Rams 2012 NFL Draft

[Memento]

Of course he didn't, and people have different evaluations of that. My own begins with noticing no one on the OL played well last year. (Then, it got injured. Not counting the injured part.) What I saw with Saffold was typical of the offense in general in the first games. Timing was off. They were out of sync. They had trouble executing protections. Venturi even commented on that part--the protections. He stated at first he thought that they didn't know the protections in the new offense but then he realized they had the book knowledge, but had trouble executing a complex new offense in real time, without sufficient reps to prep them at the physical, "2nd nature" level. In fact the entire offense looked like that. Saffold also had technique problems with bull rushers, to the point where ARZ even put Calais Campbell on him in 4 DL sets, which is strange, cause CC is no pass rushing RDE. I just figure they had seen his issues with power guys on film and deliberately put a power guy on him. The best take I have seen on that explains that it is a technique thing--he has to attack the guy and get up on him, and that his problems come when power guys catch him going backwards. All of that combined to make him clearly and openly unconfident, which led to all the mistakes and penalties.

He didn't stop being the quick-footed guy with natural knee bend and natural balance he was in 2010. He was just overwhelmed in a new offense and stressed and mistake-prone as a result.

Since that was true of absolutely everyone, then, I attribute it much more to the situation. Learning a new offense, without an off-season, under a coordinator who rushed ahead of them and never slowed down to shore up execution.

I see in Saffold the potential to be a Matt Light/Chad Clifton kind of good career LOT. It would be a shame to waste a high pick on another LOT if that's true.

While I get what you're saying, I just have to mention that Campbell is, in fact, a pass-rusher, despite the fact that he plays in a 3-4. He led the Cardinals in sacks for the second year in a row (eight sacks this year), which is really impressive for a 3-4 end. I also have to mention that Harvey Dahl had an absolutely amazing year, especially considering that he was moved to right tackle (an unfamiliar position) in the middle of the year. Aside from him and Saffold, however, I wouldn't guarantee anyone on that O-line a job on the Rams next year. The O-line as a whole was dreadful, and it was much more than not being on the same page; there were many times where they were just overwhelmed - either physically or in the technique department - in both passing and rushing downs.

I'm not giving up on Saffold at all. Moving him to right tackle isn't the same as giving up on him; as a matter of fact, I really do think that he could help fix our woes on the right side (remember that we face guys like Clemons, Acho, and Brooks at least six times a year, and they all line up against the right tackle).

As for drafting O-linemen late? I can see that for guards and centers (unless they're as talented as Hutchinson or Mangold), but not so much for tackles. In today's NFL, it's almost a necessity for a team to draft tackles high. Look at Green Bay and San Francisco; both of those teams drafted two offensive tackles in the first round (Bulaga and Sherrod with the Packers and Staley and Davis with the 49ers). In San Francisco's case, they also drafted a guard with a first round pick (Iupati). The Jermon Bushrods of the world are rare, and I don't want to count on a late draft pick to fix such a critical issue.

Just my opinion.

I should be clear.

I think that Saffold can be put back together and that it would be a mistake to move him to ROT and draft another LOT high.

I think that Saffold's year this year was a fluke. I really do think that he's a great tackle to have on a team. But does it really matter which side he dominates on when you have tons of teams that draft tackles on both sides in the first and second rounds? Nowadays, defenses try to get the upper hand in pass-rushing situations by moving guys around to the weaker side. Why couldn't Saffold be an elite right tackle, especially with Dahl helping him out?

 

[Anonymous]

Of course he didn't, and people have different evaluations of that. My own begins with noticing no one on the OL played well last year. (Then, it got injured. Not counting the injured part.) What I saw with Saffold was typical of the offense in general in the first games. Timing was off. They were out of sync. They had trouble executing protections. Venturi even commented on that part--the protections. He stated at first he thought that they didn't know the protections in the new offense but then he realized they had the book knowledge, but had trouble executing a complex new offense in real time, without sufficient reps to prep them at the physical, "2nd nature" level. In fact the entire offense looked like that. Saffold also had technique problems with bull rushers, to the point where ARZ even put Calais Campbell on him in 4 DL sets, which is strange, cause CC is no pass rushing RDE. I just figure they had seen his issues with power guys on film and deliberately put a power guy on him. The best take I have seen on that explains that it is a technique thing--he has to attack the guy and get up on him, and that his problems come when power guys catch him going backwards. All of that combined to make him clearly and openly unconfident, which led to all the mistakes and penalties.

He didn't stop being the quick-footed guy with natural knee bend and natural balance he was in 2010. He was just overwhelmed in a new offense and stressed and mistake-prone as a result.

Since that was true of absolutely everyone, then, I attribute it much more to the situation. Learning a new offense, without an off-season, under a coordinator who rushed ahead of them and never slowed down to shore up execution.

I see in Saffold the potential to be a Matt Light/Chad Clifton kind of good career LOT. It would be a shame to waste a high pick on another LOT if that's true.

While I get what you're saying, I just have to mention that Campbell is, in fact, a pass-rusher, despite the fact that he plays in a 3-4. He led the Cardinals in sacks for the second year in a row (eight sacks this year), which is really impressive for a 3-4 end. I also have to mention that Harvey Dahl had an absolutely amazing year, especially considering that he was moved to right tackle (an unfamiliar position) in the middle of the year. Aside from him and Saffold, however, I wouldn't guarantee anyone on that O-line a job on the Rams next year. The O-line as a whole was dreadful, and it was much more than not being on the same page; there were many times where they were just overwhelmed - either physically or in the technique department - in both passing and rushing downs.

I'm not giving up on Saffold at all. Moving him to right tackle isn't the same as giving up on him; as a matter of fact, I really do think that he could help fix our woes on the right side (remember that we face guys like Clemons, Acho, and Brooks at least six times a year, and they all line up against the right tackle).

As for drafting O-linemen late? I can see that for guards and centers (unless they're as talented as Hutchinson or Mangold), but not so much for tackles. In today's NFL, it's almost a necessity for a team to draft tackles high. Look at Green Bay and San Francisco; both of those teams drafted two offensive tackles in the first round (Bulaga and Sherrod with the Packers and Staley and Davis with the 49ers). In San Francisco's case, they also drafted a guard with a first round pick (Iupati). The Jermon Bushrods of the world are rare, and I don't want to count on a late draft pick to fix such a critical issue.

Just my opinion.

I should be clear.

I think that Saffold can be put back together and that it would be a mistake to move him to ROT and draft another LOT high.

I think that Saffold's year this year was a fluke. I really do think that he's a great tackle to have on a team. But does it really matter which side he dominates on when you have tons of teams that draft tackles on both sides in the first and second rounds? Nowadays, defenses try to get the upper hand in pass-rushing situations by moving guys around to the weaker side. Why couldn't Saffold be an elite right tackle, especially with Dahl helping him out?

I was thinking of the draft pick. So it's a combination of factors. (1) I don;t like the idea of using a high pick on a tackle, (2) you're less likely to get a good LOT after the first round, (3) and it's easier to get a good ROT after the first round.

So, if my own view is both that Saffold is recoverable (and of course coach might not agree) and that it's better to use high picks on other positions of need (and of course coach might overrule me).

 

[libertadrocks]

Id say the majority of this board is in favor of either drafting Blackmon or trading down.

Found this interesting:

"Area scouts and sources" tell SI's Tony Pauline that "a lot of teams" have Baylor's Kendall Wright rated as the No. 1 wide receiver in the 2012 NFL draft.

Pauline reports that "several teams," including one NFC playoff club, have Wright rated higher than Oklahoma State's Justin Blackmon. Blackmon is a favorite of media draftniks, but he is likely to run in the 4.5s at 6-foot-1 and has a checkered off-field history. Wright is three inches smaller, but will likely time in the low-4.3s and has drawn comparisons to Carolina's Steve Smith for his combo of vertical skills and physicality in traffic. With the Senior Bowl just over a week away, Wright may be a sleeper to be drafted in the top ten.

 

[JdashSTL]

Id say the majority of this board is in favor of either drafting Blackmon or trading down.

Found this interesting:

"Area scouts and sources" tell SI's Tony Pauline that "a lot of teams" have Baylor's Kendall Wright rated as the No. 1 wide receiver in the 2012 NFL draft.

Pauline reports that "several teams," including one NFC playoff club, have Wright rated higher than Oklahoma State's Justin Blackmon. Blackmon is a favorite of media draftniks, but he is likely to run in the 4.5s at 6-foot-1 and has a checkered off-field history. Wright is three inches smaller, but will likely time in the low-4.3s and has drawn comparisons to Carolina's Steve Smith for his combo of vertical skills and physicality in traffic. With the Senior Bowl just over a week away, Wright may be a sleeper to be drafted in the top ten.

Hes a very versatile player. Can play in the slot, outside, hes even thrown passes, and I bet NFL teams may even consider lining him up at RB. he had 57 carries thru 2 seasons, but then he only had 18 his last 2 seasons. Wes Bunting compared him to the Steelers young WRs.

 

[RamFan503]

We have some size at receiver and TE. If this guy can truly get separation, maybe it wouldn't be a bad move. Problem we have to work out then is getting some of our supposed red zone threats to actually perform in the red zone and our O-line to hold a block long enough for this speedy new toy to get that separation. Not sure a 5'9" receiver is wise early in the draft - especially for us.

 

[JdashSTL]

We have some size at receiver and TE. If this guy can truly get separation, maybe it wouldn't be a bad move. Problem we have to work out then is getting some of our supposed red zone threats to actually perform in the red zone and our O-line to hold a block long enough for this speedy new toy to get that separation. Not sure a 5'9" receiver is wise early in the draft - especially for us.

The ideal scenario id like to see, if our FO absolutely loved him, is trading up into the 1st round somewhere in the early to mid-20s to get him. It wouldnt shock me at all if he goes in the top 20 tho.

 

[Ramhusker]

With the Fisher hire, I'm thinking Kalil will be the pick.

 

[JdashSTL]

With the Fisher hire, I'm thinking Kalil will be the pick.

Trading down will still be in play. People have already been buzzing about RG III a lot and once he gets to do interviews with teams and has his pro day his popularity will skyrocket even more. Hes a great character kid.

 

[bluecoconuts]

With the Fisher hire, I'm thinking Kalil will be the pick.

Trading down will still be in play. People have already been buzzing about RG III a lot and once he gets to do interviews with teams and has his pro day his popularity will skyrocket even more. Hes a great character kid.

Depends on how far down they go. Personally I'd be nervous about going any lower than 8 or 9. Depending on the return of course.

 

[Ramhusker]

Best case scenario, we get Fisher and Bradford to stage a spat and get rumors going that SB is not going to work out and the Rams are going to pick RG3. That way, we get Cleveland and Washington into a bidding war for the #2 pick. That would be a sweet result. Otherwise, I think our only dance partner is probably Washington at #6 where I think Kalil and Blackmon are both gone. Then who do we target????

 

[brokeu91]

Of course he didn't, and people have different evaluations of that. My own begins with noticing no one on the OL played well last year. (Then, it got injured. Not counting the injured part.) What I saw with Saffold was typical of the offense in general in the first games. Timing was off. They were out of sync. They had trouble executing protections. Venturi even commented on that part--the protections. He stated at first he thought that they didn't know the protections in the new offense but then he realized they had the book knowledge, but had trouble executing a complex new offense in real time, without sufficient reps to prep them at the physical, "2nd nature" level. In fact the entire offense looked like that. Saffold also had technique problems with bull rushers, to the point where ARZ even put Calais Campbell on him in 4 DL sets, which is strange, cause CC is no pass rushing RDE. I just figure they had seen his issues with power guys on film and deliberately put a power guy on him. The best take I have seen on that explains that it is a technique thing--he has to attack the guy and get up on him, and that his problems come when power guys catch him going backwards. All of that combined to make him clearly and openly unconfident, which led to all the mistakes and penalties.

He didn't stop being the quick-footed guy with natural knee bend and natural balance he was in 2010. He was just overwhelmed in a new offense and stressed and mistake-prone as a result.

Since that was true of absolutely everyone, then, I attribute it much more to the situation. Learning a new offense, without an off-season, under a coordinator who rushed ahead of them and never slowed down to shore up execution.

I see in Saffold the potential to be a Matt Light/Chad Clifton kind of good career LOT. It would be a shame to waste a high pick on another LOT if that's true.

While I get what you're saying, I just have to mention that Campbell is, in fact, a pass-rusher, despite the fact that he plays in a 3-4. He led the Cardinals in sacks for the second year in a row (eight sacks this year), which is really impressive for a 3-4 end. I also have to mention that Harvey Dahl had an absolutely amazing year, especially considering that he was moved to right tackle (an unfamiliar position) in the middle of the year. Aside from him and Saffold, however, I wouldn't guarantee anyone on that O-line a job on the Rams next year. The O-line as a whole was dreadful, and it was much more than not being on the same page; there were many times where they were just overwhelmed - either physically or in the technique department - in both passing and rushing downs.

I'm not giving up on Saffold at all. Moving him to right tackle isn't the same as giving up on him; as a matter of fact, I really do think that he could help fix our woes on the right side (remember that we face guys like Clemons, Acho, and Brooks at least six times a year, and they all line up against the right tackle).

As for drafting O-linemen late? I can see that for guards and centers (unless they're as talented as Hutchinson or Mangold), but not so much for tackles. In today's NFL, it's almost a necessity for a team to draft tackles high. Look at Green Bay and San Francisco; both of those teams drafted two offensive tackles in the first round (Bulaga and Sherrod with the Packers and Staley and Davis with the 49ers). In San Francisco's case, they also drafted a guard with a first round pick (Iupati). The Jermon Bushrods of the world are rare, and I don't want to count on a late draft pick to fix such a critical issue.

Just my opinion.

I should be clear.

I think that Saffold can be put back together and that it would be a mistake to move him to ROT and draft another LOT high.

I think that Saffold's year this year was a fluke. I really do think that he's a great tackle to have on a team. But does it really matter which side he dominates on when you have tons of teams that draft tackles on both sides in the first and second rounds? Nowadays, defenses try to get the upper hand in pass-rushing situations by moving guys around to the weaker side. Why couldn't Saffold be an elite right tackle, especially with Dahl helping him out?

I generally agree with you. I think this was the classic sophomore slump that Saffold and Bradford had, but when coupled with the new system and lack of full offseason, it made it more glaring. I think Saffold will end up being fine as an LT.

However if we could draft someone who will be an elite LT and move Saffold to RT, we could be golden for years. I wish we could count on Jason Smith, but I'm afraid that the concussions will always make him prone to season ending/career ending injuries. I really do like Jason Smith, and I think he hasn't been given a fair chance because of his injuries. But I don't think we can count on him finishing a season, and at a position that is as important as OT, we need someone we can count on. I think we should either move him to a less important position (guard) or cut our losses and release him.

 

[Warner4Prez]

There is still that whole matter of the Saffold "significant" pectoral injury. It's something that I'm sure weighs heavily in the discussion for coaches/FO. No idea what his recovery status is...

 

[libertadrocks]

Best case scenario, we get Fisher and Bradford to stage a spat and get rumors going that SB is not going to work out and the Rams are going to pick RG3. That way, we get Cleveland and Washington into a bidding war for the #2 pick. That would be a sweet result. Otherwise, I think our only dance partner is probably Washington at #6 where I think Kalil and Blackmon are both gone. Then who do we target????

Walter football(yeah I know its not the best source) actually has this scenario built into their mock. Putting a trade into a mock is pretty rare. They have us selecting Richardson at 6.

Picking at #6 is tough. The best talent is off the board(Luck, Griffen, Kalil, Blackmon). We could go with the second best OT(Reiff/Martin) or a guy like Kirkpatrick. I think it would be a reach to go after Floyd/Wright/Jeffrey or a DT.

I think Id try another trade lol. Someone may want Richardson or Couples.

 

[RamFan503]

With the Fisher hire, I'm thinking Kalil will be the pick.

Not that I would argue with the pick but it seems to me from what I have read that Fisher is not likely to take an O-lineman with a #1 pick. I think it makes sense to take the guy but a Fisher coached team has never used the first pick on an O-lineman. Not saying that can't change with the circumstances.

 

[JdashSTL]

Best case scenario, we get Fisher and Bradford to stage a spat and get rumors going that SB is not going to work out and the Rams are going to pick RG3. That way, we get Cleveland and Washington into a bidding war for the #2 pick. That would be a sweet result. Otherwise, I think our only dance partner is probably Washington at #6 where I think Kalil and Blackmon are both gone. Then who do we target????

Walter football(yeah I know its not the best source) actually has this scenario built into their mock. Putting a trade into a mock is pretty rare. They have us selecting Richardson at 6.

Picking at #6 is tough. The best talent is off the board(Luck, Griffen, Kalil, Blackmon). We could go with the second best OT(Reiff/Martin) or a guy like Kirkpatrick. I think it would be a reach to go after Floyd/Wright/Jeffrey or a DT.

I think Id try another trade lol. Someone may want Richardson or Couples.

I might be OK with Michael Floyd there. Id be a little suprised if he doesnt go top 10 as long as the Jaguars dont trade down, they really need WR help. Ive also seen people mock Devon Still in the top 10, maybe he could be in play.

After Kalil the next best OL, IMO, is DeCastro, but taking a OG that early?? I dont know about that. Maybe I do get caught up in teams "reaching" for players lol. Jaguars were KILLED for taking Alualu. How did that work out? No idea lol. Raiders were killed for taking DHB, but he was just a speedy WR that was inconsistent, and had upside, thats not looking too good now. Im just looking forward to adding some talented young players to help the team.

 

[Angry Ram]

Best case scenario, we get Fisher and Bradford to stage a spat and get rumors going that SB is not going to work out and the Rams are going to pick RG3. That way, we get Cleveland and Washington into a bidding war for the #2 pick. That would be a sweet result. Otherwise, I think our only dance partner is probably Washington at #6 where I think Kalil and Blackmon are both gone. Then who do we target????

Walter football(yeah I know its not the best source) actually has this scenario built into their mock. Putting a trade into a mock is pretty rare. They have us selecting Richardson at 6.

Picking at #6 is tough. The best talent is off the board(Luck, Griffen, Kalil, Blackmon). We could go with the second best OT(Reiff/Martin) or a guy like Kirkpatrick. I think it would be a reach to go after Floyd/Wright/Jeffrey or a DT.

I think Id try another trade lol. Someone may want Richardson or Couples.

I might be OK with Michael Floyd there. Id be a little suprised if he doesnt go top 10 as long as the Jaguars dont trade down, they really need WR help. Ive also seen people mock Devon Still in the top 10, maybe he could be in play.

After Kalil the next best OL, IMO, is DeCastro, but taking a OG that early?? I dont know about that. Maybe I do get caught up in teams "reaching" for players lol. Jaguars were KILLED for taking Alualu. How did that work out? No idea lol. Raiders were killed for taking DHB, but he was just a speedy WR that was inconsistent, and had upside, thats not looking too good now. Im just looking forward to adding some talented young players to help the team.

When I say its dumb to criticize a team for "reaching" its usually for players around that draft spot. Now if a team is pickin in the top 5 this year takes someone like Courtney Upshaw or Zach Brown, yeah that's pretty stupid.

Alualu is a pretty good player, the next best player taken was a few picks later, Earl Thomas and Jason Pierre-Paul. See, and if there was a redo, JPP would've been a top 5 pick but a "reach" back then. It's a no win situation.

 

[libertadrocks]

Best case scenario, we get Fisher and Bradford to stage a spat and get rumors going that SB is not going to work out and the Rams are going to pick RG3. That way, we get Cleveland and Washington into a bidding war for the #2 pick. That would be a sweet result. Otherwise, I think our only dance partner is probably Washington at #6 where I think Kalil and Blackmon are both gone. Then who do we target????

Walter football(yeah I know its not the best source) actually has this scenario built into their mock. Putting a trade into a mock is pretty rare. They have us selecting Richardson at 6.

Picking at #6 is tough. The best talent is off the board(Luck, Griffen, Kalil, Blackmon). We could go with the second best OT(Reiff/Martin) or a guy like Kirkpatrick. I think it would be a reach to go after Floyd/Wright/Jeffrey or a DT.

I think Id try another trade lol. Someone may want Richardson or Couples.

I might be OK with Michael Floyd there. Id be a little suprised if he doesnt go top 10 as long as the Jaguars dont trade down, they really need WR help. Ive also seen people mock Devon Still in the top 10, maybe he could be in play.

After Kalil the next best OL, IMO, is DeCastro, but taking a OG that early?? I dont know about that. Maybe I do get caught up in teams "reaching" for players lol. Jaguars were KILLED for taking Alualu. How did that work out? No idea lol. Raiders were killed for taking DHB, but he was just a speedy WR that was inconsistent, and had upside, thats not looking too good now. Im just looking forward to adding some talented young players to help the team.

Probably right on DeCastro. He is supposed to be a stud OG. Taking a OG in the top 10 is sketchy tho. Its not a premier position and could be had later on. Although I guess in the FO determines he is head and shoulders above the rest of the prospects and is a cant miss guy you can take him there.

 

[bluecoconuts]

Dropping in the 10-15 spot shouldn't be hard to do.

 

[brokeu91]

Dropping in the 10-15 spot shouldn't be hard to do.

But is it the right thing to do?

To me there are six elite-type prospects: Luck, Kalil, RGIII, Richardson, Claiborne, and Blackmon. If the Rams trade down, I'd want them to stay in the top 6 (either Washington or the Browns) and pick-up one of those guys. Other than WR and OT, the other really big needs are DT and OLB. I wouldn't drop down there unless they felt an elite type of DT/OLB was available there.

 

[JdashSTL]

Dropping in the 10-15 spot shouldn't be hard to do.

But is it the right thing to do?

To me there are six elite-type prospects: Luck, Kalil, RGIII, Richardson, Claiborne, and Blackmon. If the Rams trade down, I'd want them to stay in the top 6 (either Washington or the Browns) and pick-up one of those guys. Other than WR and OT, the other really big needs are DT and OLB. I wouldn't drop down there unless they felt an elite type of DT/OLB was available there.

If we dropped down in the 10-15 range and drafted DT Devon Still id feel pretty good about that, OG David DeCastro could be in play as well, at his position I think hes an elite prospect, and were looking at having the extra picks due to trading down. Theres gonna be suprises, someone will fall further than where everyone projected them to go, someone will go higher than where they were projected.