Goff or Wentz?

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gogoat1

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Troy
Case Closed !
Tired of this argument, Goff is the better QB. McVay is the better coach and Arron Donald is better than ALL of them !
 

Ewe83

Mama's got a new baby boy
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As a Goff girl who had to put up with so many nay sayers and Wentz fanboys on my old forum this pleases me greatly

nintchdbpict0002529843711.jpg
 

LARams_1963

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greg
MIC Drop................





i
Los Angeles Passing
C/ATTYDSAVGTDINTSACKSQBRRTG
Jared Goff20/272679.9301-995.9142.1
TEAM20/272589.9301-9--142.1
i
Philadelphia Passing
C/ATTYDSAVGTDINTSACKSQBRRTG
Carson Wentz26/432425.6020-037.956.5
TEAM26/432425.6020-0--56.5
 

matt30

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Matt
I think Wentz is playing hurt or in fear of getting hurt. I think he's physically talented but, like I said before, I'm not a fan of that style of QB play.

I always knew that Goff's kind of game was more sustainable and capable of winning Superbowls.
 

TheTackle

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I wanted Goff and have always believed in him. Any QB can have a slump but let’s face Wentz would have been MVP the year the eagles went to the SB. Goff or Wentz? Goff, but that’s not to deride the latter
 

Ewe83

Mama's got a new baby boy
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That's assuming quite a lot, Nick led the Eagles through the playoffs and to a SB win, we can't know if Wentz would have done so, so no I don't have to face some imaginary la la land where he's SB MVP lol
 

TheTackle

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That's assuming quite a lot, Nick led the Eagles through the playoffs and to a SB win, we can't know if Wentz would have done so, so no I don't have to face some imaginary la la land where he's SB MVP lol

Superbowl MVP? Agreed that is a reach. League MVP no reach at all - he was a shoe in until the injury. Goff > Wentz since they were drafted, but it’s not by a landslide. Right now, Goff is playing great (and is completely underrated as always). Win a SB and that changes
 

So Ram

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Yep. I remember 2017 Wince was ballin' out thinking he was a RB half the time. It was working great until his injury. He's had to adjust and is more average.

Mark Barron & Ebukham

First off I’ll say Foles & Keenan should have taken The Rams further than they did.Fisher was F’D UP. When Fisher got fired both Foles who won the SuperBowl & Case Keenan made it to the NFC championship.So to say they could not take a team to that level or were not quality QB’s to me is an understatement at the time.Made huge bets The Rams would be at least 8-8 each season.

I’ll say Goff is a Ram & a Lifer under Sean Mcvay. They are sort of connected at the hip.

Snisher was looking into the future of Field of Dreams. The time is now,actually a season late in time.The Rams though have been to the SuperBowl .The trade is what it always was supposed to be except for Fisher being Crappy HC
 

FarNorth

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I think Wentz is playing hurt or in fear of getting hurt. I think he's physically talented but, like I said before, I'm not a fan of that style of QB play.

I always knew that Goff's kind of game was more sustainable and capable of winning Superbowls.

Everybody loves cowboy gunslinger stuff, and not just in football, but quiet serious dedicated professionalism is a better bet for getting the job done.
 

oldnotdead

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Carson's mechanics have gone to shit. He's regressed and when a veteran QB does that it's all mental. A really good example of that was Drew Brees in San Diego. He was playing like a deer in the headlights. And finally Drew was benched and they started Doug Flutie who changed Drew's career forever by personally taking him aside and talking to him. Flutie was honest and sympathetic and told him to clear his head of all the nonsense and to go outside the organization for help. He recommended a budding academy in Carlsbad. This was in 2004.

Flutie had watched on the sidelines as Brian Schottenheimer who was QB coach filled his head with nonsense and basically over-coached him. Schottenheimer was trying to totally change Drew's mechanics and how he read his progressions. What it did was make Drew try to think his way through each play instead of simply playing in his style that brought him success in college. Drew took the advice and began to blossom into the HOF QB he is today.

It was Brian Schottenheimer who pushed his father to play Drew against the orders of AJ Smith in a meaningless last game of the season in 2005 as Smith was working on extending Brees and he didn't want to risk injury. The rest is as they say is "history". Why do I bring up Brian Schottenheimer? Because as I watched Jimmy G play the last two years I see the same regression in his style of play. When he first came to SF he played as he was coached to in NE. He was steady, decisive, and accurate. Fast forward to the first game this year against AZ and he is a completely different player. He's indecisive and holds the ball too long as he tries to read the play the way Schottenheimer wants him to, and his mechanics have regressed since coming to SF and as a result, his accuracy has gone to shit.

Proof? Look at the film of his play that first season and look at his play in AZ a couple of weeks ago. When Jimmy G first got to SF he was on his way to being an elite QB. Now he's suffering from the same issues that Wentz is. Poor mechanics, poor reads, holding the ball too long, etc. IMO there is something going on behind the scenes in the Buff's organization, particularly in the coaching he's getting. That is normally the reason for this type of regression.

IMO that mental makeup and the type of coaching Goff is receiving in LA vs Wentz's mentality and coaching is the crucial difference. Wentz's game has always been making two reads and if it's not there to roll out and look for dropped coverages caused by the rollout or he simply ran. They apparently are trying to make him into a conventional pocket passer which he really isn't. Goff has always been a pocket passer and his rollouts are schemed as part of the play.

If they want to save him they need to sit him and allow him to clear his head. They need to carry him contractually for 2 more years and even then the dead cap will be over $12M for two years if they release him after the 2022 season. They may not need to sit him for a full season. A few games to clear his head, and most of all to simply change the scheme back allowing him to play as he always has when he was successful. If they do the Birds may revive this year and going into the future so this story may not be over.

The bottom line is that the fit between the HC and his offense is crucial to the success of the QB. Going back to Drew Brees as an example, Drew ran from SD, and the Schottenheimer's approach of trying to pigeon hole him into fitting Marty's scheme. What made Drew drop his moving to Miami was Payton telling Drew he would build an entire offense and scheme around him. On the flip side Marty Schottenheimer loved Philip Rivers because he knew from coaching him at the Senior Bowl he was a perfect fit for his offensive scheme.

I think Philly wanted to reduce Carson's injury exposure by converting him into a pocket passer. His injury history is testimony for the risk all teams take with the dual-threat QB. A pocket passer with good to elite accuracy is a far better prospect in that they have a much longer career trajectory. It's why the Rams made the right choice in Goff. They chose accuracy over mobility and it was the right choice.
 

Mackeyser

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Umm... Brian Schottenheimer is with Seattle...

SF doesn’t have an OC, just a run coordinator and a pass coordinator.
 

Allen2McVay

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Jim
Why do I bring up Brian Schottenheimer? Because as I watched Jimmy G play the last two years I see the same regression in his style of play. When he first came to SF he played as he was coached to in NE. He was steady, decisive, and accurate. Fast forward to the first game this year against AZ and he is a completely different player. He's indecisive and holds the ball too long as he tries to read the play the way Schottenheimer wants him to, and his mechanics have regressed since coming to SF and as a result, his accuracy has gone to shit.

Wow. If this is correct, my admiration for Pete Carroll and the Seattle Organization has increased from they are really good to absolutely brilliant.

I mean, if the Seahawks’ Offensive Coordinator (Brian Schottenheimer) has that much impact on the 49ers’ quarterback, then the Rams don’t have a chance.

What if Ken Norton Jr. screws up Aaron Donald!
 

oldnotdead

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I lived in San Diego during those years. I had access to the organization via my business and saw a lot of what was going on in those years. Things like Marty intentionally forcing GM Smith to fire him. The stuff about Flutie I got from not only other players on the team but in 2005 Doug did an interview that was published in SD about Brees' struggles. Brees himself did an interview in 2005 regarding his struggles and he talked about how the academy changed how he played and trained and only tweaked his mechanics. This stuff really happened.

Go ahead and look at Jimmy G and his play his first year. Break down his play and especially his mechanics. Now look at his play in AZ and you will see a completely different player. His mechanics are different causing issues with his accuracy. What would cause a regression in his mechanics? Normally it's coaching that causes it. Either a scheme change or over coaching the player. Remember Jimmy G is a veteran not a rookie. So why the change?

Think what you will but I know what I know about SD back then and what I see in Garapolo.