Why do we continue to play zone?

[Kupped]

People on here act like personnel limitations aren’t a thing for Morris but praise giving up 2 firsts and more for Stafford because he’s a “better fit” for McVay’s offense…..

 

[Curiousenigma]

IMO Staley made smart calls and subtle adjustments throughout the game though especially after half time. While we're not as strong in personnel it's hard to feel like we're doing that now.

Staley also ran a slightly different scheme in the sense that although we played zone to start a play...it was just until the Db's could pick a guy to cover and then they followed them the rest of the play. We are now, to my eyes, playing old fashioned strict zone Defense and you can tell that by the way Reeder drops to an area and even though a player is 5yrds to his left or right...stays in his spot until he has to tackle someone (poorly I might add) when they catch it.

The flaw in this scheme...be it Staley's or Morris' is that teams will just do the 4-6yrd passes all day or just run the ball to eat up clock. It's literally the worst defense to have if you're playing from behind.

 

[Kupped]

Staley also ran a slightly different scheme in the sense that although we played zone to start a play...it was just until the Db's could pick a guy to cover and then they followed them the rest of the play. We are now, to my eyes, playing old fashioned strict zone Defense and you can tell that by the way Reeder drops to an area and even though a player is 5yrds to his left or right...stays in his spot until he has to tackle someone (poorly I might add) when they catch it.

The flaw in this scheme...be it Staley's or Morris' is that teams will just do the 4-6yrd passes all day or just run the ball to eat up clock. It's literally the worst defense to have if you're playing from behind.

And it’s the defense McVay wanted.

I don’t think Staley made many adjustments. His back end was much more flexible & reliable. Now? It’s find Ramsey and avoid him because no one else can make a play on the ball.
Johnson & Hill could make plays on the ball and did so repeatedly.

Last year.. if Ramsey was on someone.. and your second read had Williams with Johnson lurking.. you had problems to solve.
This year? You just avoid Ramsey.

Morris is mitigating damage on the back end. That’s about all he can do with the guys they’re rolling out.

I expected a shit ton more out of Burgess and Long. Total failures right now.

 

[FaulkSF]

That and the wide open WR's on third down. WIDE OPEN. NO ONE NEAR THEM.

The Scheme is absolutely a problem and played differently then last year. Williams has proven he can play man on man and so has Ramsey but you constantly see them in soft zone. Over the middle coverage should NEVER be Rapp and Reeder. How many times do we have to keep seeing this before some one who actually watches tape says this aint working.

Disrupting WR's at the LOS and causing the QB to look elsewhere equals sacks and turnovers.

Not to excuse the offense because they have to get their shit fixed to.

But those not seeing a problem with the defense are not seeing straight. Morris is a problem. Sorry.

What are you sorry about, you're right.

 

[Curiousenigma]

And it’s the defense McVay wanted.

I don’t think Staley made many adjustments. His back end was much more flexible & reliable. Now? It’s find Ramsey and avoid him because no one else can make a play on the ball.
Johnson & Hill could make plays on the ball and did so repeatedly.

Last year.. if Ramsey was on someone.. and your second read had Williams with Johnson lurking.. you had problems to solve.
This year? You just avoid Ramsey.

Morris is mitigating damage on the back end. That’s about all he can do with the guys they’re rolling out.

I expected a shit ton more out of Burgess and Long. Total failures right now.

Yes...McVay wanted it because he thought since he had such a hard time against it that everyone else would as well. I think this Fangio/Staley defense is going to be a 1yr wonder and most teams that decided to run it will decide to move on by next year. It's very inefficient in many ways and most good teams can counter it quite easily.

The other issue is, as you have said before many times, this Staley defense lost 2x to the niners last year and got pooched by GB in the playoffs. I know AD was injured last year...but he has fallen off a cliff this year. You only notice him a few times a game now compared to previous years. I think he is done being the defensive Player of the Year from here on out.

 

[Kupped]

Yes...McVay wanted it because he thought since he had such a hard time against it that everyone else would as well. I think this Fangio/Staley defense is going to be a 1yr wonder and most teams that decided to run it will decide to move on by next year. It's very inefficient in many ways and most good teams can counter it quite easily.

The other issue is, as you have said before many times, this Staley defense lost 2x to the niners last year and got pooched by GB in the playoffs. I know AD was injured last year...but he has fallen off a cliff this year. You only notice him a few times a game now compared to previous years. I think he is done being the defensive Player of the Year from here on out.

I don't think Donald has "fallen off a cliff", but I don't think he's as dominant as he's been in the past, for sure.

Otherwise, we're on the same page on this.

 

[Giles]

I lost my faith in Morris when I saw Reeder covering adams on 3rd down.

 

[TexasRam]

I lost my faith in Morris when I saw Reeder covering adams on 3rd down.

You could literally ask an 8 year old how they might stop the packers and they would say put Ramsey on Adams.

 

[Kupped]

You could literally ask an 8 year old how they might stop the packers and they would say put Ramsey on Adams.

And the Rams still wouldn't have close to stopping them.
Adams, I think, was 3 for three or 4 for 4 against Ramsey yesterday. And everyone else was torching all the other Rams.

Turns out it was actually 5 for 5 for 41 yards... also of note... Ramsey was with Adams 56% of the time.

How did Jalen Ramsey perform against Davante Adams on Sunday?

Who won the marquee matchup between Jalen Ramsey and Davante Adams on Sunday afternoon?

theramswire.usatoday.com

 

[payote75]

Do they have the horses to play man? Does any team only play man?

Did Morris decide to move on from JJ & Troy Hill?

Look JJ is one thing but those two players moving on should not effect the defense this badly. JJ is not Ronnie Lott (and JJ was one of my faves) and Hill most certainly isn't Daryl Green. Yes we miss JJ but that doesn't explain what's going on. You can blanket the top receiver with Ramsey and double another if your that weak at cb but how are you not understanding that we are self sabotaging our own pass rush. Teams run they aren't get 50 yd runs they are getting some decent runs but 4-6 yds and yet we are keeping safeties high so that's one paper cut then once they get into short yardage we are still playing off them by at least 8 yds another cut. Then if a team decides they are not really going to run they can just short pass us to death or run us to death because we are playing so far off on the pass and keeping safeties high on runs as well so double death. What does that also do in turn it keeps our defense tired and on the field it also effects the offensive flow because they can't get on the field and when they do they feel compelled or forced to make something happen hence hold the ball to long or rush a throw just dumb mistakes it also effects mcvay and I make no excuses for his part in this at all his calls can be quite puzzling especially as of late but I believe he is also in his own head. Seems simple but somehow everyone is seeing it many have commented on it I hear it from the broadcasters from the media from our fellow posters why is everyone noticing but them???
Do special teams suck absolutely besides gay however usually shit rolls down hill and once confidence gets low you will need to catch lightening in a bottle.

So in essence teams are just taking what we give them happily and we are obliging and beating ourselves
So our offense has no flow and then forcing crap leading to bad mistakes. We are giving the other teams the blueprint to beat ourselves that simple and then not only are we giving it to them we are actually beating ourselves with it.

How can this supposed hall of fame pash rush get to the qb if teams run us to death then throw the ball in under 2.5 seconds over and over. Those rushers have no time and are rendered useless.
You come up and push them off their route and double the other dude if your corners are horrible that causes confusion that extra half second or second can allow for the rush to get home or force a fumble or a rushed throw for a pick. We aren't even using the advantage of jamming receivers within the 5 yds we let receivers run free time after time if we are 8-9 yds off then you can't touch them it actually makes the secondary worse in my opinion.

 

[Steve808]

I still think we need to man up and take our chances. If our pass rush puts pressure on the QB, they can't just throw to a spot when a free release easily got the ball to Kittle against the whiners or to secondary receivers against the butt packers.

The free release allows the receiver to just find a spot in the zone where the QB can close his eyes (like Jimmy G) and still get the first down.

It pisses me off because our defense has the talent to be top 10 even with some weak links but I believe our scheme is perfect for allowing 20 play drives where the longest play is 7 yards and still results in a TD for the other team.

It's not Ramsey but if you watch, there's always (usually the weakest) cornerback playing 10 yards off the line of scrimmage even on 3rd and 3 or 3rd and 4. It's just too easy to convert.

Other teams don't allow us such easy 3rd down coversions.

This is not f-ing rocket science.

 

[sdakotaram]

I still think we need to man up and take our chances. If our pass rush puts pressure on the QB, they can't just throw to a spot when a free release easily got the ball to Kittle against the whiners or to secondary receivers against the butt packers.

The free release allows the receiver to just find a spot in the zone where the QB can close his eyes (like Jimmy G) and still get the first down.

It pisses me off because our defense has the talent to be top 10 even with some weak links but I believe our scheme is perfect for allowing 20 play drives where the longest play is 7 yards and still results in a TD for the other team.

It's not Ramsey but if you watch, there's always (usually the weakest) cornerback playing 10 yards off the line of scrimmage even on 3rd and 3 or 3rd and 4. It's just too easy to convert.

Other teams don't allow us such easy 3rd down coversions.

This is not f-ing rocket science.

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[Tano]

And the Rams still wouldn't have close to stopping them.
Adams, I think, was 3 for three or 4 for 4 against Ramsey yesterday. And everyone else was torching all the other Rams.

Turns out it was actually 5 for 5 for 41 yards... also of note... Ramsey was with Adams 56% of the time.

How did Jalen Ramsey perform against Davante Adams on Sunday?

Who won the marquee matchup between Jalen Ramsey and Davante Adams on Sunday afternoon?

theramswire.usatoday.com

How close was Ramsey playing Adams? Was he 10 yards off too?

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

He played solid for us last year.

He's wasn't Ramsey, but he wasn't 2018 Troy Hill either.

@HE WITH HORNS Troy Hill is a very good tackler. It’s a skill that the Rams sorely miss.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

People on here act like personnel limitations aren’t a thing for Morris but praise giving up 2 firsts and more for Stafford because he’s a “better fit” for McVay’s offense…..

The Rams traded for Miller, only for his pass rush to be negated by allowing ten yard cushions 75% of the time?

Something isn’t clicking with the concept. If the Rams play man it at least allows the great pass rush to make an impact. As it is they give up easy 6+ yard throws on every down. It’s as if the defense is playing prevent all game long. At this point I’d fire Morris and hire Greg Williams to take over. He did more with less.

 

[Kupped]

How close was Ramsey playing Adams? Was he 10 yards off too?

You're going to suggest Ramsey was coached to play off Adams? He wasn't in zone. Ramsey had a pretty bad game.

 

[Kupped]

The Rams traded for Miller, only for his pass rush to be negated by allowing ten yard cushions 75% of the time?

Something isn’t clicking with the concept. If the Rams play man it at least allows the great pass rush to make an impact. As it is they give up easy 6+ yard throws on every down. It’s as if the defense is playing prevent all game long. At this point I’d fire Morris and hire Greg Williams to take over. He did more with less.

Something definitely isn't clicking and maybe you're right.. maybe they need a complete revamp on D.

I hope they figure something out.

 

[Tano]

You're going to suggest Ramsey was coached to play off Adams? He wasn't in zone. Ramsey had a pretty bad game.

I am going to have to watch the All 22 because that was a sincere question.

 

[Tano]

I am going to have to watch the All 22 because that was a sincere question.

Okay I watched the All 22 and Ramsey sucked

Per the play review, there were 4 (edit 6) passes thrown at Ramsey. Every pass but one Ramsey was 7 to 10 yards off the receiver and each time he backed up right before the pass was thrown. Each time he was late by a split second because of being off 7 - 10 yards. That was the game plan with Ramsey and that just takes his strength away. The fifth pass that I missed was a great play by Ramsey to tackle the packer running back after a 1 yard gain. And the 6th pass he got beat man to man for a 5 yard in pass (happens).

However, each play only went for 6 to 10 yards. So he basically played a good game if not for being hampered so badly by Morris.

You can't play 10 yards off a receiver and expect to block a pass that is only going 5 yards passed the line of scrimmage.

Completely terrible play calling in my book when using a player of Ramsey's ability,

And then expecting Williams to play 10 yards off as well is just adding to the stupidity.

Sorry this is just terrible play calling by Morris allowing Teams to get 5 to 7 yards on every 3rd and short.

And teams are taking advantage of it.

 

[dpjax]

I don't see how a bend don't break defensive philosophy fits with McVay's offensive philosophy of up tempo quick strike offense. It seems like a recipe to keep the defense on the field way too long, which is exactly what's happening.