New: Latest on Kroenke, Rams and NFL in STL

[Hacksaw]

SO the task force is reaching out to the Raiders now?

 

[den-the-coach]

So Goose...Raiders to St. Louis, does it have legs?

 

[ChrisW]

Here's Kroenke's solution to cross ownership. Anne Walton to buy the Rams.

http://m.bizjournals.com/denver/stories/2010/05/10/daily6.html?ana=twt&r=full

Sports magnate Stan Kroenke -- owner of the Denver Nuggets, Colorado Avalanche and Pepsi Center -- asked the NFL last week to allow his wife to own the St. Louis Rams, sources said.

The move is seen as a way to address league complications that have developed from Kroenke's decision last month to trigger an option to buy the St. Louis National Football League club.

Because Kroenke owns the National Basketball Association's Nuggets and National Hockey League's Avalanche in Denver, he is precluded by the NFL’s cross-ownership policy from owning a football team outside Denver.

While media reports last month suggested Kroenke would move the Denver sports assets into his wife’s name or children’s names, what he instead proposed in person last week to the NFL finance committee at a meeting in New York City was that his wife, Ann Walton Kroenke, would buy the Rams, the sources said.

Ann Walton Kroenke is a daughter of the late Bud Walton, brother of Wal-Mart Stores founder Sam Walton.

It’s uncertain whether the Rams proposal would pass muster, the sources said, noting that it may depend on how the deal is structured. Kroenke did include other options last week, the sources said, but details of those proposals were not available.

A Kroenke spokesman declined to comment, as did the NFL.

 

[beej]

Here's Kroenke's solution to cross ownership. Anne Walton to buy the Rams.

http://m.bizjournals.com/denver/stories/2010/05/10/daily6.html?ana=twt&r=full

Sports magnate Stan Kroenke -- owner of the Denver Nuggets, Colorado Avalanche and Pepsi Center -- asked the NFL last week to allow his wife to own the St. Louis Rams, sources said.

The move is seen as a way to address league complications that have developed from Kroenke's decision last month to trigger an option to buy the St. Louis National Football League club.

Because Kroenke owns the National Basketball Association's Nuggets and National Hockey League's Avalanche in Denver, he is precluded by the NFL’s cross-ownership policy from owning a football team outside Denver.

While media reports last month suggested Kroenke would move the Denver sports assets into his wife’s name or children’s names, what he instead proposed in person last week to the NFL finance committee at a meeting in New York City was that his wife, Ann Walton Kroenke, would buy the Rams, the sources said.

Ann Walton Kroenke is a daughter of the late Bud Walton, brother of Wal-Mart Stores founder Sam Walton.

It’s uncertain whether the Rams proposal would pass muster, the sources said, noting that it may depend on how the deal is structured. Kroenke did include other options last week, the sources said, but details of those proposals were not available.

A Kroenke spokesman declined to comment, as did the NFL.

In my opinion, (what ever that is worth) if the NFL let's him do that, they might as well strike down the rule, because this would basically render it useless. I'm not completely sure why the rule is in place in the first place, but I know this would nullify it.

 

[The Ripper]

That's the big if. Is LA SD's or Oak's hometown? NO.

No team has a legal standing in LA. It's a secondary market only so they might get a break on the relo fee but that's it. The other 2 teams can also make a case for creating the NFL market also.

This is Grubman on the Mighty 1090.

http://dehayf5mhw1h7.cloudfront.net...es/253/2015/04/14145620/4-14-Eric-Grubman.mp3

 

[The Ripper]

Here's Kroenke's solution to cross ownership. Anne Walton to buy the Rams.

http://m.bizjournals.com/denver/stories/2010/05/10/daily6.html?ana=twt&r=full

Sports magnate Stan Kroenke -- owner of the Denver Nuggets, Colorado Avalanche and Pepsi Center -- asked the NFL last week to allow his wife to own the St. Louis Rams, sources said.

The move is seen as a way to address league complications that have developed from Kroenke's decision last month to trigger an option to buy the St. Louis National Football League club.

Because Kroenke owns the National Basketball Association's Nuggets and National Hockey League's Avalanche in Denver, he is precluded by the NFL’s cross-ownership policy from owning a football team outside Denver.

While media reports last month suggested Kroenke would move the Denver sports assets into his wife’s name or children’s names, what he instead proposed in person last week to the NFL finance committee at a meeting in New York City was that his wife, Ann Walton Kroenke, would buy the Rams, the sources said.

Ann Walton Kroenke is a daughter of the late Bud Walton, brother of Wal-Mart Stores founder Sam Walton.

It’s uncertain whether the Rams proposal would pass muster, the sources said, noting that it may depend on how the deal is structured. Kroenke did include other options last week, the sources said, but details of those proposals were not available.

A Kroenke spokesman declined to comment, as did the NFL.

That's from 2010

 

[Goose]

So Goose...Raiders to St. Louis, does it have legs?

I don't think it has any real legs yet. I think it's really more of just staying informed of the situation.

 

[bluecoconuts]

Except Oakland can't afford to leave. He'd need to input $450 million just for the stadium in st.louis - that doesn't include relocation fee's and the actual cost of moving. Raiders are stuck in Oakland unless Carson comes through. If the Raiders could afford to move to St.Louis, I think they would have had a stadium in Oakland by now.

Davis needs to figure out how to get at least a billion dollars for Carson to work, not including any relocation fees. If you somehow reward him the G4 loan (which if he gets it for Carson, he should for St Louis) then that's 800 million. Naming rights and PSL's aren't going to cover that. Then you factor in moving the team and relocations fees (relocation fees are likely far more for LA than St Louis).

So essentially if St Louis isn't affordable for the Raiders, then Carson most certainly not affordable.

Its all good...I have said it before in this thread and still believe this, when you are trying to read tea leaves and determine who is going to get what, the safest bet is to assume the guy with the least cash available is the one that will take it on the chin.

Mark Davis is financially non-viable in the current NFL. Hell, Spanos is not too far behind him in that regard, but he is better liked by the other owners. Kroenke is not making himself popular with these moves and silence; but, in the end, he has the "jack" to force a positive resolution to this whole mess.

Start with the very basic proposition that Kroenke does not care - about the Rams team or players or staff, the fans, the other owners, nothing. His actions to date support this proposition unreservedly. To him, owning an NFL team in L.A. - ANY team - is the thing people are convinced that he wants. He certainly wants to develop the land in Inglewood. He also thinks that having more money - than the $6B+ he already has, as he nears 70 years old, and his life expectancy is less than a decade - is the most important thing in life...good for him, I am sure that his pyramid will be epic and they can stuff all his things in there with his rotting corpse soon enough.

From that simple set of propositions, everything else is relatively easy to envision to have the Raiders and Chargers in L.A. and the Rams in St. Louis. Davis is the long-tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs and he will be the loser in the end. Davis is going to be forced out. Initially, Inglewood will be denied. The Rams will be sold to local ownership, which will pick up the private investment portion of the Riverside stadium. After Kroenke sells the Rams, the NFL's other owners will facilitate the acquistion of the Raiders with a green light for Inglewood, the Carson partnership will crumble and the Chargers will be faced with three possibilities - 1) move ahead with Carson on their own, 2) accept a deal to join Kroenke's Raiders in Ingelwood or 3) stay in San Diego and accept the fact that they will be second fiddle in Southern California no matter what.

The best bet for the Chargers honestly is to stay in San Diego. There is enough animosity between SD and LA to fuel an increased rivalry with the Raiders (over and above the existing one) and the San Diego fans and city proper may be willing to make a long term deal that helps keep them viable regardless of what is going on 100 miles north in LA.

Oakland is the city that has shown the least interest in remaining an NFL city, followed closely by San Diego. Spanos will have options. Davis will not. Put the Raiders franchise in Kroenke's hands and in the city of LA and it will be wildly successful, resurrecting the image of the pillaging pirates of the AFL and Al Davis in the first L.A. stay. Put the Rams in a new stadium with local ownership and Peacock in place as a figurehead and the franchise will be secured for a generation or more in its adopted home. Put the Chargers in a new stadium in San Diego and the NFL gets what it wants - 3 new stadiums, including 2 that will be rotation stadia for the Super Bowl, and secure futures for 3 franchises with no one being forced into a subservient role as a sub-letting tenant of someone else's stadium.

The Rams to L.A. solves nothing. It did when the only team capable of going to L.A. was them. The issue now remains who has the clout and who does not. In this messed up country, money is speech and that means Kroenke has the megaphone, Spanos has a phone, and Davis is sitting around with two cans connected by a string.

I can't see Kroenke just giving up the Rams because he can't have LA, nor do I see some sort of group of local businessmen being able to take over, he would probably sell to a single billionaire or something like that. Plus the NFL simply forcing Davis out so Kroenke may take over the Raiders?

How do you turn down Inglewood and then give it the okay later? If you okay the stadium its good, you can't tell Kroenke "Okay you can have Inglewood, but not with your team, you need to go through the long process of selling your team, while we force out an owner just because, and then you have to buy that team, which this process will lose you tons of money."

I'm guessing both Kroenke and Davis teams up in court.

A lot of that seems rather unrealistic in my opinion.

 

[blue4]

SO the task force is reaching out to the Raiders now?

That would be the prudent move I think. I think I'd have reached out before this, and I imagine they have. Always got to have a back up plan.

 

[ChrisW]

That's from 2010

LMAO, I noticed May 10, and didn't even see the year.

 

[blue4]

I don't think it has any real legs yet. I think it's really more of just staying informed of the situation.

May not have legs yet, but at least Davis is aware now for sure that if Kroenke bullies his way to LA there is a place available and willing to increase the fortunes of his own franchise.

 

[HornsUp]

wow! starting to sound like we all need to chip in and buy Davis' kids some shoes. this just keeps getting exagerated more and more with each page of posts.

Seriously loll. The guy has money it's not like his poor. He's stated before that he would be willing to put 500 mill on the table. Idk what his net worth is but come on the Davis family probably has a net worth of more then 800 mill. It's just a guess.

 

[2105]

I doubt that. He's never broken news. He just gives his opinion. Like "my gut feeling is the Rams want to move to LA" the LA daily news flew him to STL to figure that out? He's a blogger that works for the daily news.

Guys like Sam Farmer are legit.

For example Bernie has 80k followers compared to vinnes 1,500. Sam Farmer has 35k. That's telling.

Vinny had the Chargers & Raiders in Carson a full month before anyone else.
He's had plenty of stuff first... Including info from owners meetings.
He's easily the most consistently credible source I've seen on actual news regarding the stadium issues.
That doesn't mean he's infallible or the only source. We all use several, right?

 

[Goose]

Vinny had the Chargers & Raiders in Carson a full month before anyone else.
He's had plenty of stuff first... Including info from owners meetings.
He's easily the most consistently credible source I've seen on actual news regarding the stadium issues.
That doesn't mean he's infallible or the only source. We all use several, right?

Not only do I think Vinny is credible but he has been consistent. When it comes to the LA situation it is hard to trust any source. Bernie was told before all of this that STL had nothing to worry about the Rams won't leave. Well that doesn't appear to be true and Bernie has said as much on multiple occasions. Sam Farmer and Vinny are two LA scribes that I follow on the story because they report information honestly and responsibly. That doesn't mean things won't change again. Everything has been pro-STL for a while. The momentum was going to swing back the other way eventually and it will come back again.

 

[The Ripper]

This one is from this year in the Business Journal. It's interesting but I wouldn't read much into it yet because even the best Dr gets sued from time to time. It maybe something the stadium critics use against the project.

Stadium task force member accused of fraud, negligence in prior development deal
http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/...k-force-member-accused-of-fraud.html?page=all

 

[beej]

so let me get this straight.
vince tweets out that after spending some time in STL he knows that the rams want to move, but he's not saying that they'll get it done.

and the big news is not that he doesn't think they'll get it done, but that Rams want to move??? hmmmm

 

[bluecoconuts]

so let me get this straight.
vince tweets out that after spending some time in STL he knows that the rams want to move, but he's not saying that they'll get it done.

and the big news is not that he doesn't think they'll get it done, but that Rams want to move??? hmmmm

He didn't say he didn't think they would get it done (at least this time, he's gone back and fourth on it), he said he doesn't know if they do, a pretty noncommittal answer really.

The sense that they want to move is probably more for those who believe its all about leverage. He's saying its his opinion that no, LA is not a leverage ploy, not a backup plan, it is their goal and intention.

The bit about them not getting their way is simply a different way of saying its not a done deal yet, which is obvious.

What I'm mostly interested in is his bit about them having a strong case for relocation when it comes time to that. Afterwards it seems he just latched on to the idea that the NFL wants to do Spanos right for playing ball all these years, so they may try to push him and Kroenke together because they feel that Rams+Chargers in Inglewood is better than Chargers+Raiders in Carson. That's a theory that's been around for a while now.

I think potentially the big news is that the Rams may have a good argument to move, everything else is meh in my opinion.


As far as the credibility of Vinny, I think he's got some, but he's not nearly as well connected or informed as guy guys at the LA Times or anything like that.

 

[Hacksaw]

That's from 2010

That's around the time he was bidding on the Dodgers. I'd say this confirms that Stan was thinking of relocating way back then.

 

[Hacksaw]

Bluecoconuts wrote:

"I think potentially the big news is that the Rams may have a good argument to move, everything else is meh in my opinion."

Vincent B. wrote that it had something to do with the terms of leaving Los Angeles. Now that is curious. Did the league require Georgia to put some language in the relocation docs favoring a return to LA if at some point in time the door opened?

 

[The Ripper]

Bluecoconuts wrote:

"I think potentially the big news is that the Rams may have a good argument to move, everything else is meh in my opinion."

Vincent B. wrote that it had something to do with the terms of leaving Los Angeles. Now that is curious. Did the league require Georgia to put some language in the relocation docs favoring a return to LA if at some point in time the door opened?

I wouldn't think they would be that specific just in case LA got another team. The league made assurances that there would be another team in LA.

I am trying to find the article that contains the Rams demands since it was leaked by FANS Inc.. The article was referenced in The CVC vs The NFL.