Rams have slowly painted themselves into a corner and I don’t envy McVay right now…

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Rams43

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Imo, the current problems are an accumulation of mistakes made by Snead, McVay, and Rams scouting dept.

First, let me stipulate that OL injuries this year have been catastrophic. Worst I can ever remember in any half-season going back to the 60’s. Such injuries would cripple ANY Offense in the league.

But I maintain that the OL injuries alone are not solely responsible for our plight. Hear me out.

Other factors, many of them, have cumulatively deprived Rams of other options that could have alleviated the current problems.

Let’s start by being objective about Snead’s drafting. It’s been largely mediocre for years. He hit an apparent HR with Jones, but what other near Pro Bowler has he drafted with his 2-4th round picks lately? Yeah, he’s found ‘starters’ but that’s kinda like picking the tallest midget, isn’t it? Others have posted articles breaking down our drafts in the premium (non-1st rounders) rounds and it’s been a rather paltry list since that great 2017 class.

I’m sure I’m in the minority on this one, but was that Von Miller trade really a long term positive for Rams? Sure, we won a SB with him, but we gave up a 2nd and a 3rd for half a season of Miller. And we might have won the SB without him, anyway. Meanwhile, we now miss the benefits that would have come from players taken with those premium picks for the next 10 years. Including this season, I might add. Then Rams compounded the problem by letting him get away without an early extension. Did Rams bungle the negotiations or did they prefer to let this so-called difference maker get away as part of the cost of doing business since they now had that beautiful Lombardi in their trophy case? Either way I call it a FO screwup and a big one, at that.

I may never get over the colossal error of drafting Atwell over Humphrey. Especially after Snead has stated that he learned his lesson after the Bobby Wagner fiasco. Was it Snead or, as I strongly suspect, McVay’s mistake? Either way the ripple effects of this mistake will be felt for 10 years. This was a classic unforced error. Maybe McVay should confine himself to outlining the types of players he likes at the respective positions and let Snead do the actual picking? Ya think?

Remember that scout (I think it was a scout) that was so excited about drafting Bruss that he jumped into the pool? THAT hasn’t aged well, has it? While I’m at it, why have Rams sucked at certain positions in their evals and picks for years? RB, TE, OL, and Edge specifically? And why has it been tolerated for years? I can understand some misses because drafting is an not an exact science. But year after year? Maybe Snead needs to take a hard look at his scouting dept in those areas? Duh!

I’m not gonna criticize Snead for his strategy of trading 1sts for proven players because I understand the rationale and I think it makes sense and is sustainable. But it IS predicated on hitting on a good amount of his 2nd-4th round picks and Snead hasn’t really been doing that. That has to change.

Now let’s talk about McVay for a little bit. Frankly, I LOVE him and think he’s the best Ram HC of my lifetime.

However…

He is far from perfect. For example, is he looking for the ‘right type’ of OL players and RB’s? I’m not so sure. Rams rushing attack has been rather pitiful since Gurley left if we’re being honest. That starts with the HC, y’all.

The current trend in the NFL is a resurgence of the running attack and away from the passing game and yet McVay stubbornly is bucking that trend. Many pundits have recently published on this topic. Want a recent prime example? McVay only ran the ball maybe 15 times behind his backup QB Wolford and an overmatched OL vs Cards. He literally set Wolford up for failure with that strategy. I rest my case.

Want more painting-in-corner examples? McVay either cannot or will not run 12 personnel sets because he doesn’t think that either Blanton or Hopkins can handle it. This 12 set attack might alleviate his OL current shortcomings and make Stafford’s life a lot easier. Whose fault is it that our TE room is so weakened? And btw, why not give this Carter kid a few snaps at either TE or FB? WTH is there to lose at this point?

Speaking of giving youngsters a chance, why not Atwell, McCutcheon, and Hardy? Again, what’s to lose at this point? McVay is too stubborn on such matters.

Also, McVay seems to be obsessed with adding Offensive skill players but seems to have a blind spot when it comes to his OL. Even when fully healthy this OL wasn’t keeping opposing DC’s up at night. So, if we’re being honest, this OL has been treated like a red headed stepchild for far too long. That’s on McVay.

Like I said up top, Rams have slowly painted themselves into this corner metaphorically for years and we’ve all been overlooking it because of the exciting winning seasons, the playoff appearances, and winning the last SB. Well, now the chickens have come home to roost. Time to face facts.

Solutions?

Get back to basics.

Snead has to draft better in rounds 2-4. He needs to shake up his scouting dept, maybe starting with the dude who jumped into the pool after drafting Bruss. Lol. The OL and RB would be great places to start the reload.

McVay needs to do some SERIOUS self evaluation. He needs to establish a credible running game or he’s finished. The league no longer fears his passing game by itself. He probably needs to let Snead pick the players at draft time, too. McVay should focus on what’s in his own lane.

MCVay needs to do a ruthless eval on his current asst coaches. Some of them are not producing needed results as was the case back in the day.

Glad I got that off my chest. I feel better now.
 

TexasRam

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Lots of good observations there and lots of hard truth.

But I am not a fan of the “Sure we
Won a superbowl with Miller” logic.

Everyone knew there was a likely scenario where he ends up being a one year rental. I don’t think we could assume we would have won a
Lombardi without him. Look at our current defensive issues with no pass rush. I would make that trade 100 times over. A Lombardi is so hard to get. We pushed all the chips in and I respect Mcvay and Snead for that. Had to go and get it. We sold out with Donald getting up in age and all the other peices in place and healthy.

Same thing is happening with the eagles and Niners and other teams this year. It’s the right move.

But I’ll be the first to agree on many of your other points, especially the way they failed to prioritize the Oline. Even if healthy our starters are a very mediocre suspect group. Not a fa of questioning too much of the play calling or personal though. I think nothing works when the Oline is in shambles.
 

Kupped

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First thing's first... with a functional offense, this team is 6-4. Would that be horrible? I'd say no.. 10-7 or 11-6 would be an acceptable record, coming off a Super Bowl win with the personnel losses they had.

The interesting thing about the running game is that THEY KNEW it was a problem. Who knows how well it would've performed with a healthy line.. but, I just don't know about the current mix of coaches and McVay's mindset. You bring up very, very good points about McVay and his issues as a play caller. I worry that if he doesn't have his perfect mix of 11 personnel players, he can't adapt.

There are issues with the drafting.. but, you just can't say.. "I know there are a lot of Oline injuries.. BUT... "
The Oline injuries are SO catastrophic.. that they distort everything on the team. Everything.
Again.. with a healthy line.. I don't think 6-4 is unrealistic at all. With a healthy line.. Stafford isn't on the bench and Kupp isn't hurt because of a hospital ball pass.
Young defenders aren't exposed as much.. Aaron Donald isn't on the field as much... the defense can take more chances...

When you have THAT MANY injuries on the line... it's just not likely you can function.

Rams need to get healthy on the O line next season.. and add a couple of players.

The Bruss thing didn't age well because he's hurt. Slow preseason, for sure.. but we have no idea what he'd look like this far in.

Questioning the Miller trade is absolute, 100% horseshit. There's no Super Bowl without him. Period.

Injuries on the offensive line this season is the story. Everything shitty came from that. I don't know that they'd be as good as last year, but they wouldn't be shit, that's for sure.
 

Ellard80

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It's like some of you didn't watch the Rams for 20 years when we had high draft picks

high draft picks often don't mean shit.

resurgence of the running game in the nfl.. not even sure where you came up with that.

There is no evidence of that - the resurgence of the running quarterback maybe.

KC is prob the best team right now and they rank 20th in run offense.

Half of the top rushing teams in the NFL are not good.

Sure the ability to run the ball would be nice... but it's not the be all end all...

We won 4 games in the playoffs and couldn't really run the ball.

Then you talk about his poor assistants lol... this dude has more assistants as head coaches right now than any other coach... and its not close.

You also have made this same basic post a few times.
 
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Ram65

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I’m sure I’m in the minority on this one, but was that Von Miller trade really a long term positive for Rams? Sure, we won a SB with him, but we gave up a 2nd and a 3rd for half a season of Miller. And we might have won the SB without him, anyway

Are you kidding me? The Rams wouldn't have won the Super Bowl without Von Miller and OBJ moves.

Then Rams compounded the problem by letting him get away without an early extension.

Who knows if Miller would have redone his contract at the time of the trade. The Bills stepped up with 3-year deal money. Very hard to second guess this without knowing all the facts. Personally, I doubt the Rams really had a chance once the Bills decided VM was their signing to win the Super Bowl as the Rams did.

I may never get over the colossal error of drafting Atwell over Humphrey.

Atwell has proven to be a very poor draft pick. I don't think the Rams had Humphrey on their radar as they liked Allen.


Remember that scout (I think it was a scout) that was so excited about drafting Bruss that he jumped into the pool? THAT hasn’t aged well, has it?

Still early.

I haven't been a total Snead fanboy but, drafting is hard. That's why making big trades and getting the players he acquired got the Rams a Super Bowl WIN. Locally the Eagles drafted Jalen Reagor over Jefferson. That's as bad as it gets. It happens all the time. Maybe it's time to make a few changes to the Scouting Department as overall they haven't done a great job. Of course, they haven't had a lot of early picks to work with,
 

Angry Ram

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TheTackle

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Imo, the current problems are an accumulation of mistakes made by Snead, McVay, and Rams scouting dept.

First, let me stipulate that OL injuries this year have been catastrophic. Worst I can ever remember in any half-season going back to the 60’s. Such injuries would cripple ANY Offense in the league.

But I maintain that the OL injuries alone are not solely responsible for our plight. Hear me out.

Other factors, many of them, have cumulatively deprived Rams of other options that could have alleviated the current problems.

Let’s start by being objective about Snead’s drafting. It’s been largely mediocre for years. He hit an apparent HR with Jones, but what other near Pro Bowler has he drafted with his 2-4th round picks lately? Yeah, he’s found ‘starters’ but that’s kinda like picking the tallest midget, isn’t it? Others have posted articles breaking down our drafts in the premium (non-1st rounders) rounds and it’s been a rather paltry list since that great 2017 class.

I’m sure I’m in the minority on this one, but was that Von Miller trade really a long term positive for Rams? Sure, we won a SB with him, but we gave up a 2nd and a 3rd for half a season of Miller. And we might have won the SB without him, anyway. Meanwhile, we now miss the benefits that would have come from players taken with those premium picks for the next 10 years. Including this season, I might add. Then Rams compounded the problem by letting him get away without an early extension. Did Rams bungle the negotiations or did they prefer to let this so-called difference maker get away as part of the cost of doing business since they now had that beautiful Lombardi in their trophy case? Either way I call it a FO screwup and a big one, at that.

I may never get over the colossal error of drafting Atwell over Humphrey. Especially after Snead has stated that he learned his lesson after the Bobby Wagner fiasco. Was it Snead or, as I strongly suspect, McVay’s mistake? Either way the ripple effects of this mistake will be felt for 10 years. This was a classic unforced error. Maybe McVay should confine himself to outlining the types of players he likes at the respective positions and let Snead do the actual picking? Ya think?

Remember that scout (I think it was a scout) that was so excited about drafting Bruss that he jumped into the pool? THAT hasn’t aged well, has it? While I’m at it, why have Rams sucked at certain positions in their evals and picks for years? RB, TE, OL, and Edge specifically? And why has it been tolerated for years? I can understand some misses because drafting is an not an exact science. But year after year? Maybe Snead needs to take a hard look at his scouting dept in those areas? Duh!

I’m not gonna criticize Snead for his strategy of trading 1sts for proven players because I understand the rationale and I think it makes sense and is sustainable. But it IS predicated on hitting on a good amount of his 2nd-4th round picks and Snead hasn’t really been doing that. That has to change.

Now let’s talk about McVay for a little bit. Frankly, I LOVE him and think he’s the best Ram HC of my lifetime.

However…

He is far from perfect. For example, is he looking for the ‘right type’ of OL players and RB’s? I’m not so sure. Rams rushing attack has been rather pitiful since Gurley left if we’re being honest. That starts with the HC, y’all.

The current trend in the NFL is a resurgence of the running attack and away from the passing game and yet McVay stubbornly is bucking that trend. Many pundits have recently published on this topic. Want a recent prime example? McVay only ran the ball maybe 15 times behind his backup QB Wolford and an overmatched OL vs Cards. He literally set Wolford up for failure with that strategy. I rest my case.

Want more painting-in-corner examples? McVay either cannot or will not run 12 personnel sets because he doesn’t think that either Blanton or Hopkins can handle it. This 12 set attack might alleviate his OL current shortcomings and make Stafford’s life a lot easier. Whose fault is it that our TE room is so weakened? And btw, why not give this Carter kid a few snaps at either TE or FB? WTH is there to lose at this point?

Speaking of giving youngsters a chance, why not Atwell, McCutcheon, and Hardy? Again, what’s to lose at this point? McVay is too stubborn on such matters.

Also, McVay seems to be obsessed with adding Offensive skill players but seems to have a blind spot when it comes to his OL. Even when fully healthy this OL wasn’t keeping opposing DC’s up at night. So, if we’re being honest, this OL has been treated like a red headed stepchild for far too long. That’s on McVay.

Like I said up top, Rams have slowly painted themselves into this corner metaphorically for years and we’ve all been overlooking it because of the exciting winning seasons, the playoff appearances, and winning the last SB. Well, now the chickens have come home to roost. Time to face facts.

Solutions?

Get back to basics.

Snead has to draft better in rounds 2-4. He needs to shake up his scouting dept, maybe starting with the dude who jumped into the pool after drafting Bruss. Lol. The OL and RB would be great places to start the reload.

McVay needs to do some SERIOUS self evaluation. He needs to establish a credible running game or he’s finished. The league no longer fears his passing game by itself. He probably needs to let Snead pick the players at draft time, too. McVay should focus on what’s in his own lane.

MCVay needs to do a ruthless eval on his current asst coaches. Some of them are not producing needed results as was the case back in the day.

Glad I got that off my chest. I feel better now.
You make some good points without throwing anyone under the bus :helmet:
 

oldnotdead

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If McVay has a flaw it's his inability to adapt. He showed that with Goff, who he insisted on pounding a square peg into a round hole. Goff in a more tailored environment is playing well. His problem is only having one decent WR and they traded away their best TE. But the offensive scheme is tailored to Goff's skill set.

McVay doesn't have the OL to play his preferred style of offense. When your OL is struggling particularly in the passing game you should consider playing less 11 personnel and more 12 personnel, i.e. extend your OL. Or you play a power-run attack with a true FB. During the heyday of Tomlinson, the Charger OL was mediocre at best but they had a very good FB to lead for Tomlinson. Even with a 21 personnel base offense Rivers lead a very dangerous deep strike oriented offensive passing attack. Why? Because the defense had to honor the run and play action was devastating.

What I'm saying is that if McVay focused on actually running the ball in the same way he focuses on the passing attack then he would structure the run personnel for success. Instead, he messes around with a WR as a FB...C'mon man!
 

AZRams

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Are you kidding me? The Rams wouldn't have won the Super Bowl without Von Miller and OBJ moves.



Who knows if Miller would have redone his contract at the time of the trade. The Bills stepped up with 3-year deal money. Very hard to second guess this without knowing all the facts. Personally, I doubt the Rams really had a chance once the Bills decided VM was their signing to win the Super Bowl as the Rams did.



Atwell has proven to be a very poor draft pick. I don't think the Rams had Humphrey on their radar as they liked Allen.




Still early.

I haven't been a total Snead fanboy but, drafting is hard. That's why making big trades and getting the players he acquired got the Rams a Super Bowl WIN. Locally the Eagles drafted Jalen Reagor over Jefferson. That's as bad as it gets. It happens all the time. Maybe it's time to make a few changes to the Scouting Department as overall they haven't done a great job. Of course, they haven't had a lot of early picks to work with,
Yep. The were convinced Allen was the guy since 2020.

As for Bruss...come on. Dude was injured in camp for cryin' out loud.
 

SteezyEndo

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If McVay has a flaw it's his inability to adapt.

McVay doesn't have the OL to play his preferred style of offense.

You would think he would learn by now, but he is too damn proud and stubborn. Like come on he should already know his offense cannot operate with a broken OL, why do we fans have to point that out for him. Secondly Snead needs to get his shiit together and start drafting quality players. Lastly I would prefer if McVay stayed in his lane and left the offensive play calling to someone who is capable, he is doing too much and losing sight of what issues this team has…
 

Tano

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Atwell has proven to be a very poor draft pick. I don't think the Rams had Humphrey on their radar as they liked Allen.
I don't think a lot of you is remembering the 2021 preseason that well.

They were intending to use Corbett as the starting center with Evans as the starting RG

But Evans was so terrible at RG that they decided to give Allen a try at center again after being hurt for 2 seasons and move Corbett to RG

They were lucky that Allen held up that season.
 

Ram Ts

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….and they traded away their best TE.
I’m trying to remember who this good TE (better than Higbee) is that got traded but I can’t. I must be missing something obvious. But I can’t think of any TE that McVay has traded away - and one better than Higbee too.
 

Ellard80

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yes yes Mcvay doesn't care about the 0line or running the ball...

even though 3 out of 5 years he has had top 10 in both.

People also live under this myth that if your 0-line is good your offense will be good.

Cleveland has a top notch 0-line and running backs and never wins anything... the 49ners have a strong 0-line and have a losing record under Shanahan.. im sure i could find many more examples. Shit when we had our best running teams we were good but never wont it all. In the end its having the right QB and a talented defense.

You need the 0-line to be good enough.... you can't pay for elite 0 lineman and also have players like Stafford, Kupp, Donald, Ramsey, von miller, ect.

the salary cap makes it tricky.
 
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ArkyRamsFan

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I’m trying to remember who this good TE (better than Higbee) is that got traded but I can’t. I must be missing something obvious. But I can’t think of any TE that McVay has traded away - and one better than Higbee too.
I ain't speaking for OND as he has his own deal but the TE I believe he is referring to is TJ Hockenson whom the Lions traded away at the deadline. I actually think the Rams should have been all over that deal as Hockenson is an elite TE and much better and younger than Higby.
But what do I know......McVay probably would have just kept him on the bench while continuing to force the ball to Cooper Kupp.
It's gonna be very interesting tomorrow to see IF or HOW he adapts to no Kupp. I have an uneasy feeling this is `gonna get real ugly as Staff gets pounded trying to force the ball to WRs who will not be open.
I am really concerned that Matt is going to get concussed again then McVay will bring in Wolfie and get him injured while refusing to make any adaptations.
Sorry to be so negative but I've lost a lot of confidence in Coach's ability to adapt, improvise and overcome. Just ain't seein' it this year.

~ArkyRamsFan~
 

Ram Ts

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I ain't speaking for OND as he has his own deal but the TE I believe he is referring to is TJ Hockenson whom the Lions traded away at the deadline. I actually think the Rams should have been all over that deal as Hockenson is an elite TE and much better and younger than Higby.
But what do I know......McVay probably would have just kept him on the bench while continuing to force the ball to Cooper Kupp.
It's gonna be very interesting tomorrow to see IF or HOW he adapts to no Kupp. I have an uneasy feeling this is `gonna get real ugly as Staff gets pounded trying to force the ball to WRs who will not be open.
I am really concerned that Matt is going to get concussed again then McVay will bring in Wolfie and get him injured while refusing to make any adaptations.
Sorry to be so negative but I've lost a lot of confidence in Coach's ability to adapt, improvise and overcome. Just ain't seein' it this year.

~ArkyRamsFan~
Oh I see - he for some reason crossed over to Detroit. That’s some confusing mental gymnastics posting. I guess you understand OND speak lol. Could have sworn this topic is about the Rams and McVay/Snead.
 

Ram65

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I don't think a lot of you is remembering the 2021 preseason that well.

They were intending to use Corbett as the starting center with Evans as the starting RG

But Evans was so terrible at RG that they decided to give Allen a try at center again after being hurt for 2 seasons and move Corbett to RG

They were lucky that Allen held up that season.


Overall you are correct. However, they did have a plan to address the OC position. Nothing was written in stone as to the starting offensive line. They had a 3 pronged plan. ` Allen was the 3rd option seemingly because of his devastating 2019 injury. It turns out he was the best option on the roster as Corbett had trouble getting comfortable snapping the ball and Evans was terrible at OG. I remember McVay saying Allen worked hard to get the starting job.

Sure Humphrey would have been a great pick. I'm not sure he was the highest-rated OC in the 2021 draft class.

Good article here/ This is from page 2 or 3.

https://ramblinfan.com/2022/06/23/la-rams-oc-brian-allen-paying-forward/2/

Rams Roster: Flipping to Plan C​

When the LA Rams lost offensive lineman Austin Blythe to free agency, the team did not address the offensive line via the draft. The plan was stated repeatedly in the offseason. The team would either:

I – Slide guard Austin Corbett to offensive center, and backfill his position with versatile offensive lineman Bobby Evans.

II – Insert backup offensive center, Coleman Shelton, into the vacated spot on the offensive line.

III – Restore former starting offensive center Brian Allen into his starting role, as long as he was medically cleared to do so and he could hold up in the position.

It appeared that from the moment that the pads went on, the LA Rams coaching staff had a sudden and complete change of heart as to how to configure their offensive line. Swiss army knife, Bobby Evans, was not working out at the guard position. A tackle by trade, he has been underwhelming at the guard position.

But perhaps more surprising was the struggle of Corbett to effectively snap the football in pads. While he had played center in his career, he had settled in at offensive guard and the transition back to center was too great of a change on the fly. So almost overnight, the Rams restored Corbett to guard and installed Brian Allen as the starting center.