Free agency thread

  • To unlock all of features of Rams On Demand please take a brief moment to register. Registering is not only quick and easy, it also allows you access to additional features such as live chat, private messaging, and a host of other apps exclusive to Rams On Demand.

Ram_Rally

Rams On Demand Sponsor
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Aug 15, 2014
Messages
5,639
About Suh and his Ram future, if any.

I have 3 questions.

1. Were Suh’s contributions during the regular season worth $14 million? Other than the Lions game where he “motivated” himself, that is?

2. What would be so wrong about drafting a DL replacement for Suh? Sounds like the Rams can get a quality DL in this loaded draft. One much younger and much less expensive than the “regular season” Suh.

3. What kind of a message does it send to extend a coasting regular season Suh to our “we, not me” culture?
1. No, and 5 sacks when you line up next to Donald is disappointing . At 10 plus per year, you're looking for great production, which leads to. . .
2 . I'd draft his replacement . Half the cost and can provide similar upside . This is a good interior class . Id rather be average at nose tackle if it means we can get better at edge, safety, etc in free agency .
3. I dunno, maybe he wasn't coasting . If the point was to earn a new contract and impress a team, why give them so much subpar tape? Maybe Wade made some adjustments .Either way, I don't think anyone on the team was unbelievably selfish so I'm okay with them .
 

OldSchool

Rams On Demand Sponsor
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Nov 3, 2013
Messages
39,085
1. No, and 5 sacks when you line up next to Donald is disappointing . At 10 plus per year, you're looking for great production, which leads to. . .
2 . I'd draft his replacement . Half the cost and can provide similar upside . This is a good interior class . Id rather be average at nose tackle if it means we can get better at edge, safety, etc in free agency .
3. I dunno, maybe he wasn't coasting . If the point was to earn a new contract and impress a team, why give them so much subpar tape? Maybe Wade made some adjustments .Either way, I don't think anyone on the team was unbelievably selfish so I'm okay with them .
3) Or perhaps he was playing exactly how Wade wanted him to play. Does anybody honestly think Wadewouldnt call out any player for not putting out the desired effort? He coached some of the leagues great defenders but he wouldn’t bench Suh if he wasn’t giving the desired effort? I’m all for moving in from him but these criticisms of Suh to me are more insults to Wade than they are to Suh. My dream is still Dexter Lawrence falling to us and replacing Suh.
 

Rams43

Hall of Fame
Joined
Jun 20, 2014
Messages
4,137
3) Or perhaps he was playing exactly how Wade wanted him to play. Does anybody honestly think Wadewouldnt call out any player for not putting out the desired effort? He coached some of the leagues great defenders but he wouldn’t bench Suh if he wasn’t giving the desired effort? I’m all for moving in from him but these criticisms of Suh to me are more insults to Wade than they are to Suh. My dream is still Dexter Lawrence falling to us and replacing Suh.

Just calling it as I see it, OldSchool.

I expected a helluva lot more from Suh during the regular season, pure and simple. Not gonna back up from that.

Hope you’re right about Dexter Lawrence, btw. Lol.
 

OldSchool

Rams On Demand Sponsor
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Nov 3, 2013
Messages
39,085
Just calling it as I see it, OldSchool.

I expected a helluva lot more from Suh during the regular season, pure and simple. Not gonna back up from that.

Hope you’re right about Dexter Lawrence, btw. Lol.
And I’m just saying a hall of fame caliber coach never brought up a lack of effort from anybody on that dline all year. We have no evidence that our dc wasn’t happy with performance and to me it comes back to something I’ve been getting grief for saying the last two years. Trust in Wade.
 

Merlin

Enjoying the ride
Rams On Demand Sponsor
ROD Credit | 2023 TOP Member
Joined
May 8, 2014
Messages
37,485
3) Or perhaps he was playing exactly how Wade wanted him to play. Does anybody honestly think Wadewouldnt call out any player for not putting out the desired effort? He coached some of the leagues great defenders but he wouldn’t bench Suh if he wasn’t giving the desired effort? I’m all for moving in from him but these criticisms of Suh to me are more insults to Wade than they are to Suh. My dream is still Dexter Lawrence falling to us and replacing Suh.

Prob in all this is that Wade isn't going to sit anyone if the guy behind him is worse. We had zero depth at NT, no real options to demonstrate that you're going to sit the pine for routinely being washed out of plays. It was the same deal with CB when Peters had to step up and struggled so badly.

Through it all Wade got nothing but flak from the faithful this past season. But it wasn't really on Wade IMO. He had some guys who took a while to get on track with the scheme and with doing their jobs. He put on a clinic in the playoffs with non-optimal pieces all over the defense and did a great job masking weaknesses.

IMO let's go get him those other four pieces he was lacking (OLB, S, NT, ILB) and watch our defense destroy our opponents on the way to a Super Bowl title.
 

Merlin

Enjoying the ride
Rams On Demand Sponsor
ROD Credit | 2023 TOP Member
Joined
May 8, 2014
Messages
37,485
https://www.si.com/nfl/2019/02/12/jadeveon-clowney-texans-nfl-free-agency-stock-watch

Texans’ Jadeveon Clowney Set to Benefit From Defense-Friendly Free-Agent Market

CONOR ORR
February 12, 2019

Throughout the next several weeks, we’ll be assessing the market on some of the best free agents set to come available on March 14. Beyond scheme fit, these decisions will be impacted by available finances, team thoughts on current draft prospects and perception of value vs. actual value. We’ll try and parse through those ideas here.

Player: Jadeveon Clowney
Age: 25 (turns 26 on Feb. 14)
Position: Defensive end/outside linebacker
2018 salary: $13.311 million (fifth-year option of his 2014 rookie deal).
2018 statistics: 21 quarterback hits (tied for career high), nine sacks, three fumble recoveries and 37 solo tackles.

Why he’s a top-tier free agent (barring the Texans’ franchise tag): It’s fairly remarkable how well Clowney has performed throughout his career given that he’s been The Chosen One since his days in Rock Hill, South Carolina. Though he has a good number of snaps on his shoulders already, he hits the market at the right age—he’ll turn 26 on Feb. 14, and he could theoretically come up for another contract at age 30. He rushes the passer well from both the inside and outside, and when given the opportunity to face a single, replacement-level blocker, there have been games that Clowney absolutely took over on his own. He’s athletic enough to shift around in a hybrid defense, but powerful enough to hold his own against the run.

Risks involved: Despite missing significant time his rookie season with a torn meniscus, Clowney has been relatively healthy in subsequent years. I think teams may struggle with the middling sack numbers, but I would counter with the way Houston’s defense has been set up and what it expects of Clowney on every snap. The scariest part for general managers will likely be cost. Clowney is a market-setting talent and could command some serious money given his age, versatility and salary floor as a former No. 1 overall pick. The question is whether someone will be willing to commit the contract length and total guarantees that would get this deal done quickly.

Market prospects: Clowney can play in any scheme, rush from just about any technique and is willing and able to make non-glamorous plays in the backfield that benefit the defense. His complementary role on a talented roster shouldn’t be overlooked. Should he not be franchised (it's very likely Houston explores this scenario and tries to lock him in on a one-year pact for a little less than $19 million), Clowney will benefit from another free-agent market where teams needing help on defense have deep pockets and also must contend in 2019. There are currently five teams with $70 million or more in effective space (h/t Over The Cap) and none of them are loaded on defense. The interesting part? Of the teams with the most cap space, almost all of them pick in the top 10 of the 2019 draft—a pool said to be loaded with defensive talent, especially on the edge. That could either increase Clowney’s market value (teams would want to pair their new edge rusher with someone used to taking double teams), or make teams flush with draft capital believe that they can replicate the production through a handful of picks.

Potential destinations: Houston (franchise tag), Indianapolis, Tennessee, NY Jets, L.A. Rams

Contract comps:

Khalil Mack, Chicago Bears: Six years, $141,000,000 / $23.5 million APY / $90,000,000 total guarantees.

Von Miller, Denver Broncos: Six years, $114,100,00 / $19,016,667 million APY / $70,000,000

Olivier Vernon, New York Giants: Five years, $85 million / $17,00,000 million APY / $52,500,000

Question or comment? Email us at talkback@themmqb.com.
 

Rams43

Hall of Fame
Joined
Jun 20, 2014
Messages
4,137
And I’m just saying a hall of fame caliber coach never brought up a lack of effort from anybody on that dline all year. We have no evidence that our dc wasn’t happy with performance and to me it comes back to something I’ve been getting grief for saying the last two years. Trust in Wade.

Well, in the real world one will seldom see a player being called out publicly by his coaches, OldSchool.

So the lack of such calling out is hardly the same as Wade being satisfied privately with Suh. Or Joyner, Peters, Barron, Ebu, or Brockers, for that matter.

Words said (or not said) are one thing. Offseason actions are another. The actions speak far more eloquently than mere words. I will be surprised if we don’t see at least 4 new starters on D this year.
 

Ram65

Legend
Joined
Apr 30, 2015
Messages
9,628
Market prospects: Clowney can play in any scheme, rush from just about any technique and is willing and able to make non-glamorous plays in the backfield that benefit the defense. His complementary role on a talented roster shouldn’t be overlooked. Should he not be franchised (it's very likely Houston explores this scenario and tries to lock him in on a one-year pact for a little less than $19 million), Clowney will benefit from another free-agent market where teams needing help on defense have deep pockets and also must contend in 2019. There are currently five teams with $70 million or more in effective space (h/t Over The Cap) and none of them are loaded on defense. The interesting part? Of the teams with the most cap space, almost all of them pick in the top 10 of the 2019 draft—a pool said to be loaded with defensive talent, especially on the edge. That could either increase Clowney’s market value (teams would want to pair their new edge rusher with someone used to taking double teams), or make teams flush with draft capital believe that they can replicate the production through a handful of picks.

Potential destinations: Houston (franchise tag), Indianapolis, Tennessee, NY Jets, L.A. Rams

Clowney would be a crazy move! Cut Brockers and Barron and sign Clowney. Rams could go with most of the current defense and add the 1st round pick either NT/Lber. Bring along the young rookies from last year.

Clowney is great the only other problem besides money is I think he tires out some. Did last year against the Rams after dominating early.

Fun to dream.
 

Adi

Pro Bowler
Joined
Jan 19, 2016
Messages
1,808
Name
Adi
Losing brockers would be painful but i see how he warrants that after last season .

Suh, and Fowler hopefully stay. Both of them seemed to enjoy playing with this team and really showed up in the playoffs

Joyner , bye

Peters disappointed as the number 1, but he is still far better than most corners on this team. Him and Talib were a good combo and I would bring him back

Barron bye. His productivity can be duplicated for alot less money

Littleton , hopefully stays and gets even better with a run stuffing MLB next him .
 

Ram_Rally

Rams On Demand Sponsor
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Aug 15, 2014
Messages
5,639
3) Or perhaps he was playing exactly how Wade wanted him to play. Does anybody honestly think Wadewouldnt call out any player for not putting out the desired effort? He coached some of the leagues great defenders but he wouldn’t bench Suh if he wasn’t giving the desired effort? I’m all for moving in from him but these criticisms of Suh to me are more insults to Wade than they are to Suh. My dream is still Dexter Lawrence falling to us and replacing Suh.
The more I observe about Lawrence, the less I like . I'd like him but maybe not round 1 .
 

dang

Legend
Joined
Mar 15, 2018
Messages
6,952
About Suh and his Ram future, if any.

I have 3 questions.

1. Were Suh’s contributions during the regular season worth $14 million? Other than the Lions game where he “motivated” himself, that is?

2. What would be so wrong about drafting a DL replacement for Suh? Sounds like the Rams can get a quality DL in this loaded draft. One much younger and much less expensive than the “regular season” Suh.

3. What kind of a message does it send to extend a coasting regular season Suh to our “we, not me” culture?
So which option would Rams fans prefer for next year:
1) Suh at NT for $12M (hypothetical 2 year deal for Suh) and Franklin-Meyers at DT
2) Brockers at NT for $10.750 M and Franklin-Meyers at DT
 

Akrasian

Rams On Demand Sponsor
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Jun 18, 2014
Messages
4,929
So which option would Rams fans prefer for next year:
1) Suh at NT for $12M (hypothetical 2 year deal for Suh) and Franklin-Meyers at DT
2) Brockers at NT for $10.750 M and Franklin-Meyers at DT

I'd rather go with Brockers - but what I'd really prefer is extending Brockers and reducing his cap hit a bit further. I suspect he would trade guaranteed money for a lesser cap hit.
 

LesBaker

Mr. Savant
Joined
Aug 23, 2012
Messages
17,460
Name
Les
I'd like to see Suh back, but at a lower salary.

Fowler needs to stay. Getting rid of him adds a hole in the weakness of the defense. That's a bad managerial decision. He played well, and he should be a priority this offseason.
 

PhillyRam

Rams On Demand Sponsor
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Jun 1, 2013
Messages
6,427
Name
Scott
Do any thoughts on the Broncos Brandon Marshall? 30 year old ILB, was hurt in 2016 and missed 5 ganes last year, but started on 2 SB teams.

Could he be Barron's replacement with Kiser pushing him for PT?
 

BonifayRam

Legend
Joined
Jan 14, 2013
Messages
13,435
Name
Vernon
So which option would Rams fans prefer for next year:
1) Suh at NT for $12M (hypothetical 2 year deal for Suh) and Franklin-Meyers at DT
2) Brockers at NT for $10.750 M and Franklin-Meyers at DT
#2 by a larger amount!

Suh skills & talents are not used to their fullness when played @ NT. If you're going to bring in a player like Suh you need to place him in the position so you can get the most out of your money invested in his natural best playing position in this Wade D which is the 5 tech post. If the Rams had a big need @ the 5 tech position I could entertain Suh's return, but the fact is we have two very good 5 tech DE's already signed in Brockers & Franklin. In addition to this Snead has a low-cost contract already ready for 5 tech DE Morgan Fox who is only 24 yrs old. Finally, if Snead desires he can (with little cap drain) have 5 tech 5 yr veteran Ethan Westbrooks return to play his best 34 D playing position.

Ethan Westbrooks has been playing out of position for 2 full seasons now. There was a reason we did not see much from him for the last two yrs. Rams have had him starting or backing up the NT post in 2017/2018. Ethan's skills are much more 5 tech DE or to a lesser degree 3 tech DT but he is NO NT @ 6-4 287 lbs!
 

dang

Legend
Joined
Mar 15, 2018
Messages
6,952
So what is the take on Kiser and OBO no even sniffing the field of play. Need more time? Special Teamers and backfills only? Injuries?
 

BonifayRam

Legend
Joined
Jan 14, 2013
Messages
13,435
Name
Vernon
Do any thoughts on the Broncos Brandon Marshall? 30 year old ILB, was hurt in 2016 and missed 5 ganes last year, but started on 2 SB teams.Could he be Barron's replacement with Kiser pushing him for PT?
Sounds like Marshall is having the same old worn out unhealthy symptoms like Mark Barron to me. What will be his asking price? I rather move Cory Littleton to weakside ILB post & draft another MLB'er that lets us realizing a real cap savings (from Barron's release) to utilize for keeping Saffold.
 

Kevin

Pro Bowler
Joined
Sep 8, 2014
Messages
1,382
Do any thoughts on the Broncos Brandon Marshall? 30 year old ILB, was hurt in 2016 and missed 5 ganes last year, but started on 2 SB teams.

Could he be Barron's replacement with Kiser pushing him for PT?
Brandon Marshall would be due to receive $6.5 M and $7.0 M as base salaries in 2019 and 2020. Maybe he would sign with the Rams for a little less than that if some of it was guaranteed.
 

Merlin

Enjoying the ride
Rams On Demand Sponsor
ROD Credit | 2023 TOP Member
Joined
May 8, 2014
Messages
37,485
So what is the take on Kiser and OBO no even sniffing the field of play. Need more time? Special Teamers and backfills only? Injuries?

Wade has a history of getting relatively overlooked ILBs paid after they've been under his coaching and system. So we might see an unheralded guy step up at that other spot opposite Littleton. But the problem here is that Littleton's already a guy who has exceeded expectations from humble origins, and for some of these other guys on the depth chart Wade needs to have enough raw ability for the guy to learn and grow in the system, namely some speed/range and ability to be physical.

Kiser needed enormous work in pass coverage coming out of the draft. So he's a possibility if he makes big strides this offseason and camp. But we're probably looking at an under the radar type FA addition plus a mid to later round pick added to the group for this next year.