Resigning D Williams was critical, Rams need more at CB

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FrantikRam

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And we were 2nd in the NFL in sacks with everybody but Ebukam returning. However we're losing a starting Corner. Also to say we got torched because of a lack of pass rush is incredibly disingenuous without mentioning the fact that the best defensive player the DPOY the man who pressures the QB the most in the NFL was not himself and didn't play even the whole game. To sit here and blame it on a lack of pass rush and not saying why is really shady.

Also there's a major difference between the pass rush and the secondary.

The secondary is returning everybody but our starter JJ3 who also called the plays. A big loss but we've prepared for him leaving by drafting to fill behind him the last 2 drafts.

We drafted Terrell Lewis who going into his 2nd year should provide a boost to the pass rush opposite our expensive resigning of Floyd and his 10 sack season.

Who's the CB we've drafted the last 2 years that's going to step up this year and fill the void left by Hill leaving? Also we don't know yet if Williams will be back. Everybody assumes and hopes he will be back but it's far from certain that he will, if it was certain he'd have signed the offer sheet already. We drafted Long 2 years ago and we can hope that he steps up in his 3rd year but so far he's given no reason to think he will.

CB is a very real need for the Rams according to some of us. Funny though the people who want a CB also want to add a body to the Edge room. Obo has been decent but hurt and inconsistent. Lewis showed flashes but needs to be healthy. None of the other OLB/Edge on the roster inspire much confidence. Just because we obviously need a CB doesn't mean we can't or shouldn't add an Edge as well.

People are entitled to their opinions obviously - it's just ironic because I'm sure many of the people who say CB is a need now also said it was a need one year ago this time - Hill was everyone's favorite player to cut and now we're wondering who will replace him? Someone already on the roster who fans haven't seen so have written off. Those people were dead wrong about Hill, but then some are doubling down again this year.

We actually lost arguably our second best pass rusher - definitely third best - in Morgan Fox.

I'm aware that AD was injured and wasn't trying to be shady at all - in fact, him being injured proves my point because we had zero Pass rush without him. Pass rush is a bigger need right now than CB IMO.

Really don't get the "obviously need a CB" comment. We have two top 10 CBs - saying third CB is an obvious need when weve been developing players in house - why stop there? At that point almost every backup is an obvious need because we don't have a starting caliber player (according to the same group that wanted to cut Troy Hill) waiting in the wings.

It's not a need for 2021 but I can see it as a need if we're unsure about being able to re-sign Williams. I won't be upset if we draft a CB but I don't think any position can be classified as a need if you have two top 10 players at that position and have invested prior draft picks and time in developing the depth behind them.
 
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CGI_Ram

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And if anyone thinks otherwise, just remember the 2011 season.
Without looking... my guess is that is the season we signed Al Harris off the street to be a starter late in the season.

That was painful.

Really don't get the "obviously need a CB" comment. We have two top 10 CBs - saying third CB is an obvious need when weve been developing players in house - why stop there? At that point almost every backup is an obvious need because we don't have a starting caliber player (according to the same group that wanted to cut Troy Hill) waiting in the wings.
But what if Ramsey or Williams were to miss a couple of games?

If Long is the 3rd CB... that leaves only Deayon?

CB feels very much a need to me.
 
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FrantikRam

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Without looking... my guess is that is the season we signed Al Harris off the street to be a starter late in the season.

That was painful.



But what if Ramsey or Williams were to miss a couple of games?

If Long is the 3rd CB... that leaves only Deayon?

CB feels very much a need to me.

I guess I should clarify - whichever position Burgess doesn't play is a depth need. But even in saying that, who were 4th and 5th CBs last year? Long and nobody. My preference would be to bring in a cheap vet or UDFA to let them all compete.

But it's not more of a need than other positions. If we're worried about Ramsey or Williams getting injured, then what if AD does? Kupp and DJax both got injured last year - so even though we might be deeper at WR, given injury histories, WR would be a bigger need to me.

OL has less talent. TE has less talent and depth. DL has less talent. LB has less talent. S has less talent.

The only positions I'd classify as less of a need than CB are QB and RB.

For 2021. I'm fine if we draft a CB high because we might lose Williams - the draft is for the future so that'd be a smart thing to do.

But it bugs me when so many people called this a need last year when we were worse off going into the season, and were wrong. Despite Hills experience he wasn't well thought of, and Williams was an unknown.
 
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Memento

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Without looking... my guess is that is the season we signed Al Harris off the street to be a starter late in the season.

That was painful.
Yep. And he went on IR. I think at least four cornerbacks (and that's not even counting other positions) went on IR in 2011.
 
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OldSchool

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People are entitled to their opinions obviously - it's just ironic because I'm sure many of the people who say CB is a need now also said it was a need one year ago this time - Hill was everyone's favorite player to cut and now we're wondering who will replace him? Someone already on the roster who fans haven't seen so have written off. Those people were dead wrong about Hill, but then some are doubling down again this year.

We actually lost arguably our second best pass rusher - definitely third best - in Morgan Fox.

I'm aware that AD was injured and wasn't trying to be shady at all - in fact, him being injured proves my point because we had zero Pass rush without him. Pass rush is a bigger need right now than CB IMO.

Really don't get the "obviously need a CB" comment. We have two top 10 CBs - saying third CB is an obvious need when weve been developing players in house - why stop there? At that point almost every backup is an obvious need because we don't have a starting caliber player (according to the same group that wanted to cut Troy Hill) waiting in the wings.

It's not a need for 2021 but I can see it as a need if we're unsure about being able to re-sign Williams. I won't be upset if we draft a CB but I don't think any position can be classified as a need if you have two top 10 players at that position and have invested prior draft picks and time in developing the depth behind them.
And Ramsey goes out we can't cover anybody just like if AD goes out. Fact is we have 1 CB signed beyond this year. And even if we lead the league in sacks QB's will still have time to get rid of the ball no matter how short that time is and the two have to work in conjunction, just like last year, in order for the pass defense to be successful. After this season we have 1 CB on the roster with any kind of ability unless Williams signs for more than his 1 year tender. We also know that Snead has a real history of drafting for need the year before it becomes a big vital need. On the other hand we have 5 guys on the 2022 roster listed as a DT 1 as a DE and 3 as an OLB.
 
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Merlin

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Why is Williams a guaranteed loss next season? Do people think he will get Jalen Ramsey money?

The cap goes up next year and the Rams get some dead money cleared. It’s the perfect situation for them to resign Williams.
Good point Elm and I think it's possible. The prob with corner is we don't know if the Rams have budgeted Williams in. And we also don't know what they think of Burgess who they said would be in the mix for slot when they drafted him. Or Long. Now I haven't seen anything from Burgess to make me think he can play the slot so I'm skeptical but this is about what the Rams think. Also I think Long is too soft for outside the hashes so if he does win a spot on this roster it will be in the slot IMO.

We do need a slot at the least in this draft just to be safe but with slot it doesn't have to be early.

I don’t see any reason/need to use a top pick on a CB. DWill is going nowhere this season and maybe even LT. Sure get a young pup in 4th round or later. But early on — no way — bigger immediate needs (OL, LB, Edge)
I think the Rams have CB, OLB, OT, and to some extent ILB in a place where they can do nothing and might still be ok. For this season. Which means what would make them pick any of those positions is a player who blows their minds being there at 57.

So if there's a really high graded corner at 57 you love you don't overthink it. You take him.
 
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Tano

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Snead will just trade his high 2024 draft picks for a CB if one goes down
 
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So Ram

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Good point Elm and I think it's possible. The prob with corner is we don't know if the Rams have budgeted Williams in. And we also don't know what they think of Burgess who they said would be in the mix for slot when they drafted him. Or Long. Now I haven't seen anything from Burgess to make me think he can play the slot so I'm skeptical but this is about what the Rams think. Also I think Long is too soft for outside the hashes so if he does win a spot on this roster it will be in the slot IMO.

We do need a slot at the least in this draft just to be safe but with slot it doesn't have to be early.


I think the Rams have CB, OLB, OT, and to some extent ILB in a place where they can do nothing and might still be ok. For this season. Which means what would make them pick any of those positions is a player who blows their minds being there at 57.

So if there's a really high graded corner at 57 you love you don't overthink it. You take him.
Now in your mind set & post makes no sense in David Long.Well maybe ?

CB has to be the position early.The value of picks are what they are as always. BPBP of need.
A Center might be tops. The Rams need to look at both 2021& 2022.

I think David Long at the very least needs to fill part of what Troy Hill brought at CB/Slot. — Burgees has that skill set.The problem is about the ankle injury.Speed is important.
 

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Guys priority #1 next off-season will be DWill so I am not drafting a corner at 57. By that point probably 7+ corners will be off the board, but most likely only 3 ILBs, 1 Guards exclude Vera Tucker, and maybe 2 Centers so the odds of getting a more dominant or later at those positions is more likely.
 

Merlin

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IMO the key at 57 is taking the absolute best player. Outside of RB. Take the best player who falls to you and adjust from that point with that group that continues into round 3-4.

I really feel like they aren't sitting there saying "OMG WE NEED XXXX HERE." It's gonna be who's the best guy. If that guy is a corner cool it's a need and you can't have enough of them.
 

OldSchool

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Guys priority #1 next off-season will be DWill so I am not drafting a corner at 57. By that point probably 7+ corners will be off the board, but most likely only 3 ILBs, 1 Guards exclude Vera Tucker, and maybe 2 Centers so the odds of getting a more dominant or later at those positions is more likely.
There’s no way of knowing if the 6th or 8th CB taken is a better or worse player than ILB or any other position. You can’t quantify player value or skill like that. Chase Claypool was what the 12th WR taken last year? I’m gonna go out on a limb and say he was better than Marlon Davis who was the 4th DE taken and went before him. When we get to pick 57 in a few weeks we can assess who’s available we can make guesses but even that is subjective and we won’t know until they get on the field. By you logic the first ILB is a better pick than the 4th QB just because no othe ILB have been taken.
 
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OldSchool

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IMO the key at 57 is taking the absolute best player. Outside of RB. Take the best player who falls to you and adjust from that point with that group that continues into round 3-4.

I really feel like they aren't sitting there saying "OMG WE NEED XXXX HERE." It's gonna be who's the best guy. If that guy is a corner cool it's a need and you can't have enough of them.
And if a guy they want there they feel can be had later trader Les will go into action.
 
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FarNorth

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There’s no way of knowing if the 6th or 8th CB taken is a better or worse player than ILB or any other position. You can’t quantify player value or skill like that. Chase Claypool was what the 12th WR taken last year? I’m gonna go out on a limb and say he was better than Marlon Davis who was the 4th DE taken and went before him. When we get to pick 57 in a few weeks we can assess who’s available we can make guesses but even that is subjective and we won’t know until they get on the field. By you logic the first ILB is a better pick than the 4th QB just because no othe ILB have been taken.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Chase Claypool would have been a better selection for Green Bay than a back up qb who will never play as long as Aaron Rodgers is alive and upright. GB fumbled away a chance for a championship by failing to give the best qb in the NFl the weapons needed to win it all.
 
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CGI_Ram

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I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Chase Claypool would have been a better selection for Green Bay than a back up qb who will never play as long as Aaron Rodgers is alive and upright. GB fumbled away a chance for a championship by failing to give the best qb in the NFl the weapons needed to win it all.
They sure did. A 1st round talent, on offense, puts them over Tampa and into the Super bowl. (y)
 

So Ram

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People are entitled to their opinions obviously - it's just ironic because I'm sure many of the people who say CB is a need now also said it was a need one year ago this time - Hill was everyone's favorite player to cut and now we're wondering who will replace him? Someone already on the roster who fans haven't seen so have written off. Those people were dead wrong about Hill, but then some are doubling down again this year.

We actually lost arguably our second best pass rusher - definitely third best - in Morgan Fox.

I'm aware that AD was injured and wasn't trying to be shady at all - in fact, him being injured proves my point because we had zero Pass rush without him. Pass rush is a bigger need right now than CB IMO.

Really don't get the "obviously need a CB" comment. We have two top 10 CBs - saying third CB is an obvious need when weve been developing players in house - why stop there? At that point almost every backup is an obvious need because we don't have a starting caliber player (according to the same group that wanted to cut Troy Hill) waiting in the wings.

It's not a need for 2021 but I can see it as a need if we're unsure about being able to re-sign Williams. I won't be upset if we draft a CB but I don't think any position can be classified as a need if you have two top 10 players at that position and have invested prior draft picks and time in developing the depth behind them.
Well - Old School is ALWAYS Wrong In my Book & believe you both have gone MAD.

I just saw your both continuing this thing ? Your both right at needs.

I was thinking Olb/De was the biggest need.CB is always a need.I can’t remember being a trade Troy Hill ?
Never cut him though.I saw him at training camp & was like,who is he.He stood out as one of the best DB’s in drills.
—Eric Weedle -seemed to have a dark mask & long sleeves.Looked like a small little black DB imo.I’d always have to look up his number 32?

JJ43 never stood out ?? He will be missed.Troy Hill really filled the slot CB
—Fuller was a Big surprise.

I can make a Huge case for some what your saying about need.Your example of Morgan Fox though.
Then this no need for a CB in this draft is crazy.David Long being the key though & Burgees health.
 

So Ram

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I guess I should clarify - whichever position Burgess doesn't play is a depth need. But even in saying that, who were 4th and 5th CBs last year? Long and nobody. My preference would be to bring in a cheap vet or UDFA to let them all compete.

But it's not more of a need than other positions. If we're worried about Ramsey or Williams getting injured, then what if AD does? Kupp and DJax both got injured last year - so even though we might be deeper at WR, given injury histories, WR would be a bigger need to me.

OL has less talent. TE has less talent and depth. DL has less talent. LB has less talent. S has less talent.

The only positions I'd classify as less of a need than CB are QB and RB.

For 2021. I'm fine if we draft a CB high because we might lose Williams - the draft is for the future so that'd be a smart thing to do.

But it bugs me when so many people called this a need last year when we were worse off going into the season, and were wrong. Despite Hills experience he wasn't well thought of, and Williams was an unknown.
Well I’ll agree with you that there are Doubters.I will call you out then as The Hater!!!

First off I thought was OLB/DE Biggest of Need,but I’m starting to think a little different.I also need to stat I was Right about The Rams CB’s.Actually CB David Long didn’t play much in 2020 like I thought.
The Rams stock piling DB’s has what made there Defense #1. It was The Depth & growth over the last 2 years.
—Brockers & Fox were attached at The Hip,especially when Ogletree left.They both were then ultimate Pro’s.

My point is just like your saying Troy Hill & D. Williams were nobody’s Unknowns.We can discuss that itself.

Justin Holland was a perfect wire Starter game 1 2020.He has not had training camp & made some big time mistakes.The thing is is that he has the Skill Set to improve.He played soft on the edge & didn’t secure the edge.Took to long to read & react.
-Big upside on a unknown.

T.Lewis- a rookie who came in hurt.Is still really raw.Mist Ram Fans complain about him & his injuries.Doubt he will be healthy.T.Lewis is a guy I call Baby Huey!!! This guy is a Freak in size & speed.He is to dumb to think he isn’t going to be a Superstar.He is slow off the edge & doesn’t shed blockers quickly.Maybe it is a read & react thing,or being to disciplined.Talk for hours about his upside.JR likes him. Can play OLB off the ball.ext..ect.... ?
K. Young ?? OLB ??
OO - this guy will get playing time in 2021.Will be counted on & is in a cont year. What is his value.One thing is for sure he has good work ethic & is an asset for any young player.
Lawyer - is an unknown who as a rookie has been hurt,but in camp seems to keep himself on the roster.
Banks
Copeland
Hoecht
Williams
—Add Gaines & A” Robinson inside as well. Then can SJD69 play outside ?

That all said the saying goes you always try to add playmakers early.
Just like you can never have to many CB/DB’s
 

Rams43

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Well I’ll agree with you that there are Doubters.I will call you out then as The Hater!!!

First off I thought was OLB/DE Biggest of Need,but I’m starting to think a little different.I also need to stat I was Right about The Rams CB’s.Actually CB David Long didn’t play much in 2020 like I thought.
The Rams stock piling DB’s has what made there Defense #1. It was The Depth & growth over the last 2 years.
—Brockers & Fox were attached at The Hip,especially when Ogletree left.They both were then ultimate Pro’s.

My point is just like your saying Troy Hill & D. Williams were nobody’s Unknowns.We can discuss that itself.

Justin Holland was a perfect wire Starter game 1 2020.He has not had training camp & made some big time mistakes.The thing is is that he has the Skill Set to improve.He played soft on the edge & didn’t secure the edge.Took to long to read & react.
-Big upside on a unknown.

T.Lewis- a rookie who came in hurt.Is still really raw.Mist Ram Fans complain about him & his injuries.Doubt he will be healthy.T.Lewis is a guy I call Baby Huey!!! This guy is a Freak in size & speed.He is to dumb to think he isn’t going to be a Superstar.He is slow off the edge & doesn’t shed blockers quickly.Maybe it is a read & react thing,or being to disciplined.Talk for hours about his upside.JR likes him. Can play OLB off the ball.ext..ect.... ?
K. Young ?? OLB ??
OO - this guy will get playing time in 2021.Will be counted on & is in a cont year. What is his value.One thing is for sure he has good work ethic & is an asset for any young player.
Lawyer - is an unknown who as a rookie has been hurt,but in camp seems to keep himself on the roster.
Banks
Copeland
Hoecht
Williams
—Add Gaines & A” Robinson inside as well. Then can SJD69 play outside ?

That all said the saying goes you always try to add playmakers early.
Just like you can never have to many CB/DB’s
Just a friendly suggestion, So Ram.

It would be a good idea for you to proofread before posting. The current spelling and punctuation errors make reading difficult and also detract from the points you’re trying to make.
 

Merlin

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Now in your mind set & post makes no sense in David Long.Well maybe ?

CB has to be the position early.The value of picks are what they are as always. BPBP of need.
A Center might be tops. The Rams need to look at both 2021& 2022.

I think David Long at the very least needs to fill part of what Troy Hill brought at CB/Slot. — Burgees has that skill set.The problem is about the ankle injury.Speed is important.
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