How bad is Stafford hurt?

[Kupped]

I am guilty of that buildup. I had the highest expectations with Stafford but that's sort of my thing, as I did the same with Bradford and Goff.

What I think you are doing here, however, is lumping things together unnecessarily. Goff had issues reading rush threats, getting through reads, etc. His problems were things that McVay didn't want to deal with. The root of my arguments with many here re: Goff was the excuse making for his shortcomings. Goff was not good enough for a perennial competitor type organization.

Stafford is just starting out in this offense. As a veteran he has mostly read those rush threats and gotten through his reads etc. He is already a better QB for us than Goff the question is whether that trade cost will end up being worth it. But that determination has a long way to go. It's going to come down to the rest of this schedule, the playoffs, and even next season and the playoffs.

The difference is I am not going to make excuses for Stafford. Have not and am not and will not. Thing is for some around here who were on that Goff side of the fence they want to be right and are ready to condemn the trade (as they already have condemned it on day one) and they are also ready to shit on Stafford for his mistakes when the truth is all QBs make them and he's been consistently top 5 in passer rating all season long even with those struggles.

So I'm going to continue enjoying the bright side of that coin. For those like Texas who want to see the dim side knock yourselves out. If you want to be right that badly knock yourself out. If Stafford fails this year and next I'll understand moving on to a new QB. Not gonna victimize him and then carry that baggage through the successive seasons as that new QB tries to settle in and lead us to wins.

What will really be nice is Stafford putting an exclamation on that trade this year. Still plenty of room for that to happen too. We'll see how this goes and who knows maybe there's a victory lap in your future.

The upside with Stafford is *fun*.. great looking offense, exciting.
The downside? Is the same disappointment level, if not more, with Goff.

I don't care about style, I care about winning. Stafford showed me plenty during that three game losing streak to leave me *greatly* concerned about whether the Rams made the right call.

 

[OldSchool]

I am guilty of that buildup. I had the highest expectations with Stafford but that's sort of my thing, as I did the same with Bradford and Goff.

What I think you are doing here, however, is lumping things together unnecessarily. Goff had issues reading rush threats, getting through reads, etc. His problems were things that McVay didn't want to deal with. The root of my arguments with many here re: Goff was the excuse making for his shortcomings. Goff was not good enough for a perennial competitor type organization.

Stafford is just starting out in this offense. As a veteran he has mostly read those rush threats and gotten through his reads etc. He is already a better QB for us than Goff the question is whether that trade cost will end up being worth it. But that determination has a long way to go. It's going to come down to the rest of this schedule, the playoffs, and even next season and the playoffs.

The difference is I am not going to make excuses for Stafford. Have not and am not and will not. Thing is for some around here who were on that Goff side of the fence they want to be right and are ready to condemn the trade (as they already have condemned it on day one) and they are also ready to shit on Stafford for his mistakes when the truth is all QBs make them and he's been consistently top 5 in passer rating all season long even with those struggles.

So I'm going to continue enjoying the bright side of that coin. For those like Texas who want to see the dim side knock yourselves out. If you want to be right that badly knock yourself out. If Stafford fails this year and next I'll understand moving on to a new QB. Not gonna victimize him and then carry that baggage through the successive seasons as that new QB tries to settle in and lead us to wins.

What will really be nice is Stafford putting an exclamation on that trade this year. Still plenty of room for that to happen too. We'll see how this goes and who knows maybe there's a victory lap in your future.

And what you're trying to do here is go and pump the brakes on what you and a lot of others did after the trade. The hype train was so over the top as was the criticism of people who wanted to pump the brakes or had questions about the trade when it went down. People were criticized in many very unfair ways about the trade and still get it. There's no changing that those eggs have already been broken.

The only victory lap in my future is if the Rams win a Lombardi this year and/or next. Implying that I or others would celebrate for anything is yet more insults hurled at fellow Rams fans and totally unnecessary.

 

[Merlin]

And what you're trying to do here is go and pump the brakes on what you and a lot of others did after the trade. The hype train was so over the top as was the criticism of people who wanted to pump the brakes or had questions about the trade when it went down. People were criticized in many very unfair ways about the trade and still get it. There's no changing that those eggs have already been broken.

The only victory lap in my future is if the Rams win a Lombardi this year and/or next. Implying that I or others would celebrate for anything is yet more insults hurled at fellow Rams fans and totally unnecessary.

I have admitted multiple times that my hope was too high. And I'll do it here again. My hopes of a GSoT type surge were too high.

Can't speak to broken eggs and all that. But I will say we're all adults here. And we're all Rams fans. Those two things in combination should allow us to get behind Stafford without all that polarizing bullshit. I think it's fair to say both sides of the argument said some dumb shit and I admit I posted some shit I wish I could take back but that tends to be how I learn, that being the hard way.

 

[blackbart]

Why do all of these threads go back to Goff. Fuck Goff he is not our QB, he will never be as good as Stafford.

Stafford has already shown in less than 1 full year he is a huge upgrade. His supporting cast has been destroyed with injuries, the defense and special teams have been average at best and we are still 8-4, in the 5 slot for playoffs and have a chance to win out down the stretch and make a deep run in the playoffs.

I know Stafford has said he’s fine, from his perspective and getting beat down in Detroit all those years he probably is however, this team can and should keep him clean in the pocket and not having to deal with those nagging injuries that he’s use to.

Being injured isn’t an excuse but it might be an explanation for some of his poor throws.

 

[Kupped]

Stafford is a much better QB, I think.
But the turnovers worry me.

Now, I feel strongly about that but also don’t subscribe to any, “If they don’t win a Super Bowl, the trade is a bust” line of thinking.

I want to see what actually happens before analyzing what’s going to happen.

 

[Soul Surfer]

We probably won't find out until after the season is over.

He looks like a completely different QB. It is likely it is at least, in part, due to injury.

I am curious if he got hurt this year, or if it's a chronic thing. Injury concerns were a real concern for the trade

As opposed to our last quarterback who never got hurt.

 

[Kupped]

As opposed to our last quarterback who never got hurt.

Blue font?
Was injured last year?
(and this year, btw)

 

[Soul Surfer]

Blue font?
Was injured last year?
(and this year, btw)

Yeah, just a little sarcasm.

 

[VFerragamo]

Have it on good account from a source in the Lions organization who's been friendly with Stafford for 10+ years that his back is in bad shape. Said most QBs would be sitting out butin typical Stafford fashion he's trying to push through it. I guess he did that with Lions a few times and at the end of the season revealed he had a pretty serious injury.

FWIW, he also said the accuracy issues we've all witnessed the past several weeks where he's throwing above or behind receivers are really out of character and a clear symptom of the back issues. Says accuracy was never an issue for him in DET..

 

[TexasRam]

I root for Stafford and honestly support him 100% as the Rams QB.

Not sure why any Ram fan would think any other Ram fan does anything less.

The trade is a separate issue. I didn't like it due to my personal belief with why the Rams offense went from #1 to bottom third of the league. It was clear to me the issue was mostly related to Oline and Mcvay. QB's don't start sucking. Mahomes for example this year has about the same QB rating as Goff last year. Mahomes didn't start sucking. He didn't stop working hard or spending all his time with his wife. He lost some key Olineman. Some here thought Mahomes would never struggle the way he is now. Look at Josh Allen. Look at Lamar Jackson with his 87 QB rating. This is what happens in the NFL.

QB's are highly dependent on several things especially their Oline and playcallers.

Many people did not like the idea of scapegoating and trading the youngest QB ever to win an NFC championship. A QB that lead the Rams to the Super Bowl without Kupp and with a beatup Gurley that was half his former self.

I believe people are starting to see why Stafford has issues beating good teams. He lacks poise under pressure and often he is not very accurate on easy throws that NFL QB's normally make.

Mcvay is young and had a knee jerk reaction when his offense began to crumble under his decison making with the Oline and failure to evolve his offense. He sold the farm for a QB with no playoff wins and the same QB rating as his own QB.

Now people are backtracking and admitting maybe they were a little too hyped. Yea you were. The trade was a scapegoat for Mcvay. Exactly what we were saying all along.

But it's really not a big deal. We are rolling with Stafford and I am hopefull Mcvay continues to Evolve his scheme while Stafford improves his game. We haven't even played a playoff game yet so who knows. Coaches and players improve and if Stafford is as good as some thought he might be then we will be in a Super Bowl. And I will be the first to cheer him on. He is the Rams QB and our future is now.

 

[Tano]

The trade is a separate issue. I didn't like it due to my personal belief with why the Rams offense went from #1 to bottom third of the league. It was clear to me the issue was mostly related to Oline and Mcvay.

This

 

[Tano]

Have it on good account from a source in the Lions organization who's been friendly with Stafford for 10+ years that his back is in bad shape. Said most QBs would be sitting out butin typical Stafford fashion he's trying to push through it. I guess he did that with Lions a few times and at the end of the season revealed he had a pretty serious injury.

FWIW, he also said the accuracy issues we've all witnessed the past several weeks where he's throwing above or behind receivers are really out of character and a clear symptom of the back issues. Says accuracy was never an issue for him in DET..

I have said it many times - I believe Stafford's back is really bothering him. And hearing stuff like this doesn't surprise me one bit.

Back issues flare up all the time once you have a bad back.

 

[NEOM]

If it’s really a back issue that doesn’t disappear, or comes back from time to time or in the later stage of the season, this trade will look extremely bad, cause you could have tried to get Rodgers for Goff.

 

[Faceplant]

Oh good, a discussion we have not had before.....Goff vs Stafford. How refreshing......

 

[Tano]

Oh good, a discussion we have not had before.....Goff vs Stafford. How refreshing......

A little sarcastic here

So far - we are discussing the trade for Stafford because of his back issues

Not saying that we like Goff but that the trade for Stafford was concerning due to his previous back injury and how they have a tendency to flare up.

I have not once said anything about how I would rather have Goff in this thread and so far only maybe 1 or 2 people have implied they would rather have Goff.

I am still hoping that his back gets better and we will see the earlier season Stafford once the playoffs get here.

 

[thirteen28]

I root for Stafford and honestly support him 100% as the Rams QB.

Not sure why any Ram fan would think any other Ram fan does anything less.

The trade is a separate issue. I didn't like it due to my personal belief with why the Rams offense went from #1 to bottom third of the league. It was clear to me the issue was mostly related to Oline and Mcvay. QB's don't start sucking. Mahomes for example this year has about the same QB rating as Goff last year. Mahomes didn't start sucking. He didn't stop working hard or spending all his time with his wife. He lost some key Olineman. Some here thought Mahomes would never struggle the way he is now. Look at Josh Allen. Look at Lamar Jackson with his 87 QB rating. This is what happens in the NFL.

QB's are highly dependent on several things especially their Oline and playcallers.

Many people did not like the idea of scapegoating and trading the youngest QB ever to win an NFC championship. A QB that lead the Rams to the Super Bowl without Kupp and with a beatup Gurley that was half his former self.

I believe people are starting to see why Stafford has issues beating good teams. He lacks poise under pressure and often he is not very accurate on easy throws that NFL QB's normally make.

Mcvay is young and had a knee jerk reaction when his offense began to crumble under his decison making with the Oline and failure to evolve his offense. He sold the farm for a QB with no playoff wins and the same QB rating as his own QB.

Now people are backtracking and admitting maybe they were a little too hyped. Yea you were. The trade was a scapegoat for Mcvay. Exactly what we were saying all along.

But it's really not a big deal. We are rolling with Stafford and I am hopefull Mcvay continues to Evolve his scheme while Stafford improves his game. We haven't even played a playoff game yet so who knows. Coaches and players improve and if Stafford is as good as some thought he might be then we will be in a Super Bowl. And I will be the first to cheer him on. He is the Rams QB and our future is now.

This is an excellent post and sums up the feelings a lot of us had when the trade went down.

I'm behind Stafford 100% and absolutely want him to succeed in a Rams uniform. I want to be able to say, when the final analysis of this trade goes down, that yes, it was absolutely, unequivocally worth it. I want Stafford's biceps to get bigger due to the weight of very heavy, gaudy rings on his fingers.

At the same time, I think there was a lot of overlooking some problems that went much deeper than the QB with regard to our offense the last two years and those problems have reared their ugly head again this year with Stafford. If nothing else, I hope people can now see what those problems were and realize that no matter who is taking snaps, they need to be fixed. You can't just abandon the run at critical times. You can't just keep throwing right into the strength of the defense. You can't be predictable with your playcalling. And you can't just always blame the QB when the limitations of your system start to be exposed. McVay absolutely must learn this lesson if he wants to go from being a very good coach to an elite coach. Sooner or later, Stafford will be gone and McVay will have to start over with someone new. And when that someone struggles - which is inevitable - McVay can't just toss him out without looking at himself and the conditions under which the QB is playing and how those conditions have changed.

I hope the next time we have a guy under center who has shown some ability but begins to struggle when conditions change to something much less favorable under those that existed when he was succeeding, they'll pump the brakes on putting all the blame on one guy and look at the bigger picture.

Live and learn.

 

[FarNorth]

I have said it many times - I believe Stafford's back is really bothering him. And hearing stuff like this doesn't surprise me one bit.

Back issues flare up all the time once you have a bad back.

It's shocking to discover that Stafford now may a back issue. Glad we vetted that before the trade.

Seriously, Stafford's health after 12 years in Detroit and a serious back injury was one the main reasons some of us were not so sure about the trade.

I like Stafford, he's trying his hardest, takes responsibility, doesn't complain. Learning a new offense is a challenge for any qb. Stafford's nevertheless had some great success this season and at his best has been great.

But no one should be surprised that he may have back problems. Or sometimes makes bad decisions or inaccurate throws. Or that it remains to be see if he can win pressure or playoff games. And no one should surprised that the Rams' offense may have issues other than at qb. These were always questions. And they will be until the Rams make a deeper playoff run than, say, last year and Stafford shows he is capable of winning really big games.

 

[FrantikRam]

Should we just...split the site into two parts so that people can go where people agree with their takes on Goff/Stafford respectively? This doesn't seem likely to end until Stafford is no longer a Ram and it'll eventually drive people away

 

[FrantikRam]

The problem is the trade was sold by a lot of people around here and even McVay himself as the solution to our problem and the move that was going to put us over the top. Then we come out see 1st half struggles and a 3 game stretch where at times he was worse than his predecessor and cost us in large part three games. The build up by people around here led to a lot of the feelings like TR was saying and others have said before.

Serious question. No snark intended.

"at times he was worse than his predecessor and cost us in large part three games" - is a statement that would be true about any QB. Rodgers, Brady, literally any QB. I think Rodgers game in week one this year was worse than any game Goff has ever had in his career.

So what are you trying to say here?

I was hugely in favor of the trade - but I never once insinuated that Stafford would play better than Goff did here in every game. In fact if asked, I would have said there would FOR SURE still be bad games. That's life as a QB.

 

[OldSchool]

Serious question. No snark intended.

"at times he was worse than his predecessor and cost us in large part three games" - is a statement that would be true about any QB. Rodgers, Brady, literally any QB. I think Rodgers game in week one this year was worse than any game Goff has ever had in his career.

So what are you trying to say here?

I was hugely in favor of the trade - but I never once insinuated that Stafford would play better than Goff did here in every game. In fact if asked, I would have said there would FOR SURE still be bad games. That's life as a QB.

He was brought in to upgrade the position and so that we didn't have games where the QB was the cause of a loss. That was said by many people countless times all off season. Deny if you want but that's the absolute truth and he was the reason if not a major reason we lost 3 in a row.