 470.

It is also worth noting the capital invested in of those backups Kilgo a 6th rounder, Winn a cheap FA like Walker, and Gotsis a second round pick who played the least (221 snaps). Wade doesn't need a huge capital investment into his D-line depth. IMO Brockers should stay at NT and we will need more than Walker rotating behind Easley and Donald but, I certainly wouldn't prioritize adding D-line depth over improving the offense.

I don't want to ask Wade to do more with less. You don't need to score 30 PPG if you have a top 5 defense. Wade has shown he's capable of making a defense with good talent great and making a defense with great talent elite. It puts less pressure on Goff and McVay if our defense is consistently holding the opposition under 20 points per game.

Lets not act like there isn't a ton of talent already in place on this defense. Yes, they need depth, but they aren't giving Wade less. He has 6 first rounders in his front 7 with the 7th guy being a proven vet he coached. A legit safety in Mo and starting nickel or safety in Joyner. Top it off with the highest paid CB in the league and another CB he hand picked to compete to start. There is nothing lesser about that group and I certainly wouldn't prioritize adding depth to the talent already in place over adding to the offense.

Is Woods, Tavon, and Evan Engram or Zay Jones or Chris Godwin that much better than Britt, Tavon, and Quick or Cooper?(in 2017)

As a collective group I like the upside and versatility more. I am not as a high Zay Jones as others, but Engram Gives you a mismatch against safeties and LBs and Goodwin adds something the Rams dont have with his deep speed, decent size, and ability to consistently make contested catches.

In the most important respects, yes. For one, you don't have to worry about Woods, Tavon, and Reynolds/Cooper dogging it on their routes. Second, I think the route running will be significantly improved. Third, I trust McVay WAY MORE than I trust Boras or Cignetti to maximize the skill-sets of our players, scheme them open, and put them in positions to succeed.

Yes the scheme will be better, in fact McVay does a great job crossing his receivers in their patterns or on their release to allow the WRs to get separation. However, you have to win one on one in this league as well. The Skins offense really felt the loss of Jordan Reed in the redzone. Reed's ability to consistently win one on one vs safeties and LBs was key to skins redzone offense where you can't do as much scheming open in a confined space.

From my vantage point, whether we address WR in the second round or the fifth round, we're not going to have an elite unit unless a couple of our guys step up this year. Is it realistic to count on a rookie to be a superstar for us?

I never said anything about being a superstar, but like I said before you need to start developing talent around Goff. I am not expecting a rookie to be a superstar off the bat, but I am expecting the Rams to start developing some successful weapons around Goff. That starts with acquiring talent who may not be rookie superstars, but at least you start developing legit weapons for your most important asset and as he grows in the league those guys can grow with him. This process takes time and the rams need to start it now
 

jrry32

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Lol, fine Jerry I will post the long response I was trying to avoid.

Good. I'd like to get a better sense of your complaints.

You are right rookies provide no guarantees in 2017, but that goes for either side of the ball. This isn't a quick fix. Get talented guys around Goff early and start develop them and their moldable traits into legitimate weapons. Start building a long term rapport with the Rams most important asset now

TE is a tough transition. If you put a former WR like Higbee consistently inline against powerful NFL DEs you are setting that guy up for failure. On the flip side, as a TE coach McVay coached one of the better rookie TE seasons out of a big time talent in Jordan Reed who had 500 yards in 3 TDs playing in only 9 games. Reed had alot of talent as a rookie and McVay put that talent in a position to succeed by using him as mismatch weapon in the slot and out wide against LBs and Safeties. I believe McVay can do that again by taking advantage of the best talents available in this extremely talented TE class.

These are fair points. My question is...why can't he do this with Tyler Higbee? Higbee won't be a rookie, he is a converted WR, and he's 6'6" 250 with plus athleticism and phenomenal hands. Adding George Kittle allows us to move Higbee around while still having a blocking TE.

Yes, there are no guarantees with the defensive rookies either, but that's fine. Watt doesn't have to make a massive impact as a rookie for the pick to be worthwhile. He's the 3rd OLB. Jourdan Lewis doesn't have to make a massive impact as a rookie (although, it would be nice). I think both players are capable of it, though, because they are intelligent, hard-working, and polished players.

Part of the problem last year running the ball is no one respected our WRs. Tavon, Woods, and a 5th round rookie is a bottom 5 WR group in the league and is scaring anyone, so we will be running into alot of the same issues. I agree Kroemer will improve this group significantly, but it won't suddenly become a game changing group like Cowboys

Nobody respected the Bills' WRs.(especially when Watkins was out) It didn't stop them from leading the NFL in rushing.

Our problems last year running the ball were threefold:
1. We had an OL that couldn't run block (for many reasons);
2. We had an OC who couldn't scheme and didn't call plays with a purpose; and
3. We had a passing game that didn't function.

All of these were interrelated. Personally, I feel that fixing problems #1 and #2 might just make a difference for problem #3 as well.

Plus, Whitworth completely changes our OL. Let's say that Greg is actually a good or even great OG. We go from a weakness at LT and RG to a great LT and a good/great RG. That changes a lot too. We'll see what Greg becomes, but I think very highly of Kromer.

I didn't say we had nothing, but both the TE and WR position need upgrades and Free agency isn't the only place you add talent. The Rams don't need multiple new TEs with Harkey, Higbee, Hemmingway and other developmental guys on the roster. They could however use an upgrade at TE and they can certainly do that when this 2017 draft has the best group of TEs in a while. Why pay a couple million short term for vet when you can have the cheaper higher upside guy potentially giving you more.

Agreed. The Rams could use an upgrade at TE. Like you said, this draft is deep and stacked. Why not use that? I have us drafting George Kittle in the late 4th round. He's a 6'4" 250 pound TE who runs a 4.52 40, can block as well as any TE in this class, and doesn't drop passes.

You highlighted McVay's ability to develop TEs. Why not give him a guy like Kittle to develop? Isn't that taking advantage of McVay's strengths as a coach and the depth of the draft?

Best of all, Kittle can get on the field as a rookie and allow us move Higbee around to take advantage of his receiving ability.

That's my rationale for drafting Kittle. Why give up a second or third round pick when I can use what basically amounts to a fifth round pick on a guy who is just as athletic and a better blocker? Kittle needs more development as a pass catcher, but that is something I'm assuming will be one of our staff's fortes.

As for not adding another veteran WR the Rams are spending the 5th most money in the league at WR next year. With so many other needs, limited cap space, and a ton of money already committed to the position it makes more sense to supplement that position through the draft where you get more upside and more value.

Which we did. We spent a fifth on an undervalued WR who put up 1000+ yards, 17+ yards per catch, and 12 TDs in the SEC this year.

We also spent a seventh on an athletic project from Grambling. It seems to me that your issue is more with when I added the players rather than the players I added. It doesn't make sense to me.

Josh Reynolds is one of the most pro ready WRs in this draft.

Yes we will not have an elite unit next year, but it doesn't mean we shouldn't start developing top notch talent around Goff. If a rookie with potential can come in year one a put up rookie year Allen Robinson numbers or something like that as he builds towards the future with Goff I will take it. Michael Thomas and Sterling Shepard were big contributors after getting drafted in the second round in a weaker WR draft. Obviously Thomas is the higher end of the spectrum, and we are less likely to find a guy like that. However, the chances of finding a guy like that are significantly higher in the 2nd compared to the 5th. Even if you don't get a guy that good I would be happy with sterling shepherd like rookie production with that guy showing potential for more. IMO I would rather start developing a higher round guy with more talent instead of just adding yet another middle round guy.

But the round doesn't guarantee anything. Brian Quick was a second round pick. I don't want a second round pick. I don't want a fifth round pick. I want certain players.

Josh Reynolds is one of the handful of WRs on my list of guys that I think are worth pounding the table for the Rams to draft. I'd rather have Josh Reynolds in any round over ArDarius Stewart in any round. Yet, Reynolds is a projected fifth round pick. Stewart is a projected second to third round pick.

Wade does play alot of base, but he also does not rotate his lineman nearly as much as guys like Greg Williams. The three main backup Bronco d linemen Gotsis, Kilgo, and Winn combined for 645 snaps, while each starting D lineman played at leas that combined amount. RE Crick played 939 snaps, NT Williams played 644 snaps, and LE Wolfe played 663 snaps while missing 2 games. In contrast Donald played 830 and with Brockers banged up Easley was second with 470.

It is also worth noting the capital invested in of those backups Kilgo a 6th rounder, Winn a cheap FA like Walker, and Gotsis a second round pick who played the least (221 snaps). Wade doesn't need a huge capital investment into his D-line depth. IMO Brockers should stay at NT and we will need more than Walker rotating behind Easley and Donald but, I certainly wouldn't prioritize adding D-line depth over improving the offense.

I disagree. Brockers should play LDE. I don't trust Easley as a starter. I'd rather Easley be a rotational DL.

And it has nothing to do with prioritizing anything. I'm drafting value where I see it. I'm trying to get as many guys that I value highly as possible.

I don't care if I draft a DL in the 4th round or the 6th round. I don't care if I draft a WR in the 2nd round or the 5th round. I am trying to draft players that will be successful. I am not prioritizing certain positions in certain rounds. I am taking need into account, but I'm not going to prioritize need over value. Especially when we have needs at both positions.

Lets not act like there isn't a ton of talent already in place on this defense. Yes, they need depth, but they aren't giving Wade less. He has 6 first rounders in his front 7 with the 7th guy being a proven vet he coached. A legit safety in Mo and starting nickel or safety in Joyner. Top it off with the highest paid CB in the league and another CB he hand picked to compete to start. There is nothing lesser about that group and I certainly wouldn't prioritize adding depth to the talent already in place over adding to the offense.

I'm not prioritizing anything. I'm drafting the best values with our needs in mind.

Our defense has talent, but it also has holes. I'm not going to pass on building a monstrous defense based on where the value lies in the draft because we have more needs on offense. I'm not going to force need picks over value.

As a collective group I like the upside and versatility more. I am not as a high Zay Jones as others, but Engram Gives you a mismatch against safeties and LBs and Goodwin adds something the Rams dont have with his deep speed, decent size, and ability to consistently make contested catches.

Engram is coming from a spread offense with a limited route tree and will play a different position in the pros. I like Engram, but there's no guarantees that he'll give us a ton of production as a rookie. He may, or he may not. You have the same issue with Godwin. His route running needs development, and he'll be facing tougher competition. He may need time to transition to the pros.

Either ways, I like both players, but I rank T.J. Watt over both. I'm not forcing a need pick. Especially when I can grab Josh Reynolds and George Kittle later on.

Why? Josh Reynolds adds the exact same skill-set that Godwin does. He has the speed to separate vertically, he showed the ability to make contested catches in college, and he offers size.

Kittle doesn't offer the same skill-set that Engram does, but his skill-set might actually fit better with what we need if McVay envisions Higbee as the move TE in his offense.

Yes the scheme will be better, in fact McVay does a great job crossing his receivers in their patterns or on their release to allow the WRs to get separation. However, you have to win one on one in this league as well. The Skins offense really felt the loss of Jordan Reed in the redzone. Reed's ability to consistently win one on one vs safeties and LBs was key to skins redzone offense where you can't do as much scheming open in a confined space.

Well, we'll have 6'6" Higbee to help with that. We'll also have 6'3" Josh Reynolds. He did post 30 TDs in 3 years in the SEC.

Plus, we'll have Todd Gurley. That's something the Redskins didn't have.

I never said anything about being a superstar, but like I said before you need to start developing talent around Goff. I am not expecting a rookie to be a superstar off the bat, but I am expecting the Rams to start developing some successful weapons around Goff. That starts with acquiring talent who may not be rookie superstars, but at least you start developing legit weapons for your most important asset and as he grows in the league those guys can grow with him. This process takes time and the rams need to start it now

The Rams need to retool. There are going to be holes on this roster. I focused on value and accepted that I couldn't address every need with a second or third round pick. The board broke in a way that led to defense having the superior value early.

We'll have money and a first round pick next year to further address weapons for Goff. In the mean time, we might find that some of our younger guys step up.
 

OldSchool

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We don't know what we have one way or another, that certainly shouldn't stop us from adding more talent on the offensive side of the ball in addition to them. Just because we add more offensive talent doesn't mean those guys wont play. You are just adding weapons to a team that doesn't have many.
We need to add talent period not just on the offensive side.
 

LACHAMP46

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Too much to argue here we could go on forever. So I will just say this. The last 4 years the Rams have at best finished 28th in offense while finishing dead last offensively the past 2 years. During that time Tavon Austin has been one of the least efficient WRs in NFL history. Woods is a nice piece with upside to produce more than he has in the past, but hasn't eclipsed 700 yards to this point in his career. You can expect improvements from 4th round picks Higbee and Cooper, but not to the point where they are offensive focal points this team is sorely lacking. They hired a young Offensive Head Coach and Offensive Coordinator coming from two teams with some of the best weapons in the league to develop the number one overall pick at QB they spent significant draft capital on to trade up for. With all that said do you really think they will not address the offensive side of the ball and get those guys help until the 4th round?
Get'em! Steal yo girl!!!!
LOLOLOL
I don't understand why you want to address offense early? (This is a loaded defensive draft) Exactly which offensive player would you like? I'm assuming TE or WR?
Say Forrest Lamp or Garrett Bolles fell to 37....what do we do? It all depends if SncVay value either over a guy like TJ Watt.....and I'm cool with either decision....but don't start drafting wr's early....without fixing foundational stuff...I think we still have 6-8 wr's & 3-4 TE's on the roster....Lets see what we got first....

I'm drafting value where I see it. I'm trying to get as many guys that I value highly as possible.

I don't care if I draft a DL in the 4th round or the 6th round. I don't care if I draft a WR in the 2nd round or the 5th round. I am trying to draft players that will be successful. I am not prioritizing certain positions in certain rounds. I am taking need into account, but I'm not going to prioritize need over value. Especially when we have needs at both positions.
I just wanted to highlight this comment. Never know when Kev or Snead are reading stuff like this......excellent point young man.
 

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Brilliant Draft. (y)

However I was under the impression that we traded our 7th round selection to Miami so we would not get that 2nd CB. I believe we need TWO outside NOT Nickle-Backs. So this would be my first suggested amendment to this latest draft jrry32. Adding to capable starting outside CB's is key to permitting EJ Gaines to permanently vacate one starting outside post & moved EJ into competition for the Nickle & free safety positions. Same can be said for Joyner too. Rams look to have two other Nickle-back types in Blake Countess & Mike Jordan. So outside corners that can press is priority.

I have no issues with the first 3 selections going defense looks sound to me. The NT pick is also very important to Wade' D. I am not high on any of the top centers & Chase Roullier is rated very low at this time as a 6th or 7th rd value but like you I really like his upside! My dream draft would to land Lamp with our top 2017 selection to be our starting center! I see no need for a ISLB'er when we do have Forrest & Hager ready to be the primary two back ups inside.

In conclusion I would use that 4th TE selection & the 6th ILB'er selection to seek outside corners myself. Your a future NFL team draft administrator for sure!
 

OldSchool

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Brilliant Draft. (y)

However I was under the impression that we traded our 7th round selection to Miami so we would not get that 2nd CB. I believe we need TWO outside NOT Nickle-Backs. So this would be my first suggested amendment to this latest draft jrry32. Adding to capable starting outside CB's is key to permitting EJ Gaines to permanently vacate one starting outside post & moved EJ into competition for the Nickle & free safety positions. Same can be said for Joyner too. Rams look to have two other Nickle-back types in Blake Countess & Mike Jordan. So outside corners that can press is priority.

I have no issues with the first 3 selections going defense looks sound to me. The NT pick is also very important to Wade' D. I am not high on any of the top centers & Chase Roullier is rated very low at this time as a 6th or 7th rd value but like you I really like his upside! My dream draft would to land Lamp with our top 2017 selection to be our starting center! I see no need for a ISLB'er when we do have Forrest & Hager ready to be the primary two back ups inside.

In conclusion I would use that 4th TE selection & the 6th ILB'er selection to seek outside corners myself. Your a future NFL team draft administrator for sure!
We get Baltimore's 7th this year from the Chris Givens trade.
 

StealYoGurley

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You highlighted McVay's ability to develop TEs. Why not give him a guy like Kittle to develop? Isn't that taking advantage of McVay's strengths as a coach and the depth of the draft?

Wade is also adept at developing Corners, DL, EDGE players. There is a ton of depth at those positions as well especially corner arguably the deepest position in the draft. Why not give him later or mid round talent to develop. Why focus on giving the more talented players to the side of the ball that is clearly superior talent wise. There is value in adding a starting TE, WR, or OL especially if that player is as good as Evan Engram, Zay Jones, Mack Hollins, Chris Godwin, Gerald Everett, Carlos Henderson, Juju etc. Spending the first 3 picks on defense the year after drafting a QB number 1 overall is unheard even from teams with alot more offensive talent than the Rams.

Our defense has talent, but it also has holes. I'm not going to pass on building a monstrous defense based on where the value lies in the draft because we have more needs on offense. I'm not going to force need picks over value.

I am not advocating for forcing need picks TJ Watt is not so much better(if he is at all) than Chris Godwin, Zay Jones, or Evan Engram that a 3rd OLB is a better value for this particular team than a starting WR or TE . Especially when the rams are coming off back to back seasons ranked dead last in offense. Snead has stated the theme of the whole offseason is scoring more points. IMO it makes no sense to build such a great coaching staff and invest so much in a number one overall pick QB and not surround them with the best talent possible. LaFleur's Falcons last offseason had Julio Jones the best WR in the league and they didn't think that was enough. They added Sanu, Gabriel, Aldrick Robinson, in FA and drafted Austin Hooper all in one offseason. The Rams who are far less talented on the offensive side of the ball shouldn't be content with adding Whitworth, Woods, and a couple mid round picks.

I don't have a problem with Kittle or Reynolds, they are good players. Why give McVay good when you can give him potentially great. McVay and LaFleur are coming from teams with Great o-lines and the best set of weapons in the league. Both teams built those groups by consistently adding talented players early in the draft and spending in FA. They were working with some of the best players at their position Higbee, Kittles, Reynolds, and the weapons on the Rams roster do not project as the best at their position or even close. IMO their offensive players in this draft that can fall closer to that category.

We need to add talent period not just on the offensive side.

Yes, but the offensive side of the ball is clearly in need of more help. I am not advocating for ignoring the defense. I am saying the defensive players picked aren't so much better (if at all) than the offensive talent available that a 3rd CB or OLB presents a better value than a starting WR or TE. One of my main points is you cant expect a head coach and OC coming from the best sets of weapons in the league to be good rolling with adding 4th and 5th rounds picks in addition to Robert Woods, Whitworth, and the 32nd ranked offense minus their two biggest offensive weapons being and being ok with that. I can't imagine the rams any shape or form not taking an offensive player before the 4th round. Snead stated it all offseason the priority is scoring more points.

I don't understand why you want to address offense early? (This is a loaded defensive draft) Exactly which offensive player would you like? I'm assuming TE or WR?

Is this missing blue font haha? The Rams finished 32nd in offense 2 years in a row in their highest offensive finish the last 4 years is 28th. They have a number one overall pick who struggled last year behind a bad line with a bottom 5 WR group. I don't want to repeat those mistakes again. As rams fans we waited 9 years after Torry Holt before we had another 1,000 yard receiver and that guy is gone. I have no interest in waiting any longer to add offensive talent to this team. Thats why I want to address offense especially since there is quality offensive talent available. I am not advocating reaching because there are offensive players who are just as good if not better than the defensive talent available and the Rams and their 32nd ranked offense need to take advantage of that.

To answer your other question in round 2&3 I really like Goodwin, Engram, Mack Hollins, Everett, and Carlos Henderson. To a lesser extent I also like Zay Jones, Chad Hansen, Juju, Amara Darboh, and Josh Malone. Bottom line there is alot of quality offensive talent out there.
 

OldSchool

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Yes, but the offensive side of the ball is clearly in need of more help. I am not advocating for ignoring the defense. I am saying the defensive players picked aren't so much better (if at all) than the offensive talent available that a 3rd CB or OLB presents a better value than a starting WR or TE. One of my main points is you cant expect a head coach and OC coming from the best sets of weapons in the league to be good rolling with adding 4th and 5th rounds picks in addition to Robert Woods, Whitworth, and the 32nd ranked offense minus their two biggest offensive weapons being and being ok with that. I can't imagine the rams any shape or form not taking an offensive player before the 4th round. Snead stated it all offseason the priority is scoring more points.

You're missing the point. You build the best team, you don't ignore a good defender for a less talented offensive player because your offense is worse.

But the main point that I posted earlier is the best friend for a young QB developing is a running game and a good defense that isn't going to make it so he has to pass the ball 50 times a game. The offense took a gigantic leap forward with the change from McVay to Fisher alone. We've upgraded the line with Whitworth and moving GRob inside along with upgrading the center position.

You brag about the weapons he had in Washington. Garcon a 6th round WR, Reed a 3rd round TE, a 3rd round and a UDFA RB along with another 1st and 4th round WR. All led by a 4th round QB. Who's to say our 3rd, 4th and 6th round drafted offensive talent can't be developed by the same guy that was the Redskins OC?
 

LACHAMP46

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Is this missing blue font haha? The Rams finished 32nd in offense 2 years in a row in their highest offensive finish the last 4 years is 28th. They have a number one overall pick who struggled last year behind a bad line
I agree to an extent. Fix the line first...Lets see if the QB & WR's we already have, can play.

To answer your other question in round 2&3 I really like Goodwin, Engram, Mack Hollins, Everett, and Carlos Henderson. To a lesser extent I also like Zay Jones, Chad Hansen, Juju, Amara Darboh, and Josh Malone. Bottom line there is alot of quality offensive talent out there.
I think Mac Hollins, who I also like, and Josh Malone who I'm starting to like as well, could be had on day 3. Goodwin, Henderson & Everett (the TE, correct) are not players we need to target in the 2nd round in a pretty deep draft....
 

StealYoGurley

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You're missing the point. You build the best team, you don't ignore a good defender for a less talented offensive player because your offense is worse.

I fully understand the point, but I think you are missing my point. I am saying there are offensive players are just as good as Watt and Lewis if not better. I am not saying pass on the more talented player on defense just because we need offense. If the prospects available are just as good or close I am taking the offensive player. Especially if that player is a starting OL, WR, or TE as opposed to 3rd OLB or CB.

But the main point that I posted earlier is the best friend for a young QB developing is a running game and a good defense that isn't going to make it so he has to pass the ball 50 times a game. The offense took a gigantic leap forward with the change from McVay to Fisher alone. We've upgraded the line with Whitworth and moving GRob inside along with upgrading the center position.

I am not saying having a good defense and a running game doesn't help. The running game will be important, but this isn't the Jeff Fisher ball control Rams. I expect Kroemer to improve our run game and O line in general, but it doesn't mean we shouldn't add top notch weapons. If Fisher was coaching this team great draft, but he isn't McVay is here to present a huge upgrade and leaving him with the tools fisher picked isn't the way to do that. You can't tell me a rookie play calling head coach is going to come in ignore offense with the limited premium picks he has in his first draft when the talent is equal or close to it on the offensive side of the ball. He is going to make an impact on this offense and mold it in his image not primarily rely on Fisher's guys. There is no way you can justify spending three picks on the defensive side of the ball when especially when you use 2 on front 7 seven that is already at least top 10 in the league as it is currently constructed.

The rams have pieces on defense to be a very good defense right now. Even before the draft talent wise this front 7 is arguably top 5 in the league. Why you would add to that twice before you even touch your bottom 5 WR group when the prospects are equal or close. I am also not saying the defense is a finished product because the defense could certainly use more, but not at the expense of missing out talent that is just as good as those defenders on the offensive side of the ball.

The broncos can add Roby as the third CB behind Talib and Harris and Ray as third OLB behind Ware and Miller when they have legit weapons on the other side of the ball in Demaryius Thomas, Emmanuel Sanders, Julius Thomas, Wes Welker was still around when Roby was picked, Peyton's play hadn't fallen off a cliff yet, Clady was still a franchise LT at that point. They had a ton of talent on the offensive side of the ball before they added talented 3rd CBs and OLBs.

You brag about the weapons he had in Washington. Garcon a 6th round WR, Reed a 3rd round TE, a 3rd round and a UDFA RB along with another 1st and 4th round WR. All led by a 4th round QB. Who's to say our 3rd, 4th and 6th round drafted offensive talent can't be developed by the same guy that was the Redskins OC?

I am not bragging about anything it is fact both the Falcons and Skins had great weapons the Rams currently constructed is a bottom 5 unit in the league. Tavon has been one of the least efficient WRs since targets became a stat. I like Woods I think he will eclipse his career best totals, but even if he does that that is not enough, just like Britt eclipsing 1,000 yards with everyone else floundering around him wasn't enough. I also like Higbee and I think he can be an asset and big part of the game plan even if he is just the number 2 TE, but his presence and whopping 85 a yards isn't stopping me from adding top TE talent if I have the opportunity.

The Garcon Washington got was not a 6th rounder they signed him when he already established himself as a legit WR in the NFL. They also signed DeSean after he proved himself as a legit starting WR1 in the league. Their 4th round WR Crowder was the third 3 guy behind 2 bonafide NFL WRs. Yes Reed is a 3rd rounder and I am advocating for selecting a TE at least then especially in this TE class. In Reed's TE class there were 6 guys drafted in the first 3 rounds and 4 are legit studs in Eifert, Ertz, Reed, and Kelce. Conversely there were 10 drafted in rounds 4-7 and not a single one is anything more than a JAG. I'd rather pick from the studs in round 2-3, especially in this draft.

When Cousins became a full time starter and started playing really good ball in 2015 he had elite talent around him. He is not putting up those numbers with Tavon, Robert Woods, a 5th rounder and Higbee. Cousins career took off with legit talent around him and if we want Goff's career to take off we need to put better piece around him

I'm just saying these coaches know the importance of having legit talent around their developing QBs. There is difference between getting the WR or TE the team has ranked in the top 10 or top 5 in rounds 2 and 3 compared to guys the team has ranked much lower in rounds 4 and 5.

I agree to an extent. Fix the line first...Lets see if the QB & WR's we already have, can play.

How many years have Rams fan been saying things like that. "Lets see if Chris Givens can be more than a deep threat?" "Austin Pettis has flashed maybe he can finally step up. he made that big catch that one time." "Greg Salas showed some talent how about that guy?" "Man if Only Danario could stay healthy?" "We might have something in Laurent Robinson." Aren't you tired of hoping and waiting for middle round guys to develop into more? Why do you still want to wait and see? Lets get some legit talent in here finally, preferably not the Quick project type or Tavon shortest WR in round 1 ever type..

I think Mac Hollins, who I also like, and Josh Malone who I'm starting to like as well, could be had on day 3. Goodwin, Henderson & Everett (the TE, correct) are not players we need to target in the 2nd round in a pretty deep draft....

I disagree the Rams have been adding JAGs for years with terrible results. They need the best offensive talent available. Not just to add offense for the sake of adding offense, but because they are just as good if not better than the defensive talent available.
 
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Rams43

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Outstanding mock, jrry32. Simply outstanding.

In fact, if Reynolds falls as you predict, I'd call it a HR draft. All the bases covered with good value top to bottom.

I think it's the best I've seen, actually.

We all know that with the depth in this draft that the Rams could go in about a million different directions. But if they finished with this collection, I would be downright aroused, if you catch my meaning. Lol.

BTW, I am particularly impressed by the way you outline your reasoning with each pick. A pleasure to read, sir1
 

OldSchool

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When Cousins became a full time starter and started playing really good ball in 2015 he had elite talent around him. He is not putting up those numbers with Tavon, Robert Woods, a 5th rounder and Higbee. Cousins career took off with legit talent around him and if we want Goff's career to take off we need to put better piece around him

I'm just saying these coaches know the importance of having legit talent around their developing QBs. There is difference between getting the WR or TE the team has ranked in the top 10 or top 5 in rounds 2 and 3 compared to guys the team has ranked much lower in rounds 4 and 5.

Agree to disagree, I say the QB and the offense made Reed and Crowder who were 3rd and 4th round picks better. I say Goff and McVay with the improved OLine will make Higbee, Cooper, Austin and Woods even better. It speaks volumes that McVay came in and hasn't cleaned out getting rid of all these bad WR's and TE that you think we have. He clearly gives the impression that he likes these guys. We'll see when the actual draft comes around what happens. But it's comments like yours that always crack me up. You're implying that later round picks can't be contributors yet you cite another teams great weapons and all but one of them are 3rd round or later picks. Agree to disagree on a pointless discussion I guess. We are just speculating here and it's nothing really worth arguing over.