Reasons for WR at 19

[Memphis Ram]

 

[Ramhusker]

Do the Rams nab one of these?


View: https://youtube.com/watch?v=cZ9KEnejNBk&si=p1RuRMRLlkpyxMZC

 

[Merlin]

Do the Rams nab one of these?

Feels like a very good chance. Definitely some guys McVay will be high on.

 

[JimY53]

Okay, but they did try to trade up for a similar TE in round one last year(Kincaid) or so the story goes. They also took an athletic TE in round two when they took Everett. Then McVay didn’t really use him as much as I’d expect for a high second round pick.

If they did draft Bowers I’d be inclined to think it was to use him as something other than just a TE. But we won’t find out because he’s likely gone.

I don't know where he will be drafted, gone or not. But circumstances have changed. Rams now have Puka. They didn't last year.

If Kupp goes down, (as he did last year) Puka would probably be the F -- the position you are talking about. Last year, Rams didn't have the foreknowledge that Puka would be great.

As I said, I could be wrong, but he's not a fit for Rams, IMO, as a and F or slot, to take Kupp's place. And Kincaid? Maybe he was going to but I would have seen him as a replacement for Everett, who you mentioned a TE2

 

[muggmeister]

Small, hybrid TE/WRs are what McVay has made most of his money with in the NFL. He had a hell of a good one in Washington. Year one in LA he drafted Everett to be that, but Everett had shitty hands and probably some other issues like being stupid. Kupp was basically the same size as those previous two, same type of skill set with a little power a little shake 'n bake, and dominant over the middle. Nacua had the same skill set, similar size again and not a burner but the same types of trait.

Bowers fits that. He's a little small for a TE but bigger than the guys McVay has had. Probably stronger and tougher on YAC too. And with Stafford throwing him the ball he'd be a YAC monster, because you gotta have the receiver and the QB for that to shine.

If we want another Cooper Nacua then just trade back a bit and draft Ladd MConkey who's even a tad faster, 4.39 combine.

 

[Londoner]

Cooper Nacua

Bet he was great at the combine.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

If we want another Cooper Nacua then just trade back a bit and draft Ladd MConkey who's even a tad faster, 4.39 combine.

He has had injuries.

 

[Merlin]

If we want another Cooper Nacua then just trade back a bit and draft Ladd MConkey who's even a tad faster, 4.39 combine.

He's more of a Woody with wheels. But yeah I suspect he may be one of their targets.

 

[Memphis Ram]

I don't know where he will be drafted, gone or not. But circumstances have changed. Rams now have Puka. They didn't last year.

If Kupp goes down, (as he did last year) Puka would probably be the F -- the position you are talking about. Last year, Rams didn't have the foreknowledge that Puka would be great.

As I said, I could be wrong, but he's not a fit for Rams, IMO, as a and F or slot, to take Kupp's place. And Kincaid? Maybe he was going to but I would have seen him as a replacement for Everett, who you mentioned a TE2

Bowers position is Weapon/Matchup Problem.

He's your FB, H-Back, Slot, TE, X, Y, Z...12345. It just depends upon the play.

 

[Londoner]

Bowers position is Weapon/Matchup Problem.

He's your FB, H-Back, Slot, TE, X, Y, Z...12345. It just depends upon the play.

If Bowers is there at 19, we’d be mad not to take him.

The problem is that he’s going to be long gone by then.

 

[Memphis Ram]

If Bowers is there at 19, we’d be mad not to take him.

The problem is that he’s going to be long gone by then.

Maybe. Maybe not.

If he gets past the Jets, the only team I would be concerned about would be the Bengals or another team trading up ahead of #19.

 

[Merlin]

No way Bowers gets near us. No way. I'll gladly eat fucking crow on that one. Tempting fate hard.

If he does he'll be a Ram.

 

[JimY53]

Bowers position is Weapon/Matchup Problem.

He's your FB, H-Back, Slot, TE, X, Y, Z...12345. It just depends upon the play.

I get it (also note TE and Y are the same thing) but that's who Puka is. And Kupp ... meanwhile you're describing someone who may be fine but at a position we have people. If rams took him and passed on elite pass rusher, good DL (to take snaps of Williams and Donald) or a CB for future (White risky and on one-year-deal) all the while you can find tweeners in later rounds, so-called "matchup" problems ... I don't see spending the 19th pick on a guy who is not dominant in terms of that kind of player --- he does nit have the length of Kelce ... which is what you are wanting ... someone like that.

And thinking this kid is at 19 makes little sense to me. And Rams have roles, he could be a slot/H-back TE, but he's not going to scare anyone as an X, or Z, so outside hype I see a good tight end ... a move tight end, too small to block but can play the slot/H-back kind of tile ... when Rams go 12 personnel.

But if Rams go receiver, would be better to get a potential good X to replace Robinson or someone who can replace Kupp... Puka is the multi-role guy to me ...

If Rams had a top 10 pick and an elite edge were available, say Turner, I take Turner

If Bowers is on the board at 19, and there are elite players left, I pass ... Rams need defensive help far more than TE like that.

 

[Memphis Ram]

I get it (also note TE and Y are the same thing) but that's who Puka is. And Kupp ... meanwhile you're describing someone who may be fine but at a position we have people. If rams took him and passed on elite pass rusher, good DL (to take snaps of Williams and Donald) or a CB for future (White risky and on one-year-deal) all the while you can find tweeners in later rounds, so-called "matchup" problems ... I don't see spending the 19th pick on a guy who is not dominant in terms of that kind of player --- he does nit have the length of Kelce ... which is what you are wanting ... someone like that.

And thinking this kid is at 19 makes little sense to me. And Rams have roles, he could be a slot/H-back TE, but he's not going to scare anyone as an X, or Z, so outside hype I see a good tight end ... a move tight end, too small to block but can play the slot/H-back kind of tile ... when Rams go 12 personnel.

But if Rams go receiver, would be better to get a potential good X to replace Robinson or someone who can replace Kupp... Puka is the multi-role guy to me ...

If Rams had a top 10 pick and an elite edge were available, say Turner, I take Turner

If Bowers is on the board at 19, and there are elite players left, I pass ... Rams need defensive help far more than TE like that.

No. I don't want someone like Kelce. I want someone like Bowers.

Those few snaps we see Skowronek as lead blocker in the backfield. Let's see much more with a bigger, faster Bowers who happens to be a good blocker, btw.
Lined up outside going against a smaller CBs or out-matched LBs would scare opposing offenses due to his physicality and speed. He's a YAC monster capable of breaking tackles running through secondaries like Debo Samuel does to the Rams every season.

Rams need difference makers. Not just hole fillers. There are no elite EDGE players that are going to be on the board at #19. There are no elite EDGE players in this draft. And if there were, they sure wouldn't be on the board at #19.

 

[JimY53]

No. I don't want someone like Kelce. I want someone like Bowers.

Those few snaps we see Skowronek as lead blocker in the backfield. Let's see much more with a bigger, faster Bowers who happens to be a good blocker, btw.
Lined up outside going against a smaller CBs or out-matched LBs would scare opposing offenses due to his physicality and speed. He's a YAC monster capable of breaking tackles running through secondaries like Debo Samuel does to the Rams every season.

Rams need difference makers. Not just hole fillers. There are no elite EDGE players that are going to be on the board at #19. There are no elite EDGE players in this draft. And if there were, they sure wouldn't be on the board at #19.

Seen too many "monsters" in college turn out to be decent pros. But not live up to the hype. I don't know if he will be great or not. I have seen him play enough to see he's a great college player but have been around long enough to see these "monsters" be just okay.

But as far as Kelce ... don't get the negative comment there. Bowers may be good but he won't have a career like Kelce's. Why? because that would be Bowers will be an all-time great.

He may just be Dalton Kincaid or worse. I do know that Rams don't need a TE/H-back ... Rams need edge, CB, DT the most alont with a single-side WR who can contest for balls.

 

[JimY53]

No. I don't want someone like Kelce. I want someone like Bowers.

Check out what people said about OJ Howard, Kyle Pitts, Ebron coming out of college --- so called game-changers.

over 30 years on 2 TEs have had 1,000-yard seasons taken in the top 20. No player draft in the top 30 has produced multiple
1,000-yard seasons... lots of WRs have. It's just an odd position--the best ones are taken later in draft.

And most the good seasons by TE over past 20 years are by guys under 25 -- in other words it takes time. So positionally, the value for a TE being impact in not high. Can this guy be exception? Perhaps but WR much higher value in general...

Just saying I don't but the hype ... and in general, TEs don't have to be taken high to be impactful. Whereas very few edge rushers have good careers taken outside very high rounds... very rare

 

[Memphis Ram]

Seen too many "monsters" in college turn out to be decent pros. But not live up to the hype. I don't know if he will be great or not. I have seen him play enough to see he's a great college player but have been around long enough to see these "monsters" be just okay.

But as far as Kelce ... don't get the negative comment there. Bowers may be good but he won't have a career like Kelce's. Why? because that would be Bowers will be an all-time great.

He may just be Dalton Kincaid or worse. I do know that Rams don't need a TE/H-back ... Rams need edge, CB, DT the most alont with a single-side WR who can contest for balls.

I wasn't making a negative comment towards Kelce. You assumed that he was what I wanted and that wasn't the case at all.

Team needs don't influence player availability and they change yearly. While we don't know how the Rams rate these guys, I'd hate it if they passed on a potential difference maker just to attempt to fill a need with a lesser rated player. In those instances, teams are more likely to fill a position with a body, but the need still exists because that need filler isn't very good.

 

[Memphis Ram]

Check out what people said about OJ Howard, Kyle Pitts, Ebron coming out of college --- so called game-changers.

over 30 years on 2 TEs have had 1,000-yard seasons taken in the top 20. No player draft in the top 30 has produced multiple
1,000-yard seasons... lots of WRs have. It's just an odd position--the best ones are taken later in draft.

And most the good seasons by TE over past 20 years are by guys under 25 -- in other words it takes time. So positionally, the value for a TE being impact in not high. Can this guy be exception? Perhaps but WR much higher value in general...

Just saying I don't but the hype ... and in general, TEs don't have to be taken high to be impactful. Whereas very few edge rushers have good careers taken outside very high rounds... very rare

There is no need for me to consider what others said about the players you listed. I've been a draftnik for decades and have my own take. Not one of them is like Bowers. Ebron struggled drops and wasn't very physical. Pitts was and always has been just a big WR. He wasn't nearly the blocker coming out of college. And I don't recall what I thought about Howard. He must not have been as impressive for me to pay attention.

The YAC master Bowers doesn't have to have a or multiple 1,000 yard seasons to have a tremendous effect on the Rams offense.

And finally, Bowers is not just a TE. Sure, that's the position that will be listed when he is drafted. But if used the way I see him (which is all over the field which includes the FB spot I've wanted for years now), his true position is weapon.

 

[JimY53]

I wasn't making a negative comment towards Kelce. You assumed that he was what I wanted and that wasn't the case at all.

I only brought him up because he's the best TE/slot/H-back in the NFL. Then you responded with you wanted Bowers, someone like him rather than Kelce. That's fine but Bowers won't have the kind of NFL career Kelce had because it's darn near impossible.

So, I was responding only that you said you wanted Bowers, not Kelce, which I found odd.

Team needs don't influence player availability and they change yearly. While we don't know how the Rams rate these guys, I'd hate it if they passed on a potential difference maker just to attempt to fill a need with a lesser rated player.

No one is suggesting that you pass on a difference-maker. You are saying this TE is a better prospect than the edge players out there.

If the Bowers falls to 19 and Turner falls to 19 -- who do you take? To me there is no question. You, obviously disagree.

The question is if Rams think this TE is a real difference-maker or not. That's what they say about everyone, but TEs that high, are not productive and that includes the athletic "game changing" kind.

Kelce 3rd round, Kittle? 5th.

So the value of a TE/H-back is not that great. Edge rushers---highly valuable and harder to get.

In those instances, teams are more likely to fill a position with a body, but the need still exists because that need filler isn't very good.

No, not really. No one is saying reach for an edge. But you don't take a guy who may not be the difference maker you think he is and historically rarely are when you can get end edge, CB, DT, WR all bigger needs and will have SOMEONE with a high 1st round grade on them.

rams can get a "move" Te later .. sure he won't have as much talent but they won't be able to get a player with high chances of success who plays edge because lower drafted guys don't do as well. Lower draft TEs do well pretty often. more often than edges, IMO

Just look at 3rdrounders --- it may turn out that Byron Young, who was a 3rd rounder may be the best 3rd round OLBer in 20 years... it's that rare for a guy taken that low to have the success he did

And it's not as rare for good TEs to come from 3-4-5 rounds.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

There have been a lot of first round Tight ends. Hockenson was a first round tight end, and he fit the Shanahan/McVay model for the Vikings.

Vernon Davis was picked sixth in round one and had a very good career.

Jeremy Shockey went at 14 and he had a good career.

I know that McVay tries to stay ahead of defensive trends or other league changes. He has made some changes to his offense, even last year.

If he coveted Bowers and traded up a few spots to get him, then I’d trust he has a good plan to use him. Bowers is a considered a top ten pick and higher than ten on most big boards. McVay could see him as another piece to make his offense even harder to defend.