Mike Karney Q and A

[Shaky]

Mike Karney Q and A

Rams fans,

I'd like to begin by saying thank you to shaky and tony-sopRAMO for asking me to be apart of tonight. i feel honored to come on and talk rams football and football in general with all of "the original herd" and answer everything based on my experience of playing the game and playing for the rams organization for 2 years. with that, l plan on answering your questions with the mindset of "shooting it straight". i will not "sugar coat" my answers, in regards to the organization past or present, players, coaching or front office. my answers will be coming from what i saw as a player, and what i believe to be true. In no means whatsoever am i being bitter towards any of it. i was fortunate and lucky to have played as long as i did. Although, i will say, my time with the rams was far far too short. but nothing gives me more statisfaction than to help educate or give better "insight" to a game i enjoyed playing at the highest level. once again, thanks for having me on and i hope all of you enjoy!

Mike Karney


full transcript: www.ramsfans.com

 

[-X-]

Cool. It's the Karney World Tour!

Seriously though. It's cool that you get all these interviews, Shake. Much props. :ww:

 

[Shaky]

thanks X.

 

[JdashSTL]

Thanks for posting. A lot of interesting stuff. He added onto the issue with Bradford that other people have mentioned: body language. I wonder how big of a leadership quality this is for NFL players on offense when they are looking at their QB.

 

[steferfootball]

"the atmosphere all around the facility from a players point of view, was very uncomfortable. almost like you had to always watch what you said and what did no matter who was around. it didn't at all feel like a normal nfl lockerroom or facility should feel like. the weirdest thing for me was when we won a game, spags acted and wanted the staff to do the same, like we lost. but when we lost, it felt like we had won a game. just very very unusual and not normal at all from what the "norm" of the nfl is like. spags had players in the lockerroom as spys to tell him what guys were saying and doing. and we knew who they were and alot of us stayed away from those guys. same went with a lot of the staff as well. which brings me to gullickson. rock and i were together for 2 years in new orleans. and let me say he was a totally different guy when he was the strength coach there. he evetually could not withstand the pressure he was getting from spags on a daily basis, and also very insecure himself, gave in to the mold that spags was looking for. he was a guy who would go upstairs and tell on guys for what ever reason it was. WHICH IS A STRENGTH COACHES SIN TO DO. the weight room and lockerroom, are where players can be who they are. what i mean by that is, joke, laugh, talk trash etc...just a very a unfortunate situation that didn't make it at all to fun to be at work..."

Something happened to Karney. Every former player I've heard has said good things about him. He is a players coach. Karney is painting him like an orwellian fascist dictator.

I think it is deeper than him being cut and not getting playing time.

 

[Stranger]

Spags had spies throughout the organization? WTF?

 

[Anonymous]

Spags had spies throughout the organization? WTF?

Enh, if true, and we don't know (I mean Karney has nothing good to say about any Ram but Jackson)...I doubt it was that apocalyptic.

If anything it's equally likely that Karney just liked to complain and some guys got sick of it.

That team did not play in 2011 like a team that had given up on its coach or didn't respect him--meaning, it played hard even in bad situations. That was not true of Linehan. And unlike Spags, multiple players complained about Linehan, and let things get out about him.

 

[-X-]

Spags had spies throughout the organization? WTF?

Enh, if true, and we don't know (I mean Karney has nothing good to say about any Ram but Jackson)...I doubt it was that apocalyptic.

If anything it's equally likely that Karney just liked to complain and some guys got sick of it.

That team did not play in 2011 like a team that had given up on its coach or didn't respect him--meaning, it played hard even in bad situations. That was not true of Linehan. And unlike Spags, multiple players complained about Linehan, and let things get out about him.

Yeah, that's a new one from Karney. In the umpteen interviews he's done prior to this one with The Herd, he didn't feel compelled to talk about THAT? I dunno. Even if it's true, he should probably let go of the ghost now. Unless he's just that jaded. Nobody else has come forward to say anything even remotely like what he's saying, so all we have to go on is his account anyway.

 

[JdashSTL]

"the atmosphere all around the facility from a players point of view, was very uncomfortable. almost like you had to always watch what you said and what did no matter who was around. it didn't at all feel like a normal nfl lockerroom or facility should feel like. the weirdest thing for me was when we won a game, spags acted and wanted the staff to do the same, like we lost. but when we lost, it felt like we had won a game. just very very unusual and not normal at all from what the "norm" of the nfl is like. spags had players in the lockerroom as spys to tell him what guys were saying and doing. and we knew who they were and alot of us stayed away from those guys. same went with a lot of the staff as well. which brings me to gullickson. rock and i were together for 2 years in new orleans. and let me say he was a totally different guy when he was the strength coach there. he evetually could not withstand the pressure he was getting from spags on a daily basis, and also very insecure himself, gave in to the mold that spags was looking for. he was a guy who would go upstairs and tell on guys for what ever reason it was. WHICH IS A STRENGTH COACHES SIN TO DO. the weight room and lockerroom, are where players can be who they are. what i mean by that is, joke, laugh, talk trash etc...just a very a unfortunate situation that didn't make it at all to fun to be at work..."

Something happened to Karney. Every former player I've heard has said good things about him. He is a players coach. Karney is painting him like an orwellian fascist dictator.

I think it is deeper than him being cut and not getting playing time.

But how many former players have spoken about Spags the HC?

You know whats weird about all this, if this was New York and a former player did a chat about his time there during Rex Ryans tenure and said all these kinda things, this would probably be a pretty big deal haha.

My first thought about the atmosphere in the lockerroom is it does sound very similar to an article about the Scott Pioli and the Chiefs organization nowadays. A coach has spies? For what purpose?

 

[Anonymous]

"the atmosphere all around the facility from a players point of view, was very uncomfortable. almost like you had to always watch what you said and what did no matter who was around. it didn't at all feel like a normal nfl lockerroom or facility should feel like. the weirdest thing for me was when we won a game, spags acted and wanted the staff to do the same, like we lost. but when we lost, it felt like we had won a game. just very very unusual and not normal at all from what the "norm" of the nfl is like. spags had players in the lockerroom as spys to tell him what guys were saying and doing. and we knew who they were and alot of us stayed away from those guys. same went with a lot of the staff as well. which brings me to gullickson. rock and i were together for 2 years in new orleans. and let me say he was a totally different guy when he was the strength coach there. he evetually could not withstand the pressure he was getting from spags on a daily basis, and also very insecure himself, gave in to the mold that spags was looking for. he was a guy who would go upstairs and tell on guys for what ever reason it was. WHICH IS A STRENGTH COACHES SIN TO DO. the weight room and lockerroom, are where players can be who they are. what i mean by that is, joke, laugh, talk trash etc...just a very a unfortunate situation that didn't make it at all to fun to be at work..."

Something happened to Karney. Every former player I've heard has said good things about him. He is a players coach. Karney is painting him like an orwellian fascist dictator.

I think it is deeper than him being cut and not getting playing time.

But how many former players have spoken about Spags the HC?

You know whats weird about all this, if this was New York and a former player did a chat about his time there during Rex Ryans tenure and said all these kinda things, this would probably be a pretty big deal haha.

My first thought about the atmosphere in the lockerroom is it does sound very similar to an article about the Scott Pioli and the Chiefs organization nowadays. A coach has spies? For what purpose?

There's a difference. The article on Pioli had multiple sources.

This is one ex-player venting.

And it just sounds to me like he didn't like the way Spags did things. Which happens. Also sounds to me like he values his own opinion, a lot. Which also happens.

But considering how he has not one good word to say about a single thing related to the Rams--not the players, not the coaches, not the rest of the staff (except Jackson)--it also sounds to me like MK is just one of those guys who complains a lot. Like Kyle Turley (Martz). Or Eric Hill (DV).

 

[Anonymous]

Spags had spies throughout the organization? WTF?

Enh, if true, and we don't know (I mean Karney has nothing good to say about any Ram but Jackson)...I doubt it was that apocalyptic.

If anything it's equally likely that Karney just liked to complain and some guys got sick of it.

That team did not play in 2011 like a team that had given up on its coach or didn't respect him--meaning, it played hard even in bad situations. That was not true of Linehan. And unlike Spags, multiple players complained about Linehan, and let things get out about him.

Yeah, that's a new one from Karney. In the umpteen interviews he's done prior to this one with The Herd, he didn't feel compelled to talk about THAT? I dunno. Even if it's true, he should probably let go of the ghost now. Unless he's just that jaded. Nobody else has come forward to say anything even remotely like what he's saying, so all we have to go on is his account anyway.

Probably because his playing days are over and he doesn't want to work in the NFL is my guess. He had a 7 year career so he would know what's normal and what isn't. I wouldn't be surprised if others in similar situations in the future give corroborating accounts of Spags tenure here. Let's face it....Hanny is an easy going guy out of the NFL and what he's said and alluded to since Spags left had to have been earned. It's really out of character for Hanny yet he hasn't been shy about it......or how gracious and accommodating JF has been to him from the start. To me it smacks of too much smoke for there not to have been fire. Think about the O line play for the last 3 seasons. Could letting one of the best O line coaches in the history of the game use the weight room ad be available to answer questions that any lineman or player may have a bad thing? Regardless it's great to know that JF isn't the neophyte and will have the respect of the players and fellow coaches throughout the NFL.

 

[Anonymous]

Spags had spies throughout the organization? WTF?

Enh, if true, and we don't know (I mean Karney has nothing good to say about any Ram but Jackson)...I doubt it was that apocalyptic.

If anything it's equally likely that Karney just liked to complain and some guys got sick of it.

That team did not play in 2011 like a team that had given up on its coach or didn't respect him--meaning, it played hard even in bad situations. That was not true of Linehan. And unlike Spags, multiple players complained about Linehan, and let things get out about him.

Yeah, that's a new one from Karney. In the umpteen interviews he's done prior to this one with The Herd, he didn't feel compelled to talk about THAT? I dunno. Even if it's true, he should probably let go of the ghost now. Unless he's just that jaded. Nobody else has come forward to say anything even remotely like what he's saying, so all we have to go on is his account anyway.

Probably because his playing days are over and he doesn't want to work in the NFL is my guess. He had a 7 year career so he would know what's normal and what isn't. .

So would every other veteran Ram.

How does that make this one isolated view "true."

When Linehan went down, it was clear the majority of players were done with him. We heard things. They quit on the field.

With Spags, they didn't quit on the field, and so far the only guy to trash him is MK--who also trashes every single other Rams player and coach and official he mentions, with the exception of Jackson.

So why all of a sudden is one voice the truth that speaks for a majority? Remember with Linehan it wasn't just one player who let their displeasure be known. Now...it is just one guy.

 

[Selassie I]

Knowing that MK is no longer a player ... I think he can be much more open about his feelings concerning coaches. If he offends someone , its not going to cost him a job. I believe his answers provided us a look into the Spags locker room that many seem to Not want to believe.

He gave more than 1 reason that he didn't believe in the past regime...

Poor leadership at the top (ownership)

Insecure / paranoid coaches

HC "played not to lose"

When he was recruited - he was told the offense would be like the Giants... and that did not happen.

Unhealthy atmosphere in the locker room for a number of reasons.


I'm not going to shit can his answers because he's one of the first to openly voice his displeasure with the actions of the previous regime. His insight holds plenty of credibility with me EVEN IF he felt he wasn't used to his potential while with the Rams, felt dissed , was an ex-saint , etc.... He gave reasons for his displeasure, and unlike any of us, he was actually in the locker room. He obviously holds some resentment .


Great interview Shakes!

 

[Shaky]

Knowing that MK is no longer a player ... I think he can be much more open about his feelings concerning coaches. If he offends someone , its not going to cost him a job. I believe his answers provided us a look into the Spags locker room that many seem to Not want to believe.

He gave more than 1 reason that he didn't believe in the past regime...

Poor leadership at the top (ownership)

Insecure / paranoid coaches

HC "played not to lose"

When he was recruited - he was told the offense would be like the Giants... and that did not happen.

Unhealthy atmosphere in the locker room for a number of reasons.


I'm not going to shyte can his answers because he's one of the first to openly voice his displeasure with the actions of the previous regime. His insight holds plenty of credibility with me EVEN IF he felt he wasn't used to his potential while with the Rams, felt dissed , was an ex-saint , etc.... He gave reasons for his displeasure, and unlike any of us, he was actually in the locker room. He obviously holds some resentment .


Great interview Shakes!

right on Mon. :bg:

 

[Stranger]

Spags had spies throughout the organization? WTF?

Enh, if true, and we don't know (I mean Karney has nothing good to say about any Ram but Jackson)...I doubt it was that apocalyptic.

If anything it's equally likely that Karney just liked to complain and some guys got sick of it.

That team did not play in 2011 like a team that had given up on its coach or didn't respect him--meaning, it played hard even in bad situations. That was not true of Linehan. And unlike Spags, multiple players complained about Linehan, and let things get out about him.

Yeah, that's a new one from Karney. In the umpteen interviews he's done prior to this one with The Herd, he didn't feel compelled to talk about THAT? I dunno. Even if it's true, he should probably let go of the ghost now. Unless he's just that jaded. Nobody else has come forward to say anything even remotely like what he's saying, so all we have to go on is his account anyway.

Probably because his playing days are over and he doesn't want to work in the NFL is my guess. He had a 7 year career so he would know what's normal and what isn't. I wouldn't be surprised if others in similar situations in the future give corroborating accounts of Spags tenure here. Let's face it....Hanny is an easy going guy out of the NFL and what he's said and alluded to since Spags left had to have been earned. It's really out of character for Hanny yet he hasn't been shy about it......or how gracious and accommodating JF has been to him from the start. To me it smacks of too much smoke for there not to have been fire. Think about the O line play for the last 3 seasons. Could letting one of the best O line coaches in the history of the game use the weight room ad be available to answer questions that any lineman or player may have a bad thing? Regardless it's great to know that JF isn't the neophyte and will have the respect of the players and fellow coaches throughout the NFL.

I really haven't had a chance to listen to Hanny since the Spags firing... what's he been "alluding to" re: Spag since that time, can you summarize here. Also, what's Hanny been saying about his experiences with Fisher so far? Thanks.

By the way, I've got no reason to doubt MK. And if he's best buds with SJ, then SJ must think he is a good guy who wouldn't BS us due to some childlike-grudge. So again, I'm buying what he is saying.

 

[Anonymous]

By the way, I've got no reason to doubt MK. And if he's best buds with SJ, then SJ must think he is a good guy who wouldn't BS us due to some childlike-grudge. So again, I'm buying what he is saying.

You also have no reason for accepting his personal view as representing the team's.

The "best bud" thing is not going to cut it--my best friends have said things I don't believe.

And "bs-ing" isn't the only option. It's not a simple dichotomy with absolute truth on one side and direct unmitigated bs on the other. Sometimes guys see things a certain way, is all.

When Linehan got canned there were multiple voices from the team that let it be know he was not respected as a head coach, PLUS the team quit on him on the field, openly and visibly.

Neither thing is true this time.

There are any number of reasons for why MK could see things the way he sees things but not in the least represent a majority view, or even a significant minority view.

My bet is, the people who most strongly objected to Spags before he was fired will try to make it out as if MK is representative of a general team view. Meanwhile, everyone else will range from skeptical to "well there might be some truth in some of that." Many will simply point out that one guy dumping on a coach does not mean that the TEAM felt that way, and moreover there's no evidence they do.

 

[Anonymous]

Knowing that MK is no longer a player ... I think he can be much more open about his feelings concerning coaches. If he offends someone , its not going to cost him a job. I believe his answers provided us a look into the Spags locker room that many seem to Not want to believe.

He gave more than 1 reason that he didn't believe in the past regime...

Poor leadership at the top (ownership)

Insecure / paranoid coaches

HC "played not to lose"

When he was recruited - he was told the offense would be like the Giants... and that did not happen.

Unhealthy atmosphere in the locker room for a number of reasons.


I'm not going to shyte can his answers because he's one of the first to openly voice his displeasure with the actions of the previous regime. His insight holds plenty of credibility with me EVEN IF he felt he wasn't used to his potential while with the Rams, felt dissed , was an ex-saint , etc.... He gave reasons for his displeasure, and unlike any of us, he was actually in the locker room. He obviously holds some resentment .


Great interview Shakes!

right on Mon. :bg:

Yes indeed.

 

[Anonymous]

Spags had spies throughout the organization? WTF?

Enh, if true, and we don't know (I mean Karney has nothing good to say about any Ram but Jackson)...I doubt it was that apocalyptic.

If anything it's equally likely that Karney just liked to complain and some guys got sick of it.

That team did not play in 2011 like a team that had given up on its coach or didn't respect him--meaning, it played hard even in bad situations. That was not true of Linehan. And unlike Spags, multiple players complained about Linehan, and let things get out about him.

Yeah, that's a new one from Karney. In the umpteen interviews he's done prior to this one with The Herd, he didn't feel compelled to talk about THAT? I dunno. Even if it's true, he should probably let go of the ghost now. Unless he's just that jaded. Nobody else has come forward to say anything even remotely like what he's saying, so all we have to go on is his account anyway.

Probably because his playing days are over and he doesn't want to work in the NFL is my guess. He had a 7 year career so he would know what's normal and what isn't. I wouldn't be surprised if others in similar situations in the future give corroborating accounts of Spags tenure here. Let's face it....Hanny is an easy going guy out of the NFL and what he's said and alluded to since Spags left had to have been earned. It's really out of character for Hanny yet he hasn't been shy about it......or how gracious and accommodating JF has been to him from the start. To me it smacks of too much smoke for there not to have been fire. Think about the O line play for the last 3 seasons. Could letting one of the best O line coaches in the history of the game use the weight room ad be available to answer questions that any lineman or player may have a bad thing? Regardless it's great to know that JF isn't the neophyte and will have the respect of the players and fellow coaches throughout the NFL.

I really haven't had a chance to listen to Hanny since the Spags firing... what's he been "alluding to" re: Spag since that time, can you summarize here. Also, what's Hanny been saying about his experiences with Fisher so far? .

I haven't been keeping notes but X has done an X-cellent job at posting Hanny interviews so best is to listen to those interviews. If memory serves the topic was addressed immediately after JF was hired so that narrows it a lot. Spags prohibited Hanny from the weight room and facilities at Rams Park which was a change from how things were done before stretching back to Martz and probably Vermeil too, perhaps even earlier in St. Louis. The media was aware of the change and had it's own issues with the closed practices, distancing players from teams past successes by removing pictures etc. Hanny said that the first time he met JF at Rams Park he was told he was most welcome in the facility with JF even offering him an office (or something to that effect). In other words he was treated as a friend and valuable resource which he has most certainly earned. Very reminiscent of the valued relationships with past players and coaches the baseball Cardinals work hard to foster/maintain for the benefit of the current players. It's simply smart management to instill a culture of respect while embracing and striving for excellence. It's what winners do.

 

[Selassie I]

Players don't quit on the field for even the worst coaches in today's NFL ,,, that would be career suicide. Game tape does not lie, and every player knows that EVERY snap they are involved in will be analyzed by their potential future employer.

Saying that the players "didn't quit on the field" for Spags is really misleading ... players don't quit on the field nowadays because they want to continue to receive NFL paydays . That's the true motivation.

 

[Faceplant]

I think this article is very telling. For the record, I was of the opinion that Spags should get another year to prove himself, but these statements hash with everything I saw with my own eyes the past 2 years. Jason Smith over his head? Check. Loney subpar? Check. Spags playing "not to lose"? Check. Discount Karney's comments all you like, but he has a lot better understanding of how things were going at Rams park than any of us. Is he a little jaded? Sure. I doubt if he was still active in the NFL, that he would have been so pointed. then again, maybe the fact that he is retired gives us more "truthful indsight" out of him than what other, active players are saying/not saying. We heard early and often when Spags took over that he was a micomanager style HC. When it works, you are a genius, when it doesn't....well, you piss people off. I have to admit, I am more and more thankful that Fish is here. Great Q&A Shaky, thanks!!!