Goff vs Wentz. Will it be flexed?

[dieterbrock]

Tom Brady won the super bowl in his 2nd season..the first that he ever started a game...he completed 63% of his passes. The guy we see today is a much better player...but the one we saw in 2001 was the same competitive person. They stuck with him because he didn't make mistakes...turnovers...Drew was healthy enough to play in the playoffs...I think....and they stuck with Brady.

Then why aren't you comparing him to Jared Goff's performance in the playoffs in his 2nd season?

And Brady was not overly impressive in that REGULAR season, couldnt beat a team with a winning record

 

[OldSchool]

Then why aren't you comparing him to Jared Goff's performance in the playoffs in his 2nd season?

And Brady was not overly impressive in that REGULAR season, couldnt beat a team with a winning record

It's funny he talks about Brady being great in that 2nd season. But you listen to interviews with guys like Troy Brown who was a veteran for the young QB. Brown talks about that year and it being the most simplistic offense the Patriots ever had and Brady at that young stage couldn't even be considered a game manager.

 

[LACHAMP46]

Then why aren't you comparing him to Jared Goff's performance in the playoffs in his 2nd season?

And Brady was not overly impressive in that REGULAR season, couldnt beat a team with a winning record

This is why I like you db

This conversation SHOULD have went towards, well, his numbers are similar to Brady in his 2nd season.....
63%....passing for Brady.....funny thing is...Wentz is at 62%....Goff is at 59%....yards per attempt would be interesting too...

but for some reason.....guys in here all wanna act like what we all saw Monday night is what's been going on out here on Sunday.

Brady comparison fits for me...because he is like Brady...in body style...mannerisms....a lot of stuff...no-cal kid too....Brady has the system too....probably needs that system....same with Goff....it works for me...

But don't tell me that the red head isn't special...I'll spend days telling you you're wrong.

 

[Tano]

If's and I bet really don't go here....but I'll play.

If Wentz had been drafted....I kinda think we would have won enough, and Fisher would still be here

We will just have to agree to disagree.

I think Wentz would have sucked almost as badly as Goff. The only difference being that Wentz was probably a better fit for Fisher's offence.

I re-watched the games last year on All 22 and let me tell you, I could not believe how many times they called a pass play and 5 guys would run routes shorter than 8 yards. I would say over 40% of the time, every receiver would run a short rout.

I also looked extremely closely at Goff's passes in the first half of each game (by the second half of most of his games it basically became desperation time and I am not going to count that) and Goff made the right decision and accurate pass on over 70% of the passes. Again a lot of them went incomplete but Goff still made the right decision. NO ONE WAS OPEN!!

That offense was from the dark ages where the forward pass was an afterthought (and they couldn't run the ball either)

 

[LACHAMP46]

It's funny he talks about Brady being great in that 2nd season.

Don't think I ever said Brady was great in his 2nd season....I think I called him Tom Terrific....Elite...Special...He and Rodgers.....the only 2. But that was at this point in his career.

But his 2nd year...he was solid...he didn't have to win many games....in fact...I don't think he HAD to win a game until the Raider game....and the game vs the Rams.

He completed 63% of his passes....pretty solid...what I'd call good...good QB play...can win...but it's hard in the playoffs...it would be easier to win with a great QB...

 

[LesBaker]

Wentz is not a running QB but a scrambling QB who can make plays out of the pocket.

He is absolutely a running QB. In fact he has run more than any QB not names Cam Newton. CN has 49 runs, CW has 40,

He IS a running QB.

In fact Goff's history from college to now suggests this is only the tip of the ice berg.

I think he is on that type of trajectory and this will be the year he "gets it" and next year he's going to be even better.

Goff next year will be same age as Wentz as a rookie....

This can't be ignored, he is going to grow mentally, gain some heft, maturity and continue to hone the craft.

 

[dieterbrock]

But don't tell me that the red head isn't special...I'll spend days telling you you're wrong.

I'll be right beside you telling anyone who thinks that they are nuts.
Doesnt mean Goff isnt special too
1983 saw 2 of the greatest QB ever, Elway and Marino drafted. Jim Kelly not far behind. Doesnt only have to be 1 special guy

 

[LACHAMP46]

We will just have to agree to disagree.

I don't doubt what you saw on All-22....I just disagree that a QB like Wentz won't improve your offense...the running game...and even the passing game by scrambling, would get better. Of course, this is just my opinion too

 

[LACHAMP46]

1983 saw 2 of the greatest QB ever, Elway and Marino drafted. Jim Kelly not far behind. Doesnt only have to be 1 special guy

Which is where I get my expert opinion db....

Elway was the greatest QB I ever saw...the throws...the scrambling...then I saw Marino....

I think I see the new Elway....

 

[Snaz]

Wasn't this topic about Rams vs Fagles getting flexed? I think it should, the 1 and 2 of the 2016 draft both leading their teams to winning seasons. Should be a great game, probably hyped up a lot due to the draft.

 

[ramsince62]

I was a Wentz guy right from the get, but i was also thrilled with goff selection after watching a lot of his college film. Butttt I won't get into that too much since this thread isn't the "whose side were you on, on draft night?" It's obvious Wentz is playing at a pretty damn high level, especially on third down, with the ability to be extremely elusive and aggressive downfield. With that said, he is much older than Jared (I wanna say by 3 years) and I think Jared could potentially enjoy the same success, although in a different skill set, if we incorporate more deep throws like the eagles do.

One note I took away from Sunday was Bill Cowher's excellent point on the cbs wrap up show that 3 things could happen when you throw a deep ball with an accurate QB, 2 of which are positives: 1) you could throw an incomplete pass, 2) you could throw a touchdown, or 3) you could draw a PI.

WE NEED MORE DOWNFIELD SHOTS!!! I like what we're doing, but we have a horse in particular itching and scratching to be turned loose, let's push it deep over the top!!

Pssst.....I agree with you about Wentz, back then and now.

 

[Rmfnlt]

Wentz IS better RIGHT now
I dont think anyone denying that.

I'm not (denying that). Don't think anyone is.

Where there seems to be a disconnect is:
a) recognizing the benefit Wentz had playing with that coaching staff vs what Goff was subjected to

C'mon, man... the Fisher/Boras/Weinke staff wasn't enough for Goff? What's the guy need? Coryell, Gillman and Martz? Geesh... They were so knowledgeable about offense, they decided to sit him until it was clear the season was lost.

opening an old Bulger/Warner type wound about "who the better QB will be"

And we all know how well those "debates" went... we always got things resolved amicably.

 

[PhillyRam]

Nah, bust is being an underachiever, especially with the team that drafted them. By your logic Tony Mandarich is not considerd a bust because he went on and played several years with the Colts at OG.


And Bledsoe had a damn good career...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drew_Bledsoe

So not sure why you are trying to diminish it. Pats had not gone to the playoffs for 8 consecutive years before he got there, then they made it 6 times with him there.


Carry on.

 

[RedRam]

Wasn't this topic about Rams vs Fagles getting flexed?

Hmmmm...it was...

 

[nighttrain]

I guess Greg's a bust...but he's still starting...I thought bust were out of the league...like "busted"...but I could be wrong...LOL

ahhhh, he's not starting, and that's that
train

 

[nighttrain]

Bust used to be guys that were out of the league....not just under-performing for their draft position....otherwise, there'd be busts all over...
I guess Brian is a "bust" by your definition...he's not even playing, so he's close by my definition too..

There is a difference between good QB play and great...yes?


If's and I bet really don't go here....but I'll play.

If Wentz had been drafted....I kinda think we would have won enough, and Fisher would still be here

.

Wentz would have had a bad rookie year playing behind GRob, no doubt in my mind. GRob is QB killer, but if this had happened and Fisher was still coach, my crystal ball says we would be some very unhappy fans
train

 

[bluecoconuts]

That was not Tom's rookie year. it was his 2nd year.

And ya know, the whole... Cheating thing...

 

[nighttrain]

This is why I like you db

This conversation SHOULD have went towards, well, his numbers are similar to Brady in his 2nd season.....
63%....passing for Brady.....funny thing is...Wentz is at 62%....Goff is at 59%....yards per attempt would be interesting too...

but for some reason.....guys in here all wanna act like what we all saw Monday night is what's been going on out here on Sunday.

Brady comparison fits for me...because he is like Brady...in body style...mannerisms....a lot of stuff...no-cal kid too....Brady has the system too....probably needs that system....same with Goff....it works for me...

But don't tell me that the red head isn't special...I'll spend days telling you you're wrong.

But so is Goff, very special are the two of them
train

 

[LACHAMP46]

GRob is QB killer,

wow....I was gonna tell you to cool it....but Stafford is 2nd:shocked: in QB sacks:headexplosion:....rest of his numbers are....good tho...12 TD passes....1400+ yards....89 quarterback rating....guess who he reminds me of??? Yeah, I said he was good too....LOL:rolllaugh:

 

[yrba1]

Don't have any interest in debating over Goff vs Wentz. I just hope that Goff will come out as the cream of the crop, or at least be under center with the better team throughout his time with us.