Time for a plan B

[RamzFanz]

Me personally, Clowney still has some baggage. The pro day was nice, but I'm not sold he changed much opinion one way or the other.

So... For the Texans, there is risk with the QBs and Clowney. They need a QB, they know Bortles pretty well... I'll be surprised if that's not their pick.

For the Rams, plan B is Mathews... a nice consolation prize at that. (Or write in another name...Robinson, Mack, Watkins).

All that said...

If Clowney makes it to #2 we take him, unless the offers to trade down are good.

I think we agree in principle. Texans take Clowney or they want a QB. They could trade with the Rams, get additional picks, AND get Bortles.

They could also trade with the Jags if the Jags want Clowney, get extra picks, AND get Bortles.

So, in my mind, if it's Bortels they want, they would at least consider both of those.

What would you do if you were Snisher, assuming they have overcome the doubts, and really want Clowney? Say no, we won't give up our second overall and a 5th and 7th rounder and risk not getting Clowney? Call their bluff and risk they take him or trade elsewhere? Or is a 5th and 7th worth the assurance he's yours?

I say they trade without a second thought or regret.

 

[RamzFanz]

No what I'm saying is if they don't love him so much it's not a slam dunk to take him at #2, then I just wouldn't assume they're gonna give up somethin to get him at #1.

Yeah, I got ya. But in my mind, he is a slam dunk at 2. In my scenario, he has to be.

I agree with you if he's not a slam dunk.

However, I think he's a slam dunk at 1. Either the Texans, Rams, or some other team is going to go after him. The Rams being the least likely because they won't offer much. But I think they would offer something.

 

[SaneRamsFan]

Really good discussion but my honest opinion is it's being over thunk. We are looking at it under a microscope with blue and gold lenses. Texans fo will be castrated by the press and fans if they get cute and lose out on manziel or bortles. Jacks their only possible trading partner and I doubt they (jacks) are willing. Texans will take their qb of choice. Rams will trade down with atlanta or possibly Cleveland. I just don't see it happening any other way.

 

[RamzFanz]

Really good discussion but my honest opinion is it's being over thunk. We are looking at it under a microscope with blue and gold lenses. Texans fo will be castrated by the press and fans if they get cute and lose out on manziel or bortles. Jacks their only possible trading partner and I doubt they (jacks) are willing. Texans will take their qb of choice. Rams will trade down with atlanta or possibly Cleveland. I just don't see it happening any other way.

If the Rams don't want Clowney, or want whoever they can get from a trade more, I agree. I don't know what you can get this season at 6th and in the 2nd round, after trading down, that would be worth more than Clowney. 6th could mean you get no one you want. Clowney, Robinson, Mathews, Watkins, Mack could all be gone. What then?

 

[CGI_Ram]

They could also trade with the Jags if the Jags want Clowney, get extra picks, AND get Bortles.

If they trade out of #1, they could lose Bortles to someone jumping to the Rams spot! That could happen... And it would be a huge blow to their strategy of trading down expecting to get Bortles.

And, no way I trade up for Clowney. Too good of options at #2. Too good of depth to trade any premium picks to get to #1.

 

[RamzFanz]

If they trade out of #1, they could lose Bortles to someone jumping to the Rams spot! That could happen... And it would be a huge blow to their strategy of trading down expecting to get Bortles.

And, no way I trade up for Clowney. Too good of options at #2. Too good of depth to trade any premium picks to get to #1.

Yes, if they are set on Bortles, they could be screwed if the Rams trade down.

I guess that's where we disagree on Clowney. I don't like taking anyone at 2 as much as Clowney for the Rams. I also wouldn't consider a round 5 and 7 surplus pick as premium. I would do it in a heartbeat to guarantee Rams get Clowney. That would be the best way to start a draft, lock up the BPA.

 

[SaneRamsFan]

If the Rams don't want Clowney, or want whoever they can get from a trade more, I agree. I don't know what you can get this season at 6th and in the 2nd round, after trading down, that would be worth more than Clowney. 6th could mean you get no one you want. Clowney, Robinson, Mathews, Watkins, Mack could all be gone. What then?

Texans take bortles. Atl takes clowney. Jacks takes mack. Cle takes watkins. Oak takes robinson. Mattews still left. Thats the worse you can do. I trust oak to do something stupid and robinson still be thete at six. Thats worse case. I still think boortles manziel and bridgeovertroubledwaters could all go top five.

 

[SaneRamsFan]

Just for the record if clown ey is there at two and we take him I will own his jersey before the end of the day.

 

[RamzFanz]

Texans take bortles. Atl takes clowney. Jacks takes mack. Cle takes watkins. Oak takes robinson. Mattews still left. Thats the worse you can do. I trust oak to do something stupid and robinson still be thete at six. Thats worse case. I still think boortles manziel and bridgeovertroubledwaters could all go top five.

Mathews in trade for a number 2 pick and a second rounder would be a bad decision in my book. Unless rams parlay the extra picks and 13 into a second blue chip player or get a first next season sprinkled on top.

I love Mathews for our second pick. That would be a coup. He and Clowney are the only two "ready for prime time" players IMHO. Any other choices may not even start. I don't see passing on Clowney for him. Clowney / Mathews would be a massive upgrade for the Rams. Of course, that would require a big trade up.

 

[RamzFanz]

Just for the record if clown ey is there at two and we take him I will own his jersey before the end of the day.

I'll be in line with you.

 

[CGI_Ram]

Yes, if they are set on Bortles, they could be screwed if the Rams trade down.

I guess that's where we disagree on Clowney. I don't like taking anyone at 2 as much as Clowney for the Rams. I also wouldn't consider a round 5 and 7 surplus pick as premium. I would do it in a heartbeat to guarantee Rams get Clowney. That would be the best way to start a draft, lock up the BPA.

Yeah I don't see Clowney as that significantly better/safer when all things considered - to trade up for.

I'd also argue those late round choices proved valuable in our trade to land Zac Stacy.

 

[RamzFanz]

Yeah I don't see Clowney as that significantly better/safer when all things considered.

I'd also argue those late round choices proved valuable in our trade to land Zac Stacy.

We have 12 picks this season. Plenty of trade bait.

One of my big motivators is Clowney would start somewhere day one. Mathews too probably. No one else is a lock and I really want immediate impact. Between the two I see clowney as the bigger impact because the Rams will have plenty of opportunity for O line in the draft. Clowney / Mathews would be the ultimate season changer IMHO.

 

[CGI_Ram]

We have 12 picks this season. Plenty of trade bait.

One of my big motivators is Clowney would start somewhere day one. Mathews too probably. No one else is a lock and I really want immediate impact. Between the two I see clowney as the bigger impact because the Rams will have plenty of opportunity for O line in the draft. Clowney / Mathews would be the ultimate season changer IMHO.

I will say... The thought of using Clowney, mixing things up with how we play Long and the OLB position, could be absolutely unstoppable in a Greg Williams science lab!

 

[Ramhusker]

So here's a possible scenario I see playing out in it's most simplified manner:

Texans are on the clock. They call Snisher and say "We are torn between Clowney and QB X. We've decided on Clowney unless you give us 2 and a 5th and 7th."

You're Snisher, what do you do?

I think you HAVE to trade if it's reasonable. You get Clowney and give up little in return. You still have a second 1st round pick and 8 more picks. No one could ever fault you for taking the consensus #1 nor would it be a bad move at all in my mind. As Snisher, I would be ecstatic to get Clowney and another blue chip at 13 or earlier.

How about you take the trade then flip it to ATL for their 6th, 39th, and a 2nd in 2015?

 

[SaneRamsFan]

If we wound up with clowney and mattews that would be the best draft in memmory and I need a good memory been doing this for awhile.

 

[RamzFanz]

How about you take the trade then flip it to ATL for their 6th, 39th, and a 2nd in 2015?

I considered that too! That would be cool. Make it a first in 2015.

 

[RamzFanz]

I will say... The thought of using Clowney, mixing things up with how we play Long and the OLB position, could be absolutely unstoppable in a Greg Williams science lab!

I know, right? Get some good secondary, play man coverage, blitz their asses off! That could be amazing!

If the QB only has a second to throw every down, you know when the ball is coming. JJ could go back to his nasty ways.

 

[Ramhusker]

I considered that too! That would be cool. Make it a first in 2015.

Greedy greedy greedy

 

[tonyl711]

IMO there is no way the Rams trade with the Texans, Clowney is not a need pick, and there are going to be blue chip players in needed positions at #2, Texans take Clowney, no problem we have our pick of Mathews, Robinson or Watkins. if the Texans don't take Clowney then we open up the trade lines, either way we are sitting pretty, why give up picks to move up?

 

[Memphis Ram]

Also, you don't pass on Holt just because you have Bruce and Proehl. The upside of a Quinn, Clowney, Long line is so high, it's worthy of the risk IMHO. It could be an offense destroying mix. Unstoppable. That line with some man coverage by some decent cover guys and exotic blitz packages could be a show stopper. No one else in the draft offers that IMHO.

Sure, but I wouldn't trade up for Torry Holt when I could stand pat and select Champ Bailey.