Raheem to ATL

[Psycho_X]

View: https://x.com/tori_mcelhaney/status/1754586830832328792?s=20

 

[Tano]

I tell you what --- when I get home I will break down the number of blitzes and the success rates ... I don't know what the results will be .. I cannot do it now do not have my password for stathead on this computer but we can see if blitzing on 3rd and 10+ (will have to be 3rd and 11) helps teams that do it more ...

and we can ALL learn more on the subject ... fair enough?

Fair enough but also see what I wrote to Oldschool

 

[Juice]

I hate to say it but they acutally proves when you said fams didn't blitz you were wrong ... it proves you wrong, not right.

Damn, that confused the hell out of me. Just joshing @JimY53. I appreciate your analysis.

 

[JimY53]

Thats all you got ? Another lame gif ?
So, you must # 2. The 14 year old in their moms basement.

 

[JimY53]

Fair enough but also see what I wrote to Oldschool

I did and will do it again just to make sure I understand it. I asked a couple questions of people who know a lot more than both of us. And got interesting answers. Among them is the philosophy of blitzes and the effectiveness of blitzes. One said that some teams blitz and it doesn't have the intended effect .. that a blitz like that makes players crash test dummies. And blitzing is not to be agressive or tough, it is for a specific purpose.

This idea that bltizing is some answer to all things is off base. If coaches had their wish they would rush with 4 and cover with 7 and not blitz at all. That is toughness. That is agressive, 4 guys beating 5 blockers, 6 even.

So, I think there is a basic misunderstanding of the whys and hows and purposes of blitzing on 3rd downs. It's not a test of manhood ... see "crash test dummy" comment

 

[oldnotdead]

As I've pointed out previously, having just a good GM or good HC isn't enough. A championship caliber franchise needs both who can work together towards the common goal. The Rams have both in McVay and Snead. It's why IMO it starts with the GM who then hires the HC who will work with him. They must compliment each other and that only comes with true mutual respect. That relationship is the bedrock of all successful franchises. Ultimately it's ownership that must hire the right GM then allow him (or her) to bring in the right HC who has the same vision of team building.

The relationship must be dynamic with both working together in sync towards their goal of fielding a championship team. Holmes decided upon Campbell because he could see that he would bring the type of culture to the team that Holmes wanted. Perhaps he isn't the most creative or inventive HC but he is successful because like McVay he has created a culture of winning in a franchise that was sorely lacking. It's why I don't see the Lions as a one and done type of team like the Eagles devolved into being. It remains to be seen how the Eagles will respond to their collapse.

Raheem has come from one of the best cultures in the NFL. Is it no wonder he is bringing as many of those coaches as he can with him? That culture is the bedrock upon which a winning culture is built. Hopefully, he will have success in Atlanta as a HC.

 

[Tano]

I did and will do it again just to make sure I understand it. I asked a couple questions of people who know a lot more than both of us. And got interesting answers. Among them is the philosophy of blitzes and the effectiveness of blitzes. One said that some teams blitz and it doesn't have the intended effect .. that a blitz like that makes players crash test dummies. And blitzing is not to be agressive or tough, it is for a specific purpose.

This idea that bltizing is some answer to all things is off base. If coaches had their wish they would rush with 4 and cover with 7 and not blitz at all. That is toughness. That is agressive, 4 guys beating 5 blockers, 6 even.

So, I think there is a basic misunderstanding of the whys and hows and purposes of blitzing on 3rd downs. It's not a test of manhood ... see "crash test dummy" comment

I think my original statement was that I wanted the Rams to be more aggressive on 3rd down and 10 plus.

Let's go back to that statement. I think I got way off track in our conversation and I apologize for that.

Being aggressive doesn't mean just blitzing. It also means playing the CBs more aggressive as well.

Sometimes it means mixing it up and doing both or pretending your blitzing and back off and playing CBs in man and then backing off.

I really want to go back and re-watch the games to see if Morris did that on 3rd down and 10 + but my NFL.com is not working right now.

Edit - I could be wrong and Morris did play more aggressively than I believe. I am going by memory of the games and my memory isn't photographic. But I definitely want to go back and look at the games to either verify what I believe I remember seeing or that my memory is faulty.

 

[JimY53]

Edit - I could be wrong and Morris did play more aggressively than I believe. I am going by memory of the games and my memory isn't photographic. But I definitely want to go back and look at the games to either verify what I believe I remember seeing or that my memory is faulty.

I think you obviosuly mean well. I think the failures tand out in your mind more than the sucessess and it frustrates you to no end. No end.

 

[Tano]

I think you obviosuly mean well. I think the failures tand out in your mind more than the sucessess and it frustrates you to no end. No end.

That's possible. But again I like aggressive defenses and Morris imho (and I want to stress in my opinion) was a bit too conservative for my taste. Again it's just a preference. And then again it was probably McVay that wanted Morris to be that conservative.

I think at times McVay is too conservative on offense especially on 4th and 2 around the 30 when we didn't have a capable kicker.

 

[JimY53]

But again I like aggressive defenses and Morris imho (and I want to stress in my opinion) was a bit too conservative for my taste. A

I think at times McVay is too conservative on offense

And from our interrections I think Genghis Khan was probably too conservative for your tastes

 

[Allen2McVay]

And from our interactions I think Genghis Khan was probably too conservative for your tastes

As I recall, Genghis Khan played a lot of Cover-2. Could you post a few dozen screen shots.

 

[Memento]

As I recall, Genghis Khan played a lot of Cover-2. Could you post a few dozen screen shots.

As I recall, Genghis Khan got a lot of people killed on the routes he took. Maybe he should be our DC?

 

[WestCoastRam]

As I recall, Genghis Khan played a lot of Cover-2. Could you post a few dozen screen shots.

This thread become about THE GOAT now.

 

[Tano]

And from our interrections I think Genghis Khan was probably too conservative for your tastes

A bit of hyperbole there.

 

[JimY53]

Yes, there was but what needs to be understood is if a team is using a seven man protection on third and 10 or 11 you don’t want to blitz you can’t be that aggressive. If it’s third and six, then you can blitz it makes sense situational football. On third and sixth teams will free release their backs and you might have a chance for a blitz to get there. To get a first down on third and 1011 you have to have deeper routes and have deeper routes. You can’t have five man protections you need at least six sometimes seven you don’t blitz that.

 

[Tano]

Yes, there was but what needs to be understood is if a team is using a seven man protection on third and 10 or 11 you don’t want to blitz you can’t be that aggressive. If it’s third and six, then you can blitz it makes sense situational football. On third and sixth teams will free release their backs and you might have a chance for a blitz to get there. To get a first down on third and 1011 you have to have deeper routes and have deeper routes. You can’t have five man protections you need at least six sometimes seven you don’t blitz that.

Maybe not but I don't want CBs seven to 10 yards off the line of scrimmage either all the time on 3rd and 10.

Move them up and then back or vice versa.

I remember one 3rd and 10 where Witherspoon was at minimum 7-9 yards back and dropped back to 12 yards back and the receiver cut in front of him for a 11 yard gain and a first down.

I believe that happened more than a few times to our CBs.

I wouldn't mind if they were 5 yards back and dropped to 7 yards back and let the receiver then cut in front of them for a 6 yard gain.

 

[gogoat1]

This ^^^^^^^

 

[JimY53]

Maybe not but I don't want CBs seven to 10 yards off the line of scrimmage either all the time on 3rd and 10.

They are not 7 to 10 yards off the line of scrimmage all the time on 3rd and 10.
When I get back srom Las Vegas with porve this one wrong in about 30 seconds and it will be yet another time you've said something with a massive generalization with no evidence to back it up.

It's you remembering some things but not everything. And it is yeat another case of you moving the goalpost.

When it's explained to you why teams blitz less on 3rd and 11 plus than on 3rd and say 7-9 then you go to CB depth. And when that will be proven false you will go to something else. Just like when you went fomr one thing and another

Many posts ago I used a meme of Goldmember saying you cannot be please. That's you. You made up your mind and you cannot and will not listen to facts. You want you opinion to be of equal value to an opinion based on sound football knowledge like that of NFL coaches.

You have your preferences but you don't have any reasoning for them. Nothing to back them up as to why you want them or if they would even work.

Move them up and then back or vice versa.

They do exactly that.

I remember one 3rd and 10 where Witherspoon was at minimum 7-9 yards back and dropped back to 12 yards back and the receiver cut in front of him for a 11 yard gain and a first down.

I believe that happened more than a few times to our CBs.

Show the clip so we can analyze it. Tell me the games they happened and I can find them. I cannot go just ny your memory though. It's been proven to be faulty.

I wouldn't mind if they were 5 yards back and dropped to 7 yards back and let the receiver then cut in front of them for a 6 yard gain.

 

[Tano]

They are not 7 to 10 yards off the line of scrimmage all the time on 3rd and 10.
When I get back srom Las Vegas with porve this one wrong in about 30 seconds and it will be yet another time you've said something with a massive generalization with no evidence to back it up.

It's you remembering some things but not everything. And it is yeat another case of you moving the goalpost.

When it's explained to you why teams blitz less on 3rd and 11 plus than on 3rd and say 7-9 then you go to CB depth. And when that will be proven false you will go to something else. Just like when you went fomr one thing and another

Many posts ago I used a meme of Goldmember saying you cannot be please. That's you. You made up your mind and you cannot and will not listen to facts. You want you opinion to be of equal value to an opinion based on sound football knowledge like that of NFL coaches.

You have your preferences but you don't have any reasoning for them. Nothing to back them up as to why you want them or if they would even work.


They do exactly that.


Show the clip so we can analyze it. Tell me the games they happened and I can find them. I cannot go just ny your memory though. It's been proven to be faulty.

The Bengals game they failed 7 out 8 attempts (two were due to end of half/game plays) and the Rams basically played fairly aggressive on all of the plays and the one time they failed was because the Slot CB dropped back 12 yards and allowed the Slot WR to be wide open over the middle. I liked the overall aggressiveness on that play but not sure why the slot CB had to drop back so far. Other teams do that and I just don't understand why they allow easy completions over the middle. Seems counterproductive to me since the goal is to stop the team from converting a 3rd down and long play. However, aside from that one play., this was a great game by the Rams on 3rd down and 10 plus.

I want to see the other games that they weren't so good on. Maybe they played the same way but I swear I saw a lot of plays where the CBs dropped back to 12 yards and allowed an easy 1st down on the receiver who cut in front of them.

Edit - that was the one game where I stated Morris defense played their hearts out and should have won the game for the Rams.

But McVay went pass happy in that game especially in the Red zone and ended up kicking FGs for every Red Zone attempt. Plus what was Thomas doing being inserted at LT. He was absolutely horrible in that game.

The only Rams TD was near the end of the game.

 

[Merlin]

Jesus Christ the two of you need to get a fucking room or something.