Brian Flores suing NFL

[blackbart]

It's not easy to draw a baseline. I'm not arguing that 60% of assistant coaches must be Black. I'm not arguing that 30% of head coaches must be Black. But I am arguing that when 30% of assistant coaches are Black and only 3% of head coaches are Black right now, it strongly demonstrates that there is an issue. A guy like Brian Flores getting fired despite overachieving and winning the past two years only highlights that problem.

So you’re saying Flores got fired because of his race not because he wasn’t on the same page as the owners?

 

[Kupped]

but that's not their fault. they were only following the rules. they had their guy but needed to interview two black coaches to follow the rules.

the rooney rule needs to be tweaked somehow. i'm not sure how or if it's even possible. i guess the league just hoped the owners would eventually just hire the best guy for the job on their own accord without having the rule in place.

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Well, no… it is their fault.

They know the rules and decided that it wasn’t important to observe the rule.

If they’d made their decision before making a decision, that’s violating the rule which is about the hiring process.

“the best guy” argument is funny to me.. because of how often they hire the wrong guy. Comedy.

 

[jrry32]

So you’re saying Flores got fired because of his race not because he wasn’t on the same page as the owners?

I don't know why Flores got fired. But I am saying that there's a history of Black coaches being undeservedly fired in the NFL. Indeed, it's what prompted the league to create the Rooney Rule. The NFL's HC ranks are very disproportionately white, even relative to the rest of the coaching pool. That is indicative of a problem. It indicates that they're not hiring purely on merit.

 

[dieterbrock]

Which reinforces that they brought Flores in as a sham.

Why? Daboll was their top candidate. Happens in every coaching cycle. Happens in real world too. Daboll was their top choice, but they still had others to interview.
So what if after Daboll left his interview, he signed with Miami?
Was it still a sham?
Byron Leftwich was Jacksonville top candidate, they still interviewed others. Were those sham interviews?

 

[Kupped]

Why? Daboll was their top candidate. Happens in every coaching cycle. Happens in real world too. Daboll was their top choice, but they still had others to interview.
So what if after Daboll left his interview, he signed with Miami?
Was it still a sham?
Byron Leftwich was Jacksonville top candidate, they still interviewed others. Were those sham interviews?

It’s not about whether you’ve got a “top candidate”… it’s about whether you’ve made an actual decision.

The Vikings process is a view of a real process, imo.

 

[dieterbrock]

But I am saying that there's a history of Black coaches being undeservedly fired in the NFL

A history? Like who? Hue Jackson? Marvin Lewis? I completely agree that Flores firing is mind boggling, and the details of that will be sorted out. But who got so undeservedly fired?

 

[dieterbrock]

It’s not about whether you’ve got a “top candidate”… it’s about whether you’ve made an actual decision.

The Vikings process is a view of a real process, imo.

They made a decision that Daboll was their top guy, they didnt offer him a deal until after the interviews were complete.
If they offered Daboll the job before the other interviews, then yes its a sham. But until he signs on the dotted line, its anyones game.
I wholeheartedly agree that its inexcusable that the NFL has such a low rate, and that they need a better solution. I dont think creating a racial divide over what wasnt a racially motivated decision is a terrible way to make said change

 

[Kupped]

They made a decision that Daboll was their top guy, they didnt offer him a deal until after the interviews were complete.
If they offered Daboll the job before the other interviews, then yes its a sham. But until he signs on the dotted line, its anyones game.
I wholeheartedly agree that its inexcusable that the NFL has such a low rate, and that they need a better solution. I dont think creating a racial divide over what wasnt a racially motivated decision is a terrible way to make said change

That’s the argument and the basis of the suit that Flores will have to prove. That they had already made their decision.

 

[jrry32]

A history? Like who? Hue Jackson? Marvin Lewis? I completely agree that Flores firing is mind boggling, and the details of that will be sorted out. But who got so undeservedly fired?

Tony Dungy (TB), Jim Caldwell (DET), Art Shell (1994), Lovie Smith (CHI), and David Culley. I laughed at the Culley hire, but he did well enough that a god awful Texans team didn't end up with the #1 pick. And now, the Texans reportedly want to replace him with a guy who has never coached in college or the NFL (Josh McCown).

 

[Dodgersrf]

His foot is in a door already. The next step he takes is a huge one. I don’t blame him for treading carefully.

For some of these guys - the interview is a 2 way thing. I’d bet my left nut that Harbaugh went into Minnesota and demanded control over personnel - was told no - and then went back to Michigan for that reason.

I Bet he gets the Bucks job, once Arians figures out what he's going to do.

 

[kurtfaulk]

Well, no… it is their fault.

They know the rules and decided that it wasn’t important to observe the rule.

If they’d made their decision before making a decision, that’s violating the rule which is about the hiring process.

“the best guy” argument is funny to me.. because of how often they hire the wrong guy. Comedy.

What?

They only interviewed Flores and the other guy because of the rules. Otherwise they would have just signed daboll after his interview. He was always their guy.

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[Kupped]

What?

They only interviewed Flores and the other guy because of the rules. Otherwise they would have just signed daboll after his interview. He was always their guy.

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Right.

Which is the point.. they had their guy before going through an open process.

 

[kurtfaulk]

Right.

Which is the point.. they had their guy before going through an open process.

They still followed the rules to a tee.

You can't force a team to sign someone they don't want.

Flores isn't so much better than daboll. Especially with qbs. It could be argued he's much worse with qbs. Nobody heard the hire and were shocked daboll got the job instead of Flores.

.

 

[Kupped]

They still followed the rules to a tee.

You can't force a team to sign someone they don't want.

Flores isn't so much better than daboll. Especially with qbs. It could be argued he's much worse with qbs. Nobody heard the hire and were shocked daboll got the job instead of Flores.

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Lol… no, that wouldn’t be following the rules.

 

[Antonius]

Tony Dungy (TB), Jim Caldwell (DET), Art Shell (1994), Lovie Smith (CHI), and David Culley. I laughed at the Culley hire, but he did well enough that a god awful Texans team didn't end up with the #1 pick. And now, the Texans reportedly want to replace him with a guy who has never coached in college or the NFL (Josh McCown).

It’s always made me a bit uncomfortable how black head coaches don’t always seem to get their chance at building something like non-black coaches. Steve Spagnuolo was given three years, and posted nothing but losing records. In two out of the three years he had, he won a total of three games.

Steve Wilks was fired from AZ after one 3-13 record. Culley was let go after one season. Hue Jackson was the Raiders head coach for one year.

 

[blackbart]

I don't know why Flores got fired. But I am saying that there's a history of Black coaches being undeservedly fired in the NFL. Indeed, it's what prompted the league to create the Rooney Rule. The NFL's HC ranks are very disproportionately white, even relative to the rest of the coaching pool. That is indicative of a problem. It indicates that they're not hiring purely on merit.

The owners of the business have every right to make the decision who works for them.

Do you happen to have a list of this history of blacks who have been fired without cause? How many of them have won court cases for unlawful termination?

I’m calling bullshit.

 

[Kupped]

It’s always made me a bit uncomfortable how black head coaches don’t always seem to get their chance at building something like non-black coaches. Steve Spagnuolo was given three years, and posted nothing but losing records. In two out of the three years he had, he won a total of three games.

Steve Wilks was fired from AZ after one 3-13 record. Culley was let go after one season. Hue Jackson was the Raiders head coach for one year.

Culley getting fired was something.

 

[Kupped]

The owners of the business have every right to make the decision who works for them.

Do you happen to have a list of this history of blacks who have been fired without cause? How many of them have won court cases for unlawful termination?

I’m calling bullshit.

It’s the owners own rule designed to make themselves look good.

So, they did this to themselves.

 

[kurtfaulk]

Lol… no, that wouldn’t be following the rules.

Yes, it is.

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[blackbart]

It’s the owners own rule designed to make themselves look good.

So, they did this to themselves.

I agree. It is a publicity stunt.