We have 3 players that are a bit problematic, huh?

[LesBaker]

Who do you think tells Demoff to extend or sign FA?

Fisher.

But the money is up to Demoff. Fisher wanted to keep Janoris Jenkins too.

Same exact things were said about Bradford. If Tavon isn't needed by McVay, then that's gonna work itself out. If McVay wants him, something else will get worked out.

Y'all worry too much.

That's very true.

Hmmm after reading my post I see how it can be misconstrued that I think that Demoff did it and Fisher didn't have final say. This is something I totally do not believe, Fisher had total say who to sign/resign.Headaches freak you sometimes! lol

Fisher had final roster say, but if Demoff couldn't get a player signed, or wasn't willing to offer enough to keep a player, then it really didn't matter how much Fisher wanted to keep a player. The cap is the cap and in a lot of ways that dictates the discussion too.

As X pointed out Demoff has kept the cap in good shape, the Rams have been up against it but have never had any real cap issues and have never had to purge the roster like some teams have. I'm sure he has a "value" in his head for each player/position.

 

[FrantikRam]

I don't put Tavon in the problem category - he is what he is on this team: a backup RB/gadget player. This HC didn't get him paid, and it's likely he will be gone after this year or next, and that won't impact our salary cap as we have a ton of space.

I agree on Quinn, although we have 10 different players on defense with a sack, we've pressured the QB well, and we're 2nd in the NFL and only 3 behind the leader with 20 sacks. Quinn is playing a part in that.

Watkins - not a problem. Look, Woods, Kupp, our TEs, Gurley - all have excelled in the passing game. Why? We've played against Josh Norman, Jalen Ramsey and Richard Sherman - with Patrick Peterson, Janoris Jenkins, Peterson and Sherman again still to come. These guys are mostly covering Watkins, and when that happens it allows our offense to go 10 vs. 10 and we have match up advantages all over the field.

Watkins might not be getting targets but he's helping this offense.

 

[LesBaker]

Just a thought about TAustin. And by the way I do understand that people are not happy with his cap hit.

The Rams may not have beaten the Cowboy and the 49ers without his contribution in those two games.

The go ahead TD that Gurley scored was a DIRECT result of Austin going in motion, he froze the two defenders that Gurley ran past to get so wide open. Without that fake jet sweep that play doesn't happen.

Gurley had a huge game versus the 49ers and Austin played a big role in that too. Gurley had holes to run through because Austin was occupying defenders in motion and on fake sweeps.

So a case can be made that the Rams may be 3-3 or 2-4 without Austin.

McVay has been openly stating that Austin's impact is not going unnoticed by the coaches.

 

[LACHAMP46]

The goal with this offense isn't to feed star players. It's to spread it around in an unpredictable manner and get the W.

Preach it Brother... preach it!!

I would think the goal of the offense is to SCORE. We're trending the wrong way in this area. Sammy Watkins can help this. Looks to me that he was missed by the QB on the open throws this last game. He also had a 3rd down drop early in the game....At least we're trying to get him involved early.

Our 3rd down struggles have nothing to do with Sammy Watkins....Our redzone struggles have NOTHING to do with Sammy Watkins.

I'd tell you maybe it's time to feed our star players in the redzone...or on 3rd down...but I'm sure you both know that.

 

[Rams43]

I'd say that this is the pot calling the kettle black, but that would be a disservice to @kurtfaulk because I haven't seen anything in his history that indicates he's biased for or against Austin.

Did we really need another thread attacking Tavon? It's getting to be like Craig Dahl, Donnie Avery, etc. at this point. He's on the team until the end of the year. Let's just have a moratorium until then.(and this is an example of the pot calling the kettle black)

You say that I’m biased against Tavon, jrry32.

I say that I’m being objective about the evidence while others are engaged in groupthink.

Potatoes, potahtohs.

Sometimes I feel like the kid in the Aesop’s Fable that was saying, “The Emperor has no clothes”. Lol.

But we agree on one thing. Tavon is on the team until the end of the year.

 

[Ramlock]

You say that I’m biased against Tavon, jrry32.

I say that I’m being objective about the evidence while others are engaged in groupthink.

Glad I'm in groupthink with Coach McVay!

But we agree on one thing. Tavon is on the team until the end of the year.

Then we get to see a weekly post filled with Tavon love....from Ram43

Hooahh!

 

[-X-]

I say that I’m being objective about the evidence while others are engaged in groupthink.

Ugh.

I hate that phrase. It suggests that there's no critical thought going on except for your own. I'd give people here a little more credit than that. If 3 or more people share the same opinion, that doesn't mean they're all simply agreeing with each other because it's en vogue. They just happen to share the same opinion is all.

 

[Rmfnlt]

Sorry but he is not the same threat that Austin is because Austin can take any possession all the way for a TD. There is a difference between running the play before the ball is snapped and before anyone has it and after the snap and who does have it.

Didn't that Cooper guy run a kickoff back for a TD Sunday? Wasn't that some pretty darned nifty running? Not comparable to what Austin can do/has done?

Fisher didn't do contracts, Demoff did and still does. So you can't blame Fisher or Snead.

And whose influence and direction did Demoff use to resign players? That’s a football decision which falls under Fisher not operational which is Demoffs dept.

To me, if Fisher wanted a player, he got that player.. unless it was absolutely cost prohibitive (Demoff told him flat out "we can't afford him").
So, for 99% of who was on that roster, it was Jeff Fisher's doing. Defense? Good decisions. Offense? Let's just say he was hit-and-miss at best.

Sometimes they pay a bit more than *we'd* like, but that's the cost of doing business if the coach or GM (or both) want to retain or sign a guy and not lose him.

I think this is similar to what I just said...

I would think the goal of the offense is to SCORE. We're trending the wrong way in this area. Sammy Watkins can help this.

Our 3rd down struggles have nothing to do with Sammy Watkins....Our redzone struggles have NOTHING to do with Sammy Watkins.

Listen, you really like Watkins... I get it.

But he hasn't been able to distinguish himself either in 3rd down or red zone situations. You can tell me all the reasons why you think he hasn't (distinguished himself) but the fact of the matter is... for most of the games, his best contribution has been as a decoy (and some have been arguing he hasn't even done that very well). .

With respect, I'll say I'm done trying to explain my position to you on Watkins...

Over a period of time, it's easy to see posters who have forged alliances with certain players... it becomes emotional and, in that regard, starts bordering on the forbidden subjects on the board (politics, religion, etc.).

So, I'll leave at this... let's just see how it plays out... you and me.

You can argue the relative merits of Watkins with other posters.

Peace out.

 

[-X-]

I think this is similar to what I just said...

Sounds cooler when I say it.

 

[Rams43]

Ugh.

I hate that phrase. It suggests that there's no critical thought going on except for your own. I'd give people here a little more credit than that. If 3 or more people share the same opinion, that doesn't mean they're all simply agreeing with each other because it's en vogue. They just happen to share the same opinion is all.

Can we agree that this topic is one that reasonable people can disagree upon?

That perhaps neither side is 100% right or wrong?

Besides, this Tavon issue will self correct after this season, anyway.

 

[Rmfnlt]

Besides, this Tavon issue will self correct after this season, anyway.

Yes, it will.

So, my hope is that we don't see any more of these threads every Monday.

 

[-X-]

Can we agree that this topic is one that reasonable people can disagree upon?

That perhaps neither side is 100% right or wrong?

Besides, this Tavon issue will self correct after this season, anyway.

Of course.

 

[Rmfnlt]

Of course.

You OK?

 

[Ram65]

True story. He spoke about that in detail. They were a triad of sorts. Fisher and Snead would determine who they wanted, and then they'd go to Demoff who would then tell them if said player would fit into their *long term* financial plans. Demoff has this stuff figured out years in advance with all the players. And let's not pretend he just picks a number out of his ass and throws it at the player. That's a negotiation between Demoff and the agent(s) with a cap to the negotiations already predetermined. Sometimes they pay a bit more than *we'd* like, but that's the cost of doing business if the coach or GM (or both) want to retain or sign a guy and not lose him.

After ALL of the constant complaining about what guys cost and how much they "bled" the Rams, has this team ever been in cap trouble with Demoff handling these things? Say what you want about other stuff, but there's never been an issue with him handling that department.

It's not about not being in cap trouble. It's about maximizing your financial resources to acquire the assests/players that help you win. Overpaying a player takes away the ability to get resign or acquire additional talent.

It seems like he did with the Tavon Austin contract. Everyone around the NFL thinks that was a horrible contract because of the pay numbers. I've said before, it was probably a Fisher desperation move that wanted to resign him him early. I still think Demoff has to have the common sense when to say no. He needs to override somethings for the betterment of the team even if they can handle deals financially longer term.

 

[Rmfnlt]

I still think Demoff has to have the common sense when to say no. He needs to override somethings for the betterment of the team even if they can handle deals financially longer term.

Fisher > Demoff

 

[Ram65]

Fisher > Demoff

What does that mean?

 

[LACHAMP46]

Didn't that Cooper guy run a kickoff back for a TD Sunday? Wasn't that some pretty darned nifty running? Not comparable to what Austin can do/has done?

That was a pretty sweet return....excellent blocking....still not a Tavon-esq return...but I'd take it.

Over a period of time, it's easy to see posters who have forged alliances with certain players... it becomes emotional and, in that regard, starts bordering on the forbidden subjects on the board (politics, religion, etc.).

So, I'll leave at this... let's just see how it plays out... you and me.

You can argue the relative merits of Watkins with other posters.

Peace out.

Emotional....naw...not even passionate....just convinced that our problems on offense are not related to trying to get Watkins involved. Not even close...I'll give him that 3rd down drop...hell, the way he's been catching the ball, I'd have went for it on 4th down.

I don't forge alliances....I like the way that sounded tho...I just look at production...past and present. It appears we're not using a prime asset well...or enough. And the offense is suffering for it.
Too much Woods, Higbee, Everett and maybe Kupp.....Need more Watkins...and even Tavon. to go with Gurley.

 

[Soul Surfer]

Did we really need another thread attacking Tavon? It's getting to be like Craig Dahl, Donnie Avery, etc. at this point. He's on the team until the end of the year. Let's just have a moratorium until then.

You're right man!

Craig Dahl sucks!

 

[Rmfnlt]

What does that mean?

It means that Fisher overpowered Demoff to the point that Demoff was likely silenced... even if he (Demoff) thought a deal didn't have the right value quotient.

 

[Ram65]

It means that Fisher overpowered Demoff to the point that Demoff was likely silenced... even if he (Demoff) thought a deal didn't have the right value quotient.

I thought Demoff had the final say money wise. He made a very bad financial deal that looked liked he pulled numbers out of his ass which was my initial reference. That's one of the three reasons we are in this thread. My point is Demoff should not allow anyone Fisher/Snead/McVay to make him grossly overpay a player. He should know the market and in this case he was way off. Did it cost the Rams not resigning Jenkins?