Better Rams #1 overall pick: Bradford or Goff

[RamDino]

I think Gurley was a better back than Dickerson. ED might have been a slightly better runner... slightly..., but Gurley was a better receiver and blocker (and leader!).

 

[So Ram]

Even when he went to Minnesota, he wasn't particularly good. He pulled an Alex Smith and put up numbers that look good on the surface in 2016, but their offense went nowhere because he checked it down nonstop. 2017 Case Keenum in that offense was very arguably better than 2016 Bradford. Sam was definitely a victim of his circumstances, but he wouldn't have been a superstar in better circumstances. IMO, in a good spot, he would have been similar to Alex Smith later in his career. Cautious game manager who doesn't lose you games but won't win you games either. I'd take Goff over Sam without thinking twice. Goff is prone to turnovers, but he has the balls to go win you games.

And I say this as a person who loved Bradford as a prospect and have to admit I was very wrong in hindsight.

Bradford still is the HIGHEST paid rookie EVER in The NFL.Bradford had some Bad luck.
I’ll just say if Goff was put in Bradford’s situation it would have been interesting.We already saw what Jared Goff looked like under Jeff Fisher his rookie season.

 

[NJRamsFan]

I’d honestly be interested in hearing a case made for Bradford being better because I just don’t see it.

 

[NJRamsFan]

Bradford still is the HIGHEST paid rookie EVER in The NFL.Bradford had some Bad luck.
I’ll just say if Goff was put in Bradford’s situation it would have been interesting.We already saw what Jared Goff looked like under Jeff Fisher his rookie season.

You do realize the highest paid rookie thing is due to NFL rule changes and not an accolade of Bradfords right?

 

[Soul Surfer]

Gurley vs Jackson who was better?

When both were in their prime I'd go with Gurley.

He had home run speed Jackson only dreamed about.

 

[NJRamsFan]

When both were in their prime I'd go with Gurley.

He had home run speed Jackson only dreamed about.

Speed so fast you might miss his whole prime (blue font)

 

[Loyal]

I’d honestly be interested in hearing a case made for Bradford being better because I just don’t see it.

The only case that can be made is that it can't be known. Goff wasn't under the pressure that Bradford was, imo. Goff had a better Oline, weapons and a vastly superior OC/HC. He was 0-7 under Fisher. Sam had freakin' Spags and Fish for HC's. He had Shurmer, McDaniels and Schotty for his OC's, 3 offensive systems in three years and all of them sucked. To me, it can't be known. I probably pick Goff, but it's not a slam dunk.

 

[NJRamsFan]

The only case that can be made is that it can't be known. Goff wasn't under the pressure that Bradford was, imo. Goff had a better Oline, weapons and a vastly superior OC/HC. He was 0-7 under Fisher. Sam had freakin' Spags and Fish for HC's. He had Shurmer, McDaniels and Schotty for his OC's, 3 offensive systems in three years and all of them sucked. To me, it can't be known. I probably pick Goff, but it's not a slam dunk.

Yeah but that’s really just making excuses for Bradford (albeit valid ones) and saying what coulda shoulda woulda happened. In reality Goff was just flat out better. There’s an alternate timeline out there where Ryan Leaf dominated the NFL. But when asking who was better you have to examine what happened not what you think maybe coulda happened or who had it worse

 

[Loyal]

Yeah but that’s really just making excuses for Bradford (albeit valid ones) and saying what coulda shoulda woulda happened. In reality Goff was just flat out better. There’s an alternate timeline out there where Ryan Leaf dominated the NFL. But when asking who was better you have to examine what happened not what you think maybe coulda happened or who had it worse

But context matters. The Goff we saw with less protection this last year is why we got rid of him. No protection, ever, was Bradfords reality for his whole term with the Rams. As important as the QB is, it's still a team sport. I like Goff's toughness more than Bradford's, but again, put Goff in Bradford's situation and I don't think we see much difference.

 

[FrantikRam]

Not. Even. Close.

Dickerson by a country mile. Dude ran for 2105 on stacked boxes... it's not even close.

Now... Dickerson or Faulk? That's a conversation because they're such different backs that it's hard to compare... like comparing Jim Brown (best power back of all time, all due respect to the 1a: Earl Campbell) versus Barry Sanders (best shifty back of all time)

On pure aesthetics, it's Dickerson, hands down. He ran upright and guys on D would think they were lining him up for an epic smash and... he'd just glide right by. He was deceptively fast. Only guy I recall catching him from behind was Darrell Green.

Oh I agree.

Gurley was the best offensive player in 2018, on a Super Bowl team. Something that ED never was (on a Super Bowl team).

I agree that Goff was better than Bradford, but the Super Bowl doesn't have much to do with that equation. For the same reason that Gurley isn't put on Dickersons level despite his OPOY award and Super Bowl appearance.

 

[PhillyRam]

But context matters. The Goff we saw with less protection this last year is why we got rid of him. No protection, ever, was Bradfords reality for his whole term with the Rams. As important as the QB is, it's still a team sport. I like Goff's toughness more than Bradford's, but again, put Goff in Bradford's situation and I don't think we see much difference.

Bradford was made of glass. Nuff said.

 

[Memento]

When both were in their prime I'd go with Gurley.

He had home run speed Jackson only dreamed about.

You must be misremembering Jackson in his prime. Jackson broke quite a few long touchdowns where nobody caught him, he had the softest hands out of any Rams back not named Faulk (and at 6'2", 242 lbs.), and he was a vicious blocker. And unlike Gurley, Jackson was consistent enough to gain 1,000 rushing yards every year for eight consecutive seasons and did it all with no help aside from an aging Torry Holt.

 

[FrantikRam]

Easily Jackson, even if you took out Gurley's injury history.

I see a lot of people saying that but I don't see it.

Even with Gurleys limited prime, I think his two best seasons are enough to put him over Jackson.

 

[Memento]

I see a lot of people saying that but I don't see it.

Even with Gurleys limited prime, I think his two best seasons are enough to put him over Jackson.

Gurley had better offensive lines and players around him than Jackson, and I'd put up Jackson's 2006 season against anything Gurley did. And the consistency can't be ignored.

 

[So Ram]

You do realize the highest paid rookie thing is due to NFL rule changes and not an accolade of Bradfords right?

Okay Sherlock!! Good investigating.

I did see Bradford’s rookie season at the Stick live.The next STRIKE season was F”D up!! You go back & lock at not having an OFF Season with a New OC vs. Having Sean Mcvay & a full off season.

Ask me who is better. Jackie Slater or Andrew Whitworth?? I think if you go rewatch the movie blindside it might give you another clue about people & how they look upon the world. Figure out where your heart is.
I look back at Roger Saffolds career & The beef they had at the end of 2016.It wasn’t pretty. Whitworth has brought something pretty special to this Rams Franchise.
Spags talked a good game about Pillars.Andrew Whitworth us all of that. A pure mentor of Men as well as Sean Mcvay.They deal with issues & teammates while allowing the Diva & personalities to come out.

Suh vs Jason Pierre Paul
Spags won one with him & lost one with Paul(JPP)
Tom Brady won one with him & lost one against JPP.

It’s all Crack up on how you want to look at things.As In Hardknocks Sean Mcvay says let’s call a Spade a Spade.

 

[NJRamsFan]

But context matters. The Goff we saw with less protection this last year is why we got rid of him. No protection, ever, was Bradfords reality for his whole term with the Rams. As important as the QB is, it's still a team sport. I like Goff's toughness more than Bradford's, but again, put Goff in Bradford's situation and I don't think we see much difference.

That type of context only matters if you’re asking who COULD have been better, not who actually was. Sure looking at it your way could be a fun conversation but there’s no way for us to actually know we can only examine the body of work that each player put together and Goff’s was superior and it’s not close.

Playing out a hypothetical what if Bradford was on the McVay era rams and still suffered his signature seemingly endless season ending injury? You can’t blame it all on his o-line because while the rams o-lines he played behind were bad, he suffered season ending injuries at Oklahoma behind some of the best college o-lines ever (if I remember correctly.) at the end of the day nothing really matters if you can’t stay healthy.

Again I’m not trying to downplay the advantages Goff had bc of team or the disadvantages Bradford had due to team but again...Goff’s success as played out on the field was superior to Bradfords and that’s where this debate has to end.

 

[NJRamsFan]

Okay Sherlock!! Good investigating.

I did see Bradford’s rookie season at the Stick live.The next STRIKE season was F”D up!! You go back & lock at not having an OFF Season with a New OC vs. Having Sean Mcvay & a full off season.

Ask me who is better. Jackie Slater or Andrew Whitworth?? I think if you go rewatch the movie blindside it might give you another clue about people & how they look upon the world. Figure out where your heart is.
I look back at Roger Saffolds career & The beef they had at the end of 2016.It wasn’t pretty. Whitworth has brought something pretty special to this Rams Franchise.
Spags talked a good game about Pillars.Andrew Whitworth us all of that. A pure mentor of Men as well as Sean Mcvay.They deal with issues & teammates while allowing the Diva & personalities to come out.

Suh vs Jason Pierre Paul
Spags won one with him & lost one with Paul(JPP)
Tom Brady won one with him & lost one against JPP.

It’s all Crack up on how you want to look at things.As In Hardknocks Sean Mcvay says let’s call a Spade a Spade.

I’m honestly confused about a lot of the points you’re making as I didn’t address any of that stuff

I was simply responding to the fact that you capitalized the fact that Bradford is still the HIGHEST paid rookie qb EVER as if it was an accomplishment of his. Every year there was a new highest paid rookie qb ever until the NFL introduced the rookie wage scale which is the only reason Bradford remains the highest. It’s not some career milestone. It’s a rule change.

 

[dieterbrock]

I see a lot of people saying that but I don't see it.

Even with Gurleys limited prime, I think his two best seasons are enough to put him over Jackson.

Injuries suck, plain and simple. Only far to compare players at their best. I mean, is anyone going to say Frank Gore was better then Gayle Sayers?
Gurley over Jackson hands down

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Goff but not by much. So much has to do with the situation a player comes into. Shurmur turning Bradford into a check down machine didn't develop him. Goff would have gone the same disastrous route had Fisher remained head coach. I expect Goff to have a Bradford like career from here on out. He will play well enough to stick on some teams, may impress some years, maybe even get traded for a first round pick. But won't be considered a top QB in the league.

 

[dieterbrock]

I’m honestly confused about a lot of the points you’re making as I didn’t address any of that stuff

I was simply responding to the fact that you capitalized the fact that Bradford is still the HIGHEST paid rookie qb EVER as if it was an accomplishment of his. Every year there was a new highest paid rookie qb ever until the NFL introduced the rookie wage scale which is the only reason Bradford remains the highest. It’s not some career milestone. It’s a rule change.

At one point, Goff had signed for the most guaranteed money ever, didnt last long though