Somebody sell me on Goff

[Mackeyser]

Maybe, but maybe he could start, like Mariotta did. Its not about the system, its about what is between the ears. Just IMO. In no way am i discounting Wentz in any of this, just supporting Goff cause I am hella biased lol. These two weks need to go by fast so we can all back the same person. This is gonna be a painful two weeks for sure.

Yeah. I posted about how Wentz/Goff is like Winston/Mariotta. I think Mariotta will be pretty good and same with Goff. I'm pretty biased, too, but I'm sooooo ready for this to be over.

I want it to be Wentz because I'd like our future to start now. Goff won't start for Fisher. I can't see that.

 

[Belchazer]

I grew up a fan of the California Golden Bears. I went to my first game at Memorial Stadium in 1968. Most of my family has graduated from Cal. What I can tell you is that Rams will probably select Goff # 1 overall in the 2016 NFL Draft. They should not, but, they will because by all of the measurable information that organizations collect these days. For them Goff will be the logical choice.

My personal feeling is that Goff is going to have a hard time in the NFL. Since college and professional football has been divided over the last decade or so by the use of the spread option and air raid concepts now popular in the college game it has become more difficult for college signal callers to make the transition from college to professional football. The two most successful of these quarterbacks have been Cam Newton and Colin Kaepernick.

Newton has been able to make the transition in part because the Carolina organization has been smart to allow Newton to use his own personal skill set while he has grown into the position of being an NFL quarterback (ie the the spread option concepts he used in college) while also allowing him to use his physical size and strength as a running threat, especially in the red zone.

Kaepernick was given the same advantage when he came out of college but the more the 49ers tried to force him into being a pro-style quarterback the more problems he had.

The history of Cal football over the last fifty years has been for the most part a history of bad to mediocre football. There has been a few exceptions but bad to mediocre has been the overall trend. However, even when Cal has been bad they have always been able to produce moments. Usually sneaking up on a superior team such as Stanford (Cal's #1 rival), UCLA, or Arizona. These upsets took place in years where Cal's record for the season could be anywhere from 2-9 to 4-7. In 1980 I personally saw the Golden Bears led by "The Great Jay Torchio" (note the sarcasm) beat Stanford and John Elway in the final game of the season. Cal finished the season with a record of 3-8 costing Roger Theder his job as head coach at Cal.

The reason why I mention all of this is because Jared Goff in his Cal career never produced "A Moment". In three seasons at Cal Jared Goff has defeated 3 division 1 football programs. All in his final season. He has beaten San Diego State, Air Force, and Washington State. That's it.

Cal started the 2015 campaign with a 5-0 record beating Grambing State, San Diego State, Texas, Washington, and Washington State. With a 5-0 start ABC decided to make the Cal-Utah game in week six a featured game of the week. Goff threw 5 interceptions and 0 Touchdowns under the bright lights of a national audience.

People are very impressed with Jared Goff's statistics. 43 Touchdown passes and over 4,000 yards passing in his final season at Cal. Before anyone gets excited about this they should know that Colby Cameron had similar statistics at Louisiana Tech during his senior season (Sonny Dykes last year at LA Tech) throwing for 4147 yards 31 TDs and 5 interceptions. Compared to Goff's 43 TD's with 13 interceptions. Cameron barely got a sniff in the NFL.

Is Goff going to be great? I do not know. Is he going to be a bust? I still do not know. What I do know is that he has never had to learn a play book having run the same offense in high school as he did in college.

My overall feeling is that if a great QB comes out of this draft it is going to be someone that we are presently not talking about.

 

[8to12]

Its not like the PAC12 has great defenses... plus Goffs wrs are better than Wentzs wrs. Just saying

Not the proper way to compare. Cal's WR's are average when compared to the defenders they face in the PAC-12. On the other hand Wentz' receivers, and his other teammates, are usually a step above their competition. Goff had an average to below average O-line for 3 seasons, had average receivers, a weak running game and a below average defense. And, he took a pounding but stayed resilient.
Do you know of any tape of Wentz getting pressured, sacked, and knocked around by defenders? ....... because I can't seem to find much.

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

I grew up a fan of the California Golden Bears. In three seasons at Cal Jared Goff has defeated 3 division 1 football programs. All in his final season. He has beaten San Diego State, Air Force, and Washington State. That's it.

Cal started the 2015 campaign with a 5-0 record beating Grambing State, San Diego State, Texas, Washington, and Washington State.[/QUO

---------------------


It's a math thing...btw welcome to the board!

 

[Mackeyser]

Not the proper way to compare. Cal's WR's are average when compared to the defenders they face in the PAC-12. On the other hand Wentz' receivers, and his other teammates, are usually a step above their competition. Goff had an average to below average O-line for 3 seasons, had average receivers, a weak running game and a below average defense. And, he took a pounding but stayed resilient.
Do you know of any tape of Wentz getting pressured, sacked, and knocked around by defenders? ....... because I can't seem to find much.

The Northern Iowa game was one. There's a vid with all of his passes from it, runs almost 15 minutes.

 

[ramsince62]

He has those things that you really can't teach, pocket awareness, and anticipation. Dude is also a baller, who never gives up in a game, seen him get the crap beat out of him, and he just keeps getting up, and throwing impossible throws in tight coverage.

OK, he's a baller, with pocket awareness who apparently gets the crap beat out of him because he can't escape. Case in point for comparison:

Goff, 3 years rushing attempts (170), ..........yards gained (-114)....apparently, Goff can't even fall forward for a yard.

Wentz, 2 years rushing attempts (201), ........yards gained (+936)....

Wentz is 2 inches taller, obviously quicker and heavier. Admittedly Goff has an edge with experience, but Wentz is perceived to have more upside. Personally, I don't agree that either of them is worth the cost. Beyond that, why not take the bigger potential upside? Let him sit a year and see what happens. They have the perfect excuse (again) for mediocre performance, why not take advantage of it? They're going to wear this team out this season anyways, traveling all over the damn place including Europe, shuttling from coast to coast for road games, so what's the rush? I get the horrible feeling again that they're going serve up a rookie and feed him to the wolves behind a questionable OL that still has a lot of coming together to do. :baghead:

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

I get the horrible feeling again that they're going serve up a rookie and feed him to the wolves behind a questionable OL that still has a lot of coming together to do. :baghead:

Or the Rams o line is young and on the rise

 

[ramsince62]

Or the Rams o line is young and on the rise

Of course it's on the rise, it's hard to do other wise at this point. Put a rookie behind a yet established OL and you're looking for trouble or haven't we seen a number of young QB's loose their confidence, knee or both by rolling them out too early?

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

Of course it's on the rise, it's hard to do other wise at this point. Put a rookie behind a yet established OL and you're looking for trouble or haven't we seen a number of young QB's loose their confidence, knee or both by rolling them out too early?

Maybe, but depending on Saffold (yikes, did I really say that) I think this O line is ready to break out right now

 

[LosAngelesRams]

At this point, Matthews is clearly ahead GRob, not sure this is even debatable, you know there is still a chance GRob will never reach his potential

Here's the thing with me;

1) I have seen plenty of Goff, to me I would compare him to another QB I've seen a lot of...Philip Rivers

2) I have never seen Wentz play, sorry, but cherry picked highlight film just doesn't cut it with me, hey if the Rams actually select Wentz, well I'll dams sure wince, then get over it and board the Wentz Wagon

One thing is for sure, the Ram know their man, and got him!!

To take Wentz from my perspective would be pretty damn Ballzy

I really hope Grob learns alot in that training facility he was at recently, the guys a fucking beast physically. If he can get it together mentally he'll go from one of the worst to the best most likely but we just need that to actually manifest.

Wentz is just too much of a risk for me with all the picks we traded, of course, like you I'll support him to the fullest if they draft him. He's just not my choice between the 2. I watch Pac games and Goff has just been amazing.

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

I really hope Grob learns alot in that training facility he was at recently, the guys a freaking beast physically. If he can get it together mentally he'll go from one of the worst to the best most likely but we just need that to actually manifest.

Wentz is just too much of a risk for me with all the picks we traded, of course, like you I'll support him to the fullest if they draft him. He's just not my choice between the 2. I watch Pac games and Goff has just been amazing.

Make no mistake, I'm still pulling for GRob likewise, I think we all can agree he possesses the tools

 

[LosAngelesRams]

http://www.ramsondemand.com/threads/cal-fans-take-on-goff.44095/

this is the pros man....you can't keep getting hit, and keep getting up...

Simple physics....mass X somethin
seriously...you have to see the risks....Bradford wasn't good enough, look at RGIII....Not convinced, check out Marcus Marriota....Hell, Big Ben was hit on his motorcycle, and didn't have a helmet on, I think....Looked like he hit the windshield...and played in 2 weeks....You need a lil size, and luck to stay healthy with these monsters chasing you...
Would this keep me from drafting Goff? No, but if Wentz & Goff are close, I'm taking the bigger player. Simple physics....

Yea, but that applies to any QB in the NFL, even proven ones, see Big Ben. I'm just saying its not logical to use the guys frame/size as a worry when he's already taken the beatings in the Pac and proved to be tough.

Wentz may be bigger but he has durability issues himself.


View: https://youtu.be/Mhx8_V0GK6Y


I believe this was the freshman that got him clean,
http://www.goyotes.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=7152

 

[Mackeyser]

for @LACHAMP46 Force = Mass x Acceleration.

And Goff did get injured at Cal. He separated his throwing shoulder in a Stanford game on a relatively easy hit (he put his arm down to break his fall and came down on the elbow. First thing you learn in BJJ and other martial arts is how to fall. Breakfalls ftw)

We all can debate this ad nauseum for the next two weeks, but I sure hope no one sours on either guy. In the end, we should end up with a quality player who will be our future.

 

[Gandalf]

damn, I love beer......(did I say that out loud?)

But, do you like a full bodied beer (Wentz) or a beer that's a little lighter (Goff)?

 

[Loyal]

But, do you like a full bodied beer (Wentz) or a beer that's a little lighter (Goff)?

I opt for less filling (cuz it tastes great!)...JARED GOFF!

 

[jrry32]

GRob is poised to have a breakout year. Watch. He had such immense physical talent that it was hard to convey just how raw he was. He wasn't just raw steak, he was still on the cow... That said, this year...this year... he's gonna be sizzlin' Watch...

That said, my only point was to point out patterns. I notice them and it's what I was trained to do as an engineer. Those patterns are NOT etched in stone. I gave the example of Aaron Donald as an example of this. Had I ignored him, that omission would/could have been an example of homerism. But the fact is that Fisher as one of the longest tenured Head Coaches in the league has some deeply entrenched personnel acquisition patterns. Are they at all positions? No. For example, he's gone with bigger thumpers at LB and now we have a hybrid LB/S technically at WIL. He's actually been pretty flexible at the linebacker position. Other positions, he tends pretty strongly to look for specific traits, often physical.

Is it GRob/Matthews all over again? Maybe. I don't think that Wentz is raw in the way that GRob was so I don't think that the analogy relates in the same way.

Actually, I think many have gotten most of the pro analogies not quite right, imho.

I see Wentz as a more athletic Big Ben type. Big arm, smart, knows the offense in and out, and will make a team pay for overpursuit of the run game. Hints....hints of Cam.

I see Goff as a taller Drew Brees. Gunslinger. Shifty in the pocket. Great footwork. Smooth release.

Now, for this team, which would be the better QB in their prime? Big Ben or Drew Brees? I'd say Big Ben. I think Fisher would say Big Ben. The stats and many, many ROD members I'm sure would disagree and want the 5k yards year after year and say Brees.

Let's be clear, both have floors and ceilings and both of their floors include abject failure and both of their ceilings include tremendous success and glory for themselves and their teams.

Whichever the Rams get, I hope they end up very close to their ceiling for a very, very long time.

I'd take Brees. I considered him the better QB in his prime than Ben in his prime.

 

[Rambitious1]

Keep in mind happy feet was the way they described Peyton Manning

That being said. When I watch goff I see an extremely intelligent Quarterback with the ability to read and dissect the entire field very quickly, look off defenders and deliver the ball with extraordinary accuracy and touch.

The most exciting thing to me when evaluation goff is the way he senses pressure while keeping his eyes downfield and can maneuver in the pocket as well as anyone I've seen. He gets the ball out extremely quickly and leads receivers before they are even in their break.

 

[Rambitious1]

Wentz has a career-high of 335 passing yards in a game where Goff averaged 330 yards per game in his career. So while playing against so-so competition, a career day for Wentz was an average day for Goff.

While Wentz looks awesome in t-shirts and shorts, Goff has shown he’s more accurate and better under pressure vs greater competition. Pro Football Focus rates Goff No. 6 in accuracy rate under pressure and No. 7 in accuracy percentage on deep passes in this draft class. Meanwhile Wentz is rated No. 29 on deep passes (20+ yards) and No. 27 in accuracy percentage when pressured.

 

[RamzFanz]

...and for the first pick of the 2016 NFL draft, the Los Angeles Rams pick:

Amari Cooper, wide receiver, Alabama!









ROD goes into meltdown Gurley pick style, because Gurley won't get a carry for 10 weeks and Rams don't need a RB.

...and then he's the best damn receiver you've ever seen and Case Keenum (or Mannion, ROD member's choice) becomes a superstar.

The end.

 

[kurtfaulk]

.

I didn't see any meltdown regarding the Gurley pick. Alot of people were happy with the pick.

.