John Johnson---PFF rating (verygood)

[Rams43]

Snead conducted an amazing draft, especially considering that he lacked a 1st rounder. Everybody can agree on that, right?

But I want to give props to the other half of the equation that results in a terrific rookie crop.

That would be the coaching and teaching. This staff excels at quickly developing rookies that are talented, smart, and willing. I maintain that a lesser staff would not have been able to get quite the results that this one did with it’s rookies.

Not to name names, but our previous regime was notably slow to develop their rookie classes, especially on O. Screaming at players and shouting F bombs ain’t coaching, y’all.

Just sayin’.

 

[OldSchool]

You never really declared who you were talking about but I'm pretty sure we're talking about the same MFer

What's up with the C+ middle school level sarcasm and gross condescending phrasing of your question? You think you sounded clever, funny or insightful? Your Special Olympic energy has reared it's ugly head.

Is everything going okay at home, bud? Are you an aristocrat of sorts? 'We can't possibly be talking about the same _____' is kind of crap some real assholes say in real life. 'Oh look a different opinion? DISMISS DISMISS DISMISS'
Did you even read what I wrote? Do you think I just pulled that crap based on a drive or 2 I watched a few weeks ago?

Love the optimism but sorry, he's not good yet, not even close. I refuse to praise him for finishing 8th in his position during a week opponent's offense couldn't move the ball from jump street. There are 8-9 other guys who had a better game IMO. It's okay, for being the worst starter on the defense i'll take him.

You could have given me reasons to believe in JJ instead of being a narrow minded troll If you just said i'm not seeing the same things as you - I would have probably cheers you and moved on, but damn, you coming at me soaked in poor self esteem triggered me.

I like expressing my crap about things i'm into.I don't get snooty over anyone else's opinion,never have and never will. My reasoning is pretty fundamental. Thought policing is some weird crap.

I'm thinking the correct response here is to relax. Don't take things personal and attack people.

 

[thirteen28]

To expand this topic a little bit ...

Johnson - starting safety
Kupp - starting slot WR, leads team in # of catches
Everett - developing, has made some big plays
Ebukam - very valuable reserve, probable future starter
Smart - decent rotational DL
Reynolds - valuable backup, has started a few games and played well, not hard to project as a future starter

.... gee, for a team that "didn't have any draft picks" according to all the pundits, we sure had a damn good draft. Go figure.

 

[OldSchool]

gee, for a team that "didn't have any draft picks" according to all the pundits, we sure had a damn good draft. Go figure.

Absolutely, and it wasn't just pundits there were a lot of negative people around here how we screwed ourselves with the trade up for Goff.

 

[JackStraw]

I'm thinking the correct response here is to relax. Don't take things personal and attack people.

It wasn't personal and i'm well over it It was kind of fun writing that out. It did certainly release some real life stress, which isn't cool I know.

Just trying to put trolls in line that selfishly distract us from our discussion at hand.
Sorry but JJ just doesn't look like he can be the player McLeod or McDonald were...hell give me Cody Davis over him, someone who i'm also not really a fan of. Reminds me too much of Craig Dahl. And yes, just because he's white.

 

[JackStraw]

double post I don't know why this happens

 

[Psycho_X]

double post I don't know why this happens

You probably hit refresh right after making the first post. That'll create a second post for some reason.

 

[RamDino]

Sorry but JJ just doesn't look like he can be the player McLeod or McDonald were...

How about we give the kid a chance. He's played what...11 games? For a third round pick, starting in his first year, at one of the more difficult positions to master on the field... I'd say he's played great! Wade Philips thinks so too.

 

[Merlin]

I can honestly say I have never seen a group of Scouts thay find as many talented defensive backs is Snead's group has found.

They find UDFAs that look better than some teams draft picks.

This is true.

I do think Fish had a good eye for DBs, and I think this staff adds value to the evaluation as well. But Les and whoever is responsible for the DBs among his scouts deserve a lot of cred there.

And it's a good thing, too, given how this offseason is looming for the secondary.

 

[James Otto]

You never really declared who you were talking about but I'm pretty sure we're talking about the same MFer

What's up with the C+ middle school level sarcasm and gross condescending phrasing of your question? You think you sounded clever, funny or insightful? Your Special Olympic energy has reared it's ugly head.

Is everything going okay at home, bud? Are you an aristocrat of sorts? 'We can't possibly be talking about the same _____' is kind of crap some real assholes say in real life. 'Oh look a different opinion? DISMISS DISMISS DISMISS'
Did you even read what I wrote? Do you think I just pulled that crap based on a drive or 2 I watched a few weeks ago?

Love the optimism but sorry, he's not good yet, not even close. I refuse to praise him for finishing 8th in his position during a week opponent's offense couldn't move the ball from jump street. There are 8-9 other guys who had a better game IMO. It's okay, for being the worst starter on the defense i'll take him.

You could have given me reasons to believe in JJ instead of being a narrow minded troll If you just said i'm not seeing the same things as you - I would have probably cheers you and moved on, but damn, you coming at me soaked in poor self esteem triggered me.

I like expressing my crap about things i'm into.I don't get snooty over anyone else's opinion,never have and never will. My reasoning is pretty fundamental. Thought policing is some weird crap.

LMAO - keyboard commando. JJ III is PFF's #11th ranked safety in the ENTIRE league, for the ENTIRE season. Obviously you were unable to comprehend the analysis which clearly displays where he ranks amongst several important metrics.

It's utterly halarious that further in this thread you refer to TJ McDonald - that JJ III can't fill his shoes. He's already a better safety than McDonald ever was. McDonald was terrible in coverage.

Anyone that cannot watch JJ III and understand he is playing at a very high level is either ignorant to the position, or simply has an agenda. Which do you qualify for?

Now go ahead and take another two hours to write a clinical response as clever as the previous one. Amazing how I may have insulted your football knowledge, and that prompts you to become personal.

 

[JackStraw]

I'm very optimistic with this team, even when I shouldn't be

After watching progression of Jamon and Big Rob i'm willing to believe Johnson might inherit spirit of Shaun Taylor

I still like TJ for this team. He wasn't great in coverage but what we need more than anything is a guy who can wrap 'em up.

 

[Faceplant]

Just trying to put trolls in line that selfishly distract us from our discussion at hand.

That "troll" is killing you in this discussion for what it is worth. Not sure why you felt the need to go off on him...that was more of a distraction than anything.

 

[James Otto]

I'm very optimistic with this team, even when I shouldn't be

After watching progression of Jamon and Big Rob i'm willing to believe Johnson might inherit spirit of Shaun Taylor

I still like TJ for this team. He wasn't great in coverage but what we need more than anything is a guy who can wrap 'em up.

This doesn't make sense at all. Wade's defense requires two safeties, both of which have range. There is no way the 49'ers shred us in the passing game like they did if you would have had JJ III in place of Mo in that game. Mo got cut for a simple reason, he had minimal range, just like TJ. And McDonald wasn't even a great wrap up tackler, as you mention. He was a hard hitting launcher, amongst the leaders in missed tackles at his position each year (with the exception of 2015).

This team needs linebackers that will hold gap integrity and attack the ball carriers, period. The safeties are not the reason for the gashing runs this year.

The safeties are, however, the reason why we rarely give up big plays in the passing game.

 

[SteveBrown]

I never said it this thread:
JJ is a FS playing SS. He will never the TJ Mac run enforcing safety. Not built for it physicall or mentally.
HOWEVER, in these "passing" days, I prefer 2 FSs playing--and we giveup a little in the run game, but have a big
advantage in the pass game.

TJ Mac couldn't handle one on one coverage.....JJ played slot corner, sometimes, in college. Big difference.

JJ might end up being like Darren Sharper on the field....smart, knows where to be and fluid.

 

[A.J. Hicks]

We'll also most likely be adding Cody Davis back into the secondary after this coming week.

For those that don't remember he was having a very good season before injury.

I pray that none of these coach needy teams interview Aubrey Pleasant.

 

[LACHAMP46]

Look at how some attack @JackStraw for his opinions....and he's just telling what HE thinks...
I like how you stick up for yourself...keep it up...

Now...for the discussion at hand....

Found this on another board....I said he was weak in run support, well this shows something else....
[www.profootballfocus.com]

8. John Johnson III, S, Los Angeles Rams
PFF Grade: 85.9
PFF Elite Stat: Johnson’s 8.4 run stop percentage when lined up within eight yards of the line of scrimmage ranks sixth among safeties.

Johnson now ranks 11th among safeties in terms of overall grade and he’s one of just six safeties to have a coverage grade of at least 85.0 and a run defense grade of at least 80.0.

I'll say now...and forever...our pass defense is aided by extreme pressure put on by our front...is it 5 or 7...or whatever...it's what is expected of Donald, Quinn, Brockers, Fox, Barwin, Samson, Longacre....and the rest...Pressure applied....It's why I expect our safeties to tackle....down the field....especially when a RB breaks loose...and this is where I have a problem with mister Johnson's game. Not enough open field stops by the last line of defense...in fact, out and out misses/whiffs/bad angles...whatever...in fact, I see some hesitancy....I just don't think he wanted to tackle Fournette on his 70+ yard run....couldn't find him in the Vikings game...don't know if he was on the field vs Philly. PFF calls him top 11th...PFF is full of it...and I mean shit....most of the time...you can't go on that...go on your eyes.

There is lot of hate on this board with JJ. I couldn't figure out why. It looks like this confirms what I am seeing on the field.

Not hate...I think he plays well for a rookie...just don't think a playoff team needs him as a starter...a lot of plays...a lot of passes he gets to....love that....other passes he's late or can't make a play...understandable...but with his tackling, it makes him a liability on the field. my opinion...maybe jackstraws too.

Nah there are a few that want to bench him in favor of Barron being moved to ss.

that'd be me...Barron is a superior player.

Anyone that cannot watch JJ III and understand he is playing at a very high level is either ignorant to the position, or simply has an agenda. Which do you qualify for?

no agenda....just don't see high level...in a league where the SS makes a bunch of plays, I don't see "high level"...I see adequate...which in the NFL, is a replaceable player.

The safeties are not the reason for the gashing runs this year.

Yes they are....they are NOT the main problem...long runs are definitely the D lines assignment...then the inside linebackers....DB's ARE the last line of defense...they need to pick up the slack if someone breaks free...unless in man coverage, they should ALWAYS be available to make a play. I think the lack of speed in the defensive backfield is the reason for this.

The safeties are, however, the reason why we rarely give up big plays in the passing game.

Meh....the D-Line...and corners...and the quality of teams we've played are the major reason.......rarely does the opponent have time to sit back there and throw deep...that's all d-line/blitzers....corners making sure tackles...

Has our defense played bad? No...hell no...could they be better? Hell yes....Minn, Philly, SF, & Dallas....hell, even the Jags threw for 220 yards....not bad, but they are the teams were gonna face in the playoffs....good passing teams...all these teams have relatively inexperienced QB's....and they lit us up...New Orleans had a pretty good statistical game too....Playoff team....good offense...

John Johnson isn't a bad player...but nowhere near what PFF claims he is...IMO, TJ MacDonald is far superior. Miami sure thinks so.

 

[OldSchool]

that'd be me...Barron is a superior player.


no agenda....just don't see high level...in a league where the SS makes a bunch of plays, I don't see "high level"...I see adequate...which in the NFL, is a replaceable player.

Nothing at all in Barron's NFL career could lead anybody to think he was a superior SS. In fact he was replaced at SS making him very replaceable. He was brought to the Rams to not be a safety! Yet once again you know better than Wade and Gregg, two of the best DC's of our lifetime.

 

[SteveBrown]

Love Barron; he is our James Harrison killer-type.
However, Barrron couldn't hack it at SS....he doesn't even look natural in coverage as LB. He has great change direction, and very good speed for a LB, and still he doesn't look like most LBs in coverage who have the same talent----meaning he is not a 'natural'; which means he could never play SS. Lovie Smith knows more than you ....For an ILB he has good coverage skills, but that is compared to ILBs who are slower and less athletic.

Maybe I am wrong, again. Merry CHristmas boys and girls. Celebrate Jesus, not presents.

 

[LACHAMP46]

Did I ever tell you guys how much I love this place? I mean, I get to go at it with Ole school....and a new challenger today...mister Steve Brown...well lets get started.

Nothing at all in Barron's NFL career could lead anybody to think he was a superior SS.

What has Johnson done...in his career....would lead anyone to believe he's superior? Seriously? Doesn't Barron lead our team in interceptions? 2nd in tackles Tackles? How about tackles for losses? SS have to tackle...well...Johnson doesn't.
Barron has always been an impact player...Tampa's defense...the system....the "old Tampa 2" is outdated and antiquated ( been wanting to use that word for a while now, glad you gave me the opportunity) and isn't used much, if at all by top defensive teams...maybe the Steelers....but even they go to a more man to man approach when facing teams like NE.

In fact he was replaced at SS making him very replaceable.

He was moved to LB due to an injury I believe...he couldn't start over TJ McDonald....probably due to seniority....and TJ can play....but once in the lineup, it was obvious he needed to stay on the field...now he's a full time ILB.

He was brought to the Rams to not be a safety! Yet once again you know better than Wade and Gregg, two of the best DC's of our lifetime.

He was brought to the Rams...the only truth in that statement....I do think if Wade can win another championship he'll be considered one of the best. Son of Bum has been gifted with great talent...wherever he's gone. He's not as good as a Carroll, Belichick, Ryan (Buddy not his sons)...and I'm pretty old so I'd put Landry, Carson, Allen, Noll, Bill Arnsparger and Grant in there as well...
Son of Bum is a good DC....not as good as his daddy...probably more like a Marvin Lewis....Rex Ryan....he turns superior talent into great defenses....

"I know better".....didn't say that....maybe I do...maybe I don't....I have an opinion...Sorry I watched the Washington game...I watched the Dallas game...I watched the PHILLY game....I saw what CASE KEENUM did to US. I'll be watching this week...on DVR....and definitely next week....against a pretty good OC....and what is supposedly a bad team...SF

However, Barrron couldn't hack it at SS....he doesn't even look natural in coverage as LB.

he leads the team in int's.....try again. Couldn't hack it? What's that mean? He tapped out? He quit? Or was moved because we didn't have an adequate LB to play next to Tree?

He has great change direction, and very good speed for a LB, and still he doesn't look like most LBs in coverage who have the same talent----meaning he is not a 'natural';

He has good speed for a SS too....pretty sure he's faster than Joyner & Johnson...I don't know what you mean he doesn't "look" like most LB's? He's one of the best players on our team...and he plays LB....he'd still be one of the best players on our team at SS. Natural? natural....

Lovie Smith knows more than you

Lovie Smith.....I like Lovie....I hate his defensive scheme...I wonder how is he doing in college football? Is his team good? Is his defense dominant? Oh great, we have google now, we can find out together, shall we?
https://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/schools/illinois/2017.html

Maybe he's a knows more....hmmmm....lets go with that...say I did agree...Maybe he doesn't know how to recruit then...or can't relate to his players...or....maybe....his bullshit assed Tampa-2 defense doesn't work anymore...probably only worked with Brooks, Barber, Sapp, and Rice....wtf?!?

What the fuck does my opinion have to do with someone knowing MORE than anyone? The proof of knowledge is in the pudding....Show me. Williams in Cleveland....Lovie with the Illini.....show me.....

Barron is a better player than Johnson...ATM....he's far better...he's far more important to THIS defense...if Johnson sat the rest of the season, he wouldn't be missed. Hell, I can barely tell he's out there now. This thread was a response to the bs PFF blows up everyones ass and people take it as gospel...I tried to show, that not only is PFF full of shit, but Johnson is probably the weakest link on our defense....all the long plays....go watch them...tell me WHERE the hell is Johnson? Go watch the runs...the long ones...the ones right at Barron....and you'd see, he's not really a LB...add to it the injuries...seems to me an easy solution.

Keep challenging every thing I write in here oleschool...I like it...keeps me on my toes...G-Rob...Quick....Goff....whatever...now Johnson.

 

[RAMpage28]

@LACHAMP46

You're mentioning Barron leading our team in INTS and tackles... As a linebacker. Yet you are acting like this translates directly to him at the safety spot. He has 3 INTS this year as a linebacker and 3 INTS in 3 years as a SS in Tampa. He is having a career year in a position he was switched to in order to revitalize his career.

Argue about Lovie being the problem if you want, but that's three years of production that isn't overly impressive. Also, as far as raw stats go, Barrons best year tackles wise as a safety was 88 combined tackles, solo and assists. John Johnson would probably surpass that if he started all 16 games.

John Johnson has 63 tackles 1 INT and 10 Pass Deflections in 14 games, 9 of which he started in.

He is better this year than T.J. Ward and Morgan Burnett in terms of raw stats and is statistically comparable to George Illoka as well.

If Mark is better than John Johnson right now... So? Barron in a career year is currently better than a Rookie. Alright. He should be. Not to mention, they are still in different positions.

John Johnson is no where near the complete liability you paint him as.

To say Barron "Is one of the best players we have at LB, he would be just as as good if he were at SS" is just false. There is a reason he was moved to linebacker in the first place and a reason he is better there than he ever was at safety.

Mark is good at linebacker right now. John is a better safety option for us than Mark is. Keep them where they are at.