Covid 19 thread

  • To unlock all of features of Rams On Demand please take a brief moment to register. Registering is not only quick and easy, it also allows you access to additional features such as live chat, private messaging, and a host of other apps exclusive to Rams On Demand.

Dieter the Brock

Fourth responder
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
May 18, 2014
Messages
8,191
Sales for my company have been down this year.

My sales to Chinese buffets alone are down over 98% this year.
Nobody wants to go to a Chinese buffet anymore, I mean if anyone sneezes at a Chinese buffet it automatically qualifies as a Chinese virus doesn't it? Just by default? Anyway, the point is I can't move sneeze guards cause restaurants aren't open and buffets are basically orgies of bacterias, fungi, and viruses, so it's been tough. Real tough.

So all of us at Dieter The Corp. have been racking our brains trying to figure out how to boost sales.

And then after reading all these posts on school safety in the times of Covid 19 - it struck me!
Simply repurposed all my companies sneeze guards into

STUDENT SAFETY SHIELDS

This here below is the "Birx Executive" Model.
It comfortably sits one student and has dual sneeze protection from Covid carrying Teachers and fellow students.
It is really easy to clean, and you can upgrade for the Hand Sanitizer holder, but that will be extra.
We also offer foil stamping in case you want to put your school's logo on it - we do have an extensive library of clip art but if your school requires a custom logos that too will be extra.

Anyway, I hope this helps any of you parents out there worried about sending their kids back to school.
This new (patent pending) invention will put all your fears to bed.

I'm taking preorders now! (also good for homeschool * parts made in China)
rams sneeze guard.jpg
 
  • HaHa
Reactions: RamBall

flv


SportsBook Bookie
Joined
Nov 3, 2013
Messages
14,440
If masks and shield and social distancing and washing hands protect you and others from why is it supposed to be so incredibly dangerous to send kids to school?
People, (especially kids), can't wear can't/won't wear masks indoors for 6-8 hours a day. Being in close proximity with several hundred different people moving from 1 classroom to another would maximise the risk if 1 single person had the virus. Going back to my childhood we had 720 kids at our school. Maths was taught in 1 part of the school, languages were in another, and science was in it's own science block. We were in classes of 25-35 less than 1M apart and we didn't know who had been in that or any other classroom at any time earlier in the day. It would have been a breeding ground for covid19. There's a huge difference between that and putting a child into the same group of 15-20 with the same teacher and the same room for the whole school day, every day. This form of education would be more basic and less specialised. I'd put a child into that latter situation but not the scenario I went to school in. There's also a natural inclination for parents to protect their kids whilst taking chances with their own lives.

In the UK we have situation where kids MUST wear masks on the buses to and from schools, but they are NOT allowed to wear a mask at school. There are 2 principles in play. 1 is to protect citizens and the other is to open up society and the economy. Those principles will inevitably have areas where they clash and result in eye-rolling dictats. It's an imperfect Universe. Suck it up and do the best you/we/I can.
 
  • Like
Reactions: RamBall and -X-

XXXIVwin

Hall of Fame
Joined
Jun 1, 2015
Messages
2,052




"Studies follow a hierarchy in terms of the quality of evidence that they can provide. Randomized double blind placebo control (RDBPC) studies are considered the “gold standard” of epidemiologic studies."

As far as I know, there has not been a single "Randomized double blind placebo control" study which shows HCQ is effective. Literally not a single one. As noted in the links above, the Henry Ford study was not a RDBPC, and was significantly flawed.

Remdesivir? Yes. 68 sites conducted a RDBPC study, and the results were statistically significant.


"68 sites were involved in this RDBPC. This included 47 in the US & 21 countries in Europe and Asia. RDBPC is where, one section of patients is given a Placebo & the other Remdesivir; the medical staff giving the treatment is also not aware of this differentiation like the patients, hence the term double blind. There is an independent data & safety monitoring which has all the information to monitor the progress. Patients treated with Remdesivir had a faster recovery time of 11 days compared with 15 days for the Placebo controlled group. The mortality rate was also better with 8.0 % for the section treated with Remdesivir compared to 11.6 % for those given Placebo."


Remdesivir or HCQ? HCQ or Remdesivir?

Shouldn't we make our choice based on the objective data of science, and not because of our political beliefs? I'm not "rooting" for or against either of these drugs. I'm just going by the results of the most rigorous scientific studies. If one is "rooting" for a drug, doesn't that say something about one's lack of objectivity?

Not a single "gold standard" RDBPC study showing HCQ is effective. Not. A. Single. One.
Were there "gold standard" RDBPC studies showing HCQ was NOT effective? Yes. Several of them.

Back in March and April, Faux News ran hundreds of stories on HCQ. But now? Crickets. Even though Faux News has pretty much given up on HCQ, some folks just can't let it go....
 
Last edited:

-X-

Dude
Joined
Jun 20, 2010
Messages
34,451
Name
The Dude




"Studies follow a hierarchy in terms of the quality of evidence that they can provide. Randomized double blind placebo control (RDBPC) studies are considered the “gold standard” of epidemiologic studies."

As far as I know, there has not been a single "Randomized double blind placebo control" study which shows HCQ is effective. Literally not a single one. As noted in the links above, the Henry Ford study was not a RDBPC, and was significantly flawed.

Remdesivir? Yes. 68 sites conducted a RDBPC study, and the results were statistically significant.


"68 sites were involved in this RDBPC. This included 47 in the US & 21 countries in Europe and Asia. RDBPC is where, one section of patients is given a Placebo & the other Remdesivir; the medical staff giving the treatment is also not aware of this differentiation like the patients, hence the term double blind. There is an independent data & safety monitoring which has all the information to monitor the progress. Patients treated with Remdesivir had a faster recovery time of 11 days compared with 15 days for the Placebo controlled group. The mortality rate was also better with 8.0 % for the section treated with Remdesivir compared to 11.6 % for those given Placebo."


Remdesivir or HCQ? HCQ or Remdesivir?

Shouldn't we make our choice based on the objective data of science, and not because of our political beliefs? I'm not "rooting" for or against either of these drugs. I'm just going by the results of the most rigorous scientific studies. If one is "rooting" for a drug, doesn't that say something about one's lack of objectivity?

Not a single "gold standard" RDBPC study showing HCQ is effective. Not. A. Single. One.
Were there "gold standard" RDBPC studies showing HCQ was NOT effective? Yes. Several of them.

Back in March and April, Faux News ran hundreds of stories on HCQ. But now? Crickets. Even though Faux News has pretty much given up on HCQ, some folks just can't let it go....
A few things here.

1. You gave 3 links that all point to the same health care policy consultant's letter to an editor, and a doctor in India's opinion. And even they don't dismiss the drug's efficacy. They just don't approve of the method used to reach their conclusion. Hardly the scathing rebuke CNN says it provided. Talk about not injecting politics into a debate over the matter. lol. Hyperbole at its finest on their part.

2. You seem rather passionate about the RDBPC method of study when it comes to this and all medical trials. Rightfully so. But what you and the other "scathing rebukers" failed to mention is that the Henry Ford study was their first step in identifying the efficacy of HCQ treatment. They admitted that their study results should be interpreted with some caution, should not be applied to patients treated outside of hospital settings and required further confirmation in prospective, randomized controlled trials.. It says as much right there in their peer review submission. Also, They're. Doing. Exactly. That. They're conducting that RDBPC right now. [https://www.henryford.com/whip-covid-19]. And yet, before they can complete their second study, people (MSM) are rushing out to completely discredit their findings. Well, that one guy and that other guy are, but the MSM is making it out to be an avalanche of rebukers.

3. Why isn't their website being taken down? They're making the same exact claims those 'frontline doctors' made. That's "dangerous information" according to big tech. Can't have people running around saying HCQ can save lives. Let me tell you why their website remains. Because the Henry Ford doctors aren't gathered in a presser with a Government building backdrop and people aren't spreading their video across multiple social media platforms with the same backdrop. Somebody had to put out that fire, and quick. So they did. It was their (big tech's) determination that it was dangerous information for us to have (their words). Name me one doctor at FB, Twitter or Google who conducted the studies you mentioned before they silenced those people. Just one.

Shouldn't we make our choice based on the objective data of science, and not because of our political beliefs?

You let me know when big tech follows this advice. Because as of right now, they're determining what information we can even have before we follow your preferred method of choice-making. And it sure as fuck was political on their part. Lastly, I can't take you seriously about keeping politics out of it after saying "Faux News" multiple times. How about we all just remain free to determine what we can take in as information and spit out as opinion without big tech making that decision for us.
 

OC--LeftCoast

Agent Provocateur
Joined
Nov 24, 2012
Messages
2,895
Name
Greg
I’m going to give @XXXIVwin the benefit of the doubt over the out of character “Faux News” rant, it was late Friday and like many perhaps he was making merry, he’s typically above that, but if were ( oh wait) to reply it would be along the lines of just how many times must one cover the same story?

I get we all have our opinions on news sources but it’s probably not a bad thing to tone down the labels
 

Dieter the Brock

Fourth responder
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
May 18, 2014
Messages
8,191
Come on, why is this HCQ debate still going on?

The vaccines are gonna be huge money makers - look at the billions being thrown their way already

Can’t let some $5 pill get in the way

You don’t think those that run those platforms, news agencies, big tech, aren’t invested in the vaccines - come on now

Our medical system is like a dinosaur - just look at any alternative medicine and Google it, you’ll see hundreds of websites slamming them calling them quackery. I use Standard Process and they are amazing company but just type in Standard Process into Google and you’ll see what i mean. Who’s gonna let someone fix the root cause of your issue and cure you when big pharma can treat your symptom forever with their pills?

Money my friends.
It’s all about money.
 

XXXIVwin

Hall of Fame
Joined
Jun 1, 2015
Messages
2,052
A few things here.

1. You gave 3 links that all point to the same health care policy consultant's letter to an editor, and a doctor in India's opinion. And even they don't dismiss the drug's efficacy. They just don't approve of the method used to reach their conclusion. Hardly the scathing rebuke CNN says it provided. Talk about not injecting politics into a debate over the matter. lol. Hyperbole at its finest on their part.

2. You seem rather passionate about the RDBPC method of study when it comes to this and all medical trials. Rightfully so. But what you and the other "scathing rebukers" failed to mention is that the Henry Ford study was their first step in identifying the efficacy of HCQ treatment. They admitted that their study results should be interpreted with some caution, should not be applied to patients treated outside of hospital settings and required further confirmation in prospective, randomized controlled trials.. It says as much right there in their peer review submission. Also, They're. Doing. Exactly. That. They're conducting that RDBPC right now. [https://www.henryford.com/whip-covid-19]. And yet, before they can complete their second study, people (MSM) are rushing out to completely discredit their findings. Well, that one guy and that other guy are, but the MSM is making it out to be an avalanche of rebukers.

3. Why isn't their website being taken down? They're making the same exact claims those 'frontline doctors' made. That's "dangerous information" according to big tech. Can't have people running around saying HCQ can save lives. Let me tell you why their website remains. Because the Henry Ford doctors aren't gathered in a presser with a Government building backdrop and people aren't spreading their video across multiple social media platforms with the same backdrop. Somebody had to put out that fire, and quick. So they did. It was their (big tech's) determination that it was dangerous information for us to have (their words). Name me one doctor at FB, Twitter or Google who conducted the studies you mentioned before they silenced those people. Just one.

Shouldn't we make our choice based on the objective data of science, and not because of our political beliefs?

You let me know when big tech follows this advice. Because as of right now, they're determining what information we can even have before we follow your preferred method of choice-making. And it sure as fuck was political on their part. Lastly, I can't take you seriously about keeping politics out of it after saying "Faux News" multiple times. How about we all just remain free to determine what we can take in as information and spit out as opinion without big tech making that decision for us.
Great post, man. Reasoned, fair, civil. Wish others were capable of engaging in dialogue like this, rather than just plugging their ears at anything that might contradict their predetermined views, and looking for fake “gotcha!!” BS points.

You actually care about objective truth, whereas others here only care about info that confirms their pre-existing narrative.

Will respond to your 3 reasoned points when I have the time.
 
  • Like
Reactions: flv and -X-

-X-

Dude
Joined
Jun 20, 2010
Messages
34,451
Name
The Dude
Great post, man. Reasoned, fair, civil. Wish others were capable of engaging in dialogue like this, rather than just plugging their ears at anything that might contradict their predetermined views, and looking for fake “gotcha!!” BS points.

You actually care about objective truth, whereas others here only care about info that confirms their pre-existing narrative.

Will respond to your 3 reasoned points when I have the time.
Thanks, but I'll be deleting your post after you submit it because I deem it to be harmful information. ;)
 

Angry Ram

Captain RAmerica Original Rammer
Joined
Jul 1, 2010
Messages
11,851
In my area they're cancelling recess and eating lunch in the classroom because they know that won't work.
If it were me, depending on how big the yard was I'd split them into 2 groups, and rotate everyday.

But then you gotta think about that its not just one grade, it's 6 grades, 7 if you include pre-k. You'd have to wipe down the playground everyday for every grade level. For 180-200 days. That's a shit ton of money right there, and its not like public schools are swimming in cash.

The more you unwrap it, the more variables come in to play. It's gonna be very hard for everyone.
 

Neil039

Rams On Demand Sponsor
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Apr 3, 2020
Messages
378
In Colorado Springs they are floating a few ideas. I live in a large, but very strong school district. Half day for all grades K-5. No lunch. Teachers get 1 hour to eat and clean classrooms. No parents or outside visitors.

(Not sure this will work)For Junior High and High School ages, 1 assigned half day a week with set classrooms for students. Teachers will assign work(all iPad based in my sons school). Course designated teachers will meet with the smaller classes and provide assistance with work. Thoroughly cleaning school in the evening and on no student days.

This is all speculative at the moment. The first day of school has been pushed back a week and may be pushed back again by Friday.

This may be the first time in recent history where massive amounts of kids voluntarily stay back a grade. The ‘“I graduated High School when I was 20“ phrase may not be to uncommon soon.
 

Dieter the Brock

Fourth responder
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
May 18, 2014
Messages
8,191
This may be the first time in recent history where massive amounts of kids voluntarily stay back a grade. The ‘“I graduated High School when I was 20“ phrase may not be to uncommon soon.
Take your GED
Enroll in JC for 2 years
2 years at University
Done at 20
 

OC--LeftCoast

Agent Provocateur
Joined
Nov 24, 2012
Messages
2,895
Name
Greg
Great post, man. Reasoned, fair, civil. Wish others were capable of engaging in dialogue like this, rather than just plugging their ears at anything that might contradict their predetermined views, and looking for fake “gotcha!!” BS points.

You actually care about objective truth, whereas others here only care about info that confirms their pre-existing narrative.

Will respond to your 3 reasoned points when I have the time.
If I may toss my simple minded perspective in here;

”Jane, You Ignorant Slut” :D (can’t believe I used 70’s comedy on a 2020 Libersaurous Rex)

You can post links until the end of time dismissing HCQ...conjecture, fact, fake news who the hell really knows for certain ( no one yet) however one thing you can count on is, there is one hell of a lot more going on here than meets the eye.

Now to the point to what I have actually seen with my own eyes and therefore base my beliefs on, cuz I’m that annoying prick that tends to believe what he sees over what he’s told, (that’s literally cost me thousands upon X
thousands, sigh) I have actually viewed many, many Doctors annnnnnd Patients hailing the drug not as a cure, but a inhibitor to slow the virus effects, and you know I’m sorry but thru my view that’s just going to outweigh links that, whom the hell knows complete research data

Why such push back on a band aid...More importantly...why the blatant censorship? I don’t like the look of it, I’d hope we could take a step back and ponder these points.

To deny there isn’t a political angle here in my view to quote Mike Tyson would be “ludacwiss”

Just a calculated reasonable response to those whom take to link posting as a final arbiter, I guess I’m saying I trust what I physically see over what I read from unverified sources.

Cheers!
 
Last edited:

Allen2McVay

Rookie
Joined
Mar 29, 2020
Messages
192
Name
Jim
However one thing you can count on is, there is one hell of a lot more going on here than meets the eye.

I’m saying I trust what I physically see over what I read from unverified sources.
Personally, I think there is a lot less going on here than meets the eye.

The U.S. is the greatest Democracy in the history of the world, and that is a great thing ... Except during a Pandemic.

I believe in simply listening to the experts, and following the science and the numbers.

Wear a mask and socially distance. Development of comprehensive Testing and Contact Tracing programs. Thoughtful, phased-in re-openings that only start with measured declines in positivity rates, hospitalizations, incubations and deaths.

That's the game-plan for getting on-top of this virus. Not beating it or ending it but gaining some control over it to realistically and responsibly opening the economy.

The U.S. has not done any of these things on a National-level

It's been successfully done across the world by most countries but not the U.S.
 

OC--LeftCoast

Agent Provocateur
Joined
Nov 24, 2012
Messages
2,895
Name
Greg
Personally, I think there is a lot less going on here than meets the eye.

The U.S. is the greatest Democracy in the history of the world, and that is a great thing ... Except during a Pandemic.

I believe in simply listening to the experts, and following the science and the numbers.

Wear a mask and socially distance. Development of comprehensive Testing and Contact Tracing programs. Thoughtful, phased-in re-openings that only start with measured declines in positivity rates, hospitalizations, incubations and deaths.

That's the game-plan for getting on-top of this virus. Not beating it or ending it but gaining some control over it to realistically and responsibly opening the economy.

The U.S. has not done any of these things on a National-level

It's been successfully done across the world by most countries but not the U.S.
I agree with most of your points, to that I’ll lift my mug to Cheers my man:beer2:

However, not so sure it was germane to my post

we good tho
 

kurtfaulk

Legend
Joined
Sep 7, 2011
Messages
11,196
Come on, why is this HCQ debate still going on?

The vaccines are gonna be huge money makers - look at the billions being thrown their way already

Can’t let some $5 pill get in the way

You don’t think those that run those platforms, news agencies, big tech, aren’t invested in the vaccines - come on now

Our medical system is like a dinosaur - just look at any alternative medicine and Google it, you’ll see hundreds of websites slamming them calling them quackery. I use Standard Process and they are amazing company but just type in Standard Process into Google and you’ll see what i mean. Who’s gonna let someone fix the root cause of your issue and cure you when big pharma can treat your symptom forever with their pills?

Money my friends.
It’s all about money.
i just typed in standard process into google and all i got on the first page was information about their products.

.
 

12intheBox

Legend
Joined
Sep 12, 2013
Messages
7,114
Name
Wil Fay
Thanks, but I'll be deleting your post after you submit it because I deem it to be harmful information. ;)
As a mod - you can do that. ROD takes down peoples comments all the time because they think that they would be bad for the board - and truth be told - those decisions are usually correct. ROD gets to control the posts on ROD.

Why is it such a problem for Twitter and Facebook to make those calls for themselves?

If they think that people running out and taking HCQ is going to be bad for them - and they don’t want people seeing advice for them to “hurt themselves” on their platform, don’t they have some freedom to make that choice?