Cleveland looks like a logical trading partner

[CGI_Ram]

Me personally; I think they are fools if they don't trade up to ensure they get who they want. Otherwise, they take a huge gamble on their whole offseason plan.

 

[tonyl711]

if Houston takes a QB with the first pick (which I believe they will), it almost forces the Browns to deal with us, having only 2 QBs left worth drafting that high and knowing Jax is going QB. they are rumored to be in love with Johnny but I don't think they would turn down Bridgewater either, I don't think they are willing to try latter draft picks and FAcast offs anymore, they have the ammo and this is their best shot, I think they pull the trigger.

 

[BonifayRam]

if Houston takes a QB with the first pick (which I believe they will), it almost forces the Browns to deal with us, having only 2 QBs left worth drafting that high and knowing Jax is going QB. they are rumored to be in love with Johnny but I don't think they would turn down Bridgewater either, I don't think they are willing to try latter draft picks and FAcast offs anymore, they have the ammo and this is their best shot, I think they pull the trigger.

Morning tonyl711, how much harder will the Rams be to deal with IF the Texans pull the lever on a QB leaving Snead-Fisher-Williams looking directly @ DL'er Jadeveon?

 

[bluecollarram]

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/...xNbFzagwsAHZLkxI8xo0wN2M6ZV6UiDZsjNDsE3jURrD5

 

[Flash]

None of these guys are elite and they all have warts. There is no Luck in this draft and the whole idea trading up for a QB because we need to draft one is illogical. If Bortles is rated 7th on your board, you stay there, if Manziel is rated 15th on your board you don't trade up which you will come to find out. Going by that logic, teams would have traded up to select Geno Smith or Matt Barkley last year which we know is not the case. Teams like Atlanta, Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Atlanta, even Seattle and San Fran and Cincinatti didn't trade up to draft their franchise QB, it never works. The thought that every team wants to emulate Washington is rooted in a failed team and philosophy. Not only did it cause them to overspend the cap because they didn't have young draft picks they could plug in from day 1, they were forced to keep aging veterans for a marginal QB diva. Do you think Washington would make that trade again or build the team and continuity and wait for a guy like Foles or Wilson later in the draft? Nobody wants to emulate Washington or Dan Snyder..even the lowly Browns which you will see on draft day. If they trade up they think the guy is going to bring a Super Bowl but it won't be at the expense of building the team.

 

[tonyl711]

Morning tonyl711, how much harder will the Rams be to deal with IF the Texans pull the lever on a QB leaving Snead-Fisher-Williams looking directly @ DL'er Jadeveon?

lol, we hold the winning hand my friend, me personally I don't think they would take Clowney although it is a real possibility, but my thinking is we got teams by the balls, you want the second QB? show us the draft picks. you want a DE who many feel is a once in a generation player? show us the draft picks. then after we get their 4th, either 1 of the top 3 QBs will still be there or Clowney, another trade possibly, or you still get Clowney and their #26 pick and probably a second or third.

 

[Ramifications]

Remember when the Browns had #6 overall in 2004?

They passed on Big Ben. Deciding to stick with retreads like Garcia and drafted a QB in the 4th round. Big mistake.

You think they do that again?

They also passed on Rodgers (a lot of teams did, but they needed a QB more than most), and could have made a trade up of a few moves for Cutler. Some years they didn't have a high pick, or if they did, there wasn't a good fit for a QB there. They also missed on Dalton and Kaepernick at the top of the second in 2011. In the 15 years or so since the franchise was resurrected as a kind of expansion team (old Browns became the Ravens, which is why it is weird talking about old "Browns" records), they have spent three firsts on a QB. Tim Couch, Brady Quinn and Weedon (latter two not high picks at 1.22). They were hamstrung with Couch for a few years, but have done shockingly little since to crawl out of the perpetual QB hole. They always seem to have retreads. Even Weedon was a former baseball player within a few years of 30 when they got him.

In about the same time frame, IND spent one less first and got Manning and Luck, so they get a blue chip elite QB nearly uninterruptedly for more than two decades. Imagine if Manning had busted, would IND have goofed around for 15 years filling that hole before Luck? There should be a fan mutiny if they roll with Hoyer, after wasting the Richardson pick and recouping the 1.26, which they could package for a QB like Bridgewater or Manziel.

 

[Ramifications]

None of these guys are elite and they all have warts. There is no Luck in this draft and the whole idea trading up for a QB because we need to draft one is illogical. If Bortles is rated 7th on your board, you stay there, if Manziel is rated 15th on your board you don't trade up which you will come to find out. Going by that logic, teams would have traded up to select Geno Smith or Matt Barkley last year which we know is not the case. Teams like Atlanta, Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Atlanta, even Seattle and San Fran and Cincinatti didn't trade up to draft their franchise QB, it never works. The thought that every team wants to emulate Washington is rooted in a failed team and philosophy. Not only did it cause them to overspend the cap because they didn't have young draft picks they could plug in from day 1, they were forced to keep aging veterans for a marginal QB diva. Do you think Washington would make that trade again or build the team and continuity and wait for a guy like Foles or Wilson later in the draft? Nobody wants to emulate Washington or Dan Snyder..even the lowly Browns which you will see on draft day. If they trade up they think the guy is going to bring a Super Bowl but it won't be at the expense of building the team.

Rodgers and Cutler had warts, they weren't Luck either. It is also illogical to have zero competent QBs for 15 years. If they keep trying to rinky dink the most important position, could another 5-10 years go by? A quarter century? Are CLE fans that were around 50 during the reboot going to start dying before they find a QB? Manziel has been moving up, more likely he is top 5 than 15 by now. Last year unlike this year in that there weren't four of the top five and five or six of the top eight teams needing QBs.

ATL spent a 1.3 on Ryan. If they had traded up for him, he would have been the same QB. There aren't separate categories for a 1.3 QB that isn't traded up for one that is. He is just a 1.3 QB. Would he have somehow transmuted into a bust if they had needed to trade up for him? BTW, he had warts, and wasn't Luck either. The problem with talking about QBs like Wilson and Foles as day two and three successes, is how many failures were there in that range?

Trading up never works? What about Eli Manning? Michael Vick (pre-dog)? RG3 looked like a pretty good trade when he had a historically good rookie year (Y/A and low INT percentage - if we are going to knock Bradford for a bad Y/A, consistency would dictate recognizing he was great here?) and led a moribund franchise to the playoffs, and it is a little early to shovel the dirt on his NFL career, they did that deal for a decade. Shanahan running RG3 when he had a weakened knee until he suffered a torn ACL, losing trust and having a complicated situation worsened by nepotism doesn't make him a diva. A lot of disinformation was propagated by Skeletor as his empire lay crumbling and in ruins, so in a vain effort to salve his colossal ego and salvage the little remaining of the detritus and wreckage that used to be his reputation, he used mouthpieces to say Snyder was meddlesome, and he didn't want RG3. How come after basking in the genius of the ROY season, he didn't defer to Snyder and say he was the real genius, he had nothing to do with it, instead of falsely taking credit? Because it was complete malarkey, Skeletor is a pompous, disingenuous, bitter, petty, vindictive fool who was stupid enough to think it wouldn't be transparent that he was insulting the intelligence of others with his pathetic, preposterous, self-aggrandizing narratives. Lucky for us, the bile and spite that drove him to sit RG3 at the end in a feeble last gasp act of revenge on the owner and QB, and fingernails clawing on the edge of the cliff act of desperation to preserve the illusion of his competence by inserting Cousins at the end backfired and blew up in his face, they lost out and brought the prized 1.2 pick.

BTW, because RG3 tore his ACL (if WAS makes the playoffs year two, is this trade as critically panned?), should we assume a CLE QB also would?

Speaking of Cousins, he looked bad, can't imagine banking on him to be a starter. Schaub was mentioned elsewhere, and he did well in the past, but is coming off a career worst season. How often do guys like that turn into Kurt Warner? CLE fans have read this novel before - everybody dies in the end.

 

[Mojo Ram]

Good discussion.
I'm hoping HOU takes Clowney and then MINN,CLE,OAK and JACK all go into a frenzy.
I think Minnesota will be picking at #2 when its all said and done. We'll be sitting at #8 and #13 and a future 1st. Rams could move back up if they want to(with #8 and #13)...or just sit tight and grab two quality players.

 

[Flash]

Rodgers and Cutler had warts, they weren't Luck either. It is also illogical to have zero competent QBs for 15 years. If they trying to rinky dink the most important position, could another 5-10 years go by? A quarter century? Are CLE fans that were around 50 during the reboot going to start dying before they find a QB? Manziel has been moving up, more likely he is top 5 than 15 by now. Last year unlike this year in that there weren't four of the top five and five or six of the top eight teams needing QBs.

ATL spent a 1.3 on Ryan. If they had traded up for him, he would have been the same QB. There aren't separate categories for a 1.3 QB that isn't traded up for one that is. He is just a 1.3 QB. Would he have somehow transmuted into a bust I'd they had needed to trade up for him? BTW, he had warts, and wasn't Luck either. The problem with talking about QBs like Wilson and Foles as day two and three successes, is how many failures were there in that range?And yet a guy that was selected 18th in that draft has a Super Bowl and an MVP and Ryan doesn't. Look at the Playoffs last year, Kaepernick was a 2nd (I believe), Brady a 6th, Wilson a 3rd, Foles a 3rd., Dalton a 2nd (I believe). Then you have Manning, Newton, Luck and Alex Smith who were the first overall, Rodgers a later first and Brees the 32nd pick. I can think of just as many failed attempts at an early QB or guys that have turned out to be mediocre, which you guys are teetering on going into a 5th year with Bradford no matter what the excuse. Think of it this way, Dalton has proven to be a way better QB than Bradford and they are talking about looking for his replacement.

Trading up never works? What about Eli Manning? Michael Vick? RG3 looked like a pretty good trade when he had a historically good rookie year (Y/A and low INT percentage - if we are going to knock Bradford for a bad Y/A, consistency would dictate recognizing he was great here?) and led a moribund franchise to the playoffs, and it is a little early to shovel the dirt on his NFL career, they did that deal for a decade. Shanahan running RG3 when he had a weakened knee until he suffered a torn ACL, losing trust and having a complicated situation worsened by nepotism doesn't make him a diva, a lot of disinformation was propagated by Skeletor as his empire lay crumbling and in ruins, so in a vain effort to salve his colossal ego and salvage the little remaining of the detritus and wreckage that used to be his reputation, he used mouthpieces to say Snyder was meddlesome, and he didn't want RG3. How come after basking in the genius of the ROY season, he didn't defer to Snyder and say he was the real genius, he had nothing to do with it, instead of falsely taking credit? Because it was complete malarkey, Skeletor is a pompous, disingenuous, bitter, petty, vindictive fool who was stupid enough to think it wouldn't be transparent that he was insulting the intelligence of others with his pathetic, preposterous, self-aggrandizing narratives. Lucky for us, the bile and spite that drove him to sit RG3 at the end in a feeble last gasp act of revenge on the owner and QB, and fingernails clawing on the edge of the cliff act of desperation to preserve the illusion of his competence by inserting Cousins at the end backfired and blew up in his face, they lost out and brought the prized 1.2 pick. Vick..Really? Griffin? Eli is the best example and he has two Super Bowls which is the only reason he is in consideration. His below 60% completion percentage, his 81 career Rating and more turnovers than TDs aren't elite in the least but the Super Bowls do justify it. You guys should know, you had a Grocery Bagger for a QB and he dominated. I bet you would take that grocery bagger over the mediocrity you have had to deal with since he left.

Speaking of Cousins, he looked bad, can't imagine banking on him to be a starter. Schaub was mentioned elsewhere, and he did well in the past, but is coming off a career worst season. How often do guys like that turn into Kurt Warner? CLE fans have read this novel before - everybody dies in the end.

I am not advocating I want Cousins but I am not buying trading up for any of these guys. Go look at any big board. Manziel is 21st on Scout inc. right now.. the only reason people are saying top 5 is because they see teams that need a QB. You don't take the 21st rated player 1st in the draft. Stop listening to the draft pundits and use common sense. These same guys were talking Geno Smith #1 last year.

 

[tonyl711]

I am not advocating I want Cousins but I am not buying trading up for any of these guys. Go look at any big board. Manziel is 21st on Scout inc. right now.. the only reason people are saying top 5 is because they see teams that need a QB. You don't take the 21st rated player 1st in the draft. Stop listening to the draft pundits and use common sense. These same guys were talking Geno Smith #1 last year.

ive read where your FO says they want Johnny, don't know if its true, but if it is that must mean they think he is worth at the very least their #4.

 

[RamFan503]

I gotta ask. If the Browns have a QB they are hot after, and they honestly don't know who Houston is going to pick, why would they move up to #2 instead of #1? If I'm Houston, I take the same trade everyone thinks Cleveland would give the Rams. But honestly, I think Cleveland knows the Rams are not taking a QB. So that leaves the #1 and 3 spots to concern them if they indeed have a true #1 QB in mind. If they have 1a and 1b then I don't see them trading with us. Hopefully I'm wrong because I would love their two first rounders and a second for our #2 pick. I still don't see it happening.

 

[RamFan503]

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/...xNbFzagwsAHZLkxI8xo0wN2M6ZV6UiDZsjNDsE3jURrD5

Ouch!

 

[Rams and Gators]

I gotta ask. If the Browns have a QB they are hot after, and they honestly don't know who Houston is going to pick, why would they move up to #2 instead of #1? If I'm Houston, I take the same trade everyone thinks Cleveland would give the Rams. But honestly, I think Cleveland knows the Rams are not taking a QB. So that leaves the #1 and 3 spots to concern them if they indeed have a true #1 QB in mind. If they have 1a and 1b then I don't see them trading with us. Hopefully I'm wrong because I would love their two first rounders and a second for our #2 pick. I still don't see it happening.

For that to happen Houston would have to be happy with either a QB (any of the top 3) or Clowney or maybe someone else, and not be too bothered which one they get, similar to the Rams position, because if they trade down to 4 there's a risk the Rams will trade with someone and you end up missing out on your guy.

 

[Ram_of_Old]

I am not advocating I want Cousins but I am not buying trading up for any of these guys. Go look at any big board. Manziel is 21st on Scout inc. right now.. the only reason people are saying top 5 is because they see teams that need a QB. You don't take the 21st rated player 1st in the draft. Stop listening to the draft pundits and use common sense. These same guys were talking Geno Smith #1 last year.

I have Redskins fans daily telling me that the Skins will get their first round draft choice back when they send Cousins to the Rams. Ain't gonna happen. It would be a bad deal for both teams. The Rams don't need him and the Skins don't know when RG2.5 is going down again. Cousins is a serviceable QB. He is not worth a first round pick though.

 

[Rams and Gators]

I have Redskins fans daily telling me that the Skins will get their first round draft choice back when they send Cousins to the Rams. Ain't gonna happen. It would be a bad deal for both teams. The Rams don't need him and the Skins don't know when RG2.5 is going down again. Cousins is a serviceable QB. He is not worth a first round pick though.

Ask them why would we trade a first for a QB with more INTs than TDs when we can get Tebow for free?

 

[RamFan503]

None of these guys are elite and they all have warts. There is no Luck in this draft and the whole idea trading up for a QB because we need to draft one is illogical. If Bortles is rated 7th on your board, you stay there, if Manziel is rated 15th on your board you don't trade up which you will come to find out. Going by that logic, teams would have traded up to select Geno Smith or Matt Barkley last year which we know is not the case.

Or Ponder? No offense and it is great to get opinions from fans of other teams but your franchise doesn't have the greatest track record here. Ours still has some proving to do too but.... just sayin'

 

[Rams and Gators]

Or Ponder? No offense and it is great to get opinions from fans of other teams but your franchise doesn't have the greatest track record here. Ours still has some proving to do too but.... just sayin'

What's Ponder got to do with the Browns?

 

[max]

I am not advocating I want Cousins but I am not buying trading up for any of these guys. Go look at any big board. Manziel is 21st on Scout inc. right now.. the only reason people are saying top 5 is because they see teams that need a QB. You don't take the 21st rated player 1st in the draft. Stop listening to the draft pundits and use common sense. These same guys were talking Geno Smith #1 last year.

I've seen many other boards that have Manziel in the top 10. Gil Brandt has him rated #1. Drew Boylhart has him in the top 10 and going to the Browns and he calls Manziel an impact QB. http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings has Manziel at #7. But that's not the main point.

The main point is that you need a QB, just like you needed a QB in 2004. You can't pass on a QB with you first pick. You're FO needs to figure out which of those QB is gonna be a good one and go get him. If I was a Browns fan, I would be perfectly fine with sitting at #4 and not trading up. But if they passed on a QB at #4 and they could have had another Big Ben, then I would be sick.

 

[max]

I have Redskins fans daily telling me that the Skins will get their first round draft choice back when they send Cousins to the Rams. Ain't gonna happen. It would be a bad deal for both teams. The Rams don't need him and the Skins don't know when RG2.5 is going down again. Cousins is a serviceable QB. He is not worth a first round pick though.

Now that's very funny. And sad for the Skins fans.