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[The Ripper]

Mo. legislators sue Nixon to stop state stadium funding
• By David Hunn, Alex Stuckey

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/...cle_879fd7da-677d-5301-8f27-2ff1ff71a318.html

ST. LOUIS • Six state legislators have sued Gov. Jay Nixon and the public board that owns and operates the Edward Jones Dome to block state funding of a proposed riverfront football stadium here.

Senator Rob Schaaf and Representatives Rob Vescovo, Jay Barnes, Mark Parkinson, Eric Burlison and Tracy McCreery allege that taxpayer money is “in the process of being spent illegally by the Defendant in pursuance of an illegal construction of a new NFL stadium in St. Louis with taxpayer money,” the suit says.

Nixon’s two-man stadium task force has presented a plan for a $985 million stadium just north of downtown. The task force estimates it will take at least $250 million from the state and city of St. Louis, and say that money will come from an “extension” of the bonds used to build the Edward Jones Dome, where the St. Louis Rams now play.

The legislators’ suit argues that extending those bonds is illegal.

Schaaf, R-St. Joseph, said lawmakers did everything they could to resolve this problem while the Legislature was in session. Bills were filed and discussions were had on the floor but they didn't get anywhere.

"If they want to build a stadium, go ahead but don't expect the state to pick up the tab unless they come to the Legislature and ask permission to go into debt," Schaaf said.

If it is approved by a vote of the people, he said, he would be OK with money going toward the stadium.

"I always trust the people," Schaaf said. "If the people want to spend $300 million, more power to them."

This story is breaking. Check back soon for more details.

These guys aren't going to let it go.

The suit may not be successful but what they're doing is causing some worries for the potential bond underwriters.

 

[den-the-coach]

kids follow their parents in their sports affiliations.

Dad, Grandfather's & Uncle's are/were Giants, Yankees, Rangers & Knick fans and I went Rams, Dodgers, Kings & Lakers so not always... Sometimes kids go in total opposite directions although my kids root for the same teams I do, but my Dad is a nice guy, his son not so much.

 

[blue4]

The suit may not be successful but what they're doing is causing some worries for the potential bond underwriters.

These guys aren't going to let it go.

I hope every Missouri politician that is against this new stadium loses reelection, and loses badly. Even if the Rams stay.

So....Rob Schaaf is back after his bill was thrown out before the state voted on state funding.

I've said it before. Missouri's politicians are a special interest pandering gerrymandering cancer that should be removed like a malignant tumor. The problem is what makes them so awful as practical leaders makes them almost invincible during an election season. God, between Stan's money and our ability to make short sighted decisions that turn into self inflicted wounds a guy could get downright pessimistic.

 

[OldSchool]

I'm pretty sure what he wants to do is extend the payoff year of the bonds 30 years past what they are now. The arguement is that it won't create a new tax, but extend the current Hotel/Rental Car taxes.

But when they create these bonds it's my understanding they assign a number of years and dollar total. If they extend it that's taking those Hotel/Rental taxes even longer that's denying them to the politicians that planned on using them after the initial bond would expire. There are arguments for each side of the discussion.

 

[OldSchool]

Dad, Grandfather's & Uncle's are/were Giants, Yankees, Rangers & Knick fans and I went Rams, Dodgers, Kings & Lakers so not always... Sometimes kids go in total opposite directions although my kids root for the same teams I do, but my Dad is a nice guy, his son not so much.

Way to not quote my whole comment

 

[BuiltRamTough]

I've said it before. Missouri's politicians are a special interest pandering gerrymandering cancer that should be removed like a malignant tumor. The problem is what makes them so awful as practical leaders makes them almost invincible during an election season. God, between Stan's money and our ability to make short sighted decisions that turn into self inflicted wounds a guy could get downright pessimistic.

IMO they're not really trying to stop it they're trying to delay it, which is even worse. I really don't know how politics work and who's is the strongest but doesn't the governor override everyone else besides the president of the U.S.?

 

[RamBill]

Does the Carson stadium project have a leg up on Stan Kroenke’s? Bernie Miklasz talks with Randy Karraker about it. They also talk about the delay of the public vote in STL.

Listen to Bernie Talk Carson vs. Kroenke

 

[The Ripper]

IMO they're not really trying to stop it they're trying to delay it, which is even worse. I really don't know how politics work and who's is the strongest but doesn't the governor override everyone else besides the president of the U.S.?

3 equal branches of the government. Each one can override the others

 

[blue4]

IMO they're not really trying to stop it they're trying to delay it, which is even worse. I really don't know how politics work and who's is the strongest but doesn't the governor override everyone else besides the president of the U.S.?

Not when the legislative branch is majority opposition party.

 

[OldSchool]

Does the Carson stadium project have a leg up on Stan Kroenke’s? Bernie Miklasz talks with Randy Karraker about it. They also talk about the delay of the public vote in STL.

Listen to Bernie Talk Carson vs. Kroenke

I find a lot of this both humorous and contradictory.

1) They criticize Inglewood for a lack of parking that it doesn't have, the plans call for plenty of parking. And that's been the biggest criticism of the St Louis stadium is a lack of parking.

2) They criticize the Inglewood stadium because it's being designed to be a possible multi use stadium and the land around it is developed with housing and businesses. One of the selling points they trumpet the loudest is they want this stadium to be a multi use and plan it's usage to be an equal NFL and MLS stadium.

3) They make Carmen Policy out to be a saint who's loved by the NFL.

It's just funny to me the homerism that they will criticize Inglewood on things and not realize what they're saying is also critical of the St Louis stadium effort.

 

[Sum1]

I find a lot of this both humorous and contradictory.

1) They criticize Inglewood for a lack of parking that it doesn't have, the plans call for plenty of parking. And that's been the biggest criticism of the St Louis stadium is a lack of parking.

2) They criticize the Inglewood stadium because it's being designed to be a possible multi use stadium and the land around it is developed with housing and businesses. One of the selling points they trumpet the loudest is they want this stadium to be a multi use and plan it's usage to be an equal NFL and MLS stadium.

3) They make Carmen Policy out to be a saint who's loved by the NFL.

It's just funny to me the homerism that they will criticize Inglewood on things and not realize what they're saying is also critical of the St Louis stadium effort.

I haven't listened to it, and I have no doubt there is a homer tone to it all...but I haven't heard or read anything whatsoever about there being criticism of parking with the St. Louis stadium plan.

 

[Loyal]

WHo the eff is Carmen Policy? "None of us are intimately involved with the plans.." ~Bernie M.

This doesn't prevent Bernie from talking about it authoritatively...

 

[iced]

I find a lot of this both humorous and contradictory.

1) They criticize Inglewood for a lack of parking that it doesn't have, the plans call for plenty of parking. And that's been the biggest criticism of the St Louis stadium is a lack of parking.

2) They criticize the Inglewood stadium because it's being designed to be a possible multi use stadium and the land around it is developed with housing and businesses. One of the selling points they trumpet the loudest is they want this stadium to be a multi use and plan it's usage to be an equal NFL and MLS stadium.

3) They make Carmen Policy out to be a saint who's loved by the NFL.

It's just funny to me the homerism that they will criticize Inglewood on things and not realize what they're saying is also critical of the St Louis stadium effort.

pretty much why anything bernie says is taken with a grain of salt

 

[bluecoconuts]

i dont think Stan is going to empty his bank account either, he has his limit too. i dont understand why you would think GS will cringe and Stan wont when GS has 12 times the money. they have publicly stated that they would cover the cost of the stadium and help cover any operating losses, why is it that thier word is not as good as Stans in your eyes?

Because Goldman Sachs is an investment bank that is setting up various loans from various different banks to pay for the stadium and their primary goal is to see as much of a profit as they can for said various investors. If they cant get good timely profits then it's not worthwhile to invest.

Kroenke however is bankrolling it with his own pockets, meaning he most likely has a higher threshold for what is deemed 'worth it' in terms of how high to go. While profits are indeed important for him as well, it's not likely that he would really live long enough (although he could with modern medicine) to see how high those profits can get. That's why some have said it's not just about himself but also for his family. He has a longer window to see the returns, so he can invest more. Plus with the scope of his project he's projected to earn more money than Carson if he indeed has two teams, and if he has one team (his) then he has complete control of the market, meaning those profits are no longer split, and it's higher for him (while Carson with two teams might be higher overall, the teams will get a smaller share obviously).

 

[bluecoconuts]

but I haven't heard or read anything whatsoever about there being criticism of parking with the St. Louis stadium plan.

I thought that was one of the first complaints by the NFL, there was only about 10,000 parking spots and they said they needed more. They adjusted it I believe, but they still lack parking (I believe) for a Super Bowl or something like that.

 

[ChrisW]

But when they create these bonds it's my understanding they assign a number of years and dollar total. If they extend it that's taking those Hotel/Rental taxes even longer that's denying them to the politicians that planned on using them after the initial bond would expire. There are arguments for each side of the discussion.

Right, but if you're going to tax anything for a pro sports team, Rental Cars and Hotels are perfect. Charge the people that want to come see the team play. It doesn't really affect the people of the state. What I'm wondering is where else does the tax come from? Is the Rental and Hotels the only place?

 

[MrMotes]

Not when the legislative branch is majority opposition party.

Yep. Never underestimate just how much of a blood sport politics can be, how the parties will pretty much oppose each other at all costs, on all fronts at all time regardless of the issue for the sole purpose of inflicting harm on their opponent.

If the legislature does somehow derail the Riverfront Stadium and The Rams move to Inglewood, it wouldn't be too hard to come up with a conspiracy theory where Kroenke had his friends in Jefferson City run some interference for him. I'd imagine he's very well connected in MO politics...

 

[den-the-coach]

Because Goldman Sachs is an investment bank that is setting up various loans from various different banks to pay for the stadium and their primary goal is to see as much of a profit as they can for said various investors. If they cant get good timely profits then it's not worthwhile to invest.

 

[RamBill]

Missouri lawmakers sue Gov. Jay Nixon over 'illegal' Rams stadium money
By Nick Wagoner
ESPN.com

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/1...overnor-jay-nixon-st-louis-rams-stadium-money

ST. LOUIS -- The efforts to build a new $985 million football stadium and keep the St. Louis Rams in the city hit another obstacle Wednesday afternoon.

According to a suit filed in the circuit court of Cole County, six Missouri legislators are suing Missouri Gov. Jay Nixon and the Regional Convention and Sports Complex Authority over Nixon's ability to extend the bonds on the Edward Jones Dome to pay for the proposed stadium on the city's north riverfront.

As part of the stadium plan, Nixon's task force has proposed that he can unilaterally extend bonds on the current stadium at the city and state level without a public vote to provide close to $250 million in public money for the new stadium.

The suit states the plaintiffs, led by state senator Robert Schaaf, believe that Nixon's efforts to extend those bonds are illegal, and referred to the money as being used on "an illegal construction of a new NFL stadium in St. Louis with taxpayer money."

The lawsuit also states the plaintiffs have "no other remedies in the law to protect their rights and interests."

In addition to Sen. Schaaf, the suit names state representatives Rob Vescovo, Jay Barnes, Mark Parkinson, Eric Burlison and Tracy McCreery as plaintiffs.

Also on Wednesday, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch reported that the first hearing on a separate lawsuit at the city level, which was to begin Thursday, has been postponed because the judge is sick.

That suit, brought by the RSA against the city of St. Louis, says a city ordinance passed in 2002 that requires a public vote before using tax dollars for a new stadium is "overly broad, vague and ambiguous."

Unlike the suit brought at the state level, that one was brought by the RSA in an effort to allow the spending of city money also without a public vote. The RSA, which runs the Edward Jones Dome, believes the 2002 law conflicts with Missouri state statutes.

Nixon's task force, led by local businessmen Dave Peacock and Bob Blitz, has been working since November to make the stadium project a reality to keep the Rams in St. Louis. That group has acquired almost two-thirds of the land for the project via option agreements in that time, but has yet to finalize the financing plan.

Nixon and Peacock have repeatedly said they hope to have the financing plan in place and actionable by the fall.

 

[OldSchool]

Right, but if you're going to tax anything for a pro sports team, Rental Cars and Hotels are perfect. Charge the people that want to come see the team play. It doesn't really affect the people of the state. What I'm wondering is where else does the tax come from? Is the Rental and Hotels the only place?

That's the only thing I've seen it described as. And I disagree that it doesn't affect people of the state, and keep in mind being in Nevada we get a whole truckload of tax money from these, is that it would be used on things for the people of the city/county/state if it wasn't spent on the stadium. They've got an interesting debate ahead of them. This bond really in the end is a small amount of money per year in the end and if it gets upheld they'll I'm sure find another way to finance things. The biggest problem with this is it delays the St Louis stadium. And that's something they can't really afford with Inglewood ready to break ground at the end of 2015.