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Over My Dead Body

Discussion in 'OFF TOPIC' started by Thordaddy, Jun 13, 2014.

  1. PrometheusFaulk Active Member

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    Right or wrong, in our society the issue folks from a race of subjugated people take with slurs carry weight while similar complaints about peoples from a ruling class do not.
     
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  2. -X- Not into the whole brevity thing.

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    I don't disagree with that. The question, I guess, is how loud do the cries have to be before it becomes a government issue?
     
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  3. PrometheusFaulk Active Member

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    That's the old tipping point at work.
     
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  4. Thordaddy Binding you with ancient logic

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    Everyone does and always will discriminate,it's a feature of choice , I'm saying free speech is more important because it gives voice to people with BOTH our points of view so yes it's more important.
    Using a word in a flattering way which is the Redskins intent is not as you characterize it discrimination ,it's lionization, it's a strawman argument you put forth from the beginning further the right to say things which offend is why the first amendment was crafted, if no one objects to it speech doesn't need protection,the issue is rights not feelings but some don't get that,so basically you have no case except through projecting motives that don't exist and subverting the constitution.
    Your whole argument's foundation is quicksand and all you can do to bolster it is sling mud.
     
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  5. Elmgrovegnome Well-Known Member

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    ZI agree that rights are more important than feelings. Good way to put it. I imagine if given the choice between free speech or never having their feelings hurt, every American race would choose freedom of speech.
     
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  6. Rambitious1 Well-Known Member

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    It meant what it stated.
    I as an American Indian don't care. Period.
    Nothing implied.................by me.
     
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  7. Rambition Member

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    yes, i believe the team name will be changed over his dead body. one can only eat so much crow before dying from it.
     
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  8. Rambition Member

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    word nazi...is that a rush limbaugh term?
     
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  9. Rambition Member

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    seems like lots of people still think this was for real. i agree with the people that say this was just a PR stunt.
     
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  10. Rambition Member

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    just as there is no reasonable person that would think that "Redskins" refers to potatoes, there is no reasonable person that would think that "Cracker Barrel" refers to caucasians.
     
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  11. Rambition Member

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    again...just as no reasonable person would think that "Cracker Barrel" refers to caucasians, no and reasonable person would think that "Redskins" refers to potatoes, no reasonable person would think that Cracker Jack refers to caucasians. long before there was a cracker barrel, a cracker jack, or a washington redskins football team, there was the pejorative term for native americans "redskins."
     
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  12. Rambition Member

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    speak for yourself.

    i didn't think i was offended by "cracker" either, until i was dressing out in the gym after a workout and there were two young hispanic men dressing out at lockers near mine. one of them said to the other--and there was no one else anywhere near but me--"polly wanna cracker??" general hilarity ensued amongst them. i stopped going to that gym. none of which is mean to suggest that this is representative of hispanics in any way. just these two did it, and i found out i was wrong about whether the term could offend me.
     
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  13. Ramrasta The Knight Owl

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    I was obviously not being serious when I posted that... It was a sarcastic comment to denote how questionable the basis of the Redskins argument is.
     
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  14. bluecoconuts Well-Known Member

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    I won't lie, I find it very interesting that some of the people here defending "free speech" and saying that words are just words, etc etc, we're up in arms when they felt like something they like religion, or a specific example I remember, rich people, was being attacked or criticized. If I recall I was told it was offensive and should stop.
     
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  15. Thordaddy Binding you with ancient logic

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    Well I imade t up for the post but if Limbaugh wants to use it I'd be happy for him and anyone else who wants to to use it.
    Sounds like you want to now us the "Limbaugh /Fox News " intellectual dishonesty games so many on the left use when they run out of ideas and arguments .

    Look the people who have no case keep dragging it back to whether it's offensive and what if there was a common use of a word that described one of us we would feal differently, and as long as anyone responds to that it goes to the arena they want. But whether it offends is not and should not be the criteria.
    A team named the niggers would change their name because other teams would refuse to play them ,that's freedom,this is an effort to MAKE a word racist and then those who use it racist, it's so akin to the Spanish Inquisition it's remarkable.
    One more thing the term racist is objectionable to any person it is aimed at ,the implication towards all here who argue on the sdie of Dan Snyders side is that we are racist ,but it's wrong we aren't and it's a direct offense to say we are with the paltry specious evidence being presented ,it's overt and unmistakable and once iot's dispelled the attackers NEVER apologize for the false claim,they just go on to the next specious charge in their wrong headed righteous indignation,they are intentionally using a pejorative term towards ...not abstract groups but individuals and it needs to stop .
    If I tell you I use the term Redskin as a term of honor towards Native American and you don't accept my explanation of MY use ,you need to pull in your horns you are the one going too far.
    The people described as having Red Skin, were fierce warriors who fought hard against the advance of not really white men but technology and refused to accept it's inevitability,but fight they did in resourceful admirable albeit misguided fashion , technology was going to win,Dan Snyders team commemorates and honors that bravery, so he says, so I accept and even if I didn't ,I'd still not want my government to get involved ,it's not what we need government for and it usurps the power and rights of us all when it does.
     
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  16. moklerman Warner-phile

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    I'm sorry, but you're part of the problem then. You stopped going to that gym because two random guys made some vague racial comment? I hope there's more to that story.

    But in general, I find it difficult to be insulted by some racial slur when I'm not ashamed or embarrassed about my race. Because it all boils down to, in this case, someone trying to insult me by calling me white. Cracker, honky...it all means "white"(Caucasian). I think that that would apply to redskin as well. If one is not ashamed of being Indian, then redskin shouldn't be offensive. Just descriptive. Hell, I cook in the sun so I'd call it a compliment to have nice, dark skin.
     
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  17. LesBaker Mr. Savant

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    It's de-evolution actually.

    The meaning of words can change, fag doesn't mean cigarette anymore, now its a cruel taunt/slur. Redskins hasn't been used as a slur in my lifetime, maybe even longer. I've never done any research on it but I have never heard that word one single time in life other than when it's used for that team and I have traveled all over the USA for over three decades.

    Marshall, the founder of the team, was for sure a racist and refused to sign black players. Some people are using that fact to blur the line between what a lousy human he was and the name of the team he owned. It's a poor argument in my opinion and has literally zero validity. Who would name a team after something he despised?
     
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  18. Warner4Prez Mɥɐʇ┴ɥǝHǝll¿

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    I think the name is BS. I live in North Dakota and have seen it used as a slur in ugly vivid color. That's just my stance. And just one more little tidbit for you: A linguistic analysis of 42 books published between 1875 and 1930 shows that negative contexts in the use of "redskin" were significantly more frequent than positive usage. The use of the word Indian to refer to Native Americans in a similarly selected set of books was more balanced, though negative contexts outnumbered positive contexts.

    I'm with Thor in one aspect though, I don't think it's a battle the government needs to be fighting.
    I think the people of the Oneida tribe and plenty of other Native tribes and organizations have done a great job in their attempt to get the name changed including billboards and TV spots.

    I may have mentioned it before, but a cynical side of me feels that Snyder is just allowing this to get trumped up so that he can change the name. What better way for a billionaire to line his pockets then by forcing hundreds of thousands of fans to shell out for new merchandise?
     
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  19. LesBaker Mr. Savant

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    42 books published between 1875 and 1930

    It's 2014.

    Meaning and intent has changed, again I don't like Snyder he is a POS, but his team's name is not a slur in this era. From 1875-1930 maybe it was, but we live in 2014.

    Want a fag between your lips? Would you like to discuss the Jokers boner?

    Words mean things, sometimes those things change.
     
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  20. Ramhusker Well-Known Member Pit Boss

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    I stopped by the Redskins camp in Richmond this week. I didn't notice anybody's panties in a wad just yet.
     
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