Jaw's 2014 QB Rankings: Bradford #24

[AZRamsFan93]

The validity lacks when it come to the point of the youth of the WRs. This is always a problem with me, because when you look at QBs the talent around them has to match also.

When you say a QB can "make every throw in the book"...the next page should look at the talent around him.

That said...I'm looking for Sam to be much better this year...the first year I feel comfortable with the help around.

There is SO MUCH MORE to playing QB than throwing the ball. Decision making, extending plays, reading defenses all come into play. Sam has great arm talent. It is rest of his game that has been lacking. That is not just from looking at stats, that is from watching him play.

Jaworski's criticisms are spot on, IMHO. One could argue the ranking could be a few slots higher (based on potential not production), but around 20 makes sense to me.

It's up to Sam to change that.

 

[AZRamsFan93]

I wouldn't rate any other position as equal or more important than the QB.

It is pretty simple really. To win you must score more than your opponent. Scoring requires possession of the ball (except for a safety). The QB touches the ball more than any other player on the team, and distributes it to the other players so that they can potentially score.

It's not rocket science. The QB has the biggest impact on the game.

 

[PrometheusFaulk]

Yes, and why this discussion is always "SB winner" is somethinjg I don't understand.......what about playoff teams or teams that make it to the divisional round? Regardless of how you slice it if you don't have a top tier QB the odds of getting deep into the playoffs, into the SB or winning the SB go WAY down.

If you don't have an excellent QB you better have a top tier defense.

I can only speak for myself here, but for me when discussing models of ideal play, the conversation is worth focusing on examples of champions.

I'd rather be a fan of the Bucs in the 2000's than a Bills fan in the 90's. To me, the ultimate goal should winning the thing.

 

[JackDRams]

It is pretty simple really. To win you must score more than your opponent. Scoring requires possession of the ball (except for a safety). The QB touches the ball more than any other player on the team, and distributes it to the other players so that they can potentially score.

It's not rocket science. The QB has the biggest impact on the game.

I hear ya man. It's not rocket appliances.

 

[PrometheusFaulk]

It is pretty simple really. To win you must score more than your opponent. Scoring requires possession of the ball (except for a safety). The QB touches the ball more than any other player on the team, and distributes it to the other players so that they can potentially score.

It's not rocket science. The QB has the biggest impact on the game.

The guys without the ball have just as much impact on the success or failure of a play as guys that do, IMO. It's all timing and it all has to work together or it all falls apart.

 

[Boffo97]

It is pretty simple really. To win you must score more than your opponent. Scoring requires possession of the ball (except for a safety). The QB touches the ball more than any other player on the team, and distributes it to the other players so that they can potentially score.

It's not rocket science. The QB has the biggest impact on the game.

But not even the best QB ever can succeed consistently without blocking, a run game and good receivers.

 

[RamWoodie]

There is SO MUCH MORE to playing QB than throwing the ball. Decision making, extending plays, reading defenses all come into play. Sam has great arm talent. It is rest of his game that has been lacking. That is not just from looking at stats, that is from watching him play.

Jaworski's criticisms are spot on, IMHO. One could argue the ranking could be a few slots higher (based on potential not production), but around 20 makes sense to me.

It's up to Sam to change that.

This is where I think you missed what I said. Of course decision making is in the picture. My point is that there's decision maling on both side of the coin. Things like "sight adjust" where it takes the QB and the WR to see the same thing.

So there is a lot to it...but there's alot WRs have to know also...that's the point at which you can't put it all on the QB...and we've all seen these young Ram WRs make wrong reads in what they do.

WHo ever saw a successful QB without good/excellent WRs???

 

[AZRamsFan93]

The guys without the ball have just as much impact on the success or failure of a play as guys that do, IMO. It's all timing and it all has to work together or it all falls apart.

That's your opinion, and it's as valid as anyone else's.

Jaworski just gets paid to voice his, and he has a little more credibility having played the position in the NFL for a long time.

MANY knowledgeable players, coaches, fans and observers of the game also agree with him. People like Bill Walsh and Steve Young, just to name a couple.

 

[AZRamsFan93]

This is where I think you missed what I said. Of course decision making is in the picture. My point is that there's decision maling on both side of the coin. Things like "sight adjust" where it takes the QB and the WR to see the same thing.

So there is a lot to it...but there's alot WRs have to know also...that's the point at which you can't put it all on the QB...and we've all seen these young Ram WRs make wrong reads in what they do.

WHo ever saw a successful QB without good/excellent WRs???

Clearly this is true. It is the ultimate team sport.

I have watched football for many years. I played as a kid, and both of my sons played football. One of them played NCAA football in a small division I school. What I am saying is that I have watched enough football to come to my own conclusions.

While Sam has talent, and his ability has shown through on the field at times, he has never been the masterful field general that inspires confidence - at least not from what I have seen.

Maybe, as some claim, that is ALL a function of the players around him. Maybe we will see him step up this year.

I want to see him consistently execute to his abilities, even in the face of difficult situations. Handle the pressure. Own 3rd down. Then I will believe that Sam has arrived as a top flight QB in this league.

I saw a stat from last year on Sam's completion percentage by downs:

1st - 68%
2nd - 62%
3rd - 48%

Now all QBs may see their completion percentage drop on third down, but that statistic supports what I see with my own 2 eyes: Sam does not play well under pressure.

I hope that changes this year, because a pristine pocket on 3rd down is a rare quantity in the NFL.

The Rams were 29th in the NFL in 3rd down efficiency last year - 28th the year before. That may be about everything BUT Sam, but I tend to think he played a role in it.

 

[RamWoodie]

The Rams were 29th in the NFL in 3rd down efficiency last year - 28th the year before. That may be about everything BUT Sam, but I tend to think he played a role in it.

No one's saying Sam doesn't play a role...but let's not act as if there wasn't issues with WRs and OLine...there clearly was....but at least the OLine pulled together in the second half of the season.

I'll say this...the WRs the Rams now have are the best they've had since Sam came into the league...let's see what happens.

 

[Username]

I disagree that Jaws is a good analyst of QBs. I read his gushing and glowing reports on Kaepernick and it soured me on him. Not because Kaep is a Niner but because the Guy cannot even read the entire field. It kind of shows lack of mental acumen when QBing. Yet Jaws labelled him as possibly the best QB to ever play the game.

It sure was odd to see him struggle in the beginning of the year w/o Crabtree, Davis, or his defensive superstars. Why would he need those guys to win? I mean, he's a quarterback. Possibly the greatest one of all time.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

It sure was odd to see him struggle in the beginning of the year w/o Crabtree, Davis, or his defensive superstars. Why would he need those guys to win? I mean, he's a quarterback. Possibly the greatest one of all time.

Sure he needs his superstars too. But what NFL great has his OC alter the playbook to make it so his QB only has to read half the field?

 

[Username]

Don't even get me started on why the Arizona Carson Palmers are better than Sam either. He literately marched onto the Seattle Wilsons home turf and beat him at home last year. Not something too many men can say. His 52.0 completion percentage and 4 interceptions shined bright that day. Great performance to beat the SB Champ(s) single handedly.

 

[Username]

Sure he needs his superstars too. But what NFL great has his OC alter the playbook to make it so his QB only has to read half the field?

One that doesn't know the strengths of his team and players obviously. I mean we're talking about possibly the greatest fucking QB of all time, and we're limiting his reads? That's like something you'd do to a young QB with a developing arm, ridiculous line, running game, and a top 2 defense. It's a good thing Seattle didn't/doesn't do that to Russel Wilson either. Would've never won the SB without him throwing the ball 65 times a game out of the shotgun 5 wide. Too bad Sam couldn't handle doing that in the beginning of the year when we needed him to. The rest of the team was on fire while we we're just waiting for #8 to catch up again. Sigh...

 

[LACHAMP46]

Trent Dilfer & Dan Marino....enough said.....

 

[rhinobean]

One that doesn't know the strengths of his team and players obviously. I mean we're talking about possibly the greatest freaking QB of all time, and we're limiting his reads? That's like something you'd do to a young QB with a developing arm, ridiculous line, running game, and a top 2 defense. It's a good thing Seattle didn't/doesn't do that to Russel Wilson either. Would've never won the SB without him throwing the ball 65 times a game out of the shotgun 5 wide. Too bad Sam couldn't handle doing that in the beginning of the year when we needed him to. The rest of the team was on fire while we we're just waiting for #8 to catch up again. Sigh...

Where's the blue font, User?

 

[PrometheusFaulk]

That's your opinion, and it's as valid as anyone else's.

Jaworski just gets paid to voice his, and he has a little more credibility having played the position in the NFL for a long time.

MANY knowledgeable players, coaches, fans and observers of the game also agree with him. People like Bill Walsh and Steve Young, just to name a couple.

I am not surprised in the least that two great former NFL quarterbacks and a great HC who got to field two of the best quarterbacks of all time would feel that way.

Our opinions are informed by our experiences (as you note, their's is certainly more credible than mine).

I wonder what coaches like Mike Ditka, Bill Parcells, Chuck Noll, Don Shula, etc. would look like. We've seen Vince Lombardi's - "some people try to find things that don't exist, but football is only two things - blocking and tackling." You may be inclined to dismiss such a notion as archaic, but it sure looked to me like the Seahawks were better than the Broncos at blocking and tackling.

In any event, as you said we all have opinions and they all have equal validity. I just tend to get my feathers ruffled over this topic because I feel like if you don't agree with the notion that this one position carries more weight than the others you're dismissed as something of a heretic by some folks.

It's something I was taught since I was playing this game at a young age and whenever I played - all positions are equally important, all are equally accountable.

 

[moklerman]

I am not surprised in the least that two great former NFL quarterbacks and a great HC who got to field two of the best quarterbacks of all time would feel that way.

Our opinions are informed by our experiences (as you note, their's is certainly more credible than mine).

I wonder what coaches like Mike Ditka, Bill Parcells, Chuck Noll, Don Shula, etc. would look like. We've seen Vince Lombardi's - "some people try to find things that don't exist, but football is only two things - blocking and tackling." You may be inclined to dismiss such a notion as archaic, but it sure looked to me like the Seahawks were better than the Broncos at blocking and tackling.

In any event, as you said we all have opinions and they all have equal validity. I just tend to get my feathers ruffled over this topic because I feel like if you don't agree with the notion that this one position carries more weight than the others you're dismissed as something of a heretic by some folks.

It's something I was taught since I was playing this game at a young age and whenever I played - all positions are equally important, all are equally accountable.

Equally accountable, yes. Equally important, no. A good/great QB is far more important than a gunner or a blocking TE or any number of other positions.

All 11 positions are equally accountable to do what they are supposed to be doing and any one position can cause a play to break down but the responsibilities of the QB go far beyond the other positions in most cases.

 

[PrometheusFaulk]

Equally accountable, yes. Equally important, no. A good/great QB is far more important than a gunner or a blocking TE or any number of other positions.

All 11 positions are equally accountable to do what they are supposed to be doing and any one position can cause a play to break down but the responsibilities of the QB go far beyond the other positions in most cases.

I don't feel that having more tasks inherently means "of greater importance." But that's where the debate becomes perhaps semantical.

 

[moklerman]

I don't feel that having more tasks inherently means "of greater importance." But that's where the debate becomes perhaps semantical.

That you consider responsibilities "tasks" is curious to me.

It isn't just a task for the QB to decide whether a play should be run as called or to audible out of it. It is everyone else's task to run the play that the QB is responsible for calling though. Responsibility>task.

I still get the feeling that you're having a hard time agreeing that the QB position is more important than any other positions because you're interpreting it as the QB position is more important than all the other positions combined.