Too early to talk about how the Brockers return affects Rams draft needs?

[BonifayRam]

any chance Matthews returns for the league minimum? I doubt he wants to leave so cal again

Rams have to find cap $$$ now to pay what we have signed, so I would think that Clay Matthews is way too costly for a return.

 

[den-the-coach]

OL
ILB
EDGE
RB

I like this list and I could see them moving Edge and OL if they love a pass rusher, however, they have to address the offensive line IMO and come away with someone who can make a difference up front. ILB needs to be addressed as they have been avoiding that position for years.

 

[den-the-coach]

Why has Snead/McVay been so incompetent in finding, bringing & signing NON "hot garbage OL'ers listed above?

Well, let's be fair here....Rob Havenstein has been good, he just had a down year in 2019. Austin Blythe has had his moments, however, his best position moving forward is Center. Bobby Evans did show the ability to get physical at the point of attack last season and David Edwards proved not to be overwhelmed at this level, so it wasn't a total disaster.

IMO, I still believe in Noteboom, he's a better Tackle than Guard and will be ready to take over for Whitworth eventually, but Brian Allen IMO, was a failure and is a backup center at best. I think the draft is important to come away with a bad ass at Center and maybe another interior guy at guard, however, I could also see them taking somebody like Austin Jackson from USC and have him learn under Andrew Whitworth, who, iMO, could be an Assistant Coach in waiting too.

 

[BonifayRam]

I like this list and I could see them moving Edge and OL if they love a pass rusher, however, they have to address the offensive line IMO and come away with someone who can make a difference up front. ILB needs to be addressed as they have been avoiding that position for years.

Well, let's be fair here....Rob Havenstein has been good, he just had a down year in 2019. Austin Blythe has had his moments, however, his best position moving forward is Center. Bobby Evans did show the ability to get physical at the point of attack last season and David Edwards proved not to be overwhelmed at this level, so it was a total disaster.

IMO, I still believe in Noteboom, he's a better Tackle than Guard and will be ready to take over for Whitworth eventually, but Brian Allen IMO, was a failure and is a backup center at best. I think the draft is important to come away with a bad ass at Center and maybe another interior guy at guard, however, I could also see them taking somebody like Austin Jackson from USC and have him learn under Andrew Whitworth, who, iMO, could be an Assistant Coach in waiting too.

Thanks all good points....in truth Snead/McVay/Kromer trio has not done a poor job in drafting OL'ers & other OL acquirements like (UDFA's/ Trade/ WWC's). Snead/McVay duo, has fared well utilizing low value tender of team assets to secure all these young OL'ers.

Rams Center position might be is a true state of "Wait & See" or "Holding Pattern":

Blythe- This former 2 yr starter @ OG will be removed from any LG/RG considerations & will concentrate only on the OC post. Utilizing TC & pre-season to distance himself from the recent two shoulders surgeries & the badly damaged soft tissue ankle injury. Blythe will be fighting for a starting post & possible future millions $$ payday if he can turn his 2018 SB & 2019 regular season debacle around.

Allen- Now entering his 3rd TC & pre-season must regain the trust of Kromer & also recover from torn MCL. Not an easy thing to do after starting in 9 gms in 2019. Is Allen's skills & abilities back pack empty? Why was Kromer so wrong about Allen & how much rope will Kromer permit on Allen to remain in OC contention? Is what the Rams saw in Allen back in April 2018 disappeared?

Shelton- A initial regular season WWC sign after the Cards cut him. Shelton will be entering his 3rd NFL Training Camp but his first with Kromer. Kromer kept this UDFA/WWC here all season. Kromer made Shelton his top reserve OC for the entire season & by late mid season Shelton had earned the position as reserve to the starting OG's. Shelton's biggest negative as an NFL OL'er was an overall very weak in the strength & power element back in 2018. Now after two NFL seasons has Shelton put in the hard work to be a contender?

Trewyn- was signed mid season after earning a position on the Buc's OL unit. Buc's were 3 deep in OC but needed OT's thus Trewyn was released. Trewyn was a UDFA who had some good high accommodations in college. Kromer now will get an opportunity to get Trewyn in training Camp & see what this large thick 6-4 320 pound center has.

On Havenstein.....I now believe the NFL now knows how to defeat big Rob. Opponents across from him have him figured out & Rob had no answers in 2019 to offer up any resistance. Bottom line Rob can not pass block with any consistency. If he is what he was in 2019 Rob will be beaten often in passing situations. If he can not fix himself he is worthless to this McVay/Goff passing offense.

 

[Rams43]

OL
ILB
EDGE
RB

I think OL is obviosuly the most important unit we need to improve on our team. Why draft a RB early when we already have a starter in Henderson? Especially if the o-line in front of them is hot garbage. The o-line has to be upgraded if we're going to have any chance of competing and making it back to the playoffs. Funny how 2 years removed from the super bowl we're talking about just making the playoffs. A line keeps Goff clean and able to perform while also helping whoever is at RB. Im tired of all this Corbett, Blythe, Allen, Noteboom bullshit. We need talented OL personnel who impose their will, not just try to hold their ground.

After the improvement to our interior D line, Im super excited for the brock, robinson, AD, and SJD rotations. But without good ILBs behind we wont be able to really shut down the run. Maybe one of the starters is on the roster, but we need to draft an ILB with one of our two first picks.

Edge..I think we have some young upside here, but not the most pressing need. Can always use more talent rushing the passer, but to me interior D line and ILB were far bigger needs for us.

RB... Its the Henderson show now boys. Improving the line in front of him will help Goff have a better year and in turn help the running game. Draft someone in round 4 or 5 to supplement the backfield and prepare Henderson to carry the load this season.

Strongly disagree, MachS.

Firstly, our current OL is hardly ‘hot garbage’. You haven’t been paying enough attention to it’s progress, man. In fact, I make OL now as only our 3rd or even 4th highest priority.

RB is our biggest need until Henderson proves otherwise. McVay simply MUST have his feared running threat to allow his O to fire on all cylinders. Doesn’t mean that RB will or should be our first pick, depending on who falls. Just means that we must come out of this draft/FA with a RB that is starter quality. Would be insane to enter ‘20 with only Henderson/Brown/Kelly.

I make Edge our next biggest priority and favorite position to be our first pick, depending on who falls. We have 4-5 edge players already on the roster plus Floyd but none are proven quality starters. And Staley has said how highly he values edge players in his D.

I consider Littleton’s replacement a strong 3rd in importance. Young or Howard MAY be adequate but are certainly unproven at this point. I like Kiser as other ILB in base D, btw. So, a Littleton replacement could well be among our first 3 picks, again depending on who falls.

OL, by default comes in 4th on my priority list, once again depending on who falls. I see an OL player as just the 4th in terms of need at this time.

As an aside, I want to point out that there is a difference between a mock draft and a priorities list. The priorities list goes out the window if a particularly highly valued player falls to us at any of the top 4 positions.

So we’re all spit ballin’ here without benefit of most of FA not to mention the top 51 picks coming off the board.

 

[Jacobarch]

We need to figure out ILB for sure at both Mike and Will. If we don't teams will throw all over Reeser and Kiser

 

[Jacobarch]

I just have an itch they are going to go Rb in the 2nd, I definitely could be wrong, but just a gut feeling that's where they are headed.

Yeah I hope not. Rams need to learn not to invest too much into the RB position

 

[So Ram]

I like this list and I could see them moving Edge and OL if they love a pass rusher, however, they have to address the offensive line IMO and come away with someone who can make a difference up front. ILB needs to be addressed as they have been avoiding that position for years.

The only way I see The Rams drafting an offensive lineman is if Brian Allan & Noteboom are out of the picture for 2020 ?

I don’t see how a RB & WR aren’t going to be picked before anOlineman
,if even one is picked at all.

 

[den-the-coach]

I don’t see how a RB & WR aren’t going to be picked before anOlineman
,if even one is picked at all.

I guess we will agree to disagree because I believe before a RB & WR are selected either a Tackle or an interior OL will be taken. RB like Moss will be there later IMHO.

 

[MachS]

Why has Snead/McVay been so incompetent in finding, bringing & signing NON "hot garbage OL'ers listed above as you state they have been?

The fault is with the strategy IMO as we've focused on bringing in mid to late round picks and expecting them to develop and perform at a high level. We have been devoid of quality OL talent and if you dont remember the Super Bowl, that is why we lost. While other teams are investing 1st, 2nd, 3rd round picks, and big FA money, consistently into OL, we are investing 4th-7th round picks and signing outcasts from the waiver wire. Meaning yes the overall talent level on our OL has been hot garbage compared to other teams with multiple first round talent, multiple pro bowlers, etc. Losing Saffold meant losing our 2nd best lineman and we since havent recovered. Our best OL is a 38 year old tackle who doesn't even play at a pro bowl level anymore.. Think about that. When you have guys like Notbeboom, Allen, who are drafted as mid round picks, groomed for 1 1/2 years before they're ever asked to play a snap, and then fall on their face once they get asked to perform, that sets us back a TON. Then replace them with another group of late round rookies or outcast OL from other teams.

Strongly disagree, MachS.

Firstly, our current OL is hardly ‘hot garbage’. You haven’t been paying enough attention to it’s progress, man. In fact, I make OL now as only our 3rd or even 4th highest priority.

Hardly got garbage? Progress? Dude come one, you mean the last 6 games when Goff was rolling out of the pocket on 50% of his passes so he wouldnt face pressure? That progress? Yea that shows a ton of confidence in the lines development. Or how about the progress in the completely dead running game for an entire season? Do you remember what our offense became last year? Go back a bit further and it lost us the super bowl. Our QB cannot play at a competent level without a great OL. So why would our franchise ever let the OL be anything other than great? Why not sacrifice other positions to ENSURE that 100% of the time our line is great. That is the problem with our stragey, we are willing to roll the dice with the OL instead of commit to making sure its great. That is how Goff performs...that is how we get the running game back going. Expecting Goff to navigate behind an average or bad line is the most idiotic thing we could ever do. Not putting a group of road-graders in front of our RB to create holes and get the running game, play-action game going again...is idiotic. Consistently putting mid to late round talent in front of our $94M guaranteed QB who faces constant scrutiny for his play under pressure is idiotic. People have put a lot of blame on Kromer but he is widely considered one of the best OL coaches in the league, and we've been giving him peanuts to work with. He has not had one young talented OL to work in 4 years with since he's been here and its a joke. We need more talent 100%. Saying OL is the 3rd or 4th highest priority is laughable Rams43, all that matters is getting the offense back on track and getting Goff some CONFIDENCE.

 

[So Ram]

I guess we will agree to disagree because I believe before a RB & WR are selected either a Tackle or an interior OL will be taken. RB like Moss will be there later IMHO.

crazy, we will find out in less than a month.
How many OLineman make the squad & who gets cut ???

-As much as I’ve never been a Brian Allen believer ? I do think Kromer & McSnead do?
I’m a Draftnik from back in the day!! I love to find value in the draft. Your point at RB value late is solid, but I’ve always valued a Top RB. Heisman RB’s have done better than QB’s from years past. The NFL has changed though as well.
The WR position & DE/OLB have value this year in 2020.

 

[Faceplant]

The fault is with the strategy IMO as we've focused on bringing in mid to late round picks and expecting them to develop and perform at a high level. We have been devoid of quality OL talent and if you dont remember the Super Bowl, that is why we lost. While other teams are investing 1st, 2nd, 3rd round picks, and big FA money, consistently into OL, we are investing 4th-7th round picks and signing outcasts from the waiver wire. Meaning yes the overall talent level on our OL has been hot garbage compared to other teams with multiple first round talent, multiple pro bowlers, etc. Losing Saffold meant losing our 2nd best lineman and we since havent recovered. Our best OL is a 38 year old tackle who doesn't even play at a pro bowl level anymore.. Think about that. When you have guys like Notbeboom, Allen, who are drafted as mid round picks, groomed for 1 1/2 years before they're ever asked to play a snap, and then fall on their face once they get asked to perform, that sets us back a TON. Then replace them with another group of late round rookies or outcast OL from other teams.



Hardly got garbage? Progress? Dude come one, you mean the last 6 games when Goff was rolling out of the pocket on 50% of his passes so he wouldnt face pressure? That progress? Yea that shows a ton of confidence in the lines development. Or how about the progress in the completely dead running game for an entire season? Do you remember what our offense became last year? Go back a bit further and it lost us the super bowl. Our QB cannot play at a competent level without a great OL. So why would our franchise ever let the OL be anything other than great? Why not sacrifice other positions to ENSURE that 100% of the time our line is great. That is the problem with our stragey, we are willing to roll the dice with the OL instead of commit to making sure its great. That is how Goff performs...that is how we get the running game back going. Expecting Goff to navigate behind an average or bad line is the most idiotic thing we could ever do. Not putting a group of road-graders in front of our RB to create holes and get the running game, play-action game going again...is idiotic. Consistently putting mid to late round talent in front of our $94M guaranteed QB who faces constant scrutiny for his play under pressure is idiotic. People have put a lot of blame on Kromer but he is widely considered one of the best OL coaches in the league, and we've been giving him peanuts to work with. He has not had one young talented OL to work in 4 years with since he's been here and its a joke. We need more talent 100%. Saying OL is the 3rd or 4th highest priority is laughable Rams43, all that matters is getting the offense back on track and getting Goff some CONFIDENCE.

I go back and forth on this, but your post swung me back towards needing OL help. We played a weaker schedule during the last part of the season, which may have led to some false hope in that regard. Agree that Goff needs a clean pocket and a run threat to be effective. That is the case with most QB's, but most QB's aren't asked to throw as much as he is in the offense. Also, most QB's aren't eating up that much cap space.

I hope McVay has a plan, because it seems that the NFL has caught up to him a bit. I still cannot believe how far the Rams fell last year. They looked soft and undisciplined a lot of the time(Tampa, Pittsburgh). That's coaching. They also looked completely outmatched at times (whiners, Ravens), cowpokes. That's talent. Both worry me.

 

[den-the-coach]

crazy, we will find out in less than a month.
How many OLineman make the squad & who gets cut ???

-As much as I’ve never been a Brian Allen believer ? I do think Kromer & McSnead do?

If the Rams draft a Center Brian Allen is cut, in fact, if they draft an interior lineman, he's cut too IMHO. Now if they draft a Tackle like Austin Jackson USC, they might change a few things, maybe Noteboom starts on PUP, but I do believe at the very minimum one OL will be called.

As to RB, would I love them to take somebody like Cam Akers or Clyde Edwards-Helaire early? Well, yes of course, but the Rams need other things and I just have a feeling they really like Zach Moss of Utah because of his ability to run inside and his effectiveness in the Red Zone. Darrell Henderson will be 1 and Brown will be 1A, however, Moss will eventually replace Brown IMO.

At WR, I realize this is a great draft and Robert Woods is a free agent next year, but how many WR's can make the roster? Barring injury or trade you have.....Cooks, Woods, Kupp, Reynolds, Webster so there is room for one more, however, Greg Dortch has an excellent shot to make the roster as a returner replacing Natson.

@BonifayRam has somewhat backed up your analysis by stating there are some guys like Cameron Shelton, Nate Trewyn & Chandler Brewer that could factor in to the offensive line, but again I have to believe if someone like Tyler Biadasz (Center Wisconsin) or Ben Bredeson (Guard Michigan) are sitting there in the 3rd round, the Rams make the pick or they could also take Austin Jackson in the 2nd round too....We shall see very soon.

 

[Soul Surfer]

so

what are they doing with Havenstein in your scenario?

Well, we had better production out of Evans last year so why not trade Havenstein and, (especially unload) his contract?
The fall off was noticeable with Havenstein.

And now we have Edwards used to lining up next to Evans and both on rookie contracts.

If we could get a fourth round draft pick for him and unload his contract that seems like a win-win.

 

[MachS]

I hope McVay has a plan, because it seems that the NFL has caught up to him a bit. I still cannot believe how far the Rams fell last year. They looked soft and undisciplined a lot of the time(Tampa, Pittsburgh). That's coaching. They also looked completely outmatched at times (whiners, Ravens), cowpokes. That's talent. Both worry me.

Yea very true, seems like opposing NFL teams have absolutely gained ground on McVay, the last 20 or so games at least. But hard to tell if it's mostly on him because the main strategy to stop our offense right now, is overwhelm our OL physically. That stops the run and gets pressure on Goff. They've been loading up the box, with 6 man fronts a lot, playing man to man or single safety behind it. If Goff had time to let those plays develop, we could theoretically beat them down the field, but our OL right now doesn't allow for those plays to develop. So we have resorted to quicker, intermediate or underneath throws. Combine that with a dead running game and makes sense why defenses are playing tighter and windows have seemed to close quicker. I can count on one hand how many deep passes we hit last year. Yes Goff missed a lot of throws but how many more chances would he have got with an extra second or two in the pocket? How many of those throws would have been on target with less pressure in his face? At this point the best chance we have to succeed as a team is get the offense clicking again which starts with improving OL talent. Its just hilarious to me people are counting the Whitworth and Blythe signings as improving the OL. With no 1st rounder for two years I hope we keep drafting OL with 2nd and 3rd rounders, and pray they can make an impact early unlike Noteboom and Allen.

 

[So Ram]

Yea very true, seems like opposing NFL teams have absolutely gained ground on McVay, the last 20 or so games at least. But hard to tell if it's mostly on him because the main strategy to stop our offense right now, is overwhelm our OL physically. That stops the run and gets pressure on Goff. They've been loading up the box, with 6 man fronts a lot, playing man to man or single safety behind it. If Goff had time to let those plays develop, we could theoretically beat them down the field, but our OL right now doesn't allow for those plays to develop. So we have resorted to quicker, intermediate or underneath throws. Combine that with a dead running game and makes sense why defenses are playing tighter and windows have seemed to close quicker. I can count on one hand how many deep passes we hit last year. Yes Goff missed a lot of throws but how many more chances would he have got with an extra second or two in the pocket? How many of those throws would have been on target with less pressure in his face? At this point the best chance we have to succeed as a team is get the offense clicking again which starts with improving OL talent. Its just hilarious to me people are counting the Whitworth and Blythe signings as improving the OL. With no 1st rounder for two years I hope we keep drafting OL with 2nd and 3rd rounders, and pray they can make an impact early unlike Noteboom and Allen.

Well I think it’s funny you think you know more than The Rams organization & Kromer. Will see but it’s in Kromers I trust.

Yeah - one of my first Post here was The Big 5,so yes I’ve been a big fan of Whitworths. He to me is one of the better FA signings The Rams have ever had?? Reminds me of when Jackie Slatter was playing for The Rams. I had doubts & he wanted to get paid.
He always was a Top LT,but of course being an All-Pro at there age is asking a Hell of A lot!!! Heck just look at who Whitworth was going against his last 5 games ?? He was impressive to me,especially when you have to think he was not 100%,plus he still has that hunger.

Back to The OLine. I was not a Austin Blythe fan at LG,but as a center & backup guard for a season?? I think he knows the offense pretty well. It gives The young guys a chance to learn from a veteran of The Rams McSnead era.

 

[den-the-coach]

Back to The OLine. I was not a Austin Blythe fan at LG,but as a center & backup guard for a season?? I think he knows the offense pretty well. It gives The young guys a chance to learn from a veteran of The Rams McSnead era.

Blythe did play well at Center as the snaps were better and the line adjustments improved immensely. I still expect the Rams to draft a Center, having Blythe as depth will be a good thing and maybe somebody will take Brian Allen for future considerations.

 

[So Ram]

If the Rams draft a Center Brian Allen is cut, in fact, if they draft an interior lineman, he's cut too IMHO. Now if they draft a Tackle like Austin Jackson USC, they might change a few things, maybe Noteboom starts on PUP, but I do believe at the very minimum one OL will be called.

As to RB, would I love them to take somebody like Cam Akers or Clyde Edwards-Helaire early? Well, yes of course, but the Rams need other things and I just have a feeling they really like Zach Moss of Utah because of his ability to run inside and his effectiveness in the Red Zone. Darrell Henderson will be 1 and Brown will be 1A, however, Moss will eventually replace Brown IMO.

At WR, I realize this is a great draft and Robert Woods is a free agent next year, but how many WR's can make the roster? Barring injury or trade you have.....Cooks, Woods, Kupp, Reynolds, Webster so there is room for one more, however, Greg Dortch has an excellent shot to make the roster as a returner replacing Natson.

@BonifayRam has somewhat backed up your analysis by stating there are some guys like Cameron Shelton, Nate Trewyn & Chandler Brewer that could factor in to the offensive line, but again I have to believe if someone like Tyler Biadasz (Center Wisconsin) or Ben Bredeson (Guard Michigan) are sitting there in the 3rd round, the Rams make the pick or they could also take Austin Jackson in the 2nd round too....We shall see very soon.

You & I are on different pages. Yes I think Brewer has upside like Bonifay.He has liked him from training camp.I was alright with him,but not as a guy you could count on last season. The thing is he was only 21 & went through cancer. He is a fighter & I have to believe given a full offseason & OTA’s he will be a lot more advanced than most rookies coming out in 2020.

I like Johnathan Taylor.Would trade up for him.As a ling time Draftnik there is not many players I would do that for.
My reasoning for liking him so much is his value. A RB with size,speed,skill,& numbers should make him a special NFL Player?

 

[den-the-coach]

I like Johnathan Taylor.Would trade up for him.As a ling time Draftnik there is not many players I would do that for.
My reasoning for liking him so much is his value. A RB with size,speed,skill,& numbers should make him a special NFL Player?

You value RB a tad more than I do, Taylor is very good, maybe exceptional, but he was used often at Wisconsin and that would somewhat concern me, but would be my only concern and I'm not sure the Rams have the firepower to trade up into the first round.

 

[iamme33]

You value RB a tad more than I do, Taylor is very good, maybe exceptional, but he was used often at Wisconsin and that would somewhat concern me, but would be my only concern and I'm not sure the Rams have the firepower to trade up into the first round.

are you kidding me we still have the 2022 and 2023 first rounders