Rams heavily scouting QBs at Senior Bowl

[Ram_Rally]

Hundley made himself available for trade up in round 2 IMO. question is does his unwillingness to step up the plate and compete say anything about his competitive drive?

 

[LACHAMP46]

Corrected
Petty
Mannion
;-)
I dont think Grayson has a strong enough arm for my liking

Petty maybe...these other guys....

The QBs usually look poor at the senior bowl. That being said we all knew this QB class was weak.

Naw Fro, these guys look horrible in the drills

 

[Boston Ram]

Corrected
Petty
Mannion
;-)
I dont think Grayson has a strong enough arm for my liking

I'm with you in Grayson, plays with a lot of guts and grit but not much else.

 

[Yamahopper]

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/foot...cle_ac0056a7-b0e9-5db7-a8ff-43242f82b3b0.html

MOBILE, ALA. • East Carolina quarterback Shane Carden’s favorite QBs are Brett Favre and Philip Rivers.

Favre is an interesting choice because Carden looks a little like the young Favre and even sounds a little like him.

“Growing up, I was always told I looked like (Favre),” Carden said. “And I just loved the way he played the game. He always had so much passion in everything he did. The plays he was able to make outside the pocket — I just always enjoyed watching him.”

And Rivers?

“Same type of deal,” Carden said. “He brings some fire to the field. He looks like an ultimate competitor. I’ve never met the guy, but just from what I’ve seen, how he plays the game, I just love the way he plays football.”

According to one scout, Carden doesn’t necessarily wow you on the practice field, but come game day it’s a different story. He’s a gamer. Carden didn’t dispute the description.

“I try to get the most out of practice,” Carden said. “But yeah, when games start something else kinda switches in me, and I stay after it.”

Carden, who has spoken with the Rams at the Senior Bowl, grew up in Newport Beach, Calif., but moved to Houston when he was 12. A little undersized at a shade under 6 feet 2, Carden has had some good moments on the practice field in Mobile, particularly when throwing on the run on rollouts and bootlegs.


In that sense his style is reminiscent to Jeff Garcia, a feisty four-time Pro Bowler who had a long and productive NFL career. Not only has Carden heard of Garcia and heard the comparison, he has trained with Garcia in California.

“I actually worked out with him this past spring,” Carden said. “He looked at me and he was like ‘Man, you could be my brother.’

“When we were working out, he was doing the drills. He was leading them, and he was getting after it. He can still spin it, man.”

Garcia is 44.

Carden doesn’t have the name recognition of most of the other QBs attending the Senior Bowl because East Carolina isn’t a so-called “Power 5” school. But he put up great numbers in college, including school records for passing yards (11,991) and touchdowns (86) over three seasons.

He’s hoping to make a name for himself this week among the scouts and coaches here in Mobile.

“All the coaches, obviously they want to see me under center,” Carden said. “In my college career I was in the ’gun pretty much all the time. I’m just getting comfortable with that. It’s just being consistent with that footwork. Just little things here and there that each team wants to know about.”

 

[Yamahopper]

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/foot...cle_83980c34-c39b-5a9b-8b50-bddcbb8a4bbf.html

MOBILE, ALA. • In this hurry-up, no-huddle, spread-the-field craze that has become college football, Sean Mannion knows what it’s like to take a snap under center followed by a seven-step drop.

The Oregon State quarterback actually played in a pro-style offense in college — surprise! — so as he works with the North squad at the Senior Bowl, he actually knows what it’s like to call a play in a huddle.

“We were mostly under center,” Mannion said of his time with the Beavers. “We were a totally pro-style scheme. I loved the system. I feel like I’m a great fit for it.”

All things being equal, that experience could ease his transition into the NFL and make it easier to play early.

“I guess in some ways it might,” he said. “At the same time, I’m trying to develop every area of my game. In terms of being pro-ready early that’s certainly the goal, that’s certainly what I want to do. It’s all about just day-to-day improving and not really looking too far ahead. I want to be a better player tomorrow than I am today.”

Mannion, 6-5, 227, threw the ball a ton for the Beavers, including a whopping 603 attempts during the 2013 season. A four-year starter, he finished as the Pac-12’s career leader in yards passing (13,600), breaking Matt Barkley’s record.

In a memorable 2013 season, Mannion set the Pac-12 record for single-season passing yards (4,662) and a school single-season mark for touchdown passes (37). But he had wide receiver Brandin Cooks then, and a healthy offensive line.


He had neither in 2014, a season in which his numbers dipped to 3,164 yards passing and 15 touchdowns.

Given a third-round grade by the NFL draft advisory board after his junior season, Mannion decided to return to Oregon State for his senior year. Cooks, by the way, went to New Orleans in the first round of the 2014 draft — No. 20 overall.

So after that so-so senior season, Mannion undoubtedly has been asked the question a thousand times: Does he regret not turning pro after the 2013 season?

Mannion started answering even before the question was finished.

“Not at all,” he replied. “No regrets whatsoever. I certainly feel now that I’m a far better quarterback than I was at the end of my junior year. I think an event like this is the perfect time to kind of use all those lessons that I learned by playing an extra year. I feel it’s really helping me now.”

They were lessons learned through adversity.

“There were challenges,” Mannion said. “But I tried to just take that on and tried to overcome that. I think being a four-year starter, being a captain, being a leader on the team, you really try to lift everyone else around you up when things might not be as easy.”

UCLA’s Brett Hundley, at this point considered the third-best QB behind Oregon’s Marcus Mariota and Florida State’s Jameis Winston, chose not to attend the Senior Bowl. As an underclassman, Winston is not eligible to participate here.

Mariota also came out early, but because he has earned his college degree he was in fact eligible to participate in Mobile. Senior Bowl officials tried to get Mariota to attend, but Mariota — apparently without an agent at this time — declined.

Which brings us back to Mannion, who for now is lumped in a group behind Mariota, Winston and Hundley. That group includes Baylor’s Bryce Petty, Colorado State’s Garrett Grayson and East Carolina’s Shane Carden who, like Mannion, all are competing at the Senior Bowl this week.

Draft analyst Russ Lande, the former Rams scout, calls the 2015 QB class “the worst class I can remember. I don’t think there’s anybody that you can look at and say, ‘OK, this is your Andrew Luck. This is your Peyton Manning. Or Tom Brady even.’

“That is, a definite guy you want to stake a claim to in the first round. Everybody, whether it’s Winston or Mariota, they all have major questions. And I’m not even talking off the field. I’m just talking on the field, that make me wonder if they can really be successful quarterbacks.”

In terms of Mannion, one veteran NFC quarterbacks coach, speaking on condition of anonymity, said he’s not sure about his arm strength and pointed out that Mannion has a bit of a long delivery.

Neither is something you’d necessarily call a career killer, but they are traits that every quarterback-needy team will look at as they study Mannion, who’s from Pleasanton, Calif. Another thing to keep in mind in dissecting Mannion is that he threw 54 interceptions in college, which is a high number even for his high amount of attempts.

Does that speak to his decision-making or recognition? Did he have coaches who encouraged him to take chances? Unreliable receivers (other than Cooks)? Or did he simply throw more deep balls than safer dump-offs and short stuff?

In their search to bring in somebody “from outside the building” to compete with Sam Bradford — as coach Jeff Fisher said at his season-ending news conference — the Rams will seek answers to such questions.

For his part, Mannion wants to erase any doubts this week.

“I felt like this was a great opportunity for me to come out and show what I can do and compete with the other quarterbacks,” he said. “And frankly try to be the best guy. Be the best player here. That’s something I really am striving for.”

 

[tahoe]

I'm with you in Grayson, plays with a lot of guts and grit but not much else.

The way I see it, if you like Grayson you might as well just sign Colt McCoy, same guy pretty much.

 

[Boffo97]

MOBILE, ALA. • In this hurry-up, no-huddle, spread-the-field craze that has become college football, Sean Mannion knows what it’s like to take a snap under center followed by a seven-step drop.

Let's get him... I've heard Mobile QBs are good...

 

[Merlin]

That'll be depressing. Give me Glennon any day of the week over any QB at the Senior Bowl. This crop just isn't good.

I find your either/or mentality interesting Jrry.

Wouldn't mind seeing the Rams acquire Glennon, but even so I'd still like to see them add one of these young QBs. And I get it, I realize you feel they're all garbage, and maybe you'll end up being correct, maybe none of them will ever even be a starter in this league.

But the Rams still need to take one that has upside. Petty for example can make all the throws, has an impressive resume, and is a workaholic. Dude had the balls to show up to the all star game where as expected he's learning on the job and now he's garbage? I don't buy it personally. I think we can nuke any prospect and find everything wrong with them, but that mentality can interfere just like pumping them up too much IMO. I mean there's a reason why Rodgers was taken late in the first round, and it's because his association with a pass happy offense stacking his stats occluding his ceiling.

The big picture nowadays, in my estimation, is that great teams are going to do a lot of their own development of their QBs. It's either that or dumb down your offense, or lose the most games in a year where a rare QB comes out. So as I have mentioned before, up until the Rams find that QB of the future they need to roll the dice in each draft on the position and by roll the dice I mean they'll probably have to reach a little to get the guy they want. Not saying to do something asinine like reaching early first round for a third round talent, but fact is QBs are supply and demand.

It's about ceiling now, IMO. Talent + on field production + dedication is what the Rams need to look for. Every season until they find their guy.

 

[Yamahopper]

Let's get him... I've heard Mobile QBs are good...

Draft the guy who's a ACL transplant match for Bradford.

If i could have put those articles in blue font I would have.

 

[jrry32]

I find your either/or mentality interesting Jrry.

Wouldn't be an either or proposition for me if I felt there was a guy worth developing. Frankly, Nick Marshall is probably the most worthwhile project in this class(considering where each QB is projected to be picked) and he's being moved to CB.

Wouldn't mind seeing the Rams acquire Glennon, but even so I'd still like to see them add one of these young QBs. And I get it, I realize you feel they're all garbage, and maybe you'll end up being correct, maybe none of them will ever even be a starter in this league.

But the Rams still need to take one that has upside. Petty for example can make all the throws, has an impressive resume, and is a workaholic. Dude had the balls to show up to the all star game where as expected he's learning on the job and now he's garbage? I don't buy it personally. I think we can nuke any prospect and find everything wrong with them, but that mentality can interfere just like pumping them up too much IMO. I mean there's a reason why Rodgers was taken late in the first round, and it's because his association with a pass happy offense stacking his stats occluding his ceiling.

Rodgers was in the running for the #1 pick that year.

I didn't like Petty long before the Senior Bowl. He's Drew Stanton to me. Which is fine on Day 3. But somebody will overdraft him. And I'm not going to spend a top 3 round pick on a guy that I don't think has starter potential.

Petty is too erratic with his accuracy, he doesn't handle pressure well, struggles reading pressure packages, and he rarely had to face complex coverages because of the hurry up spread he played in. And the guy is an older prospect. He's almost 24 years old.

Truth of the matter is that the nuking prospects mindset really doesn't even work for me. I've been trying desperately to convince myself there's a guy in this class outside the top two that I think can be a quality starter. Which is why I've gone through periods of time where I supported Hundley, Carden, Grayson, etc. But then it hit me, I wasn't going off of what the film told me. I was trying to convince myself those guys could be good. Which reminded me of a quote, “What does a bust look like before it happens? It looks like four guys sitting in a room, trying to convince each other that some guy is better than we think he is.”

The big picture nowadays, in my estimation, is that great teams are going to do a lot of their own development of their QBs. It's either that or dumb down your offense, or lose the most games in a year where a rare QB comes out. So as I have mentioned before, up until the Rams find that QB of the future they need to roll the dice in each draft on the position and by roll the dice I mean they'll probably have to reach a little to get the guy they want. Not saying to do something asinine like reaching early first round for a third round talent, but fact is QBs are supply and demand.

It's about ceiling now, IMO. Talent + on field production + dedication is what the Rams need to look for. Every season until they find their guy.

And that's where my problem is. Because that's exactly what they shouldn't do in this draft...unless it's Mariota or Winston. Which is why I'd prefer they trade for Glennon. Think he's a better option for developing and for backing up Sam than any of the QBs in this class outside of the top two. Point of it is to buy us time.

 

[V3]

I find your either/or mentality interesting Jrry.

Wouldn't mind seeing the Rams acquire Glennon, but even so I'd still like to see them add one of these young QBs. And I get it, I realize you feel they're all garbage, and maybe you'll end up being correct, maybe none of them will ever even be a starter in this league.

But the Rams still need to take one that has upside. Petty for example can make all the throws, has an impressive resume, and is a workaholic. Dude had the balls to show up to the all star game where as expected he's learning on the job and now he's garbage? I don't buy it personally. I think we can nuke any prospect and find everything wrong with them, but that mentality can interfere just like pumping them up too much IMO. I mean there's a reason why Rodgers was taken late in the first round, and it's because his association with a pass happy offense stacking his stats occluding his ceiling.

The big picture nowadays, in my estimation, is that great teams are going to do a lot of their own development of their QBs. It's either that or dumb down your offense, or lose the most games in a year where a rare QB comes out. So as I have mentioned before, up until the Rams find that QB of the future they need to roll the dice in each draft on the position and by roll the dice I mean they'll probably have to reach a little to get the guy they want. Not saying to do something asinine like reaching early first round for a third round talent, but fact is QBs are supply and demand.

It's about ceiling now, IMO. Talent + on field production + dedication is what the Rams need to look for. Every season until they find their guy.

Why? You don't just take a player just because you need the position. If the player isn't good, don't waste the pick on them. The Rams messed up last year and now they are reaping what they sowed.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

I agree with Jrry on this one. I would rather try to acquire Glennon. However after everyone saw this Sr. Bowl crop the asking price on Glennon just went up.

I would be estatic with a trade up for Winston or even Mariotta. I just don't think they will be in reach.

 

[jrry32]

I agree with Jrry on this one. I would rather try to acquire Glennon. However after everyone saw this Sr. Bowl crop the asking price on Glennon just went up.

I would be estatic with a trade up for Winston or even Mariotta. I just don't think they will be in reach.

Hopefully not. You never know. Seems like teams tend to be kind of like "sheep". When one team gets down on their guy, a lot of the teams do. In most cases. They seem to take their cues from each other.

Hopefully Lovie and Co. being down on Glennon will keep his price down. I'd be ecstatic if we could get him for a 5th...or even less.

 

[Riverumbbq]

I'm hoping all this reaching for a QB business is just some well placed smoke screening leading up to the draft.

 

[Memphis Ram]

So as I have mentioned before, up until the Rams find that QB of the future they need to roll the dice in each draft on the position and by roll the dice I mean they'll probably have to reach a little to get the guy they want. Not saying to do something asinine like reaching early first round for a third round talent, but fact is QBs are supply and demand.

It's about ceiling now, IMO. Talent + on field production + dedication is what the Rams need to look for. Every season until they find their guy.

IMO, it's a HUGE mistake to reach a little for any position.

But, my guess is that what most teams lacking QBs have done for years now. Problem is that for every Andrew Luck or Matt Ryan there are probably 5-10 Mark Sanchezs or Jake Lockers. And for every Russell Wilson and Marc Bulger there are probably 20-30 Tony Pikes and Keith Nulls.

Year after year, it will probably always be the luck of the draw for NFL teams to land this quality traditional dropback passer. And it's hard to take the scattergun approach and grab one every year because teams won't have enough time to see what they have or it said player can be developed before the next year's selection shows up.

One day, someone's eyes will open and see that it may be time to get more creative on offense in a way to take advantage of what the college game is producing at the position. In the end, a TD is a TD no matter how it's scored. But, I guess much of the old hierarchy might have to fade away some more first.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

IMO, it's a HUGE mistake to reach a little for any position.

But, my guess is that what most teams lacking QBs have done for years now. Problem is that for every Andrew Luck or Matt Ryan there are probably 5-10 Mark Sanchezs or Jake Lockers. And for every Russell Wilson and Marc Bulger there are probably 20-30 Tony Pikes and Keith Nulls.

Year after year, it will probably always be the luck of the draw for NFL teams to land this quality traditional dropback passer. And it's hard to take the scattergun approach and grab one every year because teams won't have enough time to see what they have or it said player can be developed before the next year's selection shows up.

One day, someone's eyes will open and see that it may be time to get more creative on offense in a way to take advantage of what the college game is producing at the position. In the end, a TD is a TD no matter how it's scored. But, I guess much of the old hierarchy might have to fade away some more first.

I believe Philadelphia is trying to do this. The thing is so far it only works with a gimmicky hurry up offense that relies on a teams players to be better conditioned and prepared to play fast between snaps. The actual plays that Philly uses are not all that unique.

If you are alluding to your dream of a Delaware Wing T with a running QB then any team that runs it would have to carry 5 QBs on the roster to account for injuries.

If there is some new formula that will allow teams to score lots of points on O without a good QB I would be all for it.

 

[jrry32]

I believe Philadelphia is trying to do this. The thing is so far it only works with a gimmicky hurry up offense that relies on a teams players to be better conditioned and prepared to play fast between snaps. The actual plays that Philly uses are not all that unique.

If you are alluding to your dream of a Delaware Wing T with a running QB then any team that runs it would have to carry 5 QBs on the roster to account for injuries.

If there is some new formula that will allow teams to score lots of points on O without a good QB I would be all for it.

Yep. And the issue with Philadelphia's plan is that they sacrifice defensive points for those offensive points. So if your offense gets bogged down at all, you're basically throwing your defense to the wolves.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Yep. And the issue with Philadelphia's plan is that they sacrifice defensive points for those offensive points. So if your offense gets bogged down at all, you're basically throwing your defense to the wolves.

I believe that the NFL is already catching up to Chip Kelly. It only took one season.

 

[Memphis Ram]

I believe Philadelphia is trying to do this. The thing is so far it only works with a gimmicky hurry up offense that relies on a teams players to be better conditioned and prepared to play fast between snaps. The actual plays that Philly uses are not all that unique.

If you are alluding to your dream of a Delaware Wing T with a running QB then any team that runs it would have to carry 5 QBs on the roster to account for injuries.

If there is some new formula that will allow teams to score lots of points on O without a good QB I would be all for it.

Teams will always need a good QB. But, IMO, the definition/criteria and even circumstances of what makes a good QB will have to be altered.

In a traditional Delaware Wing T, I guess you might need to carry 5 QBs, but I don't think you would need to in Malzahn's offense. Unlike Georgia Tech's wishbone triple option where the QB had the majority of the carries, that wasn't the case at Auburn. Plus, they actually had a passing game. And one that work and was made easier for their QB via the run threat.

And as I've said before, I believe that there are a lot of players available that could run that offense who can't run a traditional NFL offense. Hence, the supply at the position far exceeds the current demand which lessens the risk of an injury at the position limiting a team's offensive success.

In a traditional attack, if your rare find of a quality dropback passer goes down, then chances are your season is over. Under Malzahn's offense, it becomes closer to next man up ala replacing a RB.

 

[Merlin]

Bottom line is with QBs you are throwing darts at the board because of the need to project so many of these guys.

Will they do the mental work in the film room. Are they smart enough. Can they make quick enough decisions at this level. Can they diagnose what defenses are doing.

The fact is that supply and demand along with importance of the position means a team without one should roll the dice every season until they find one.

If you sit back stoically and refuse to reach at all on a QB your chances of getting one drop dramatically. Like Gretzky said the only shots you are sure to miss are those you never take.

It is a crapshoot regardless so pick one and take him where you think you need to. IMO.