Billy Devaney discusses what went wrong with Rams

[Anonymous]

4 or 5 wins by another coach in a situation that doesn't really compare may offer you some proof of something, but it's still a losing season, and justifiably so. And injuries like that, coupled with a lockout and a change in systems, is an anomaly. That's why I really don't pay attention to comparisons in that regard.
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Did someone actually say that a 2-3 win difference in wins by Fisher in 2004 means something?

Ay yi yi.

Let's try logic, reason, and evidence, shall we.

Fisher's 2004 team followed a playoff year by a stocked, built, established team with depth.

The 2011 Rams were a radical rebuild in their 3rd year.

Fisher's 2004 team did not lost HALF the players to injury the 2011 Rams did. The Rams lost 11 CBs and had the single most injured offense in the least entire decade.

There. Is. No. Comparison.
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[RamFan503]

In contrast, I will discuss any Rams past anyone wants to discuss, any time.

Cause I don't think it has anything to do with moving on or not.

Brooks, Vermeil, Martz, Linehan, Spags, Ortmeyer, Shaw, Armey, Zygmunt, Softli, Devaney, Banks, Green, Warner, Bulger, earlier Bradford seasons.

Emotions can run strong. Granted. And some people are never going to listen, ever.

But I like discussing history. Now and then interested third parties get a lot out of the discussion. And besides, why should either Homer and/or Basher extremists have the field to themselves. :mrgreen:

Sounds fair enough but I get Paul's point too - I think. It seems when we talk about the past, we inevitably start talking in circles and pointing fingers. It just gets a little old and stale. Studying and understanding history is great and even necessary if used right. Unfortunately, in sports, historical comparisons are virtually useless. It gets boring and old and one can almost never come up with anything definitive even though some people seem to view their version of history as the only reality.

That being said, Spag/BD get somewhat of a pass in my book. Fisher comes in with a much better situation to start. He also has essentially an all-star cast of coaches and the solid backing of the owner who sought him out and hired him.

This is not an attempt to make excuses for Spags or belittle anything Fisher does. On the contrary. I am looking forward to the future as I think Fisher has an almost unprecedented - as far as the Rams go - environment in which to succeed. He has the experience. He has the staff as long as he can keep them. He had some real key players in place. I think he/Snead drafted well. I think he/Snead brought in a better group of FAs as well. We ALL hope the injuries are kept at bay.

I don't mind the history discussions. I figure I can look the other way whenever I choose. As long as we stay away from PD type "discussions", I'm good.

 

[DR RAM]

In contrast, I will discuss any Rams past anyone wants to discuss, any time.

Cause I don't think it has anything to do with moving on or not.

Brooks, Vermeil, Martz, Linehan, Spags, Ortmeyer, Shaw, Armey, Zygmunt, Softli, Devaney, Banks, Green, Warner, Bulger, earlier Bradford seasons.

Emotions can run strong. Granted. And some people are never going to listen, ever.

But I like discussing history. Now and then interested third parties get a lot out of the discussion. And besides, why should either Homer and/or Basher extremists have the field to themselves. :mrgreen:

Sounds fair enough but I get Paul's point too - I think. [hil]It seems when we talk about the past, we inevitably start talking in circles and pointing fingers. It just gets a little old and stale. Studying and understanding history is great and even necessary if used right. Unfortunately, in sports, historical comparisons are virtually useless. It gets boring and old and one can almost never come up with anything definitive even though some people seem to view their version of history as the only reality.[/hil]

That being said, Spag/BD get somewhat of a pass in my book. Fisher comes in with a much better situation to start. He also has essentially an all-star cast of coaches and the solid backing of the owner who sought him out and hired him.

This is not an attempt to make excuses for Spags or belittle anything Fisher does. On the contrary. I am looking forward to the future as I think Fisher has an almost unprecedented - as far as the Rams go - environment in which to succeed. He has the experience. He has the staff as long as he can keep them. He had some real key players in place. I think he/Snead drafted well. I think he/Snead brought in a better group of FAs as well. We ALL hope the injuries are kept at bay.

I don't mind the history discussions. I figure I can look the other way whenever I choose. As long as we stay away from PD type "discussions", I'm good.

I was going to respond and say something similar to this, but you beat me to it. I don't think there is any merit comparing past regimes, teams, etc. to current the same. I don't mind talking about the past in a historical sense. I also don't like continually bashing former players, teams, regimes, etc, because I don't see the point in that. Last thing that I dislike, is when people create 1000 different posts on the same subject trying to make their point.

For those that feel they have to continually do this...carry on, I will try to be more sensitive to your needs.

 

[RamFan503]

For those that feel they have to continually do this...carry on, I will try to be more sensitive to your needs.

:lmao:

 

[Thordaddy]

In contrast, I will discuss any Rams past anyone wants to discuss, any time.

Cause I don't think it has anything to do with moving on or not.

Brooks, Vermeil, Martz, Linehan, Spags, Ortmeyer, Shaw, Armey, Zygmunt, Softli, Devaney, Banks, Green, Warner, Bulger, earlier Bradford seasons.

Emotions can run strong. Granted. And some people are never going to listen, ever.

But I like discussing history. Now and then interested third parties get a lot out of the discussion. And besides, why should either Homer and/or Basher extremists have the field to themselves. :mrgreen:

Sounds fair enough but I get Paul's point too - I think. It seems when we talk about the past, we inevitably start talking in circles and pointing fingers. It just gets a little old and stale. Studying and understanding history is great and even necessary if used right. Unfortunately, in sports, historical comparisons are virtually useless. It gets boring and old and one can almost never come up with anything definitive even though some people seem to view their version of history as the only reality.

That being said, Spag/BD get somewhat of a pass in my book. Fisher comes in with a much better situation to start. He also has essentially an all-star cast of coaches and the solid backing of the owner who sought him out and hired him.

This is not an attempt to make excuses for Spags or belittle anything Fisher does. On the contrary. I am looking forward to the future as I think Fisher has an almost unprecedented - as far as the Rams go - environment in which to succeed. He has the experience. He has the staff as long as he can keep them. He had some real key players in place. I think he/Snead drafted well. I think he/Snead brought in a better group of FAs as well. We ALL hope the injuries are kept at bay.

I don't mind the history discussions. I figure I can look the other way whenever I choose. As long as we stay away from PD type "discussions", I'm good.

Agreed and IMO the biggest change was and will be Kroenke, who I contend is the best owner this franchise has had since Carrol Rosenbloom's unfortunate demise and for me I am Squarely behind his decisions.
IMO a coach is a component and if you have a crappy owner you can expect to get crappy coaching even from good coaches because they never quite get what Fisher will.

Like I said the future is bright ,scuse me IMA go brush both my teeth and tune my banjo.

 

[RamFan503]

In contrast, I will discuss any Rams past anyone wants to discuss, any time.

Cause I don't think it has anything to do with moving on or not.

Brooks, Vermeil, Martz, Linehan, Spags, Ortmeyer, Shaw, Armey, Zygmunt, Softli, Devaney, Banks, Green, Warner, Bulger, earlier Bradford seasons.

Emotions can run strong. Granted. And some people are never going to listen, ever.

But I like discussing history. Now and then interested third parties get a lot out of the discussion. And besides, why should either Homer and/or Basher extremists have the field to themselves. :mrgreen:

Sounds fair enough but I get Paul's point too - I think. It seems when we talk about the past, we inevitably start talking in circles and pointing fingers. It just gets a little old and stale. Studying and understanding history is great and even necessary if used right. Unfortunately, in sports, historical comparisons are virtually useless. It gets boring and old and one can almost never come up with anything definitive even though some people seem to view their version of history as the only reality.

That being said, Spag/BD get somewhat of a pass in my book. Fisher comes in with a much better situation to start. He also has essentially an all-star cast of coaches and the solid backing of the owner who sought him out and hired him.

This is not an attempt to make excuses for Spags or belittle anything Fisher does. On the contrary. I am looking forward to the future as I think Fisher has an almost unprecedented - as far as the Rams go - environment in which to succeed. He has the experience. He has the staff as long as he can keep them. He had some real key players in place. I think he/Snead drafted well. I think he/Snead brought in a better group of FAs as well. We ALL hope the injuries are kept at bay.

I don't mind the history discussions. I figure I can look the other way whenever I choose. As long as we stay away from PD type "discussions", I'm good.

Agreed and IMO the biggest change was and will be Kroenke, who I contend is the best owner this franchise has had since Carrol Rosenbloom's unfortunate demise and for me I am Squarely behind his decisions.
IMO a coach is a component and if you have a crappy owner you can expect to get crappy coaching even from good coaches because they never quite get what Fisher will.

Like I said the future is bright ,scuse me IMA go brush both my teeth and tune my banjo.

There with yuh man. Cheers. Now get to pluckin'

 

[Anonymous]

In contrast, I will discuss any Rams past anyone wants to discuss, any time.

Cause I don't think it has anything to do with moving on or not.

Brooks, Vermeil, Martz, Linehan, Spags, Ortmeyer, Shaw, Armey, Zygmunt, Softli, Devaney, Banks, Green, Warner, Bulger, earlier Bradford seasons.

Emotions can run strong. Granted. And some people are never going to listen, ever.

But I like discussing history. Now and then interested third parties get a lot out of the discussion. And besides, why should either Homer and/or Basher extremists have the field to themselves. :mrgreen:

Sounds fair enough but I get Paul's point too - I think. It seems when we talk about the past, we inevitably start talking in circles and pointing fingers. .

Not me. I look at the evidence and pound away at the key points. If blame is deserved I offer it (Ortmeyer, Zygmunt). If not I try to make a case for what the facts look like to me as I know them. If the issue is solely a value judgement and/or opinion (eg. how much is coaching a part of 2011) I offer an opinion but point out that that's all we will ever do is offer clashing opinions. To me discussing all of this is no different from discussing a game, a player, or a draft etc.

 

[Anonymous]

That being said, Spag/BD get somewhat of a pass in my book. Fisher comes in with a much better situation to start. He also has essentially an all-star cast of coaches and the solid backing of the owner who sought him out and hired him.

This is not an attempt to make excuses for Spags or belittle anything Fisher does. On the contrary. I am looking forward to the future as I think Fisher has an almost unprecedented - as far as the Rams go - environment in which to succeed. He has the experience. He has the staff as long as he can keep them. He had some real key players in place. I think he/Snead drafted well. We ALL hope the injuries are kept at bay.

I don't mind the history discussions.

Me neither. I don't mind them at all, they're interesting. And I think people misconstrue the entire thing if they see any of this as somehow detracting from Fisher. That's just silly IMO.