Covid 19 thread

[Loyal]

Here's some Cowboy content...

View: https://i.imgur.com/IC2dHSK.jpg

 

[RamsCardsJazz]

Here in AZ our numbers have only gone up and continue to go up every day, very few people here are taking it seriously at all, even now with people in my own community dying. There's been no slow here so I don't feel like we're almost done, and I know it's that way in other states too

This is absolutely true. I visited AZ from 6/4-6/9 and it was like being in a normal world again. Pretty much no one wears a mask. Sky Harbor Airport in Phoenix is supposed to require masks, but I'd say half or a little less than half actually wore one there. Coming from IL, as state that has had pretty strict lockdowns, it was very odd.

 

[Mackeyser]

How long have these “current events” been going on? At some point does anyone make any sense of why there hasn’t been a dramatic spike? Must be those cloth masks ehh? Or the obvious social distancing

And you Science guys, I’d ask you take a step back, set politics or ideology aside, Science has literally screwed the pooch on this from day one.

I suppose my point is maybe, just maybe we might be heading down the backstretch here and the worst is behind us, and has been.

My bet is I’m pretty confident there will be a full season

Actually, it was politics that screwed the pooch on this one.

South Korea used the least dogmatic, fact based scientific approach and they've led the world in how they are handling this.

I don't get this antipathy for science. I don't know of a single Christian scientist on here... the science we use to use the internet, computers, cell phones, modern automobiles and so much more IS THE SAME SCIENCE being used to prevent these things, but folks are acting like "no, no, no, no, no... the science I use to post my unscientific opinions on science is a totally different science than the science of other things I don't understand and therefore oppose"

What?

Also, the current spikes in AZ and TX, the two states that reopened and removed restrictions first show that the measures, even imperfectly implemented, were working. COVID units that were about to be dismantled are now full and other units are being constructed.

There is an answer based on data. Not only are we not in the back stretch, we're about to enter the far more lethal stage which will be more lethal in large part because we screwed the pooch on mandatory testing, isolation and subsistence for citizens and now we can't go back to mass isolation.

This whole thing can be summed up like this:

"COVID is a hoax/conspiracy/doesn't exist and we shouldn't just do nothing, but mass gather in protest"

"COVID exists, but it's basically the flu and we'll continue to mass gather to so that Big Science can't make me do anything"

"COVID may be serious, but it's my right to specifically NOT do the few things that would end this quickly"

"COVID is serious and has damaged our economy. We MUST get back to work!"

"COVID is very serious, but this thing was too screwed up from the beginning, so we're just gonna have to soldier through"

WTF???

Forget the administration, if every person had just followed the guidelines as they were established, we'd be close to done with this thing.

But thanks to folks and their freedumbs, it's become a giant clusterfuck. (yeah, as someone with a compromised immune system, I'm a little salty that I'm supposed to die because some fucking Karen is slightly inconvenienced by wearing a mask and bullshit on "it's too hard to breathe". I'm a severe asthmatic and I can do it for hours on end when I visit the VA or have to go grocery shopping)

I don't mean to keep going off, but this shit really gets to me. The amount of entitlement and selfishness is overwhelming.

We used to be Americans who stood up for one another. We rallied about being American, for better or worse (and we had plenty of both) Now, it seems the answer is "that asshole can die, but no one's gonna tell ME what to do"

How do we solve ANY problems with that?

 

[Mackeyser]

But people still went to Walmart and caught it anyway. So shutting down everything else had little to no effect. Look at the rates of states in the US that didn't shut everything down, vs states that had draconian measures, and there is little difference. In fact, NY had the most extreme measures to "combat" the virus, and they had the most deaths.

Population density and lack of PPE for everyone meant that infection was rampant.

You're misinterpreting the data as well as how this virus spreads. Wearing a mask near someone with COVID only mitigates you getting it by 30%. However, if the spreader is wearing a mask, the mitigation is closer to 70% and if both are wearing masks, the spread is around 99%.

Also, just wearing a mask isn't enough. How many still touched their faces? How many didn't wear gloves?

NY didn't really engage in draconian measures, just more than other places where they had virtually none.

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

Population density and lack of PPE

(PPE sure as hell ain’t a bandana or blue disposable mask)

Wearing a mask near someone with COVID only mitigates you getting it by 30%. However, if the spreader is wearing a mask, the mitigation is closer to 70% and if both are wearing masks, the spread is around 99%.

(Wow, so I guess that ER Doctor interviewed from NYs hardest hit Hospital stating one thing they’ve learned is 9 out of 10 contracting the disease get it from hands to mouth was full of it, hey but wtf would he know)

Also, just wearing a mask isn't enough.

(Can you whip up some numbers on just how many folks catch this disease outdoors)

Good Lord Mack, last time you were this worked up we passed on Wentz! (Okay that was a joke, lol)

Still love you tho, you’re one of our best

Doing this as an old fart off an iPad so I’m sure I some screwed this up

 

[Mackeyser]

No worries.

The ER Dr is right. MOST transmissions are hand to face.

The point is that the masks are to protect OTHERS from US. Wearing the mask isn't very good at giving US protection.

So, if someone with COVID breathes on us, the mask isn't gonna help a ton and will not help at all if we touch our faces and then touch our mouths.

The biggest part of me is upset because my safety is reliant on people who care more for their dogma than my life. That's a tad off-putting.

The smaller part is me upset because I want my f'n football already and the longer people fart around with their opinion, the longer we go without football.

And I'm not about either of those things...

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

Final thought, even though I have serious doubts on makeshift masks, even though I live in a County that has lifted the mandatory use, I still wear them while shopping for whatever just as a courtesy to ease those who’ve been gripped with fear.

To not do so would be non courteous thru my POV, I think most people get the point wearing a mask lessons (tho exactly how much is debate) still lessons you affecting those around you

out

edit: just saw the above, Cheers!

 

[Mojo Ram]

The biggest part of me is upset because my safety is reliant on people who care more for their dogma than my life. That's a tad off-putting.

But is it really? Everybody's life is different but in today's world, one doesn't have to leave the house in order to get anything and everything the want or even need. 30 years ago that wasn't the case, obviously. Quarantining oneself has never been as easy as it is right now. Stay home. Protect yourself.

Then there is the workplace which unfortunately puts one under the umbrella of relying on safety protocols that you can't control. I can only speak for my situation which is not ideal. I work in a large building with 100 coworkers and the public.

Those who work from home are in full control. Office/cubicle environments allow for low exposure and some control.

It all comes down to choice(when on your own time) and forced interactions and what one can control when on the clock earning a living. If you fear for your own personal safety, stay home. Don't go to restaurants, don't go to Walmart, stay away from people.

Yeah, i take more issue with the guy who's masked up sitting at home shaming the 20 somethings who are at the bar unmasked and partying. It's irresponsible behavior to be sure, but ultimately it's about adults making decisions.

I have little faith in society as it is Mack, and i realize that we are living among a large amount of stupid people in this country...but in terms of protecting ones self in this pandemic i really wish adults would stop blaming other adults. Control what you can control which, it seems to me is about 90% of your environment every day.

 

[12intheBox]

But is it really? Everybody's life is different but in today's world, one doesn't have to leave the house in order to get anything and everything the want or even need. 30 years ago that wasn't the case, obviously. Quarantining oneself has never been as easy as it is right now. Stay home. Protect yourself.

Then there is the workplace which unfortunately puts one under the umbrella of relying on safety protocols that you can't control. I can only speak for my situation which is not ideal. I work in a large building with 100 coworkers and the public.

Those who work from home are in full control. Office/cubicle environments allow for low exposure and some control.

It all comes down to choice(when on your own time) and forced interactions and what one can control when on the clock earning a living. If you fear for your own personal safety, stay home. Don't go to restaurants, don't go to Walmart, stay away from people.

Yeah, i take more issue with the guy who's masked up sitting at home shaming the 20 somethings who are at the bar unmasked and partying. It's irresponsible behavior to be sure, but ultimately it's about adults making decisions.

I have little faith in society as it is Mack, and i realize that we are living among a large amount of stupid people in this country...but in terms of protecting ones self in this pandemic i really wish adults would stop blaming other adults. Control what you can control which, it seems to me is about 90% of your environment every day.

and then there are also the people who need to work. people who can’t just stay home.

honestly, the mask is uncomfortable - it sucks. But has your fellow man really asked anything of you in your lifetime? unless you are old enough for the draft, this is the first time your country has needed you to sacrifice a little for the good of us all.

wear a mask - stay home when you can. When you need to go out, be safe. That’s the ask. And I’m seeing way too many people who just aren’t willing to sacrifice even that much. It’s depressing.

 

[Pancake]

As far as masks working for your personal protection. It depends on the mask. If your using the one grandma made from old curtains then probably won't work well for personal protection. But something that actually makes an airtight seal with the proper filter materials does protect.

 

[12intheBox]

As far as masks working for your personal protection. It depends on the mask. If your using the one grandma made from old curtains then probably won't work well for personal protection. But something that actually makes an airtight seal with the proper filter materials does protect.

some masks protect the wearer. like an n-95. For the most part, they are meant to protect others. You are much less likely to spread it if you wear one.

 

[Mackeyser]

But is it really? Everybody's life is different but in today's world, one doesn't have to leave the house in order to get anything and everything the want or even need. 30 years ago that wasn't the case, obviously. Quarantining oneself has never been as easy as it is right now. Stay home. Protect yourself.

Then there is the workplace which unfortunately puts one under the umbrella of relying on safety protocols that you can't control. I can only speak for my situation which is not ideal. I work in a large building with 100 coworkers and the public.

Those who work from home are in full control. Office/cubicle environments allow for low exposure and some control.

It all comes down to choice(when on your own time) and forced interactions and what one can control when on the clock earning a living. If you fear for your own personal safety, stay home. Don't go to restaurants, don't go to Walmart, stay away from people.

Yeah, i take more issue with the guy who's masked up sitting at home shaming the 20 somethings who are at the bar unmasked and partying. It's irresponsible behavior to be sure, but ultimately it's about adults making decisions.

I have little faith in society as it is Mack, and i realize that we are living among a large amount of stupid people in this country...but in terms of protecting ones self in this pandemic i really wish adults would stop blaming other adults. Control what you can control which, it seems to me is about 90% of your environment every day.

I already do that, Mojo.

However, I'm in a multigenerational household with 3 adult kids living at home. One is moving out right now, but I'll still have my wife who's looking for work and likely to find some shortly, my oldest son who works in a grocery store, his fiancée who works in a daycare center, her daughter who's about to enter Kindergarten and my youngest who works in a department store.

That's a whole lot of bringing home other people's germs, ESPECIALLY because in Florida, they're gonna open up schools on time and without restrictions. Remember being a parent of someone in elementary school? I had several serious health run ins and a VERY nearly fatal pneumonia from germs kids brought home from school. There are few worse places for germ aggregation and dissemination than an elementary school.

Young adults seem very susceptible to carrying the disease, but remain asymptomatic and recover easily. For this YOLO crowd, it seems like a non-starter. Very little price for ignorance.

Problem is that they are the vector for everything.

Thus, even if I lived alone and had everything delivered, I could still get it, but with virtually all of the family HAVING to go out for work, I'm reliant on the protocols we've put in place to protect..well, mostly me and the new baby when they come sometime around Christmas.

I'm reminded of a story I learned in church:

Two people were given a moment to explore the after life. One was sent to Hell, the other, Heaven.

The man who got back from Hell said, "it was horrible. We were chained to tables with the most delicious foods, but couldn't reach them. We were given forks and spoons, but the handles were too long to serve ourselves and we were just tortured because we couldn't feed ourselves."

The man who got back from Heaven said, "it was wonderful. We were attached to tables with the most delicious foods. We were given forks and spoons with handles long enough so that we could feed one another and everyone had everything they wanted and it was awesome."

What made it Heaven or Hell wasn't the location or the circumstances, but how we treated one another in those circumstances.

This virus could have been nearly over by now if we'd just loved and cared for one another enough to do a few basic things, washing our hands often and not touching our faces was to protect ourselves and wearing masks to protect others.

The masks are to protect others. The masks are to protect others. That point keeps getting missed so I'm repeating it like those 800 numbers in late night infomercials so that maybe it'll stick for the few who keep arguing against their efficacy in personal protection. They aren't for YOUR personal protection. The masks are to protect others.

This all went south because a whole lot of people chose to be selfish and inhumane rather than selfless and humane.

Having nearly died twice, once to a super bad bout of pneumonia, I've had to "make my peace" before and that's unnerving enough. The idea of going out like COVID people do... alone...sedated...on a machine...while I slowly suffocate to death over a period of weeks...

Well, I'd like to not go out like that.

Unfortunately, it's not really up to me. It's gonna be up to other Floridians who've pretty much decided to just say F it and move on even as we have the most new cases in the world right now.

That's unsettling. I'm in what I hope is the middle of a storybook romance with my wife of 30 years and we only just now have grandchildren. My kids are starting their own lives and the Rams are good and fun to watch.

I just wanna see it through is all. Seems like an easy ask, but maybe it's not? I dunno.

 

[Mackeyser]

some masks protect the wearer. like an n-95. For the most part, they are meant to protect others. You are much less likely to spread it if you wear one.

Also, the N-95 mask only works with a tight seal (which is why those Sikh doctors chose to shave their beards). That's why there's a whole host of photos of folks with PPE "scars" from wearing facial masks with tight seals and face shields.

 

[Mojo Ram]

I jumped in to talk about the POV of those who feel others are putting them at risk. I'm not talking about the POV of the greater good, and the world getting rid of a virus if everyone would just do A, B & C and stop being selfish.

I honestly don't want this to come across as harsh or cold, but if an adult is being put at risk(from Covid) because of the lifestyle and forced exposures of family or people you live with...that has nothing to do with the decisions of the general public outside of your home. That is why adults shaming what other adults are doing in the general population(not wearing masks) rubs me the wrong way.

My ex wife who has my kids 80% of the time is a respiratory therapist in a Banner hospital. I work in a grocery store. We have had those discussions about exposure to our kids(17 & 20 yrs old).

My point is that we have both accepted the fact that our children are being put at a higher risk than other kids of parents who aren't essential workers. If my ex wife was going out to bars and partying unmasked and then coming home to our kids then yeah, i will shame her harshly, but we are in control of our situation. Her and i have owned that and the kids are old enough to own it too, and my kids aren't shaming society for being too close or unmasked around mom & dad when we leave the house.

If i or my kids contract Covid it's not my fault, my ex wifes fault or the fault of the unmasked customer at the grocery store who gets in my face looking for organic fucking ginger root.
Control your situation. You do you and the ones close to you to the best of your ability.

 

[12intheBox]

I jumped in to talk about the POV of those who feel others are putting them at risk. I'm not talking about the POV of the greater good, and the world getting rid of a virus if everyone would just do A, B & C and stop being selfish.

I honestly don't want this to come across as harsh or cold, but if an adult is being put at risk(from Covid) because of the lifestyle and forced exposures of family or people you live with...that has nothing to do with the decisions of the general public outside of your home. That is why adults shaming what other adults are doing in the general population(not wearing masks) rubs me the wrong way.

My ex wife who has my kids 80% of the time is a respiratory therapist in a Banner hospital. I work in a grocery store. We have had those discussions about exposure to our kids(17 & 20 yrs old).

My point is that we have both accepted the fact that our children are being put at a higher risk than other kids of parents who aren't essential workers. If my ex wife was going out to bars and partying unmasked and then coming home to our kids then yeah, i will shame her harshly, but we are in control of our situation. Her and i have owned that and the kids are old enough to own it too, and my kids aren't shaming society for being too close or unmasked around mom & dad when we leave the house.

If i or my kids contract Covid it's not my fault, my ex wifes fault or the fault of the unmasked customer at the grocery store who gets in my face looking for organic fucking ginger root.
Control your situation. You do you and the ones close to you to the best of your ability.

But isn’t it true that if the guy in your face looking for ginger root is the one who gave it to you, and he wasn’t wearing a mask, that you might not have gotten it if he were isn’t that the whole point?

it’s contagious. The masks make it less likely to spread.

we are in this together - that’s just the way it is. We need to depend on one another to beat this. there is no way around it for most people as most of us can’t just hermit up and control our own situations.

 

[Mojo Ram]

But isn’t it true that if the guy in your face looking for ginger root is the one who gave it to you, and he wasn’t wearing a mask, that you might not have gotten it if he were isn’t that the whole point?

Possibly but i can't get pissed at him. I have to work so he can shop. It's my job. He chose to leave the house and shop instead of using any one of a dozen shop from home apps. He took a risk himself by going grocery shopping with 200 other people.

there is no way around it for most people as most of us can’t just hermit up and control our own situations.

Well this i disagree with. I would say that a vast majority of people don't need to be around groups of 10 or more people if they really don't want to.

 

[12intheBox]

Possibly but i can't get pissed at him. I have to work so he can shop. It's my job. He chose to leave the house and shop instead of using any one of a dozen shop from home apps. He took a risk himself by going grocery shopping with 200 other people.
Well this i disagree with. I would say that a vast majority of people don't need to be around groups of 10 or more people if they really don't want to.

socially, sure. But work?

I do pretty well - but I still need to work. And for me, work means court and work means jail. Not much choice there.

Police, firefighters, doctors, nurses, bank tellers, waiters, cooks, bellboys, retail, sales, flight attendants, construction, electricians, plumbers, mechanics, factory workers, farm hands, clerks, judges, delivery drivers - many jobs involve interactions with people.

If those people would only wear masks, we would all be a ton safer. Lives would be saved. Lots of them.

the 10 or more thing is a guideline to promote social distancing. You can get Covid from just one other person.