UCF KNIGHTS

[Ramrasta]

Is UCF better than many teams in the Big10, Pac12, Big12 ect ect...?

Of course they are - but if they played in those conferences they wouldn't be going 11-0 or 12-0.

Comparing them to a 7-5 pitt team?

Well yeah they are certainly better than pitt...but that's not the same thing as going 11-0 in the ACC and having a claim to the playoffs. The ACC is crappy this year - this year I think they could have easily gone 10-2 in the ACC (which is damn good)
However that's with the ACC being crap this year and many teams being down.

And played Clemson in the ACC champ - beat clemson? now that's another story



UCF needs to get in the ACC that would solve this problem and "hypothetical" debate.

Is UCF better than many teams in the Big10, Pac12, Big12 ect ect...?

Of course they are - but if they played in those conferences they wouldn't be going 11-0 or 12-0.

Comparing them to a 7-5 pitt team?

Well yeah they are certainly better than pitt...but that's not the same thing as going 11-0 in the ACC and having a claim to the playoffs. The ACC is crappy this year - this year I think they could have easily gone 10-2 in the ACC (which is damn good)
However that's with the ACC being crap this year and many teams being down.

And played Clemson in the ACC champ - beat clemson? now that's another story



UCF needs to get in the ACC that would solve this problem and "hypothetical" debate.

Clemson is the only team in the ACC that I could see beating UCF. I think they would soundly win the PAC-12 and challenge Oklahoma for the Big 12. Really, UCF is on the same tier as every top 5 team outside of Alabama and even they didn’t look invincible with Tua injured.

I’m sure UCF would gladly move to the ACC, Big 12, or Big 10 but they just need the invitation. I’m sure it would be a win-win situation. The conference would gain a powerhouse team with a large, hungry fan base and UCF gains an actual chance to earn a playoff spot.

 

[jrry32]

Thanks UCF, you kept me in the money on my parlay this week.

fwiw- UCF vs F is good for Florida and great for tv but I think UCF deserved a better matchup. I was thinking Ohio State but dont know if thier paths to certain bowl games would allow it. So....off to the Fiesta Bowl to play LSU

LSU is a rough matchup for UCF. The one thing UCF has going for them in that game is Ed Orgeron is a really shitty HC.

Clemson is the only team in the ACC that I could see beating UCF. I think they would soundly win the PAC-12 and challenge Oklahoma for the Big 12. Really, UCF is on the same tier as every top 5 team outside of Alabama and even they didn’t look invincible with Tua injured.

I’m sure UCF would gladly move to the ACC, Big 12, or Big 10 but they just need the invitation. I’m sure it would be a win-win situation. The conference would gain a powerhouse team with a large, hungry fan base and UCF gains an actual chance to earn a playoff spot.

Eh, I think you're overestimating UCF this year. But I guess there's only one way we find out.

 

[Ramrasta]

LSU is a rough matchup for UCF. The one thing UCF has going for them in that game is Ed Orgeron is a really crappy HC.



Eh, I think you're overestimating UCF this year. But I guess there's only one way we find out.

The Fiesta Bowl is a lose-lose for UCF. If UCF wins with their freshman backup QB, the narrative is the same as last year. “The game is a fluke and LSU wasn’t taking it seriously”. If UCF loses, the narrative becomes UCF is trash and was overrated the whole time.

Meanwhile, the CFP sells the lie that Group of 5 teams have a path the the playoff but go out of their way to prevent that scenario. Just look at the final rankings. UCF wins their conference championship and completes another undefeated season but somehow doesn’t jump Michigan who got blown out by Ohio State and didn’t play a game after.

UCF is asked to do the impossible. They are asked to play all their non-conference games on the road against ranked teams and stay undefeated. All the while, the games are scheduled 2-3 years in advance so you have to also predict which teams will be ranked. It’s obvious that the Group of 5 is graded on a different scale.

That’s why UCF will be playing for its 2nd straight National Championship on January 1st and they have their banner hanging proudly. A symbol that a broken system doesn’t decide the winners and losers. The champions are decided on the field, not in a conference room.

 

[jrry32]

UCF is asked to do the impossible. They are asked to play all their non-conference games on the road against ranked teams and stay undefeated. All the while, the games are scheduled 2-3 years in advance so you have to also predict which teams will be ranked. It’s obvious that the Group of 5 is graded on a different scale.

That’s why UCF will be playing for its 2nd straight National Championship on January 1st and they have their banner hanging proudly. A symbol that a broken system doesn’t decide the winners and losers. The champions are decided on the field, not in a conference room.

G5 teams are graded on a different scale because they play in weaker conferences, so yes, you need to play a couple legitimate teams out of conference (at least one needs to be highly ranked). In 2017, you were scheduled to play Maryland, Georgia Tech, Maine, and FIU. Let's not pretend that you got hit by bad luck that none of those schools were good. This year, you scheduled South Carolina State, North Carolina, Florida Atlantic, and Pittsburgh.

Yeah, it falls on UCF. If UCF really wants it, they need to put together an OOC schedule like Penn State/Michigan/Ohio State/Clemson/Wisconsin/Florida/Auburn, South Carolina/Missouri/Pittsburgh/Mississippi State/Miami, Texas Tech/Arizona State/Syracuse/Tennessee, and one weaker program. Basically, you need one premier P5 program and two solid P5 programs. That's just the reality of your situation. Declaring yourself national champions isn't going to change that.

 

[Selassie I]

Scheduling is not just snapping your fingers and ... wah-la... you have whoever you want instantly added to you schedule. Alabama isn't adding UCF to their schedule in place of The Citadel any time soon. Teams establish their schedules YEARS in advance. UCF tries to make their schedule just like all other college teams.

Follow the money if you want to see how colleges end up deciding on their schedules / opponents.

Money is a huge deciding factor in determining who will be selected for the 4 playing in the current playoff setup. HUGE.

Oh... and BAMA has claimed a number of their National Championships the same way UCF did last year. "Claimed" ... NOT earned on the field. They proudly claim those just like UCF does. Other teams have done the exact same thing throughout college football history... and it will continue as long as the highest level of college football continues to be the last D1 sport to allow their Championships to be decided by opinions instead of the play on the field.

 

[jrry32]

Scheduling is not just snapping your fingers and ... wah-la... you have whoever you want instantly added to you schedule. Alabama isn't adding UCF to their schedule in place of The Citadel any time soon. Teams establish their schedules YEARS in advance. UCF tries to make their schedule just like all other college teams.

I am aware that scheduling is done years in advance. However, UCF used to schedule tough opponents. They played South Carolina in their prime with Spurrier. They played Penn State. They played Michigan. They played Ohio State. It's hard for me to believe that it's the other programs who just randomly decided that they won't schedule UCF anymore. In fact, they're playing Stanford next year. That's a game that will mean a lot if they're undefeated again. Problem is that UCF's OOC schedule over the past two years has been quite mediocre. I don't know why.

Follow the money if you want to see how colleges end up deciding on their schedules / opponents.

Money is a huge deciding factor in determining who will be selected for the 4 playing in the current playoff setup. HUGE.

Oh... and BAMA has claimed a number of their National Championships the same way UCF did last year. "Claimed" ... NOT earned on the field. They proudly claim those just like UCF does. Other teams have done the exact same thing throughout college football history... and it will continue as long as the highest level of college football continues to be the last D1 sport to allow their Championships to be decided by opinions instead of the play on the field.

It was a different era back then. It doesn't happen anymore. The last time I recall it was USC in like 2003.

 

[jrry32]

Lol. UCF is demanding home-and-homes. Methinks they've gotten too big for their britches. It's not the big programs who are at fault for UCF's weak schedule.

 

[Selassie I]

Lol. UCF is demanding home-and-homes. Methinks they've gotten too big for their britches. It's not the big programs who are at fault for UCF's weak schedule.

The real humor in this comes from this kind of thinking.

UCF has been a TOP 10 ranked team the last 2 years. College elitists believe that most schools should just stay in their lane... be happy with whatever scraps you're thrown. The Knights aren't going to accept the 1st scrap that falls. They are negotiating with the correct attitude.

Danny White knows exactly what he's doing. Just like he did when he claimed the National Championship last year. UCF paid all of their coaches National Championship bonuses to go with that btw.

There is a plan in place. Some of it involves the recruiting process here in the Great State of Florida. There are storylines being created all the time. The fat dogs get lazy many times... and the foxes outsmart them.

There are 3 "big time" college teams here in FL. Negotiations take time... unless you are a desperado. The gators may not even be the real target.

Let's pump the brakes and just wait and see what actually happens at the end of negotiations.

 

[jrry32]

The real humor in this comes from this kind of thinking.

UCF has been a TOP 10 ranked team the last 2 years. College elitists believe that most schools should just stay in their lane... be happy with whatever scraps you're thrown. The Knights aren't going to accept the 1st scrap that falls. They are negotiating with the correct attitude.

Danny White knows exactly what he's doing. Just like he did when he claimed the National Championship last year. UCF paid all of their coaches National Championship bonuses to go with that btw.

There is a plan in place. Some of it involves the recruiting process here in the Great State of Florida. There are storylines being created all the time. The fat dogs get lazy many times... and the foxes outsmart them.

There are 3 "big time" college teams here in FL. Negotiations take time... unless you are a desperado. The gators may not even be the real target.

Let's pump the brakes and just wait and see what actually happens at the end of negotiations.

The humor in it comes from telling the teams with leverage that you demand equality. The top dogs don't need UCF. If UF handles its business, it's going to the CFP with or without UCF. UCF is one the that needs legitimate programs to compensate for its weak in-conference schedule. It needs those programs for legitimacy in the CFP hunt.

It has nothing to do with "scraps" and everything to do with earning respect. You earn respect by going out there and beating the best wherever and whenever. When you have that respect and legitimacy, then you get to make demands on equal footing. If it's about recruiting, we'll see what happens, but the truth is that you're still not competing with the "fat dogs" for players.

 

[1maGoh]

The humor in it comes from telling the teams with leverage that you demand equality. The top dogs don't need UCF. If UF handles its business, it's going to the CFP with or without UCF. UCF is one the that needs legitimate programs to compensate for its weak in-conference schedule. It needs those programs for legitimacy in the CFP hunt.

It has nothing to do with "scraps" and everything to do with earning respect. You earn respect by going out there and beating the best wherever and whenever. When you have that respect and legitimacy, then you get to make demands on equal footing. If it's about recruiting, we'll see what happens, but the truth is that you're still not competing with the "fat dogs" for players.

But if UCF accepts the 2 and 1 (is that the right term? I only skimmed the article this morning) and beats whatever high quality power 5 team, what's that team's (or any other power 5 team's) incentive to switch to home and home games? I mean, they only come away with a greater likelihood of being beaten at an away game. If UCF loses big, they don't get more games. If UCF loses close, they don't get more games or of far that they may win next time. If UCF wins, they don't get more games in order to protect the bigger school's record. Allowing the non-home and home games only further enforces the idea that UCF can be treated like an inferior that can be left off the schedule of it's inconvenient.

There is something to be said for standing one's ground about similar situations (I know nothing of this particular situation). It is possible to get people to capitulate out of annoyance or embarrassment and force the acceptance of an equal status on the surface. That would give UCF greater legitimacy within the community at large. Non-home and homes probably won't get them that no matter what the outcome is.

 

[jrry32]

But if UCF accepts the 2 and 1 (is that the right term? I only skimmed the article this morning) and beats whatever high quality power 5 team, what's that team's (or any other power 5 team's) incentive to switch to home and home games? I mean, they only come away with a greater likelihood of being beaten at an away game. If UCF loses big, they don't get more games. If UCF loses close, they don't get more games or of far that they may win next time. If UCF wins, they don't get more games in order to protect the bigger school's record. Allowing the non-home and home games only further enforces the idea that UCF can be treated like an inferior that can be left off the schedule of it's inconvenient.

What's the incentive for Clemson to schedule Auburn or Florida to schedule Michigan or Alabama to schedule USC or Ohio State to schedule Oklahoma? We see those games happen as neutral site games and home-and-homes because they bolster a team's resume and are big money-makers. Beating the top dogs won't get UCF dropped from schedules. Neither will competing with them. However, if they get blown out, you're right that they won't get home-and-homes. They didn't earn it.

The other big thing that can comes out of UCF playing those games, in addition to building their resume for the CFP, they build their resume for a bid to get into a P5 conference like the Big 12.

There is something to be said for standing one's ground about similar situations (I know nothing of this particular situation). It is possible to get people to capitulate out of annoyance or embarrassment and force the acceptance of an equal status on the surface. That would give UCF greater legitimacy within the community at large. Non-home and homes probably won't get them that no matter what the outcome is.

Yeah, the top programs aren't going to be goaded into giving UCF a better arrangement out of annoyance or embarrassment. UF plays Miami and FSU next year out of conference. They also play a SEC schedule. They don't need UCF to prove their legitimacy. If UCF doesn't want to schedule UF on their terms, UF will simply go find somebody who will.

If UCF wants that legitimacy, they need to start scheduling and winning those games. That'll mean taking those games on the other team's terms. UCF won't be considered "less than" if they schedule away games with strong programs and win them. That's how they'll get the legitimacy and respect they want. They have a strong opportunity next year with Stanford.

Let's use an analogy here. I don't know if you followed boxing. But imagine if a young boxer with a good track record started demanding that the champion fight him and give him a 50/50 split of the profits. The champion might be willing to fight him, but why would the champion accept those terms? UCF still needs to earn the status it desires. It can earn that status, but it won't do so by refusing to play unless other programs give it terms it hasn't earned at this point.

 

[1maGoh]

If UCF wants that legitimacy, they need to start scheduling and winning those games. That'll mean taking those games on the other team's terms. UCF won't be considered "less than" if they schedule away games with strong programs and win them. That's how they'll get the legitimacy and respect they want. They have a strong opportunity next year with Stanford.

If I was the head coach of UF and UCF scheduled on my terms and kicked my butt, I'd spin that into irrelevance and never schedule them again. I'd take 100% of that responsibility on myself and say something to the effect of, "this was a classic trap game and it's my fault. I failed to prepare my team to beat an opponent that we are clearly better than. My team executed the game plan I created for them and I didn't do enough. Give UCF credit, thecy came to play and they executed well. But they were just another game to us, not on the level of Alabama or Miami. To them, we're the (Rosebowl? National championship? What's the appropriate college level Super Bowl equivalent?). It's not like if they played (insert a team of a very similar talent level in my conference here) or (insert a team clearly below my talent level in my conference) that they would win. But this is what focused middle tier teams do, they play one game really hard hoping to catch a better team on a bad day. That's what happened here. They play in the AAC (that's right isn't it?) for a reason. I'll have my team ready for FSU next week, you can bet on that."

And then I would pretend like they don't exist as far as scheduling goes. And over beers with other coaches, I'd suggest they not play them either unless they want to get embarrassed. Especially if I beat that coach. "Free advice, buddy. Don't play UCF. Those guys don't effect around." Or if have assistants so it unofficially.

And they'd be stuck playing out of conference games against Liberty University for another 10 years (I assume they aren't top tier competition, but if they are, insert someone else).

 

[1maGoh]

What's the incentive for Clemson to schedule Auburn or Florida to schedule Michigan or Alabama to schedule USC or Ohio State to schedule Oklahoma? We see those games happen as neutral site games and home-and-homes because they bolster a team's resume and are big money-makers. Beating the top dogs won't get UCF dropped from schedules. Neither will competing with them. However, if they get blown out, you're right that they won't get home-and-homes. They didn't earn it.

The other big thing that can comes out of UCF playing those games, in addition to building their resume for the CFP, they build their resume for a bid to get into a P5 conference like the Big 12.



Yeah, the top programs aren't going to be goaded into giving UCF a better arrangement out of annoyance or embarrassment. UF plays Miami and FSU next year out of conference. They also play a SEC schedule. They don't need UCF to prove their legitimacy. If UCF doesn't want to schedule UF on their terms, UF will simply go find somebody who will.

If UCF wants that legitimacy, they need to start scheduling and winning those games. That'll mean taking those games on the other team's terms. UCF won't be considered "less than" if they schedule away games with strong programs and win them. That's how they'll get the legitimacy and respect they want. They have a strong opportunity next year with Stanford.

Let's use an analogy here. I don't know if you followed boxing. But imagine if a young boxer with a good track record started demanding that the champion fight him and give him a 50/50 split of the profits. The champion might be willing to fight him, but why would the champion accept those terms? UCF still needs to earn the status it desires. It can earn that status, but it won't do so by refusing to play unless other programs give it terms it hasn't earned at this point.

And don't worry, next week I'll be back to my more normal paying schedule (far less than the last 2 weeks). You won't have to deal with this much longer.

 

[jrry32]

If I was the head coach of UF and UCF scheduled on my terms and kicked my butt, I'd spin that into irrelevance and never schedule them again. I'd take 100% of that responsibility on myself and say something to the effect of, "this was a classic trap game and it's my fault. I failed to prepare my team to beat an opponent that we are clearly better than. My team executed the game plan I created for them and I didn't do enough. Give UCF credit, thecy came to play and they executed well. But they were just another game to us, not on the level of Alabama or Miami. To them, we're the (Rosebowl? National championship? What's the appropriate college level Super Bowl equivalent?). It's not like if they played (insert a team of a very similar talent level in my conference here) or (insert a team clearly below my talent level in my conference) that they would win. But this is what focused middle tier teams do, they play one game really hard hoping to catch a better team on a bad day. That's what happened here. They play in the AAC (that's right isn't it?) for a reason. I'll have my team ready for FSU next week, you can bet on that."

And then I would pretend like they don't exist as far as scheduling goes. And over beers with other coaches, I'd suggest they not play them either unless they want to get embarrassed. Especially if I beat that coach. "Free advice, buddy. Don't play UCF. Those guys don't effect around." Or if have assistants so it unofficially.

And they'd be stuck playing out of conference games against Liberty University for another 10 years (I assume they aren't top tier competition, but if they are, insert someone else).

Well, I can tell you that's not what Dan Mullen would do. It's also not what Sean McVay would do. No offense, but those sound like the sort of excuses that fans make. Regardless, if UCF kicked our butts, they'd earn a lot of respect and legitimacy from it. If we refused to play them, I bet other programs would step up and play them. It would also bolster their argument for a bid from a P5 conference.

And don't worry, next week I'll be back to my more normal paying schedule (far less than the last 2 weeks). You won't have to deal with this much longer.

I'm not sure what this means haha.

 

[1maGoh]

Well, I can tell you that's not what Dan Mullen would do. It's also not what Sean McVay would do. No offense, but those sound like the sort of excuses that fans make. Regardless, if UCF kicked our butts, they'd earn a lot of respect and legitimacy from it. If we refused to play them, I bet other programs would step up and play them. It would also bolster their argument for a bid from a P5 conference.



I'm not sure what this means haha.

Posting. It should say posting. Damn auto correct.

It would kind of sound like excuses. Tone and body language would go a long way to freaking it more of a "yep, they got me" and less of a "ignore the loss behind the curtain" kind of statement. But it would also be believable enough to potentially get me what I want, which is not playing out of conference teams that could beat me.

And yes, McVay is far too good of a person to say anything of the sort. He would own the loss and mean it. I'd be owning it to downplay it and hope everyone forgot.

 

[jrry32]

Posting. It should say posting. Damn auto correct.

It would kind of sound like excuses. Tone and body language would go a long way to freaking it more of a "yep, they got me" and less of a "ignore the loss behind the curtain" kind of statement. But it would also be believable enough to potentially get me what I want, which is not playing out of conference teams that could beat me.

And yes, McVay is far too good of a person to say anything of the sort. He would own the loss and mean it. I'd be owning it to downplay it and hope everyone forgot.

That's not what major programs are doing these days. It's a good thing. The major programs are going out of their way to schedule exciting games out of conference.

 

[1maGoh]

That's not what major programs are doing these days. It's a good thing. The major programs are going out of their way to schedule exciting games out of conference.

Well then that's a whole different bag of potatoes. Go ahead and ignore me then.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

I don’t know if it’s possible but I would love an 8 or even 6 team playoff. Every year there are a few teams just on the edge of getting in.

It would make things more interesting because most people are getting bored with Clemson and Alabama.

 

[dieterbrock]

I don’t know if it’s possible but I would love an 8 or even 6 team playoff. Every year there are a few teams just on the edge of getting in.

It would make things more interesting because most people are getting bored with Clemson and Alabama.

I don’t think it should go past 6 teams.
Top 2 seeds get a 1st round bye, bottom 4 square off.
IMO, if they go with too many teams making it, the regular season will become less relevant.

 

[RamFan503]

I don’t think it should go past 6 teams.
Top 2 seeds get a 1st round bye, bottom 4 square off.
IMO, if they go with too many teams making it, the regular season will become less relevant.

Meh. Out of all the schools, 8 teams wouldn’t really change that.

I think they need to really look at expanding the playoffs to conference winners and the undefeated.

Just like in the NFL, there are always assumptions on why or if one division is better, teams play better at different times of the year, etc...

As much as possible, the popularity contest has to end and major conference champions need to face off. Add in a few teams that were undefeated against decent competition, and you have a meaningful playoff system that actually lifts all conferences.

Match ups don’t always play out the way you expect. It is very likely that the #1 team going in, often won’t make it out.