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[RamFan503]

I'd have to say you seriously underestimate the love ST Louis has for Warner. He could have been on SF or Seattle or any other team and we would have rooted for him. You should see most residents froth at the mouth when I suggest we might have won the SB with Green if he'd not been hurt. And Green is a local boy, went to high school less than 5 miles from my house. His popularity here cannot be overstated. I think you also underestimate the loathing longtime residents of St Louis has for the Bidwell family. Which of course extends to his team.

No offense b4 but you are a St Louis only fan - as you have said. I'm not sure your take is where most other Rams fans are. It also explains your ultimate hatred for Bidwell and I can understand that. Doesn't mean they have the same hatred for the team that they have for the sack of shit that moved them.

But the rivalry with the Whiners is deep and storied. I don't doubt the fans in St Louis are rabid Warner fans but I find it very hard to believe that they would hope the Whiners win because Kurt was on the team. I'm sure some haven't followed the Rams long enough to feel the same guttural hatred for the whiners that us old timers feel but even most St Louis fans I have spoken with over the years list SF as their most hated team. Sure the shecocks have taken some of that over the past couple years but when we were going up against the cry baby and taking the games into OT, in was on big time.

A lot of us wanted bruce to do well when he signed with the niners...just not against us

As did I. I would have loved seeing Bruce rack up 200 yards against the shitchickens in a tie that sent most of their team to the ER. Other than that, I wanted Bruce to have a very good 0-14-2 season.

 

[RamFan503]

I would also say a factor is that Warner did not "leave" us, he got kicked to the curb. He didn't instantly jump over to them, he bounced around and had a rough time of it. I know that the feeling on him would be much different if he had left due to a contract dispute or money, but in this case it was the Rams who dumped him, and it wasn't like he immediately turned to the Cards for a job.

To compare it to dating, it is like if you dated a girl for a while it got really serious, but then you dumped her (no question...this wasn't a mutual split...you dumped her). You got this loser dude across the street you can't stand, but she doesn't start dating him to make you jealous so there is no revenge factor at play. Instead she dates a guy in another town (different divsion) but when that ends she somehow ends up dating the loser across the street. Surprisingly she gets him cleaned up and respectable...meanwhile the girl you dumped her for ended up having issues and not working out. Now you are looking across the street realizing she was a good girl all along, maybe you made a mistake dumping her (maybe not , maybe it wouldn't have worked for you two), and as much as you dislike the loser guy you have to grudgingly admit she is actually making him respectable and better, and in the end you have to pull for her happiness and a good end to her story.

No I don't.

 

[drasconis]

No I don't.

LOL, no you actually don't... it was a "hypothetical" general "you". The question is do you understand the anology (even if you don't agree with it)

For some of us it may be the ability to compartmentalize....

 

[blue4]

No offense b4 but you are a St Louis only fan - as you have said. I'm not sure your take is where most other Rams fans are. It also explains your ultimate hatred for Bidwell and I can understand that. Doesn't mean they have the same hatred for the team that they have for the sack of crap that moved them

I would think that a St Louis only fan and permanent resident would have a little better handle on the mentality of this than someone who's not. No offense, but why would you think you've got a better view of this? When the thread was having a discussion on the distance between SD and LA and what it means for each market I put forth the opinion that the distance involved was no big deal. Most instantly disagreed strongly, and the argument was that I didn't understand. I didn't live there, it wasn't an everyday part of my life. I now say the same to you. You know, absolutely no one is suggesting that ST Louis would support Warner and the 49ers over our own team as some have implied. What is being said is that if the Rams are out of the race, well and truly out of the race, we would support Warner no matter the team because of who he is. Why this is suddenly earth shattering or surprising or offensive is beyond me. No one even suggested that the rivalry is dead. All we are saying is that the other teams bring just as much competitive fire as the 9ers did. Again, this doesn't seem to be a controversial thing.

 

[RamFan503]

I would think that a St Louis only fan and permanent resident would have a little better handle on the mentality of this than someone who's not. No offense, but why would you think you've got a better view of this? When the thread was having a discussion on the distance between SD and LA and what it means for each market I put forth the opinion that the distance involved was no big deal. Most instantly disagreed strongly, and the argument was that I didn't understand. I didn't live there, it wasn't an everyday part of my life. I now say the same to you. You know, absolutely no one is suggesting that ST Louis would support Warner and the 49ers over our own team as some have implied. What is being said is that if the Rams are out of the race, well and truly out of the race, we would support Warner no matter the team because of who he is. Why this is suddenly earth shattering or surprising or offensive is beyond me. No one even suggested that the rivalry is dead. All we are saying is that the other teams bring just as much competitive fire as the 9ers did. Again, this doesn't seem to be a controversial thing.

Actually the bolded is what started this line of discussion.

As to having a better view, all I can say is that I have continued following this team as closely as ever and maybe even more so with the internet being so accessible. And in my discussions with the many Rams fans from St Louis, the whiners have always been a hated rival. The shecocks are gaining on them and no doubt have passed them in the eyes of many fans. The patsies are not really a rival. Most Rams fans simply hate them and what they have done to us and the league.

I don't know how many fans you speak to on this very topic. It may be a great number. But as a moderator here, I have read most posts here and interacted with a great deal of the St Louis members. Prior to that, I interacted and posted with most of the rabble (most of it St Louis fans) on the PD site. I think I have a pretty good feel for how people view the different teams. We've even had several polls that not only tell us which team is the most hated but also tend to evoke discussion about who is the hated rival and why.

As I said before, I don't doubt that many would want to see Warner do well no matter where he went but I highly doubt many would want the whiners winning the SB just because Warner was the QB. I'm sure there are some. Fortunately, we will never really know.

 

[rams2050]

I would not have cheered for Warner to win a SB had he been playing for the Cheatriots. Love the guy, but I truly believe there is no way in HELL that Warner would ever have even SIGNED to play with the Cheats. Not in his ethical, God-fearing nature to have done so.

 

[WillasDad]

I would think that a St Louis only fan and permanent resident would have a little better handle on the mentality of this than someone who's not. No offense, but why would you think you've got a better view of this? When the thread was having a discussion on the distance between SD and LA and what it means for each market I put forth the opinion that the distance involved was no big deal. Most instantly disagreed strongly, and the argument was that I didn't understand. I didn't live there, it wasn't an everyday part of my life. I now say the same to you. You know, absolutely no one is suggesting that ST Louis would support Warner and the 49ers over our own team as some have implied. What is being said is that if the Rams are out of the race, well and truly out of the race, we would support Warner no matter the team because of who he is. Why this is suddenly earth shattering or surprising or offensive is beyond me. No one even suggested that the rivalry is dead. All we are saying is that the other teams bring just as much competitive fire as the 9ers did. Again, this doesn't seem to be a controversial thing.

Simply put, to be a Rams fan means to be a Niner hater. It's essentially tradition that's passed down from generation to generation, same as college rivalries like Auburn/Alabama, Ohio State/Michigan, or USC/UCLA.

I'm sure there's a universe where a Ram fan can NOT have intense dislike for the Niners, but it's not something one typically admits amongst their Ram brethren, lest they desire to deal with those questioning their fan credibility, much like what's going on here.

I mean, it's all in fun, but....damn, son...Niners suck.

 

[D L]

I hate all 3 teams equally - Seahawks, Cards, Niners.. Seahawks have been the St.Louis rivalry since they moved here, and many times they met in the playoffs... Cardinals? The Greedy ownership that bailed on the city and abandoned us, so yea there's natural hate there...The Niners? The Decimation of the niners by the GSOT was a beautiful thing, and the first real time when people opened their eyes up to the rams in '99. But that rivalry is inherited - and I don't know how deep the hate goes there (although I do believe the STL/SF games did sell a lot of tickets in st.Louis)...Maybe them beating up on us early on in St.Louis helped add fuel to the fire.

As to Warner, he was screwed - period. And Its not like he left the Rams and ran to the Cardinals either. It wasn't an easy feat to cheer for the Cardinals - but once the Rams showed they were the joke of the NFL and the Cardinals were thriving under Warner - the same man who brought this city 2 Superbowls in 3 years and 1 ring - it became easier to root for him. they weren't rooting for the Cardinals, but they were rooting for Warner's success.

The only Comparison I can think of is imagine if Dickerson was screwed over in the same fashion as Warner, he left to go resurrect his career, and eventually ended up on the Niners..
I'd imagine for some it'd be bittersweet.

Disagree, how was Warner screwed?

He didn't win a single game after the 2001 season, and arguably cost us a shot at the playoffs in 2002 with his fumble at Washington, Marc Bulger simply was outperforming him and the Rams had a decision to make. Hindsight is always 20/20. It's not like Kurt was tearing it up immediately after he left STL. It wasn't until really that 2008 season

Love Warner, don't get me wrong, but I understand why the Rams released him.

 

[MrMotes]

Love Warner, don't get me wrong, but I understand why the Rams released him.

With the primary reason being Warner asked to be released. We even paid him a large bonus that we didn't have to. Rams handled Warner with class and respect. He just couldn't seem to face the fact he wasn't playing well enough to be our starter in 2002...

 

[OldSchool]

It does amuse me slightly that people are willing to turn their back on 20 years of history in St Louis, 320 games, GSOT, the only place they've won a Super Bowl. But a 2 game a year opponent? "Not over my dead body". (I can understand that perspective from LA locals).

Who's turning their back on the last 20 years? I've been a Rams fan for 576 regular season games. And 72 of those were against the Whiners. Meanwhile we haven't even been playing the Seaducks twice a year the whole time the teams been in St Louis. We've been playing them and the Cardinals as division rivals for 12 years now and this is supposed to be more of a rivalry than our 48 year division rival Whiners?

 

[blue4]

Simply put, to be a Rams fan means to be a Niner hater. It's essentially tradition that's passed down from generation to generation, same as college rivalries like Auburn/Alabama, Ohio State/Michigan, or USC/UCLA.

I'm sure there's a universe where a Ram fan can NOT have intense dislike for the Niners, but it's not something one typically admits amongst their Ram brethren, lest they desire to deal with those questioning their fan credibility, much like what's going on here.

I mean, it's all in fun, but....damn, son...Niners suck.

That's what it means for you. The only generations here are me and my 10 yr old son. And as far as questioning my fan cred, well that's up to you. We have people here who are fine with us losing a team so long as we stay in the NFC West so I guess we're all questioning each other's priorities.

 

[blue4]

Actually the bolded is what started this line of discussion.

As to having a better view, all I can say is that I have continued following this team as closely as ever and maybe even more so with the internet being so accessible. And in my discussions with the many Rams fans from St Louis, the whiners have always been a hated rival. The shecocks are gaining on them and no doubt have passed them in the eyes of many fans. The patsies are not really a rival. Most Rams fans simply hate them and what they have done to us and the league.

I don't know how many fans you speak to on this very topic. It may be a great number. But as a moderator here, I have read most posts here and interacted with a great deal of the St Louis members. Prior to that, I interacted and posted with most of the rabble (most of it St Louis fans) on the PD site. I think I have a pretty good feel for how people view the different teams. We've even had several polls that not only tell us which team is the most hated but also tend to evoke discussion about who is the hated rival and why.

As I said before, I don't doubt that many would want to see Warner do well no matter where he went but I highly doubt many would want the whiners winning the SB just because Warner was the QB. I'm sure there are some. Fortunately, we will never really know.

Needless to say, I think you are wrong there. I get that you talk to a lot of people. But I also spend time online (not as much as you) and I also speak to people who aren't on the internet every day. As I said before, I live here, work in the city every day. It's a topic that has literally been talked to death for years in the break rooms and office buildings. I've been participating in this very discussion for over 10 years. I'm confident I've not misrepresented my fellow St Louisans.

 

[RamFan503]

Needless to say, I think you are wrong there. I get that you talk to a lot of people. But I also spend time online (not as much as you) and I also speak to people who aren't on the internet every day. As I said before, I live here, work in the city every day. It's a topic that has literally been talked to death for years in the break rooms and office buildings. I've been participating in this very discussion for over 10 years. I'm confident I've not misrepresented my fellow St Louisans.

That's fine. I am guessing you, as more than a casual fan, speak from your experience. I have a different experience based on those I have spoken with. I think sometimes also that conversations morph depending on the people talking.

Funny to get wrapped up in all this on this thread - eh? Guess in the absence of any real and new information we have to start heading down other avenues that really don't matter all that much. I'll just figure that you indeed likely have a greater pulse from those in the Lou and accept that on the issue.

I'll just say this. Screw the whiners and the horse they rode in on.

 

[iced]

Disagree, how was Warner screwed?

He didn't win a single game after the 2001 season, and arguably cost us a shot at the playoffs in 2002 with his fumble at Washington, Marc Bulger simply was outperforming him and the Rams had a decision to make. Hindsight is always 20/20. It's not like Kurt was tearing it up immediately after he left STL. It wasn't until really that 2008 season

Love Warner, don't get me wrong, but I understand why the Rams released him.

I'm not a fan of how the situation was handled, nor do I think you give up on such an elite talent so quickly. His wife did him no favors either when she turned the radio and started saying things like Kurt Would take a trade, etc.

I understand the whole concept of his fumbles (especially that one game where he had 6, I think it was his last). he wasn't "Tearing it up" with the giants, but he was a lot better of a passer than Eli was as a rookie and they were winning more games under Warner. The biggest reason he never went back out on the field is because he elected not too, telling coughlin "You can't come back to me after Starting Eli."

But when you look back at the situation in hindsight - there's nothing about the front office that gave me any warm and fuzzies, especially after they elected to not keep London Fletcher. I felt Warner needed more time, and even with Marc playing well.

 

[MrMotes]

I understand the whole concept of his fumbles (especially that one game where he had 6, I think it was his last). he wasn't "Tearing it up" with the giants, but he was a lot better of a passer than Eli was as a rookie and they were winning more games under Warner. The biggest reason he never went back out on the field is because he elected not too, telling coughlin "You can't come back to me after Starting Eli."

So Warner was in charge of who played QB for the Giants, not Tom Coughlin?

The truth is Warner had a rough patch where he lost his job to Bulger, then to Manning and then to Leinart. But once he got healthy and got his act together, he was great again.

I wish he had been willing to stay with the Rams and be Bulger's backup. But he said he was playing as well as he ever had and wanted to be the starter. He asked to be released...

 

[RamFan503]

So Warner was in charge of who played QB for the Giants, not Tom Coughlin?

Come on man.... of course not but that story is well documented. I've seen both Coughlin and Warner tell similar versions.

The truth is Warner had a rough patch where he lost his job to Bulger, then to Manning and then to Leinart. But once he got healthy and got his act together, he was great again.

I don't believe he lost the job to Leinart - did he? I think Lienart lost his job to Warner.

I wish he had been willing to stay with the Rams and be Bulger's backup. But he said he was playing as well as he ever had and wanted to be the starter. He asked to be released...

I think he said that after his hand had healed but was still holding a clip board. I think any QB that is worth a salt wants to either start or be traded. Problem was that he lost his job due to injury and Martz told him he wasn't going to start over Bulger as long as he felt Bulger was playing well enough to win. Martz has said he regrets how he handled that whole situation. Martz was a first time HC and made some mistakes. That was one of them. But of course Warner was head strong too so the two clashed.

And that is why Stan might move the team.

 

[mr.stlouis]

Kroneke sure is pulling all the strings he can. Offering to help finance team left out of Inglewood. It's clear Spanos doesn't want him in LA. So is this a "hail Mary" from Stan? Does he see the writing on the wall? IDK, I just know that's about as shady as it gets in terms of screwing over STL. STL needs rid of him, as the owner, in the worste way. It's like he is holding a deep-seeded grudge on STL. Sure seems like its more than just money. Just my .02.

One thing is for sure, this is looking to play out fast. Nixon requested the August meeting so it's hard to believe that it's a negative for STL, despite multiple sources that declare the opposite (LA based, of course.) Will Nixon seal the deal on the financing by August? That appears to be a strong possibility. Otherwise why else would he request the meeting?

I know the naming rights have not come into play as a financing option. Is this a wild card Peacock is holding to woo Stan? That would be a nice sign on bonus. Should clear 100 million easily. That would put Stan's tab at less than 150 million.

Demoff pitched Inglewood. That was rather distasteful to hear.

So yeah, seems STL has had a lot of good days lately. This one seems to have grown in favor of LA. So you can't call me biased, at least not completely.

 

[The Ripper]

One thing is for sure, this is looking to play out fast. Nixon requested the August meeting so it's hard to believe that it's a negative for STL, despite multiple sources that declare the opposite (LA based, of course.) Will Nixon seal the deal on the financing by August? That appears to be a strong possibility. Otherwise why else would he request the meeting?

Where did you get this. Nixon did not request a separate owners meetings and the meeting isn't on St Louis. The meeting is on LA and potential relocation.

The naming rights are not a wild card they're the owners revenues just like the PSL's.

 

[mr.stlouis]

Where did you get this. Nixon did not request a separate owners meetings and the meeting isn't on St Louis. The meeting is on LA and potential relocation.

The naming rights are not a wild card they're the owners revenues just like the PSL's.

Fine, he suggested a bump up in the timeline/timeframe of the meeting. The reason being was for STL's "progress."

 

[The Ripper]

Fine, he suggested a bump up in the timeline/timeframe of the meeting. The reason being was for STL's "progress."

He suggested nothing. The NFL is on their own timeline and the meeting is on LA not St Louis. Some reporters said that it was on St Louis but that's not the case.