Softli on Bradford's deep ball

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Warner4Prez

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I don't know fellas. Watching that video it seems like he has plenty of zip and he's got the accuracy. I'm afraid it might just be a developing case of 'Bulgeritis.' I'd hate to see that happen to such a young guy with such great potential, but you'd be afraid to stand in their and take your licks while waiting for someone to get open too.
 

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X said:
zn said:
If you wait you don't complete the pass whether they get separation or not.

And not counting 2010 for obvious reasons, Bradford has had guys who can catch em past 25 yards. Clayton, Avery (preseason only), and Alexander (though DX had inconsistent hands). What I see when I watch him throw long is a guy who's inconsistent. And I think anticipation has a lot to do with it.
Catching them past 25 yards is pretty much why receivers are in the NFL to begin with. Of the three you listed, two are where? Alexander is the one primary deep threat he's had at his disposal, and when the two of them are on the same page, where's the anticipation or timing concerns? Honestly, I don't see it. Not with DX, and not with Clayton when he was in. Throwing open was basically what he did with them. That, and back-shoulder fades.

Let's put it in perspective too. 26 starts, 1 truncated offseason, 2 coordinators, a merry-go-round of receivers, and questionable protection. And yet when people 'analyze' Bradford's deep ball, they come up with the effect while ignoring the cause. Of course there's going to be inconsistency. Inconsistency is one of the ingredients in the offense.

Is he a finished product? Of course not.
Are there reasons for his stunted develop to this point? No question.

Now he's got three more new receivers to go along with the returning guys who didn't play 16 games with him either. It would be nice if he knew how fast they were already, how to anticipate their ability to break on the ball, and already trusted them to be where everyone here knows he can throw it. That's gonna take a little bit of time until he finds a guy that he's comfortable throwing to who's blanketed. That's really my only knock on Bradford at this point. He just doesn't like throwing up contested balls all that much. That, I think, is because he doesn't want to be the cause of a turnover; and that, by extension, makes the receivers look bad. All I'm saying is, let him hook up with a receiver he trusts (or two) and all of this goes away.

Exactly. Btw the splits say Bradford completed 5 +20 balls to Clayton in his short time during 2010. Two I specifically remember were beautiful back shoulder "throw you open" fades as X alludes to. Those are just completions too. I remember deep drops he had as well, and that's just Clayton. There were plenty of others as well.

As much as the "deep ball" relies on the QB, it relies just as heavily on the WR as well. We won't even get into the line on this one. Being a deep threat as a receiver definitely has to do with the ability to get open, but it also drastically has to do with the receivers ability to find the ball and make the catch. The great ones find it all the time, and make it all the time. Regardless of the circumstances. The good ones find it most of the time, and catch it most of the time, considering it's a good ball. A prime example is the preseason game last week, where Marshall says (quote/unquote) "Givens has to make that catch. It's wasn't pretty, but it hit him in the hands. If you're going to be known to take the top off of the defense, you have to make that catch. It isn't always going to be pretty."

Even when it is pretty. It's beautiful. This is what happened time and time again.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfzEvzKResM[/youtube]

Torry Holt would've dunked that over the fucking goal post.

The offense can and will do what it's capable of. Regardless of what people want. I'm sure we will see our fair share of deep balls as well. Hopefully by that time, the line has learned the blocking scheme.
 

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That whiff ^^^ by DX gave me diarrhea when it happened. You just got that feeling that things weren't going to go our way after that.

As far as Givens "taking the top off the defense", did anyone else notice that he was never really open on those deep balls?? I am watching the game AGAIN on NFL network right now, and I just don't see the separation that Marshall mentions after those deep shots....
 

PhxRam

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Faceplant said:
That whiff ^^^ by DX gave me diarrhea when it happened. You just got that feeling that things weren't going to go our way after that.

As far as Givens "taking the top off the defense", did anyone else notice that he was never really open on those deep balls?? I am watching the game AGAIN on NFL network right now, and I just don't see the separation that Marshall mentions after those deep shots....

From what I can recall, all of the balls were thrown short allowing the D to catch up.
 

Faceplant

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PhxRam said:
Faceplant said:
That whiff ^^^ by DX gave me diarrhea when it happened. You just got that feeling that things weren't going to go our way after that.

As far as Givens "taking the top off the defense", did anyone else notice that he was never really open on those deep balls?? I am watching the game AGAIN on NFL network right now, and I just don't see the separation that Marshall mentions after those deep shots....

From what I can recall, all of the balls were thrown short allowing the D to catch up.

The balls were short, but you could see prior to him slowing that there was really no seperation. If anything, his adjustment on the ball created the only separation in one case and the DBs just whiffed on the other one that hit him in the hands.
 

PhxRam

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Faceplant said:
PhxRam said:
Faceplant said:
That whiff ^^^ by DX gave me diarrhea when it happened. You just got that feeling that things weren't going to go our way after that.

As far as Givens "taking the top off the defense", did anyone else notice that he was never really open on those deep balls?? I am watching the game AGAIN on NFL network right now, and I just don't see the separation that Marshall mentions after those deep shots....

From what I can recall, all of the balls were thrown short allowing the D to catch up.

The balls were short, but you could see prior to him slowing that there was really no seperation. If anything, his adjustment on the ball created the only separation in one case and the DBs just whiffed on the other one that hit him in the hands.

Will have to go back and look but my gut tells me that the 15-30 yard mark is when you start seeing the separation. I imagine most cbs can run with a receiver within the first 15 yards. Its from that point on is where you start to see the separation.
 

Ram Quixote

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PhxRam said:
Faceplant said:
PhxRam said:
Faceplant said:
That whiff ^^^ by DX gave me diarrhea when it happened. You just got that feeling that things weren't going to go our way after that.

As far as Givens "taking the top off the defense", did anyone else notice that he was never really open on those deep balls?? I am watching the game AGAIN on NFL network right now, and I just don't see the separation that Marshall mentions after those deep shots....

From what I can recall, all of the balls were thrown short allowing the D to catch up.

The balls were short, but you could see prior to him slowing that there was really no seperation. If anything, his adjustment on the ball created the only separation in one case and the DBs just whiffed on the other one that hit him in the hands.

Will have to go back and look but my gut tells me that the 15-30 yard mark is when you start seeing the separation. I imagine most cbs can run with a receiver within the first 15 yards. Its from that point on is where you start to see the separation.
There was definite separation on Clemen's overthrow to Givens. It's not entirely accurate to say there wasn't any separation on the underthrows. If they had been on the mark, Givens wouldn't have been pulling up, like what happened on the overthrow.
 

bluecoconuts

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Faceplant said:
That whiff ^^^ by DX gave me diarrhea when it happened. You just got that feeling that things weren't going to go our way after that.

As far as Givens "taking the top off the defense", did anyone else notice that he was never really open on those deep balls?? I am watching the game AGAIN on NFL network right now, and I just don't see the separation that Marshall mentions after those deep shots....

It'll take some time really. However it also makes DB's back off a bit, because they don't want him to be wide open and get that separation. That opens up the short and mid range routes.
 

Faceplant

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Ram Quixote said:
PhxRam said:
Faceplant said:
PhxRam said:
Faceplant said:
That whiff ^^^ by DX gave me diarrhea when it happened. You just got that feeling that things weren't going to go our way after that.

As far as Givens "taking the top off the defense", did anyone else notice that he was never really open on those deep balls?? I am watching the game AGAIN on NFL network right now, and I just don't see the separation that Marshall mentions after those deep shots....

From what I can recall, all of the balls were thrown short allowing the D to catch up.

The balls were short, but you could see prior to him slowing that there was really no seperation. If anything, his adjustment on the ball created the only separation in one case and the DBs just whiffed on the other one that hit him in the hands.

Will have to go back and look but my gut tells me that the 15-30 yard mark is when you start seeing the separation. I imagine most cbs can run with a receiver within the first 15 yards. Its from that point on is where you start to see the separation.
There was definite separation on Clemen's overthrow to Givens. It's not entirely accurate to say there wasn't any separation on the underthrows. If they had been on the mark, Givens wouldn't have been pulling up, like what happened on the overthrow.

Maybe our idea of separation differs...
 

Ram Quixote

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Faceplant said:
Ram Quixote said:
PhxRam said:
Faceplant said:
PhxRam said:
Faceplant said:
That whiff ^^^ by DX gave me diarrhea when it happened. You just got that feeling that things weren't going to go our way after that.

As far as Givens "taking the top off the defense", did anyone else notice that he was never really open on those deep balls?? I am watching the game AGAIN on NFL network right now, and I just don't see the separation that Marshall mentions after those deep shots....

From what I can recall, all of the balls were thrown short allowing the D to catch up.

The balls were short, but you could see prior to him slowing that there was really no seperation. If anything, his adjustment on the ball created the only separation in one case and the DBs just whiffed on the other one that hit him in the hands.

Will have to go back and look but my gut tells me that the 15-30 yard mark is when you start seeing the separation. I imagine most cbs can run with a receiver within the first 15 yards. Its from that point on is where you start to see the separation.
There was definite separation on Clemen's overthrow to Givens. It's not entirely accurate to say there wasn't any separation on the underthrows. If they had been on the mark, Givens wouldn't have been pulling up, like what happened on the overthrow.

Maybe our idea of separation differs...
On a deep ball, a step is all you need. Givens had a step, maybe a step and a half on the DB.