Jared Goff-SamBradford: Rams Franchise QB Comparison

[bubbaramfan]

Last night over pitchers of beers with some of my Ram fan friends, we got to discussing and comparing Bradford and Goff and how they stacked up before the draft and who was more prepared to be the Rams "franchise QB". I was against the Bradford pick mainly because of his injury history. I thought he did OK his rookie year, getting O ROY honors behind a horrible OL. My knock on Bradford his whole time with the Rams was his ball placement and lack of seeing open recievers downfield. They both came from spread offenses and didn't play much from under center, Bradford made that transition pretty easily. Goff, to me after watching game film, looks more prepared to play in the NFL than Bradford was, and we shall see.....

I would like to get ROD thoughts on how the two compare coming out of collerge

 

[thirteen28]

Last night over pitchers of beers with some of my Ram fan friends, we got to discussing and comparing Bradford and Goff and how they stacked up before the draft and who was more prepared to be the Rams "franchise QB". I was against the Bradford pick mainly because of his injury history. I thought he did OK his rookie year, getting O ROY honors behind a horrible OL. My knock on Bradford his whole time with the Rams was his ball placement and lack of seeing open recievers downfield. They both came from spread offenses and didn't play much from under center, Bradford made that transition pretty easily. Goff, to me after watching game film, looks more prepared to play in the NFL than Bradford was, and we shall see.....

I would like to get ROD thoughts on how the two compare coming out of collerge

There are many others here more qualified than me to make an assessment. That being said, Goff played - and performed well - under duress and behind a bad OL far more than Bradford ever had to in college. Sam played for a powerhouse team that physically overmatched most of its opponents, and he often had a very clean pocket to work from. Goff had no such luxury, and that probably contributed to developing the pocket awareness he has now, his ability to move within the pocket, and to keep his feet moving until the last second when he has to set them to throw.

 

[Merlin]

Sam was a great prospect from all the measurables, but he just didn't have that ability to handle the pressure. Very average in the end, and that's aside from his injury-prone nature on top of that. But the Rams taking him when they did... I would have taken him too.

Goff you just don't know if he's going to hold up. Being muscled up isn't necessarily a guarantee of anything, and there are so many QBs that aren't all beefed up that are either in the Hall of Fame or will be there (Manning/Brady). As to his ability to make quick decisions and throws under pressure, absolutely. He has talent there and Snead is correct in pointing that out IMO.

If Goff becomes the next great QB in this league teams are going to be looking harder at the QBs who showed a propensity to be accurate under pressure. I believe teams will be comparing future QBs with him, provided he can stay healthy which is always a caveat with a drafted QB.

 

[NJRamsFan]

They really don't compare much whatsoever aside from being accurate and spending a lot of time in the gun in college. Nearly all of Goff's strengths were weaknesses of Bradford (pocket presence, reading the field, handling pressure)

 

[LesBaker]

They really don't compare much whatsoever aside from being accurate and spending a lot of time in the gun in college. Nearly all of Goff's strengths were weaknesses of Bradford (pocket presence, reading the field, handling pressure)

Well they ARE the same height hahahahaha.

 

[-X-]

This is a good topic for those who are willing to take it seriously.

If you're talking strictly *before* the draft, then they both have/had glowing reviews, and Bradford's pro day was flawless. Both were/are renowned for their accuracy, arm, ball placement, and intelligence. Where Goff separates from Bradford is his experience in making reads and going through progressions, whereas Bradford had his plays called in from the sidelines in a hurry-up offense. So in that sense, Goff is better prepared than Bradford was for the NFL. You wouldn't be able to make a clear distinction of who would be the better prospect if Bradford was entering the draft this year. It would be Goff/Bradford or Bradford/Goff going 1-2, and the decision would be very difficult IMO. Goff would get the edge due to medicals though.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

This is a good topic for those who are willing to take it seriously.

If you're talking strictly *before* the draft, then they both have/had glowing reviews, and Bradford's pro day was flawless. Both were/are renowned for their accuracy, arm, ball placement, and intelligence. Where Goff separates from Bradford is his experience in making reads and going through progressions, whereas Bradford had his plays called in from the sidelines in a hurry-up offense. So in that sense, Goff is better prepared than Bradford was for the NFL. You wouldn't be able to make a clear distinction of who would be the better prospect if Bradford was entering the draft this year. It would be Goff/Bradford or Bradford/Goff going 1-2, and the decision would be very difficult IMO. Goff would get the edge due to medicals though.

I disagree with that last part. Nowadays teams put a higher value on the mental part of the game. They don't assume that just because a kid has good grades or does well on the Wonderlic that he can do well in the NFL, if he has the physical ability.

I wanted Sam to be the pick. But I recall people saying he seldom if ever saw pressure because he was in an offense that got the ball out quickly and he had a mammoth Oline with NFL players on it. I dismissed this point but it actually was valid. It turns out that Sam never was very good under the pressure of a pass rush. And that insane accuracy that we all saw in college and in camp wasn't always present on the field. He was often late on crossing routes and innacurate on short throws. I believe most of that was because he was easily rattled by a pass rush and it affected him throughout the game. Traits that Goff has with being calm in the pocket while being able to sidestep the pass rush and still keep his eyes down field, and still be accurate is not something that can be taught in the NFL. That is what sets Goff apart from Bradford mostly.

 

[gabriel18]

Goffs attitude is much better . Bradford is showing his true colors in Philly and will hear the boo birds if he has enough guts to show up and play . I'm all in on the kid . Already ordered my son a #16 jersey .

 

[-X-]

I disagree with that last part. Nowadays teams put a higher value on the mental part of the game. They don't assume that just because a kid has good grades or does well on the Wonderlic that he can do well in the NFL, if he has the physical ability.

I wanted Sam to be the pick. But I recall people saying he seldom if ever saw pressure because he was in an offense that got the ball out quickly and he had a mammoth Oline with NFL players on it. I dismissed this point but it actually was valid. It turns out that Sam never was very good under the pressure of a pass rush. And that insane accuracy that we all saw in college and in camp wasn't always present on the field. He was often late on crossing routes and innacurate on short throws. I believe most of that was because he was easily rattled by a pass rush and it affected him throughout the game. Traits that Goff has with being calm in the pocket while being able to sidestep the pass rush and still keep his eyes down field, and still be accurate is not something that can be taught in the NFL. That is what sets Goff apart from Bradford mostly.

It wasn't assumed that Bradford could do well in the NFL. It was more or less a given. Hence, going #1 overall with Holmgren trying to forfeit his draft (and more) to get in position to draft him. True, he didn't have the same pressure that Goff faced, and I agree that it's a mark in Goff's column. Level of competition also comes into play, and that's a push. I also wouldn't discount Bradford's intelligence at the time. It's one of the reasons why Wentz propelled up the charts despite the system and level of competition.

Remember, we're not talking about what happened after Bradford was drafted, so I'm really only focusing on the discussion that took place for both before the draft as per the OP. Bradford's medical was a concern until his pro day, and it was arguably one of the best pro days ever put on by a prospect. I remember Gil Brandt more or less saying it *was* his most memorable and impressive, going all the way back to Aikman's. After that, nobody cared about his shoulder anymore.

 

[LesBaker]

This is a good topic for those who are willing to take it seriously.

If you're talking strictly *before* the draft, then they both have/had glowing reviews, and Bradford's pro day was flawless. Both were/are renowned for their accuracy, arm, ball placement, and intelligence. Where Goff separates from Bradford is his experience in making reads and going through progressions, whereas Bradford had his plays called in from the sidelines in a hurry-up offense. So in that sense, Goff is better prepared than Bradford was for the NFL. You wouldn't be able to make a clear distinction of who would be the better prospect if Bradford was entering the draft this year. It would be Goff/Bradford or Bradford/Goff going 1-2, and the decision would be very difficult IMO. Goff would get the edge due to medicals though.

I disagree. It's a good topic even for those who won't take it seriously. Ha sorry you axed for it!!!

That said on a serious note watch Bradford's college highlights. He has so much time in the pocket it's crazy. Goff's highlights are not like that at all. Also Bradford throws straight line passes, no touch. Goff throws feathery passes.

Bradford only had to read one side of the field too.

Bradford's pro day was like every QB's pro day, OK well not every one but almost every one. They all look good when the only defense is the air.

I think this club got it right this time. And Goff would get the edge based on more than medicals, he's just a better QB, of course this is all pre-draft.

 

[kurtfaulk]

It wasn't assumed that Bradford could do well in the NFL. It was more or less a given. Hence, going #1 overall with Holmgren trying to forfeit his draft (and more) to get in position to draft him. True, he didn't have the same pressure that Goff faced, and I agree that it's a mark in Goff's column. Level of competition also comes into play, and that's a push. I also wouldn't discount Bradford's intelligence at the time. It's one of the reasons why Wentz propelled up the charts despite the system and level of competition.

Remember, we're not talking about what happened after Bradford was drafted, so I'm really only focusing on the discussion that took place for both before the draft as per the OP. Bradford's medical was a concern until his pro day, and it was arguably one of the best pro days ever put on by a prospect. I remember Gil Brandt more or less saying it *was* his most memorable and impressive, going all the way back to Aikman's. After that, nobody cared about his shoulder anymore.

but his point is valid. sam was behind a rock wall in college. he wasn't prepared to be behind a sieve in the nfl. goff looks like he can handle a disrupted pocket.

poor sammy never really had a chance with the rams. horrible coach, poor oline, no weapons, a rb on his last legs, a complex offense in his second season during a lockout period. he wasn't prepared for any of that. the rams never really helped him at all to become a competent nfl qb.

.

 

[Dieter the Brock]

 

[JonRam99]

I disagree. It's a good topic even for those who won't take it seriously. Ha sorry you axed for it!!!

That said on a serious note watch Bradford's college highlights. He has so much time in the pocket it's crazy. Goff's highlights are not like that at all. Also Bradford throws straight line passes, no touch. Goff throws feathery passes.

Bradford only had to read one side of the field too.

Bradford's pro day was like every QB's pro day, OK well not every one but almost every one. They all look good when the only defense is the air.

I think this club got it right this time. And Goff would get the edge based on more than medicals, he's just a better QB, of course this is all pre-draft.

I agree 100%--I remember being somewhat excited about Bradford, and was concerned about his medicals, but MOSTLY I was concerned with watching his games:
He stood like a STATUE in a pocket the size of texas, and just zeroed in on receivers. He threw mostly from the gun, and had very little pressure during his time at OU. I was very nervous about how he'd handle a real NFL defense. I hoped Shurmur would maximize his talents, and during his OROY campaign, Pat was mostly successful--lots of bootlegs, etc.
But we saw what happened later: throws behind receivers; a billion dump-off passes; etc. We all made excuses for him, but even last season's QB play showed us it wasn't all the WR's or OC's faults--Bradford was a dump off machine.

I see a lot of Goff's strengths where SB lacked them: experience, progressions, toughness in a collapsing pocket, patience, vision, etc. In some ways, SB and SJ were a lot alike: one-look / one-cut players who danced around when they didn't see what they liked. Goff + Gurley will show us what a real QB / RB combo look like--no disrespect to SB / SJ, but if you were to ask me which pair I'd take.....

 

[-X-]

That said on a serious note watch Bradford's college highlights.

Oh I did. All of them. I think I posted about a million screengrabs on another forum in 2010 because of it.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

It wasn't assumed that Bradford could do well in the NFL. It was more or less a given. Hence, going #1 overall with Holmgren trying to forfeit his draft (and more) to get in position to draft him. True, he didn't have the same pressure that Goff faced, and I agree that it's a mark in Goff's column. Level of competition also comes into play, and that's a push. I also wouldn't discount Bradford's intelligence at the time. It's one of the reasons why Wentz propelled up the charts despite the system and level of competition.

Remember, we're not talking about what happened after Bradford was drafted, so I'm really only focusing on the discussion that took place for both before the draft as per the OP. Bradford's medical was a concern until his pro day, and it was arguably one of the best pro days ever put on by a prospect. I remember Gil Brandt more or less saying it *was* his most memorable and impressive, going all the way back to Aikman's. After that, nobody cared about his shoulder anymore.

Well before he was drafted some people said he was not tested because he had such a good Oline and an offense that had him throwing quickly. Some people said that was a big unknown and didn't like that he was not tested in that way. I dismissed, but it turned out to be a valid issue. There was no way to prove he could handle a heavy rush.

 

[OnceARam]

There's no comparison.

Bradford came out of an offense where he never did much of anything that wasn't wide open. Similar to Wentz in that regard.

Goff has demonstrated that he can mentally play the position. Maybe he'll never look as good as Bradford does in shorts, but it doesn't matter because the QB position is played in the pocket with traffic all around you. Hopefully our OC can limit the degree to which we stress Goff. And why would we given our run game. Something Bradford never had.

But in general it's impossible to objectively answer this question.

 

[Loyal]

Bradford was the must frustrating player I ever rooted for.....He did excellently on that Pro Day that secured his spot as the #1 Guy in the Draft. He could always make onlookers drool over his accuracy when wearing the red shirt. In practice accuracy means nothing

 

[Mackeyser]

There's no comparison.

Bradford came out of an offense where he never did much of anything that wasn't wide open. Similar to Wentz in that regard.

Goff has demonstrated that he can mentally play the position. Maybe he'll never look as good as Bradford does in shorts, but it doesn't matter because the QB position is played in the pocket with traffic all around you. Hopefully our OC can limit the degree to which we stress Goff. And why would we given our run game. Something Bradford never had.

But in general it's impossible to objectively answer this question.

Bradford has next to nothing in common with Wentz, certainly not throwing to wide open receivers. As @jrry32 pointed out in comparing Wentz and Goff, they were both accurate with Wentz throwing to sub NFL standard receivers, thus tight windows. Goff was slightly more accurate and had better ball placement on some of his throws.

Why is Wentz in this conversation of Bradford and Goff, anyway?

What's funny is that Goff would probably do better in the offense Shurmur originally wanted Bradford to run.

 

[TexasRam]

Bradford had very little pocket awareness. Goff has shown top notch pocket awareness. He senses the pressure almost always .away from it. He shows a lot of the elusiveness of Aaron Rogers but is probably in my opinion most comparable to Tony Romo. He can sometimes be caught and brought down but more times than not he's going to get away and make a throw down field that resembles how Rodgers and Romo extend drives. He will do this all game long and drive defenses crazy. Often times he will just get rid of the ball to avoid the sack. Cal's Oline was so bad that Gruden pointed out that imagine how good Goff would be if he had protection.

Goff also took a lot of hits and it never phased him. He knows how to go down and doesn't cringe and close his eyes like Bradford did. It always looked like Bradford was overwhelmed by how hard he was tackled. Goff stands tall in the pocket and will get rid of the ball at the last second knowing hes going to get hit and he takes it like a champ. Looking down field at the play rather than closing his eyes and wincing and worrying about his landing.

Maybe that's called toughness. Maybe Goff has been sacked so many times that hes used to it and doesn't fear.

Goff throws touch passes. Bradford seemed to always throw a bullet even when it wasn't required. Goff's placements of the ball is so impressive and his ability to thow it down field on the back shoulder or drop it in or lead a WR is so advanced. He reminds me of Brees the way he puts the ball in certain spots.

Then there is the Footwork of Goff that is reminiscent of Peyton Manning. Bradford was a statue.

Jeff Fisher said Jared "Sees". And this may be his best hard to quantify attribute. He sees the field, understands the defense, gets through progressions and to the open WR quickly. Reminds me of Montana or in that regard. Bradford seemed to never be able to see the field and find an open WR. Some may argue he never had an open WR.

Under pressure Goff will kill you. He hits the short medium and long slant as good as any to burn the defense constantly, with guys In his face a tick from sacking him.

Some might say Goff is the anti-Bradford. Certainly a better skill set to have success behind our inconsistent Oline.

 

[kurtfaulk]

Jeff Fisher said Jared "Sees". And this may be his best hard to quantify attribute. He sees the field, understands the defense, gets through progressions and to the open WR quickly. Reminds me of Montana or in that regard. Bradford seemed to never be able to see the field and find an open WR. Some may argue he never had an open WR.

That was the major problem with Sam. He wouldn't take a chance and let his receivers make a play. I don't know if that was him or if that was the work of spags and Fisher. Hopefully goff trusts his eyes in the nfl and let's the ball go when his receivers can make a play. And that Fisher doesn't constrict his playmaking abilities.