The NFL bungles it again

[LesBaker]

@LesBaker
What about all the streaming? I can't believe most of America is forking over $$$$ to pay to watch anything....so, does stream views register as normal viewership????

Nope it's not hard to do and I do it all the time.

Plus a lot of fans go to sports bars..........ratings aren't reality IMO.

 

[Angry Ram]

It isn't just those three things, and it isn't just now and in the moment, this has been festering for a few years and it's not going to just get better.

You are completely over-blowing it man. The actions of a few rotten apples do not represent the players as a whole. Just because they get over blown and dissected by the lawyer at PFT doesn't mean it's prevalent .

All the "gates" are issues that were solved. I get everyone hates that team in NE, but c'mon they've had success for years because they are good. They were stripped of 1st round picks and it didn't matter for them. Greg Williams got suspended for a year and served his time.

I really don't put much stock when the internet gripes about officiating. Yeah I know it's part of being a fan, but at the end of the day, the simple solution is to win. Notice how many officiating threads are on ROD this year vs. years past?

Also, "too many commercials"? The entire world is full of ads in 2017. That's how they pay for the "free" games we get. I really don't get the internet on that. Go pee during commercials or grab a bite to eat. Play Pokemon Go or w/e game that interests you on the phone. Or just deal with it...not the end of the world.

 

[Mackeyser]

You have a bunch of players doing stupid things at an alarming rate, yet the judgment always goes against the executioners. Anything short of absolute perfection gets blown up by a meddling media and public outcry.

Having said that, Goodell is coming off pretty stale and used up. In contrast, the recent suspension of that Houston Astros player for a racial gesture, and the subsequent explanation by the commissioner, was fair, eloquent and lauded by the critics. The big difference being NFL idiots do idiot things at an almost weekly rate, whereas MLB players rarely put that kind of challenge on their league office.

So am I saying that the NFL has stupid fkn players as opposed to MLB? Yes, why yes I am.

Well, after YEARS of having terrible commissioners, both MLB and NBA took the steps to get a guy who can handle those things.

And yes, I think they missed badly on picking someone to lead the NFLPA.

You don't need a commish who builds revenue. That you can leave to your EVP of Business Affairs and pay HIM well, too.

You need a commish who LEADS the league and provides steady, consistent and inspirational leadership that flows through the teams to players and fans and their communities.

Goodell is a corporate attorney who has done well financially by his clients. And if the NFL solely judges his performance by ROI, then he's the best.

However, in the history of organized sport going back to the late 19th century, Commissioners have been judged on far more and it's a mistake to narrowly define his position by the metric of revenue generation.

If that's the case and things continue, between attendance woes (for a number of factors), TV ratings decline and fewer kids playing at the Pop Warner/HS level meaning a diminishing talent pool in the future, Goodell may be the guy who killed Football.

 

[jrry32]

This issue isn't the NFL's fault. It's the Bengals trying to get away with one here. Nothing the NFL can do in this situation. The arbitrator will make the determination. We may see another grievance filed by Teddy Bridgewater against the Vikings for similar reasons.

 

[Mackeyser]

Well, at the risk of upsetting the mods, the REASON we have these protests are that we have REAL things to talk about as a society and we NEVER talk about them. (I know I'm skirting a line and I hope I keep it neutral enough to stay in bounds)

WHEN do we talk about the real issues our country faces? I don't mean BS politix, I mean the financial, social and environmental issues that real, everyday people of all races, creeds, religions, genders, etc, have to deal with on a daily basis. Things that affect how we interact with people, provide for our families and take care of ourselves and one another. When? The MSM is a joke (from pretty much every angle) and we're just not supposed to talk about these things at work, with family, with friends and if you've ever tried online, well you have the scars to prove it. WHEN do we do it? That's only partly rhetorical.

Only part of the reason why is the balkanization of our society (the tribalism, if you will). We simply in large part have forgotten how to civilly have the hard conversations, and we really need to have them. Civil society requires maintenance. Anyone ever have a wife/gf/so who ignored the "check engine" light? How'd that go?

I'm completely confident that if we actually had these grown-up conversations in a real way and treated one another as human beings as we had them, then our sports could be the distraction we prefer. I'd prefer that, too, and if you asked the players... to a person, THEY'D prefer it, too. I dunno if it's laziness or denial or selfishness or something altogether different, but we HAVE to have these important discussions (not here, but I mean in general). And mostly...we don't. As a country, we just...don't.

Also, WHY is it okay to be mad at people protesting, but it's NOT okay to be mad at the NFL for improperly displaying the flag? Those humungous flags draped across the field are a huge no-no for displaying the American flag. I'll be glad to post the Federal regs on how a flag SHOULD be displayed. The NFL gets it really wrong in a LOT of ways and it may not bother a lot of people, but it's ALWAYS bothered ME. And while there are no penalties, to involve Active Duty personnel in that is especially bothersome because if those same active duty personnel did that on their private property, they'd face potential sanction from their command structure.

I agree with Les that the NFL has bungled a LOT. The concussion issue ALONE has me want to donkey punch Goodell...repeatedly...with brass knuckles.

I'd be more sympathetic to those who want sports to be a distraction if we also all put in the work that maintaining our society demands. The fact that these issues are spilling over into sport is a symptom that is more worrisome than any individual protest or issue. And we see it not only in Sport, but all of Entertainment. When we're not working on society, we get "policy creep" where these issues seep everywhere.

The societal "check engine" light is on. We can either work on getting things fixed or not be surprised when the society breaks down during our favorite song or it makes us miss things.

Sorry, I just had to get that out. I really don't want to start anything and hope this doesn't draw the ire of the mods or fellow posters.

 

[Mackeyser]

This issue isn't the NFL's fault. It's the Bengals trying to get away with one here. Nothing the NFL can do in this situation. The arbitrator will make the determination. We may see another grievance filed by Teddy Bridgewater against the Vikings for similar reasons.

Well, it's clear the CBA needs a significant overhaul.

Among the things that need to be fixed:

Franchise Tag: It's too much in favor of owners. One tag, one time. That should be enough for teams to figure things out.

No Salary Cap: It's ridiculous that ANY player in a sport with a roster of 53 can take upwards of 20% of the cap. I didn't use to like it, but the NBA model is at least a place to start. I wouldn't want to use it as is, but it would alleviate many of the Franchise issues. I realize the NFLPA won't like it, but it will benefit the sport in the long run AND it will get more guys paid. It won't change the average, but it will improve the mean. THAT'S what a union should be doing for its members, looking out for all members, not just the highest earners.

Rookie scale: Well, they took that pendulum and mad swung it from Bradford to first rounders getting very little and having to wait as many as 7 years before getting to that guaranteed money of the second contract. They need to shorten rookie deals a year on the top end. Four years max with 1 franchise year.

Marijuana: It needs to not be a bad thing anymore. Moreover, the NFL needs to start advocating for CBD research and funding it since it may be the thing that saves football. You know those moms who won't let their kid play football for fear of neuro injury? Well a LOT of those same moms are giving their beloved pets CBD oil and mitigating a LOT of issues.

Discipline: The inconsistencies have made this a disaster. If we can't rely on the judgment of a corporate lawyer (who knew?), then it's time for the league and NFLPA to agree on discipline with respect to fighting, PED use (and beyond MJ, there should be a much more clear issue with actual PEDs and drug use with respect to suspensions. I have much less issue with Josh Gordon's MJ use than someone who's taken actual performing enhancing drugs) and domestic violence. This ongoing Zeke Elliott mess is a pox on everyone's house. It puts the NFLPA in position to want little/no punishment for someone who committed violence and it puts the NFL in position to prosecute players based on arbitrary standards.

Offseason: Teams took way too much advantage of the off-season so that players never really had any time off because "voluntary" wasn't really voluntary. Once again, the answer was to swing the pendulum from too much to too little. The league and the NFLPA have to come to some agreement to allow for player contact with coaches/ownership in a way where players don't feel that it's mandatory. At the very least, new coaches should get extra access to players for no other reason than it will improve the product the NFL and its players present to fans.

Officiating: We need full-time refs. Why? Well, because full-time refs can spend their full time working at a league facility going over rule changes and finding a UNIFORM way to call not only the rules at large, but especially the Points of Interest that seem to be the NFL's version of the Strike Zone. The biggest issue isn't too many calls, although that can be less than fun. The biggest problem is that officiating is a factor in who wins because so many calls are on the margin. We all know for instance that offensive holding happens on nearly every play and for the sake of the game they aren't going to call it every play. So, with that, how is the LEAGUE going to call it. Teams shouldn't have to play the first quarter to see how a game is going to be officiated. That's especially true for Offensive Holding and Pass Interference...and what is a damned catch. Uniformity will allow teams to better understand not only the rules, but how they will be enforced actually during play. Moreover, full-time refs would be able to work with each team so that they understand. There should never be a time where a guy on one team gets called for every infraction (GRob), but another doesn't (whichever OL Quinn is facing). That uniformity will lessen the demand to have calls reviewed by "big officiating brother" in NY and ultimately increase the pace of play.

It's just a start, but both sides have to put the product first. That means both sides can win if they work together.

 

[UKram]

I don’t see why the ewok should get special treatment ... didn’t Big Ben take his suspension without bitching about it and that case never went to court (and bens alleged crime is probably worse than what the ewok is being accused of )

As for ol Rodger didn’t he just get a huge extensions from the owners ... the guy proactively works for them as long as he keeps the nickle and dimes flowing to the owners I don’t see much changing

 

[LesBaker]

You are completely over-blowing it man. The actions of a few rotten apples do not represent the players as a whole. Just because they get over blown and dissected by the lawyer at PFT doesn't mean it's prevalent .

All the "gates" are issues that were solved. I get everyone hates that team in NE, but c'mon they've had success for years because they are good. They were stripped of 1st round picks and it didn't matter for them. Greg Williams got suspended for a year and served his time.

I really don't put much stock when the internet gripes about officiating. Yeah I know it's part of being a fan, but at the end of the day, the simple solution is to win. Notice how many officiating threads are on ROD this year vs. years past?

Also, "too many commercials"? The entire world is full of ads in 2017. That's how they pay for the "free" games we get. I really don't get the internet on that. Go pee during commercials or grab a bite to eat. Play Pokemon Go or w/e game that interests you on the phone. Or just deal with it...not the end of the world.

Polling data doesn't line up with what you are saying. Maybe these things don't bother you, but they bother A LOT of other people. So I'm overblowing nothing, I'm just stating what other people are saying is their opinion. Your's being different doesn't invalidate theirs!

Goodell is a corporate attorney who has done well financially by his clients.

Actually he isn't an attorney, common misconception and I thought it once too awhile back. He got his degree in economics.

I didn't use to like it, but the NBA model is at least a place to start.

The new NBA cap rules are complex but it seems to help the sport. They have been ahead of the curve compared to other sports when it comes to dividing the money and setting wage scales. The NFL would be smart to look at what they are doing.

I agree the rookie scale should change, but with DSmith at the helm the players are fucked, he's just too stupid to manage it well.

 

[Angry Ram]

Polling data doesn't line up with what you are saying. Maybe these things don't bother you, but they bother A LOT of other people. So I'm overblowing nothing, I'm just stating what other people are saying is their opinion. Your's being different doesn't invalidate theirs!

Polling data from what? The internet? Like that is a credible source .

I'm not trying to invalidate opinions, I'm saying that a minority with a loud mouth is making these things overblown. For all the boycott claims, the handful of players that are punished, the league is still truckin.

 

[LesBaker]

Polling data from what? The internet? Like that is a credible source .

I'm not trying to invalidate opinions, I'm saying that a minority with a loud mouth is making these things overblown. For all the boycott claims, the handful of players that are punished, the league is still truckin.

I think it was one of the major news stations or a paper. I have the link on my laptop. It's a credible source and a detailed survey.

I don't know how to respond to the second sentence because I don't know what you are trying to say..

 

[nighttrain]

@LesBaker
What about all the streaming? I can't believe most of America is forking over $$$$ to pay to watch anything....so, does stream views register as normal viewership????

shhhhhhhhhhhhhh
train

 

[RhodyRams]

um...Ok.

I don't recall any murders, lawsuits, wife beatings but yeah the 80's? ...only 3 decades ago so seems applicable to me.

the thing is the news wasnt out there 27/7 in the 80's as it is now. But how many times did Strawberry get arrested for DWI, or Gooden for cocaine, Maclain got locked up for running numbers and coke I think. Pete Rose gambling. We might not heard about the wife beatings etc back then, but I am sure it was there

 

[…..]

the thing is the news wasnt out there 27/7 in the 80's as it is now. But how many times did Strawberry get arrested for DWI, or Gooden for cocaine, Maclain got locked up for running numbers and coke I think. Pete Rose gambling. We might not heard about the wife beatings etc back then, but I am sure it was there

Or Steve Howe...who ended up finishing up with the Yankees on a positive. Yes I get it, but it was still 30 years ago, and none of it was violent crimes.

 

[bubbaramfan]

Sorry AngryRam, I beg to differ. NE has won not just because they were good, but because they also cheat, and have been doing so for the last decade.

 

[Dieter the Brock]

Clayton Bigsby for Commissioner

 

[Angry Ram]

Sorry AngryRam, I beg to differ. NE has won not just because they were good, but because they also cheat, and have been doing so for the last decade.

Get over it. You don't go year after year with 10+ win seasons for cheating.

You don't have to like that franchise (I don't either), but to say their success especially in recent year is because of alleged cheating is asinine. I mean they JUST won a SB after being down 28-3.

I don't know how to respond to the second sentence because I don't know what you are trying to say..

Internet warriors that overblow these so-called "issues". If fans are really that outrages and refuse to watch because of said "issues", then the numbers should reflect that. The ratings are still strong. The World Series only beat football because of the way that series went, it truly was record breaking and entertaining. Check out the top 10s:

http://www.nielsen.com/us/en/top10s.html

A true scenario where fans are so fed up they will refuse the numbers should reflect that. Instead, NFL still gets MILLIONS of people watching weekly. Stadiums are STILL loud. People STILL buy merch and tickets.

I'm not buying this "NFL is dying" mantra.

 

[bubbaramfan]

They've been caught cheating more than a few times. They win because they cheat. And they keep cheating because they know the front office doesn't want to give the NFL a black eye for doing anything about it.

 

[LesBaker]

The ratings are still strong.

Where did you hear that? Ratings and attendance are down.

Chemical Ali is that you?

 

[Angry Ram]

Where did you hear that? Ratings and attendance are down.

Chemical Ali is that you?

I mean I just gave you the link to the Nielsen ratings. The only thing that beat football was the World Series. Monday and Thursday Night football were tops in tv ratings in cable tv.

They've been caught cheating more than a few times. They win because they cheat. And they keep cheating because they know the front office doesn't want to give the NFL a black eye for doing anything about it.

Once again it's what fans say. Do you have anything that shows they've cheated? Their last 2 SBs were won b/c of Seattle idiocy and Falcons blowing a 20+ point lead.

 

[LesBaker]

I mean I just gave you the link to the Nielsen ratings. The only thing that beat football was the World Series. Monday and Thursday Night football were tops in tv ratings in cable tv.

Yes they are still top dog, but the lead is shrinking.